Manny Pacquiao v Alexis Arguello at 135lbs - who wins

tryingmybestt

what a great match up....

pacman versus the explosive thin man...

arguello is one of my top 5 favourite fighters of all time....

arguello was great on the outside, great on the inside, great power, timing and accuracy....

pacquiao is awesome, endless energy, speed and power

below is my initial analysis before i make my decision:

Speed: - advantage pacqiao....pacman is noticeably faster
Size and strength: - advantage arguello...a monster at the weight - 5ft 10 and 72 inch reach
Footwork: - advantage pacman, pacman had some of the best feet ever
Power: - advantage arguello....arguello had explosive power....he punched through the target...his long right hand and his uppercuts on the inside were his best punches
Heart: - equal
Chin: - advantage pacman, although arguello had a good chin
Fitness: - equal
Stamina: - equal
Defence: - advantage arguello...he was excellent with the slips and rolls
Inside fighting: - big advantage to arguello
Combination punching: - advantage pacman although arguello was good
Technique: - clear advantage to arguello, had great control and technique
Body punching: - advantage arguello, more dedicated to the body

It would be a great fight while it lasted, it would be an absolute war

I would pick arguello to win by ko in the middle rounds....Arguello had a great ability to fight at high intensity but remain composed and controlled and maintaining excellent technique

Who do you pick and why ???????

walshb

Manny

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

Manny

if i say black you say white lol


ok this time be precise and explain your reasoning please

and dont go off on a tangent when people question your reasoning

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

if i say black you say white lol


ok this time be precise and explain your reasoning please

and dont go off on a tangent when people question your reasoning

No, because you misquoting me is becoming a bit of a habit.

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

No, because you misquoting me is becoming a bit of a habit.

i'd say its because you can't back it up

arguello is in a different class...one of the best ever p4p

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

i'd say its because you can't back it up

arguello is in a different class...one of the best ever p4p

Maybe

And, why post matches if an opposing view gets to you so much? You seem to know who wins this "fantasy match."

I will tease you a little....;)

Manny at 140-147? Too fast, tough, versatile, hard hitting and non stop for Alexis. The key is speed and feet. Manny's are better.

You did not specify an weight, did you?
Edit edit edit:

At 135 lbs, oooh, Toss up. All I have to go on is Manny vs. Diaz.

Ok, again, Manny too good for reasons above.

Speedsters like Oscar, Mosley and Pea and Manny, who were so tough and versatile are to me a nightmare for a fighter like Alexis.

I also back JCC over Alexis at 135 and 140.

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

Maybe

And, why post matches if an opposing view gets to you so much? You seem to know who wins this "fantasy match."

I will tease you a little....;)

Manny at 140-147? Too fast, tough, versatile, hard hitting and non stop for Alexis. The key is speed and feet. Manny's are better.

You did not specify an weight, did you?

i clearly said 135lbs as the topic !!!!!

opposing views dont bother me at all....thats the whole point of this, to hear other peoples opinions

once again you put words in peoples mouth...how could i know who wins?

i have an opinion who wins

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

i clearly said 135lbs as the topic !!!!!

opposing views dont bother me at all....thats the whole point of this, to hear other peoples opinions

once again you put words in peoples mouth...how could i know who wins?

i have an opinion who wins

Check my edited post....Apologies.....

When you reply on this, the thread tile does not appear. Hence I did not see the weight.

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

Check my edited post....Apologies.....

When you reply on this, the thread tile does not appear. Hence I did not see the weight.

ok

as i begged you previously to do and that is stay on topic

why are you mentioning mosley, JCC etc.?

the topic is manny v arguello !

you seem to be diverting from topic to try and make your point

stick to the subject please

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

i clearly said 135lbs as the topic !!!!!

opposing views dont bother me at all....thats the whole point of this, to hear other peoples opinions

once again you put words in peoples mouth...how could i know who wins?

i have an opinion who wins

You saying/stating Alexis was in a different class sort of implies that this is pointless. If he is in a different class, why debate the match?

So, if Alexis is as you say, in a different class, then I guess Manny has no chance.

I am with you now, Alexis wins.

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

ok

as i begged you previously to do and that is stay on topic

why are you mentioning mosley, JCC etc.?

the topic is manny v arguello !

you seem to be diverting from topic to try and make your point

stick to the subject please

Ok, I am out.

Please tell me why one cannot include any names apart from Manny and Alexis.

Really, this is silly silly silly.

I used the names to back up that speedsters with toughness and skill are IMO wrong for Alexis.

You post a thread, and because I mention other names, I get criticised?

Out!

Manny beats Argello; end of.

Sorry I also said others could beat him, sorry!

You are absoluetely spoiling for an argument, not a debate. Shame really.

