Parents being 'advised' to park legally outside Renmore school

Iwannahurl

This report is on page 46 of today's Advertiser (carried to me intact by a freak wind):

Parents urged to stop parking illegally at Scoil Caithriona

Motorists who park on double yellow lines on the main road at Scoil Caithriona in Renmore, will face parking tickets and fines, unless they start using the nearby carpark.

The situation has resulted in the school becoming increasingly concerned for pupil safety. As a result the school has handed out letters to every pupil, to be given to their parents or guardians, advising that people who continue to park on the double yellow lines will be issued with parking tickets/fines.

The letter also advised parents that “children are put at risk each day by improper parking on the roadway and on the kerb stones by some parents”. It added that the illegal parking means children “cannot cross the road safely” and that other motorists “do not have a complete view of small children crossing the road” which increases the risk of a child being knocked down.

The letter ends by advising parents: “It is up to you the parent to help your children safely across the road” and that “ there is ample parking in the church car park and we encourage you to use it.”

The illegal parking situation was also the subject of a meeting between representatives of the school’s board of management, the local community garda, the community warden, and Independent councillor Terry O’Flaherty.

“It is very disappointing that these measures have to taken to curb the illegal parking,” said Cllr O’Flaherty, “but I welcome the assurances given by all who attended that this issue will continue to be monitored in the future.”

Link: http://www.advertiser.ie/galway/article/48822/parents-urged-to-stop-parking-illegally-at-scoil-caithriona

I don't get it. Why are parents being urged, advised and encouraged to park legally, safely and responsibly?

Motorists are not school children, and they already know the facts because they read about them in the Rules of the Road.

Why are increasingly scarce Garda and Council resources being diverted to attend a meeting, when these agencies already have the means of tackling the problem?

It's especially farcical at Scoil Caithriona, given that the church car park is just next door AFAICS, but the same obnoxious behaviour occurs at many if not most schools in the city.

What I'd like to see is a high-profile enforcement blitz on illegal parking at every city school in turn, accompanied by a press release to the local media pour encourager les autres. That'll cure the average regular offender PDQ, and subsequent random visits would deal with the thick-skinned recidivists.

Sorted. Now for the illegal/obnoxious parkers outside churches...

ronnie3585

I cannot understand the leniency shown to school runners and mass goers. They are easily the worst offenders when it comes to illegal parking. I walk past two schools on the way to work every morning, the sheer ignorance of the parking is incredible.

Iwannahurl

It's also totally predictable, so the enforcers have no excuse for failing to act. It's not as if they're being surprised by random sporadic lawbreaking.

snubbleste

I think it's fair to say that this scenario occurs at all schools.

Tow trucks strategically positioned ready to pounce on Monday morning will solve the school's extreme concern on the issue of pupil safety.

kevin65

It's laziness on the part of parents, and it's not unique to this school. You see it outside pretty much any primary school at drop off and collection times. Even parking in the disabled parking spaces.

kinetic

OP you dont get it? You obviously havent driven anywhere else but Galway i presume?
The way people drive and park here is not the norm. Galway drivers are stupid reckless ignorant and downright dangerous.
What goes on here with regards to the standard attitude to driving would not be tolerated in any other "city" in Europe.
i.e. stopping in yellow boxes,
driving through red lights,
pulling out in front of an oncoming car even though there probably isnt another car coming for miles,
double parking at school and shop door ways, when they could probably park safely 100 yards away,
The list goes on.
Its actually embarrassing that this notice had to be posted by the school.

Iwannahurl

What I don't get is the diplomatic tiptoeing around what is just pure ignorant lawbreaking (as well as endangerment of children, according to the report).

The methods for dealing with such behaviour already exist: Fixed Charge Notices and Penalty Points.

I'm not so sure that such illegal and obnoxious behaviour is confined to Galway: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056518955

Perhaps the above link might also help to explain why illegal, dangerous and inconsiderate behaviour on the roads is almost normal?

BostonB

Lack of enforcement is the sole issue here. Tow a load of them.

