Rangers FC lodge papers to go into administration

Dempsey

Eirebear wrote: »

What can we do about it really?
I don't have an issue with the actual application, it should be up to the authorities and/or member clubs to decide our fate - my only wish is that we are punished fairly, and similarly to anyone else in this situation and not be treated differently because we are seen as a way of making money for short sighted chairmen.

I agree on the German model, i'm sure it could be adapted to our game, but untill we clear out all the old boys club and all of the little cliques who run the game to their own ends out we havnt a hope of any progression no matter what systems are in place.

Fans can have alot of power if they stick together and voting with their feet is the strongest. If Rangers fans wanted Div3, they could have it. Green has bought the club based on the spending power of its fans and you know it. Sevco want back into the SPL, they dont care about the individual reasons but just that they win the vote. If you win the vote and the SPL 10 come out and publicly confirm your worst fears about their motivations, will you be up in arms or 'begrudgingly' accept an SPL licence?

Jelle1880

bobmalooka wrote: »

good, he's relying on people like you to buy into his crap and pump your hard earned cash into his pockets before he drops the club.

There seems to be an awfull lot of rangers fans who seem to think its all semantics and things will be back to normal come August. This mentality will allow Green to screw ye over.(and butcher the SPL while hes at it)

Many Rangers fans won't give a penny to Green before they know what will happen.

Red Crow

The higher echelons controlling the SPL and the Scottish Football League should be actively seeking stark reformation during this crisis in Scottish football.

Rangers should be punished, but the SPL should be policing the situation better and in the long term the SPL is not viable without a competitive Old Firm. While there may be European nights for the lesser privileged SPL clubs. This, in the long term, stands to cause further damage to the SPL than it does good.

No matter how long this plight of Rangers continues, sooner or later, they will return beside Celtic atop of Scottish football. Aberdeen, Motherwell, Hearts etc. all realise this and any income generated from European football that should stand to make a club more competitive in the SPL should be and will be prudently spent in the anticipation of the return of Rangers and the loss of income achieved during Rangers brief spell aloof from UEFA competitions.

This whole situation is a disaster for the SPL and a frightening lack of vision is being shown.

Regardless of a Rangers lining out in Borough Briggs or Celtic Park I'd estimate that this damages Scottish football for at least 5 years before it recovers.

Eirebear

Dempsey wrote: »

Fans can have alot of power if they stick together and voting with their feet is the strongest. If Rangers fans wanted Div3, they could have it. Green has bought the club based on the spending power of its fans and you know it. Sevco want back into the SPL, they dont care about the individual reasons but just that they win the vote. If you win the vote and the SPL 10 come out and publicly confirm your worst fears about their motivations, will you be up in arms or 'begrudgingly' accept an SPL licence?

The fans have already made it perfectly clear that if we're voted back into the SPL and given punishments which are seen to be the other clubs trying to have the best of both worlds, that we will boycott all away grounds.

That still stands, but for some reason fans of other clubs have saw fit to ridicule us for that.

Dempsey

Eirebear wrote: »

The fans have already made it perfectly clear that if we're voted back into the SPL and given punishments which are seen to be the other clubs trying to have the best of both worlds, that we will boycott all away grounds.

That still stands, but for some reason fans of other clubs have saw fit to ridicule us for that.

Why dont you boycott your own club for accepting the application?

Eirebear

Dempsey wrote: »

Why dont you boycott your own club for accepting the application?

The RST are already calling for boycotts of Green over the re-emergance of Walter Smith's consotrium.
In all honesty i;ve not been keeping up to date with it all for the last few days, so i don;t know where i stand on that one.

With regards to the application - i've already stated that i think Green & Sevco should be applying for the SPL.
While i may not be thinking along the same lines as them, the end goal is the same - to force the SFA/SPL/OtherClubs into a decision.

Scottish football needs these men in suits to either stand up and be counted, or to be weeded out.
If they keep us in the SPL, then they will be under a hell of a lot of pressure from fans everywhere - if they boot us out, then they will have done the right thing.

Dempsey

Eirebear wrote: »

The RST are already calling for boycotts of Green over the re-emergance of Walter Smith's consotrium.
In all honesty i;ve not been keeping up to date with it all for the last few days, so i don;t know where i stand on that one.

With regards to the application - i've already stated that i think Green & Sevco should be applying for the SPL.
While i may not be thinking along the same lines as them, the end goal is the same - to force the SFA/SPL/OtherClubs into a decision.

Scottish football needs these men in suits to either stand up and be counted, or to be weeded out.
If they keep us in the SPL, then they will be under a hell of a lot of pressure from fans everywhere - if they boot us out, then they will have done the right thing.