If I wasn't respondin to your multiple threads, who would?

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

Maybe

Manny at 140-147? Too fast, tough, versatile, hard hitting and non stop for Alexis. The key is speed and feet. Manny's are better.

i clearly acknowledged manny is faster and has better feet

arguello is definitely hitting harder than manny

versatile?? manny is one dimensional, he moves around and steps in with fast combos......arguello could do it all, box, punch, defence

manny is easily hit....his main defence is to move with his feet....on the inside he is open to arguello's hooks and uppercuts....on the outside arguello keeps him on the end of the long right and manny cant reach him with his short arms...

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

Ok, I am out.

Please tell me why one cannot include any names apart from Manny and Alexis.

Really, this is silly silly silly.

I sues the names to back up that speedsters with toughness and skill are IMO wrong for Alexis.

You post a thread, and because I mention other names, I get criticised?

Out!

Manny beats Argello; end of.

Sorry I also said others could beat him, sorry!

the question is who would win manny or arguello

you feel manny would win and you explain this by saying other fighters would beat arguello????????????? doesnt make sense

seriously think about your logic !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

the question is who would win manny or arguello

you feel manny would win and you explain this by saying other fighters would beat arguello????????????? doesnt make sense

seriously think about your logic !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh my god.

Manny IMO beats Arguello, what is so difficult to understand with this.

In said sorry I used other names.

I think he wins because he is better, and I think his feet and speed are key.

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

Oh my god.

Manny IMO beats Arguello, what is so difficult to understand with this.

In said sorry I used other names.

I think he wins because he is better, and I think his feet and speed are key.

thats fine....all i asked was you explain why manny beats arguello

saying what other fighters beat arguello is not really relevant IMO

when you said power and versatility i disagreed for reasons i stated already and i already said in first post manny was faster of hand and foot

if i disagree with you its not a personal attach, the point of a debate is ppl question the reasoning of opposing views....

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

thats fine....all i asked was you explain why manny beats arguello

saying what other fighters beat arguello is not really relevant IMO

when you said power and versatility i disagreed for reasons i stated already and i already said in first post manny was faster of hand and foot

if i disagree with you its not a personal attach, the point of a debate is ppl question the reasoning of opposing views....

Can you hear me out for a second.

Are you saying that when you post a match, that if someone brings in any other name apart from the two in the thread, that this is always irrelevant? BTW, that is a question above, a question.

Please state this in your rules.

I think Manny wins for the reasons I gave. **** sake, I happened to say that speedsters and tough speedters with skill also IMO beat Arguello, and then I innocently named some, and it causes this.

Can you not see how this is not going to work, if you are going to be side-tracking the debate/thread?

tryingmybestt

as an amateur arguello had 48 ko's in 58 wins.....truly amazing record for amateur

he carried his power to the pro ranks and garnered the nick name 'explosive thin man' for his skinny lanky frame and devastating power

IMO prob the greatest super featherweight of all time...toss up between him and JCC

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

as an amateur arguello had 48 ko's in 58 wins.....truly amazing record for amateur

he carried his power to the pro ranks and garnered the nick name 'explosive thin man' for his skinny lanky frame and devastating power

IMO prob the greatest super featherweight of all time...toss up between him and JCC

Hey, what has JCC got to do with it, see how this is annoying?

I am joking by the way.

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

Can you hear me out for a second.

Are you saying that when you post a match, that if someone brings in any other name apart from the two in the thread, that this is always irrelevant?
BTW, that is a question above, a question.

Please state this in your rules.

I think Manny wins for the reasons I gave. **** sake, I happened to say that speedsters and tough speedters with skill also IMO beat Arguellos, and theN i INNOCENTLY named some, and it causes this???

Can you not see how this is not going to work, if you are going to be side-tracking the debate/thread?

whats the relevance of naming fighters arguello never fought to prove he would have trouble with manny's speed?? i don't get it

once again your twisting things....of course ppl can mention other fighters in posts but the question was would arguello beat manny.....you mentioniong other fighters you think would beat arguello bears no relevance!!

if you think arguello would have trouble with mannys speed then give example of fighters he actually fought and proved this.....wheres the relevance of naming fighters he didnt fight??? how does that solidify your point of view???

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

whats the relevance of naming fighters arguello never fought to prove he would have trouble with manny's speed?? i don't get it

once again your twisting things....of course ppl can mention other fighters in posts but the question was would arguello beat manny.....you mentioniong other fighters you think would beat arguello bears no relevance!!

if you think arguello would have trouble with mannys speed then give example of fighters he actually fought and proved this.....wheres the relevance of naming fighters he didnt fight??? how does that solidify your point of view???

Ok, I will use those names when you select those specific fanatsy fights, that ok?