Mrs OBumble

So the real question is why AGS / Galway City Council are so slow to issue tickets etc, and why the public servants who work in a school are having to carry out a public education campaign about something that's not actually their responsibility.

antoobrien

kinetic wrote: »

OP you dont get it? You obviously havent driven anywhere else but Galway i presume?
The way people drive and park here is not the norm. Galway drivers are stupid reckless ignorant and downright dangerous.

You haven't been near schools in Dublin then much have you (there are two on my route to the local dart, 10 more if I walk the 4 miles to work) - they're far worse. The term blatant abandonment comes to mind, especially with the amount of chelsea tractors & people carriers still in evidence for 1/2 child families.

Webbs

kinetic wrote: »

OP you dont get it? You obviously havent driven anywhere else but Galway i presume?
double parking at school and shop door ways, when they could probably park safely 100 yards away,
The list goes on.
Its actually embarrassing that this notice had to be posted by the school.

I lived in London for years and other places in the Uk and this is the norm for parents everywhere driving their little precious who cant possibly walk the 100yards to school from the drop off/car park point as its too dangerous, without realising its their driving and parking habits that make it dangerous.

I have been in buses where the driver has had full on shouting matches with parents who parked in the bus lanes and they just didnt see what they were doing wrong.
Only difference here is that its not just school runs but also the Mass runs

christg

Not to give an excuse for terrible parking, but alot of the cars would have a new born left in the car while the mother/parent walks the older child into the school. I'm not sure what a solution would be for those mothers with a baby in tow - maybe a type of handycap spot (even though every other parent would probably park there). I walk my two kids to school every morning and I'm scared by the inconsiderate drivers - even on a rainy day they believe they have the right away and make the kids that are walking wait - even though the road is blocked further ahead by illegal parkers. I even saw one mother run a lovely little dog over and didn't even stop, she went over it with both the front and back tires and had to know she hit something. I didn't get the tag numbers, because at first I thought it was a book bag or something - it wasn't until the little kids walking start pointing to it that I realised it was a dog, by then the mother had zipped around the corner. I know it was a mother because I had to jump out of her way, it was a dark blue boxy car.

BostonB

christg wrote: »

...I'm not sure what a solution would be for those mothers with a baby in tow...

Buggy/Pram? Walking?

kinetic

I see it every day at my kids school. There are places to park away from the school gates, but yet you see mothers pull up at the school gates to let kids off and block the traffic, and across from the gates there is space for a couple of cars to pull in and there out of the way but people still insist on parking right across from the gates and causing traffic problems.

snubbleste

christg wrote: »

I know it was a mother because I had to jump out of her way, it was a dark blue boxy car.

fago

There's a simple solution in my view.

Similar to outside the new bus station, put plastic road dividers in the middle of the road from the junction to the church. Then cars will no longer be able to pull up without completely blocking the road.

Ticketing them deals with the problem temporarily, the cops will not be there each day.

Most days 2 cars park side by side at the entrance in front of the prefabs and its tricky to get yourself and the kids out between the cars.

Iwannahurl

Apparently a diplomatic approach is being tried first in Renmore in order to prevent a popular backlash against rigorous no-warning enforcement.

Though I think illegal parkers (especially footpath abusers) should be hit hard as often as possible, I can see what they're trying to achieve. So I'll wait to see how this pans out.

Apparently the letter, which was prompted by the school principal's concerns, has already made a difference. Fair enough, but I would like to see this carry-on eradicated at every school (and church, and public building) in the city. Rigorous monitoring/enforcement is needed to make sure this obnoxious habit is broken and that any re-offending is seen as anti-social behaviour.

Mrs OBumble

christg wrote: »

Not to give an excuse for terrible parking, but alot of the cars would have a new born left in the car while the mother/parent walks the older child into the school.

So it's ok to leave a new born child alone in a car for five minutes, but it's not ok to leave them there for seven minutes (two minutes = a generous measure of the extra time it takes to walk from the church car-park in Renmore).
:rolleyes:

Sponge Bob

The church car park can esily take around 200 cars and is off road. No excuse for this carry on.

galwaycyclist

christg wrote: »

Not to give an excuse for terrible parking, but alot of the cars would have a new born left in the car while the mother/parent walks the older child into the school.

In this case, and I'm open to correction, the school playground opens directly onto the church car park. It's not like they have to walk out onto the road to get to the school from the car park. It should be possible to watch your child walk accross the car park and into the school from your car.