Indeed but it seems to me that Rangers fans will be happy to take the pressure if Sevco's application gets accepted. I dont accept the notion that Rangers fans would be unhappy at being admitted with the SPL. IMO, the "uproar" would be false

lubo_moravcik

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Not if it's the same club...

Zombie club

Savage Tyrant

Celtic are to play Motherwell on Jan 2nd rather than "Club 12" ... Does anyone think that's some kind of indication or am I reading too much into it?

PauloMN

Savage Tyrant wrote: »

Celtic are to play Motherwell on Jan 2nd rather than "Club 12" ... Does anyone think that's some kind of indication or am I reading too much into it?

It's just farcical tbh.

They should get this stupid vote out of the way and get the list of teams straight before releasing fixture lists. Sure what about the div. 3 fixtures? They must be due out also.

Do we even know when the vote will take place? What's the delay?

Savage Tyrant

PauloMN wrote: »

It's just farcical tbh.

They should get this stupid vote out of the way and get the list of teams straight before releasing fixture lists. Sure what about the div. 3 fixtures? They must be due out also.

Do we even know when the vote will take place? What's the delay?

The delay I believe is that clubs must be given 14 days to convene for the meeting once summoned, and that can only be done when the transfer of SPL share request is made (which was also delayed I think due to a clerical error of some sort)... I believe the earliest the meeting will be held now is July 3rd

I agree though, it is farcical.

jack presley

Savage Tyrant wrote: »

Celtic are to play Motherwell on Jan 2nd rather than "Club 12" ... Does anyone think that's some kind of indication or am I reading too much into it?

Club 12 v Celtic on St. Stephen's day has a more familiar ring to it. There always seems to be a Celtic Rangers match around Christmas.

Eirebear

jack presley wrote: »

Club 12 v Celtic on St. Stephen's day has a more familiar ring to it. There always seems to be a Celtic Rangers match around Christmas.

traditionally it was new Years day, although that's been moved around over the last decade or so due to television and police.

Doesnt surprise me that there just so happens to be one on Boxing day though - amazing how that "Random fixture generator" works out eh?

TheBuilder

The only week Celtic and Club 12 are at home the same weekend is the week Celtic are off to play Real Madrid so they don't actually be playing. You could read into that as well.

Savage Tyrant

TheBuilder wrote: »

The only week Celtic and Club 12 are at home the same weekend is the week Celtic are off to play Real Madrid so they don't actually be playing. You could read into that as well.

Well in fairness, they were always going to do a fixture list where Club 12 could be replaced by Newco with minimal hassle. All things considered, I still think chances are very high that next seasons SPL will have a team playing out of Ibrox.

TheBuilder

Savage Tyrant wrote: »

Well in fairness, they were always going to do a fixture list where Club 12 could be replaced by Newco with minimal hassle. All things considered, I still think chances are very high that next seasons SPL will have a team playing out of Ibrox.

Yeah I know that mate, just seeing if anyone would react :pac:

Though I need to take a look at them in comparison with Dundee United's, because Dundee and them cant clash either.

Savage Tyrant

TheBuilder wrote: »

Yeah I know that mate, just seeing if anyone would react :pac:

Though I need to take a look at them in comparison with Dundee United's, because Dundee and them cant clash either.

I'd certainly take that as an indication that Dundee won't be promoted, rather that Dunfermline will be unrelegated if the application for SPL status is denied.

Dempsey

We played Rangers on the 28th Dec last season, the fixture was changed off the 2nd Jan because of Strathclyde police moaning

Dempsey

http://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/news/4378835/We-wont-walk-away-but-we-want-new-deal.html

So Sky arent ready to run a mile, surprise surprise :rolleyes:

TheBuilder

Dempsey wrote: »

http://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/news/4378835/We-wont-walk-away-but-we-want-new-deal.html

So Sky arent ready to run a mile, surprise surprise :rolleyes:

It was never definite they would so your sarcastic smiley is a bit off the mark. It was always said they had the power to rip up the deal or renegotiate a smaller deal. The new deal won't be anywhere near what it is now, so the teams outside Celtic will still suffer big time.

Dempsey

TheBuilder wrote: »

It was never definite they would so your sarcastic smiley is a bit off the mark. It was always said they had the power to rip up the deal or renegotiate a smaller deal. The new deal won't be anywhere near what it is now, so the teams outside Celtic will still suffer big time.

It will still be more than what clubs were getting on the deal thats just expired

Dempsey

July 4th, D-Day for Scottish Football

Savage Tyrant

From STV

The Scottish Premier League has ruled charges against Rangers for paying players outside of their contracts will apply to Charles Green's newco if they are voted into the top flight.

