Lights Gone?

thesandeman

I just went to cross the road at the pedestrian lights at the bottom of the Square and there they were....Gone!
Anyone notice when that happened or know if they are going to be replaced with Zebras again or what?
They need to have some kind of traffic calming thing there as cars are coming from three sides (four if a bus and a car turn from Forster St at the same time). Also its difficult to see if anything is coming from the Great Southern side. Those lights are missing as well so the traffic wont be slowed down coming to the corner.
I presume its not just broken lights or anything as all the poles are still there but they are all headless.

JONJO THE MISER

There putting them at Forster street at the corner.

biko

Better to have them before the turn as many cars from Forster side don't see them before it's too late and they ran the lights.

thesandeman

What good is that if you are crossing from the Sq to Garveys?

They were one of the worst placed lights Ive ever seen, should never have been there in the first place, about time they were taken down.

ben.schlomo

thesandeman wrote: »

What good is that if you are crossing from the Sq to Garveys?

Cross at the top of the Square or when there are no vehicles, hardly that difficult.

thesandeman

It is if you cant see if vehicles are coming from the GS side. Also if you are coming from the Eyre Sq Centre/Docks/Salthill bus stop how many people will walk up to Richardsons in order to come all the way back down again?

ben.schlomo

thesandeman wrote: »

It is if you cant see if vehicles are coming from the GS side. Also if you are coming from the Eyre Sq Centre/Docks/Salthill bus stop how many people will walk up to Richardsons in order to come all the way back down again?

Dont get how when you turn your head you cant see vehicles coming?? If you are at the Salthill busstop you can walk to Fox's where the new crossing point will be, job done.

thesandeman

I cant remember to be honest lol. I must check tomorrow. I know there is something blocking the view because I always have to strain my neck as I always check nothing is coming. And Im over 6ft tall.
Your right about Foxs corner. Could be a problem for wheelchairs though.

Iwannahurl

I don't know what the new arrangement will be, but I sincerely hope it prioritises pedestrians and not motorised traffic.

Here's a post from another thread which details the manner in which priority was in the past systematically removed from pedestrians in order to facilitate cars (emphasis added: IWH).

galwaycyclist wrote: »

Ok I am arguably biased as I was intimately involved in the campaign to stop the Eyre Square proposals. The claim that this was about attempting to give pedestrians greater priority is not, in my view, supportable. The way the ES redevelopment played out is a useful illustrator of official attitudes to pedestrian access.

My analysis is that the ES scheme was about the systematic removal of priority from pedestrians so as to facilitate motor traffic. What the traffic engineers wanted to do was create what was in effect a large roundabout comprising, Prospect hill, Forster St, and the East side of Eyre Square.

Before the scheme, the square had sets of Zebra crossings that were located on the pedestrian travel desire lines and kept the pedestrians moving through the square. The square's most important transport function was as a transit point for walkers and as a hub for public transport services. Over the years the Zebra crossings had been neglected to the point that most of the beacons were gone and the markings worn away - but they still worked.

Community volunteers even went out one morning and repainted the white stripes themselves. This sparked a funny incident where the Guards showed up and threatened to arrest people - but couldn't figure out what for.

The officials backing the scheme claimed it was about promoting pedestrians and public transport. However I recall at the time being told by a Bus Eireann official that the City officials had declined to meet them to discuss the fact that they were rearranging their bus stops for them. On the pedestrian issue - at the Bord Pleanala Oral hearing it transpired at the city council had not actually bothered to count the number of people crossing the road until that week. In a flagship pedestrian scheme no analysis had been done of who crossed the road, where, or why?

As already stated the existing crossings - which matched the pedestrians desire lines and gave them priority - were removed and traffic light or pelican-type crossings put in instead. So now the pedestrians would have to wait by default. As already indicated, some locations were changed so that pedestrians now had to make awkard detours to locations where they also could not easily see what traffic was coming.

This scheme was demonstrably about trying to control pedestrians for the greater convenience of motorists. Funnily enough to this day many people ignore the crossings and continue to cross the road where they always did.

I recall John Henry the DTO chief giving a talk in Galway where he remarked at the way traffic had been allowed to dominate the Square and this being the first thing that strikes a visitor as they leave the bus/train station.