Unless the problem is the way some people are driving around the car park?

WesternNight

Oh man seeing people get fined for parking illegally there would make me so happy. Ye should come down and have a look at what happens at 2.30pm every weekday. Not only are cars shoved up onto the kerbs (which leaves the patches of grass along the pavement absolutely destroyed), but they're also parked along the road around the corner, including practically ON the corner. Effectively crowding two junctions (Rowan Avenue and the entrance into Melody Court) for a good 20 minutes.

Then you have kids running across the road because their parents are waiting in the car, or are busy chatting to other parents.

I've been saying for YEARS that the double yellow lines should be extended a bit further up Rowan Avenue, because they stop too close to the corner. But I'd love to see traffic cops down there to actually enforce the law now and again.

kabakuyu

Why are the kids not bussed in? what catchment area does S.C. serve? surely there should be bus services for kids from the East side?

thesandeman

Dont know if anyone watches Desperate Housewives but Tuesdays episode is SO similiar to this thread.

kevin65

JustMary wrote: »

christg wrote: »

Not to give an excuse for terrible parking, but alot of the cars would have a new born left in the car while the mother/parent walks the older child into the school.

So it's ok to leave a new born child alone in a car for five minutes, but it's not ok to leave them there for seven minutes (two minutes = a generous measure of the extra time it takes to walk from the church car-park in Renmore).
:rolleyes:

You shouldn't leave a child on it's own in a car for any minutes. It's just laziness on the part of the mothers. Can't be arsed to take them out of the car. People shouldn't have kids if they are not willing to look after them properly.

KevR

I don't understand why people need to park illegally outside schools. I presume it's because the parents want to drop the kids as close to the door as possible - god forbid they park legally a little bit further down the road and their child might get 30 seconds of fresh air and exercise.

It's all fun and games until some unfortunate child gets mown down because of an illegally parked parent being a visual obstruction on the road outside a school..

Mrs OBumble

kevin65 wrote: »

You shouldn't leave a child on it's own in a car for any minutes. It's just laziness on the part of the mothers. Can't be arsed to take them out of the car. People shouldn't have kids if they are not willing to look after them properly.

Exactly my point.

I'll bet that a good number of the folks involved live 10-15 minutes walk away, too.

Oh .. and the amount of time that you average family has new-born baby for is pretty small, compared the number of years that they're taking kids to school for. So really, it was a boll*x excuse in the first place.

Iwannahurl

I wouldn't deny the hassle factor in having to drive, walk, cycle or take the bus with two or more kids in tow.

However, when driving I don't use the kids as an excuse for illegal/obnoxious parking.

Many people seem to believe having a car confers special rights and privileges, and having wee Dylan or Sophie along elevates car-based selfish behaviour almost to the level of duty.

mikemac1

Could the school organize the "walking bus"?

If there's maybe five families with ten kids beside you like Castlepark for example, then take turns and one parent walks them all to school

Have seen it in operation elsewhere and tends to work pretty well.

And if it's raining as it often does in Galway then who cares, a bit of rain and some exercise won't do any harm

ciotog

mikemac1 wrote: »

Could the school organize the "walking bus"?

If there's maybe five families with ten kids beside you like Castlepark for example, then take turns and one parent walks them all to school

Have seen it in operation elsewhere and tends to work pretty well.

And if it's raining as it often does in Galway then who cares, a bit of rain and some exercise won't do any harm

Excellent idea!

snubbleste

Does anyone know what promoted this complaint about this school in particular?
I mean it's located in a mostly residential area.

Yet there are other locations like Scoil Fhursa, St Patricks NS, Coláiste na Coiribe, Presentation NS Newcastle Rd, Mercy NS Francis St, with heavy through traffic that have the exact same problem and are arguably far more dangerous.
Maybe it's because Scoil Chaitríona has a car-park next to it and others do not.

cats.life

kinetic wrote: »

OP you dont get it? You obviously havent driven anywhere else but Galway i presume?
The way people drive and park here is not the norm. Galway drivers are stupid reckless ignorant and downright dangerous.
What goes on here with regards to the standard attitude to driving would not be tolerated in any other "city" in Europe.
i.e. stopping in yellow boxes,
driving through red lights,
pulling out in front of an oncoming car even though there probably isnt another car coming for miles,
double parking at school and shop door ways, when they could probably park safely 100 yards away,
The list goes on.
Its actually embarrassing that this notice had to be posted by the school.

where have you being living? what rock let me know , this happends anywhere in ireland.

kinetic

cats.life wrote: »

where have you being living? what rock let me know , this happends anywhere in ireland.