The league conducted an investigation into allegations the club contravened regulations by not declaring payments being made to playing staff between 1998 and 2010.

After an initial lack of co-operation from administrators Duff and Phelps in order to conduct the investigation, the SPL has now ruled there is a case to answer over a possible breach of its rules.

The situation is complicated in that Rangers are soon to cease to be a member of the league, with an application having been made by Green to have the club's share transferred to his new company.

A date of July 4 has been set for a decision on that matter, at which a 8-4 majority is required in a vote of the clubs, including a representative from the old Rangers company, which remains in administration.

If they gain the necessary support, the SPL has confirmed charges will then be brought against the new club over the actions of the old company.

If then found guilty, a disciplinary case will be brought which could see a range of sanctions brought against the club, ranging from a fine to the stripping of titles, or even expulsion from the league.

A statement from the SPL read: "The SPL Board heard a report from its solicitors following the investigation into payments to, or for the benefit of, players allegedly made by Rangers FC outside of contract.

"The delay in concluding the investigation was caused by an initial lack of co-operation from Rangers FC.

"The investigation has now been completed and, in the view of the SPL, there is a prima facie case to answer in respect of its rules.

"Disciplinary charges will be brought when the future status of Rangers FC is clarified and prior to the start of season 2012/13.

"An application for registration of transfer of Rangers’ SPL share has been received. Consideration of the application will depend on receipt by the SPL Board of all required documentation and verification.

"A general meeting of all 12 member clubs has been convened for 10am on Wednesday 4 July 2012 for members to decide whether to approve the transfer."

The full list of sanctions available to the SPL are a warning, a reprimand, a fine, the annulment of an official match, ordering a match is replayed, a points deduction, the award of an official match to an opponent, ordering games to be played behind closed doors, stadium closure, expulsion from the league, the withdrawal of a title or award, ordering compensation to be paid, a signing embargo and/or any other punishment the SPL board sees fit.

Savage Tyrant

TL;DR for previous post ...... Ouch for Newco!

All joking and gloating aside, I think the newco would be CRAZY to opt to go to the SPL. They're gonna get hammered.
And I know I do take a bit of pleasure in seeing our arch rivals on their knees... But I do understand this must be heartbreaking for you guys that love the club as we love ours.

PauloMN

Hard to know what to make of that. Is it the SPL wanting a vote for the Newco into the SPL, outlining that they will be punished - but better to have them there weakened than not at all sort-of-thing? Or are they saying they'll hammer them hard so best have them play in Div. 3 and start from scratch?

They haven't shown much balls thus far, and the transfer embargo back-fired on them. They should probably drop the

and/or any other punishment the SPL board sees fit

bit from their list of available punishments if they are not actually able to implement any such punishments

Dempsey

Savage Tyrant wrote: »

TL;DR for previous post ...... Ouch for Newco!

All joking and gloating aside, I think the newco would be CRAZY to opt to go to the SPL. They're gonna get hammered.
And I know I do take a bit of pleasure in seeing our arch rivals on their knees... But I do understand this must be heartbreaking for you guys that love the club as we love ours.

Dempsey

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18496571

SPL says Rangers have 'case to answer' over player payments

"Disciplinary charges will be brought when the future status of Rangers FC is clarified and prior to the start of season 2012/13," said an SPL spokesman.

Jelle1880

Gregory Ioannidis ‏@LawTop20 With RFC ending, liabilities and sanctions [Court of Session, dual contracts etc] would also end. This is the main advantage of New Rangers.


Gregory Ioannidis ‏@LawTop20 The 'transfer' of the OldCo's liabilities to the NewCo, would mean a serious violation of the separate corporate personality principle.


Gregory Ioannidis ‏@LawTop20 @Paulmcc12 @evanjhenderson @mdkster Just to help: SPL may vote to apply sanctions to NewCo but it would be in violation of national law

We'll see I guess.
And for those who want to know: Ioannidis is a Celtic fan

Dempsey

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Gregory Ioannidis ‏@LawTop20 With RFC ending, liabilities and sanctions [Court of Session, dual contracts etc] would also end. This is the main advantage of New Rangers.


Gregory Ioannidis ‏@LawTop20 The 'transfer' of the OldCo's liabilities to the NewCo, would mean a serious violation of the separate corporate personality principle.


Gregory Ioannidis ‏@LawTop20 @Paulmcc12 @evanjhenderson @mdkster Just to help: SPL may vote to apply sanctions to NewCo but it would be in violation of national law

We'll see I guess.
And for those who want to know: Ioannidis is a Celtic fan

I'd like to see the newco taking the SPL to court, that would be fun

Jelle1880

No, otherwise UEFA would ban all other Scottish clubs from European football.

Oh, wait