Again, it's a fantasy fight, and if it deviates and takes certain courses, and that annoys you then I think it's best I leave well alone.

Pryor's combination of power, speed, angles caused Alexis trouble. I think Manny's combination of speed, power, feet, and versatility cause him trouble.

BTW, Manny has never fought Alexis, am I allowed use Manny in this debate?;)

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

Ok, I will use those names when you select those specific fanatsy fights, that ok?

Again, it's a fantasy fight, and if it deviates and takes certain courses, and that annoys you then I think it's best I leave well alone.

Pryor's combination of power, speed, angles caused Alexis trouble. I think Manny's combination of speed, power, feet, and versatility cause him trouble.

BTW, Manny has never fought Alexis, am I allowed use Manny in this debate?;)

your replies are almost childish

of course naming another fighter that is relevant is fine

you were in the process of explaining why arguello would lose to manny and you start naming fighters that would beat arguello that never fought....i don't see the relevance

pryor beat arguelo at 140lbs.....arguello was best at 126lbs and 130lbs......arguello was at the end of his career and pryor was one of the best LWW's ever.....also i feel pryor would brutalise manny

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

your replies are almost childish

I AM CHILDISH? I mention a few names, innocently, you have a hissy fit, and I am childish..Ok.

Manny still to win.

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

I AM CHILDISH? I mention a few names, innocently, you have a hissy fit, and I am childish..Ok.

Manny still to win.

i dont think i mentioned childish because you mentioned other fighters.....you say that because it makes the statement seem ridiculous

i said childish because of your subsequent responses.....i'm purely debating my point and when i question you reasoning you take it as a personal attack :eek:

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

i dont think i mentioned childish because you mentioned other fighters.....you say that because it makes the statement seem ridiculous

i said childish because of your subsequent responses.....i'm purely debating my point and when i question you reasoning you take it as a personal attack :eek:

Not at all.

I said let's start fresh, you seem not to want to. So, if my responses get to you, confuse you, or cause contradiction, don't debate with me.

You know, you started a heap of threads that would not have got the time of day was it not for me. Maybe your future threads won't be as busy now.

tryingmybestt

walshb wrote: »

Not at all.

I said let's start fresh, you seem not to want to. So, if my responses get to you, confuse you, or cause contradiction, don't debate with me.

You know, you started a heap of threads that would not have got the time of day was it not for me. Maybe your future threads won't be as busy now.

i wanted to start afresh and i hoped you would debate fairly

WOW you so SELF CENTRED you feel the success of ones posts centres around the great walshb.......wow talk about delusional !!!:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek: you say not childish??:D

walshb

tryingmybestt wrote: »

i wanted to start afresh and i hoped you would debate fairly

WOW you so SELF CENTRED you feel the success of ones posts centres around the great walshb.......wow talk about delusional !!!:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek: you say not childish??:D

Why insult me, and then use those silly faces?

Please, set out what constitutes fairly? Then at least I will know I won't annoy or irritate you, otherwise, I will simply one word respond. Fair?

BTW, only me and you have responded on this, and most of the time it's arguing.

Leave it. I will.

Brad Goodman

Jesus lads leave it out. It's tedious.

walshb

Brad Goodman wrote: »

Jesus lads leave it out. It's tedious.

I'm toast

BTW, who do you think wins?;)

Brad Goodman

For the record I think that the Manny who destroyed De la Hoya, Hatton and Cotto would do the same to Arguello. I know he was a jr. welterweight/welterweight then but he weighed no more than 145 and could easily have stayed at 135 if the big fights and money were there.

cowzerp

Seriously lads, and both of you's this is aimed at

it's like you's want to win the debate and an argument, this thread is more about who's opinion is better, Walshb or trymybest-my recommendation is simple, if 1 of you's feel that the debate is not working stop debating with the other, the other option is put each other on ignore.

Difference of opinion is cool but watching you 2 argue is not.

walshb

Brad Goodman wrote: »

For the record I think that the Manny who destroyed De la Hoya, Hatton and Cotto would do the same to Arguello. I know he was a jr. welterweight/welterweight then but he weighed no more than 145 and could easily have stayed at 135 if the big fights and money were there.

The problem I see for Alexis here is that his defense and feet just are not good enough to see him win this. Against Pryor it was a case of landing one and eating two and three, consistently so. Manny is as fast as Pryor, as heavy handed, has the feet, speed and angles to consistently attack from all angles. He aslo has the engine to do it for 12 rds, AND, he takes a great shot too. He is more complete than Alexis. Manny sees an opening, and he will, he will attack every bit as much and every bit as ferocious as Pryor. Bad style for Alexis.

Manny is fast, hard, fit, tough, versatile, great feet, very good chin. All bad for Arguello.