I dont understand your comment?

cats.life

kinetic wrote: »

I dont understand your comment?

clueless:rolleyes:

kinetic

im clueless? go on explain

thesandeman

WooHoo! A cat fight.

*gets popcorn*

kinetic

ha

Iwannahurl

mikemac1 wrote: »

Could the school organize the "walking bus"?
If there's maybe five families with ten kids beside you like Castlepark for example, then take turns and one parent walks them all to school
Have seen it in operation elsewhere and tends to work pretty well.
And if it's raining as it often does in Galway then who cares, a bit of rain and some exercise won't do any harm

An Taisce run the Green Schools programme, which includes a 'walking bus'. It's operating successfully in a number of schools, AFAIK. They make the exercise more than just a walk by including activities and games as they go along. Far better for children's development than sitting in the back of a car with a DS or whatever...

snubbleste wrote: »

Does anyone know what promoted this complaint about this school in particular?
I mean it's located in a mostly residential area.
Yet there are other locations like Scoil Fhursa, St Patricks NS, Coláiste na Coiribe, Presentation NS Newcastle Rd, Mercy NS Francis St, with heavy through traffic that have the exact same problem and are arguably far more dangerous.
Maybe it's because Scoil Chaitríona has a car-park next to it and others do not.

Leadership from the school principal was a key factor, I believe.

Caliden

Cregmore school should take a page out of Renmore's book and do this.

Even after a truck careered into 15+ cars, due to a collision with a car where the driver had reduced visibility because of other cars not using the car park, they are still parking up opposite the front gates of the school only allowing for 1 car to pass.

When will they learn?

SillyMcCarthy

ronnie3585 wrote: »

I cannot understand the leniency shown to school runners and mass goers. They are easily the worst offenders when it comes to illegal parking. I walk past two schools on the way to work every morning, the sheer ignorance of the parking is incredible.

And don't forget to include the GAA supporter who also
think they can park where they bloody like!

Iwannahurl

Caliden wrote: »

Cregmore school should take a page out of Renmore's book and do this.

Even after a truck careered into 15+ cars, due to a collision with a car where the driver had reduced visibility because of other cars not using the car park, they are still parking up opposite the front gates of the school only allowing for 1 car to pass.

When will they learn?

Any reliable published reports mentioning that specific aspect of the Cregmore incident?

Nobody learns, especially the enforcers perhaps. This kind of thing has been going on for literally decades. Another poster mentioned the GAA. When AGS did a one-off blitz on illegal parking during a match at Pearse Stadium some time ago, GAA fans were outraged because they had been parking the same way for twenty years and never got a ticket.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056316012

Maybe this is why the school principal opted for the letter as the initial approach. If they had ticketed instead the poor hard-pressed motorists would have been in a state of extreme shock. Enforcement not being the done thing, y'see...

Mrs OBumble

mikemac1 wrote: »

Could the school organize the "walking bus"?

Of course they could.

But why the hell should they have to? Literacy rates being what they are in this country, teachers time should be spend on teaching and learning, not on organising sideline activities to stop parents breaking the law.


:mad:

WesternNight

JustMary wrote: »

Of course they could.

But why the hell should they have to? Literacy rates being what they are in this country, teachers time should be spend on teaching and learning, not on organising sideline activities to stop parents breaking the law.


:mad:

Actually, a 'walking bus' would be a great way of incorporating some incidental learning into kids' days..

Wouldn't have to be an either or kind of thing. It'd be a win win.

(sh*tty Galway weather notwithstanding)

Iwannahurl

They could learn about the weather!

mikemac1

JustMary wrote: »

Of course they could.

But why the hell should they have to? Literacy rates being what they are in this country, teachers time should be spend on teaching and learning, not on organising sideline activities to stop parents breaking the law.


