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Just bought a 2005 Audi a4 2.0tdi, need help!
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10-03-2012 6:12pm#1
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drunkmonkey wrote: »There's nothing wrong with your car, calm down, don't be worrying about it. Everything always seems worse on the internet I wouldn't worry about it. According to the internet my engine should have blown about 40,000 miles ago, pure nonsense. My particle article is meant to go any minute and that will cost €3000 according to the internet.
Seriously if you were to believe the screamers on the internet you'd never buy anything ever again.
Ya your right, sorry was a bit hysterical there, let it get on top of me a bit.... Reading all that stuff kinda ruined getting it tho so im glad i posted here, has put my mind at ease a good bit
The car is driving grand, extremely nicely and smooth i have to say so fingers crossed it continues now 0 -
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There are two separate problems which affect the 2.0TDI engines in the A4. Both are associated with the oil pump and balance shaft drive system.
The early cars (up to mid 2006 or thereabouts) used a chain drive from the crankshaft to the balance shaft/oil pump unit. The plastic tensioner on this chain breaks which leads to wear on the chain sprockets and eventual failure of the oil pump drive system, with predictable results.
VW obviously became aware of this problem at an early stage in the production run because from mid 2006 the drive system was changed from chain to a more reliable gear setup. They stopped supplying spare parts for the chain setup so many early cars that suffered chain failure were upgraded to the later gear type system.
Unfortunately this is only one problem with the oil pump drive. The other is the hex drive for the oil pump. The gears only directly drive the balance shaft. The oil pump is situated at the back of the balance shaft where it is driven off the shaft by a hex shaped bar. About half of the total length of the bar is in the oil pump but it only extends into the end of the balance shaft by about 25mm. For some reason the bar is quite a loose fit in the balance shaft which means that over time the corners wear off until eventually it gets to the stage where the balance shaft is spinning as normal but the oil pump isn't being driven.
Pictures below of a worn drive bar. This was removed from a 2008 Audi A6 @ 129,000km as a preventative maintenance measure.
The wear on the end of the shaft is clear to see. This probably would have failed within a short space of time if it hadn't been removed.
The newer balance shaft assembly is slightly improved in that it features a longer drive bar which extends further into the balance shaft which should extend the mileage they do before wearing out. But it is just a modification of a crap design rather a proper cure for the problem.
If the OP wants to take preventative steps to avoid problems down the line then the first thing that needs to be established is whether the car is still running its original chain drive system or has been fitted with the gear setup at some stage during its life.
If it is running the gear system then I would strongly advise removing the sump and balance shaft and replacing the hex drive bar. Once this is done you should have at least 100,000km before having to worry about it again.
If it has the chain drive then I would say remove the sump and replace the hex drive and inspect the chain and tensioner. If the tensioner has broken the recommended solution is to change to gear drive but this costs a lot of money, the balance shaft assembly alone costs circa €1000 + VAT then on top of that you have to buy the other gears and pay for labour. Parts to repair the chain drive are available from aftermarket sources but I don't know what the quality is like. Because of the cost involved I would say if the tensioner is ok then leave the chain drive as is. One good thing about the chain setup is that when the tensioner breaks the chain drive still works for some time afterwards with just some extra noise which should serve as a warning. So as long as you are aware of the symptoms of the issue then you should avoid doing any damage even if it does fail at some stage.
Unfortunately very often people either don't notice the extra noise or choose to ignore it until it fails completely at which stage the repair bill will either be big or very very big, depending on how lucky you are.0 -
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Here you go man http://vagdrivers.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=57780
Located between Portlaoise and Abbeyleix. Good guy. Where are you located?
Cheers man
Im from gorey in wexford0 -
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Nissan doctor wrote: »
I think it's a spin ill be making soon tbh because I want piece of mind! I adore the car so want to be able to relax and enjoy it! Apart from these issues, what's everyone's opinion on the car? It's my first car I've had that I've really wanted and i love everythin about it0 -
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Nissan doctor wrote: »
I think it's a spin ill be making soon tbh because I want piece of mind! I adore the car so want to be able to relax and enjoy it! Apart from these issues, what's everyone's opinion on the car? It's my first car I've had that I've really wanted and i love everythin about it0 -
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George Dalton wrote: »There are two separate problems which affect the 2.0TDI engines in the A4. Both are associated with the oil pump and balance shaft drive system.