Appropos the tendentious "enforcement" issue. I once stood and watched two tourists waiting to cross at the lights opposite the Bord Failte office on Forster St. As I recall the lights went through three full cycles - for the cars - and they still hadn't gotten a green man. The locals were just going in the gaps and yes buttons had been pressed. I think I moved on myself at this point.

I remember that guerilla road painting episode. Unless I am mistaken Councillor Sheila Jordan, a former mayor, was one of the painters. The group objected to the ongoing neglect of the pedestrian crossings and went out with white paint and brushes to do the job that the Council should have done. All of a sudden the Council and AGS became terribly concerned with road safety in the Square. I believe there was fury over white paint getting on car tyres too. The horror, the horror...

ladhrann

ben.schlomo wrote: »

Cross at the top of the Square or when there are no vehicles, hardly that difficult.

The point about pelican lights, zebra crossings etc. is that they should be placed to allow pedestrians to use 'lines of desire', normally the shortest distance between two points.

As other commentators have noted, the Eyre Square redevelopment ignored this and its main point (apart from some substandard paving) has been to facilitate private car users over everyone else.

Iwannahurl

Eyre Square ought to be about people, not vehicles.

I include public transport in that observation, since pedestrian access to transit hubs is critical in the use and promotion of PT.

thesandeman

Iwannahurl wrote: »

I don't know what the new arrangement will be, but I sincerely hope it prioritises pedestrians and not motorised traffic.

WooHoo!! They are back! With the added bonus of an extra set.

It looks good for pedestrians as it seems traffic from the three sides are being stopped together so everybody can cross at the same time.

Dont know how much of a delay after pressing the button or if there will be a hold up for cars when they move off though as nothing was happening when I was crossing this evening.

I wonder if its part of their testing of the smart-lights thingy?

Ficheall

I think the plan is to turn the square into a big roundabout. The council are adopting the Arc de Triomphe method and putting one of the the City's main attractions on a roundabout in the middle of a number of dual carriageways so as to maximise the number of people that get to experience it efficiently.

galwaycyclist

Ficheall wrote: »

I think the plan is to turn the square into a big roundabout. The council are adopting the Arc de Triomphe method and putting one of the the City's main attractions on a roundabout in the middle of a number of dual carriageways so as to maximise the number of people that get to experience it efficiently.

That would tie in with their latest brainwave for putting a new road bridge at the Cathedral. This suggests somewhat bizarrely, an attempt to encourage more traffic through the core of the city.

ben.schlomo

galwaycyclist wrote: »

That would tie in with their latest brainwave for putting a new road bridge at the Cathedral. This suggests somewhat bizarrely, an attempt to encourage more traffic through the core of the city.

Is that not the footbridge idea?

scholar007

thesandeman wrote: »

I just went to cross the road at the pedestrian lights at the bottom of the Square and there they were....Gone!

OK - I'll fill you in on the mystery of the missing lights (promise not to tell anyone) - You know how the corpo are replacing all the roundabouts with traffic lights - well they are a few lights short and in these hard times they don't want Councillor Podge finding out. You see they would run over budget again if they procured them through the normal channels. Podge wouldn't be happy you see.

So what they are doing is going around in the dead of night beheading a few traffic lights here and there in the hope that nobody notices. That way they are hoping to make up the shortfall without Cllr. Podge finding out and getting his face in the local papers beside the beheaded traffic light poles - SSHHH - Don't let on you know!

Iwannahurl

Ficheall wrote: »

I think the plan is to turn the square into a big roundabout. The council are adopting the Arc de Triomphe method and putting one of the the City's main attractions on a roundabout in the middle of a number of dual carriageways so as to maximise the number of people that get to experience it efficiently.

galwaycyclist wrote: »

That would tie in with their latest brainwave for putting a new road bridge at the Cathedral. This suggests somewhat bizarrely, an attempt to encourage more traffic through the core of the city.

I was in the Square on Sunday and I couldn't see what was being done with the lights.

With regard to the bigger picture, whatever that might be, I have the impression at times that the City Council/GTU have an alternative, undeclared agenda for traffic management which isn't explicitly detailed in any published proposals or strategy dcuments.

If they are really working towards a ?gyratory arrangement around the Square and environs, perhaps it also ties in with some people's ambitious plans for major developments at Ceannt Station and the Docks (assuming Ireland's political and economic climate encourages such ambition in the future). Given the amount of city centre traffic these developments would generate, one can foresee a desire on some people's part to keep all the cars moving.