:mad:

Parents council can sort it out

Nobody is asking teachers to do the walking bus, that's for parents to work on

cats.life

Caliden wrote: »

Cregmore school should take a page out of Renmore's book and do this.

Even after a truck careered into 15+ cars, due to a collision with a car where the driver had reduced visibility because of other cars not using the car park, they are still parking up opposite the front gates of the school only allowing for 1 car to pass.

When will they learn?

they made a new ''drive through'' as in drive in carpark and let of the poor little darlings who cant walk , carpark is of the road so its not that bad , its bad when collecting at 2.30 when ''mummy'' is back again, but the principal does writ a note to parents who abuse the parking now and again but they dont give a rats ass, i park early as in go early to get a good space so i wont be parked upon when last minute 'mums' come..

Iwannahurl

mikemac1 wrote: »

Parents council can sort it out

Nobody is asking teachers to do the walking bus, that's for parents to work on

I think parents just give consent for their kids to participate in the walking bus. An Taisce's Green Schools Travel initiative does the organising.

http://www.greenschoolsnews.org/resources/GSGalway%20City%20Newsletter%20.pdf

It's obviously helpful to have the principal, teachers, board of management and parents council on board, of course.

Unfortunately, given the fact that illegal/obnoxious parking is the norm at many schools (and just about everywhere else), and that cars dominate to an extreme extent, it would not be surprising if a school's parents council included members who were not averse to inappropriate motoring behaviour. If this were the case, a plan to tackle the problem mightn't be forthcoming. Indeed, illegal/obnoxious parking mightn't even be seen as a problem at all...

kabakuyu

Iwannahurl wrote: »

I think parents just give consent for their kids to participate in the walking bus. An Taisce's Green Schools Travel initiative does the organising.

http://www.greenschoolsnews.org/resources/GSGalway%20City%20Newsletter%20.pdf

It's obviously helpful to have the principal, teachers, board of management and parents council on board, of course.

Unfortunately, given the fact that illegal/obnoxious parking is the norm at many schools (and just about everywhere else), and that cars dominate to an extreme extent, it would not be surprising if a school's parents council included members who were not averse to inappropriate motoring behaviour. If this were the case, a plan to tackle the problem mightn't be forthcoming. Indeed, illegal/obnoxious parking mightn't even be seen as a problem at all...

Maybe you should hear from the said parents council before making assumptions and generalisations, just for balance of course;)

Iwannahurl

I didn't mention any particular parents council.

I'm merely making the point that illegal/obnoxious parking, around schools and in many other Galway City locations, is so commonplace as to be completely normal. That's a generalisation, but it's self-evidently true, IMO. Enforcement is also minimal to non-existent.

Therefore, it's well within the bounds of probability that parents councils include members who don't see such behaviour as being much of a problem. If it is seen as a problem, and if parents councils were addressing this issue on a regular basis, then Scoil Caithriona mightn't be so newsworthy as one of the few schools (maybe the only school?) to tackle this anti-social behaviour head-on.

kabakuyu

Like I said, you are still making assumptions about parents councils without having had any input or statement from any parents council.Your post is pure conjecture and speculation and should be treated as such by any readers of this thread.;)

Iwannahurl

Do you know of any school parents council in Galway City that has taken a stand on this issue?

Incidentally, I know of at least two schools where the parents council/board of management has chosen to ignore and/or defend obnoxious/illegal parking that has been drawn to their attention repeatedly.

I've been addressing this issue long enough to know that Scoil Caithriona is the exception rather than the rule in terms of proactively dealing with this endemic problem.

kabakuyu

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Do you know of any school parents council in Galway City that has taken a stand on this issue?

Incidentally, I know of at least two schools where the parents council/board of management has chosen to ignore and/or defend obnoxious/illegal parking that has been drawn to their attention repeatedly.

I've been addressing this issue long enough to know that Scoil Caithriona is the exception rather than the rule in terms of proactively dealing with this endemic problem.

If you know about two schools maybe you should name and shame, but until any school advocates/condones illegal parking in a statement or declares it as part of school policy your assertions are merely conjecture and I was only pointing out that fact.