The early cars (up to mid 2006 or thereabouts) used a chain drive from the crankshaft to the balance shaft/oil pump unit. The plastic tensioner on this chain breaks which leads to wear on the chain sprockets and eventual failure of the oil pump drive system, with predictable results.
VW obviously became aware of this problem at an early stage in the production run because from mid 2006 the drive system was changed from chain to a more reliable gear setup. They stopped supplying spare parts for the chain setup so many early cars that suffered chain failure were upgraded to the later gear type system.
Unfortunately this is only one problem with the oil pump drive. The other is the hex drive for the oil pump. The gears only directly drive the balance shaft. The oil pump is situated at the back of the balance shaft where it is driven off the shaft by a hex shaped bar. About half of the total length of the bar is in the oil pump but it only extends into the end of the balance shaft by about 25mm. For some reason the bar is quite a loose fit in the balance shaft which means that over time the corners wear off until eventually it gets to the stage where the balance shaft is spinning as normal but the oil pump isn't being driven.
Pictures below of a worn drive bar. This was removed from a 2008 Audi A6 @ 129,000km as a preventative maintenance measure.
The wear on the end of the shaft is clear to see. This probably would have failed within a short space of time if it hadn't been removed.
The newer balance shaft assembly is slightly improved in that it features a longer drive bar which extends further into the balance shaft which should extend the mileage they do before wearing out. But it is just a modification of a crap design rather a proper cure for the problem.
If the OP wants to take preventative steps to avoid problems down the line then the first thing that needs to be established is whether the car is still running its original chain drive system or has been fitted with the gear setup at some stage during its life.
If it is running the gear system then I would strongly advise removing the sump and balance shaft and replacing the hex drive bar. Once this is done you should have at least 100,000km before having to worry about it again.
If it has the chain drive then I would say remove the sump and replace the hex drive and inspect the chain and tensioner. If the tensioner has broken the recommended solution is to change to gear drive but this costs a lot of money, the balance shaft assembly alone costs circa €1000 + VAT then on top of that you have to buy the other gears and pay for labour. Parts to repair the chain drive are available from aftermarket sources but I don't know what the quality is like. Because of the cost involved I would say if the tensioner is ok then leave the chain drive as is. One good thing about the chain setup is that when the tensioner breaks the chain drive still works for some time afterwards with just some extra noise which should serve as a warning. So as long as you are aware of the symptoms of the issue then you should avoid doing any damage even if it does fail at some stage.
Unfortunately very often people either don't notice the extra noise or choose to ignore it until it fails completely at which stage the repair bill will either be big or very very big, depending on how lucky you are.
George,
Is there anyway of telling which type of engine I have - chain driven or
gear?
Engine code is - BRE 072516
Chassis is - WAUZZZ8E17A045189
Audi A4 2.0 TDI 140BHP
Purchased originally Mid - 2006
There is currently 77,000 km done on it ...What would you recommend I do
at this stage?
I would be happy to spend a few bob now to stop more expensive potential
problems in the future
I also found letter to previous owner see attached, it seems related to
these problems?
I rang the garage about it and they said it was checked but no work was
done on it,but that was back in 2009?
http://db.tt/Orf9BTgN
Thanks
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Thanks george, thats a seriously detailed and informative post.
Can you reccomend who or where i should go to have my car looked at to see what the story is???
......there's this one guy, called, er em............George ??
On a lighter note: George, that slack-fit hex - I really hope they hardened it, that's Chinese-level of quality...........but, wouldn't some Bearing Fit on it help too, even if you do have the hex bar, and are fitting a new one ?Ode To The Motorist
“And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road”
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George Dalton wrote: »......but now a company in NI called Powermax Engineering offer a repair on the damaged shaft by fitting a hardened insert with a closer fit to the hex bar.
.....
what I am waffling on about :pac:
....you beat me to it: I was wondering if there was a market for a properly sized, hardened hex drive.........but if the balancer material is soft as well.....jeez, lose-lose scenario.........
Makes you wonder if VAG ever ventured outside the carpark with the bloody things. They spend 10's of millions on an engine..........that doesn't get more than a couple of years in the market before exhibiting excessive wear and failure ? FFS.........does nobody test anything anymore ?
oh, and, 'waffle' ?....not at all......Carry On Waffling - One Man's Waffle is Another Man's.....er, Gospel ?
Ode To The Motorist
“And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road”
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