I still can't find the Regional Cities Programme referred to in recent reports about €25 million being made available for traffic and transportation in Galway. If such a programme exists, I wonder whether there is any coherent strategy set out that would explain everything?

By the way, could it really be regarded as a 'big roundabout' if the Skeff side of the Square remains closed to motorised traffic?

Robbo

Was it Barry Humphries who said that if you have to explain satire to someone, you may as well give up?

snubbleste

The zebra is very underrated. Re-introduce it as a practical feature in Eyre Square to celebrate the diversity of our society.

Mrs OBumble

Iwannahurl wrote: »

By the way, could it really be regarded as a 'big roundabout' if the Skeff side of the Square remains closed to motorised traffic?

What ever makes you think it's closed? Sure there's vehicles up and down there every day.

Iwannahurl

Perhaps it's an (unexplained) satirical car-free space. This is Galway City after all...

Iwannahurl

snubbleste wrote: »

The zebra is very underrated. Re-introduce it as a practical feature in Eyre Square to celebrate the diversity of our society.

Ebony and ivory...?

antoobrien

galwaycyclist wrote: »

That would tie in with their latest brainwave for putting a new road bridge at the Cathedral. This suggests somewhat bizarrely, an attempt to encourage more traffic through the core of the city.

Is that not the wolfe tone bridge?

antoobrien

Ficheall wrote: »

I think the plan is to turn the square into a big roundabout.

We had that before they decided to make the place anti-motorist by pedestrianizing one side, resulting in all the traffic being focused on the corner in question - which they've made a haimes of for everyone.

Since they're intent on making stopping cars while pedestrians have the green man(instead of the well functioning zebra crossings) they should have made it as proper light controlled junction.

Instead our pedestrians now feel free to ignore every set of lights in the square as being either inadequate or inconvenient because it's either not exactly on the corner or, heaven forbid, they've to wait a few seconds to cross.

Robbo

antoobrien wrote: »

Is that not the wolfe tone bridge?

That needs work too.

The plan for the Salmon Weir bridge is a parallel one to the south which would remove the tight chicane at the courthouse, helping the buses and having the old bridge pedestrianised.

I think another element that they want to keep quiet is perhaps to get heavy traffic off the old bridge lest a Malahide viaduct scenario happen again.

antoobrien

Robbo wrote: »

That needs work too.

The plan for the Salmon Weir bridge is a parallel one to the south which would remove the tight chicane at the courthouse, helping the buses and having the old bridge pedestrianised.

Yeah, but there's actually funding in place to start planning on the wolfe tone project (€400k for the consultants) as part of the recent announcement for strategic local routes.

If I don't hear of any funding or something like actual plans not councilors daydreams, it's not a real project in my book.

biko

Let's keep this on the topic of the lights at the square please.
For planned traffic projects (that may or may not happen) use Infrastructure forum.
This is so informational threads of ongoing work doesn't get mixed up with discussion on what happens somewhere else or something that could happen next year.

Mrs OBumble

antoobrien wrote: »

they should have made it as proper light controlled junction.

I soooo agree with this. The current "intersection" is a mess: every bus/taxi coming out of the station has to give way, cars going down the lane beside the station road (Frenchville lane???) do really strange things, and tourists driving rental cars have no idea what's going on, and how come they have a green light at the same time as the guy coming out of the bus station. Etc.

Can honestly say I've never seen anything like it, anywhere.

biko

So it seems they didn't remove the old lights between Garvey's and the square, they added new lights between Garvey's and Fox's.
At least that's what it looks like today.

galwaycyclist

JustMary wrote: »

What ever makes you think it's closed? Sure there's vehicles up and down there every day.

Golly! Not bicycles I hope?

Mrs OBumble

biko wrote: »

So it seems they didn't remove the old lights between Garvey's and the square, they added new lights between Garvey's and Fox's.
At least that's what it looks like today.

My understanding is that all they were doing was moving the pedestrial lights back to between Garveys and Foxes, instead (perhaps as well as?) the ones between the bus shelters corner and the Meryck.

Am hoping that I am wrong. Don't think so, though.

irisheddie85

There are now 3 sets of lights, the new ones are between garveys and foxes but importantly all 3 work on the same cycle now so they all turn red together and then all turn back green together.
They should now be easier for pedestrians and it removes the chance of people coming round the corner at garveys to not be able to see a red light for pedestrians
Now once taxis stop blocking the corner whenever its busy it might work alright