Mortgage write offs for all, silly billies to have debt written off

Rabidlamb

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/latest-news/banks-will-take-back-homes-under-mortgage-writeoff-plan-2986613.html

BANKS will take back homes and tie struggling homeowners to years of repayments in return for writing off their mortgage debt.

But the new debt-settlement scheme will not be a debt "free-for-all" as those who tap into it will lose their homes and still have to make repayments based on what they can now afford for between five and seven years before they have their debts cleared by the bank.

Finance Minister Michael Noonan is understood to be so happy with the plans to include mortgage debt in the new non-court arrangements that he and Mr Shatter agreed to hold a one-to-one meeting to sort their differences.

It is estimated that around 25,000 households have mortgages and other debts that they have no hope of ever being able to pay back.

It is estimated that there are between 6,000 and 12,000 mortgage holders who can pay, but won't. These people are known as strategic defaulters.

The free gravy train is about to arrive, choo choo.
Who will pick up the tab for these bad debt write offs ?...
The Magic Money Fairy of course.
This is all great:rolleyes:

theteal

"strategic defaulters" - that's much more civil than the term I had in mind!

This is going to get messy - then again, it's the indo so it's probably completely fabricated

omahaid

BANKS will take back homes and tie struggling homeowners to years of repayments in return for writing off their mortgage debt.

But the new debt-settlement scheme will not be a debt "free-for-all" as those who tap into it will lose their homes and still have to make repayments based on what they can now afford for between five and seven years before they have their debts cleared by the bank.

Finance Minister Michael Noonan is understood to be so happy with the plans to include mortgage debt in the new non-court arrangements that he and Mr Shatter agreed to hold a one-to-one meeting to sort their differences.

It is estimated that around 25,000 households have mortgages and other debts that they have no hope of ever being able to pay back.

It is estimated that there are between 6,000 and 12,000 mortgage holders who can pay, but won't. These people are known as strategic defaulters.

Sounds kinda gay

bnt

I remember asking about "strategic defaults" here a few years ago, because it was happening in the USA, and the answer was "oh, no, it can't happen here, it's against the law!" That right?

What should happen is: alongside this measure, the banks / NAMA have to make a huge write-off in their book asset values. It's those "book values" that have allowed them to get away with the illusion that they're theoretically solvent and worthy of a bailout.

It would then mean that investors who lent them money with the aim of making money - the unsecured bondholders - would get the proverbial "haircut". And so on down the line. It does no-one any long-term good for the "book" value of assets to be so much higher than the real market value - whatever those assets are (houses, mortgages, bonds, etc.) It's time to get back to reality.

Chips Lovell

But the new debt-settlement scheme will not be a debt "free-for-all" as those who tap into it will lose their homes and still have to make repayments based on what they can now afford for between five and seven years before they have their debts cleared by the bank.

Some free gravy train that is.

Ickle Magoo

Free gravy train? The banks will own their house which can be sold out from under them - pushing people who genuinely can no longer afford their mortgage and can't sell their homes into paying both rent and repayments for up to seven years...I'd imagine they'd also then be blacklisted.

Not exactly a magical fairy wipe-the-slate-clean write-off.

MugMugs

So I can start off my coke habit and screw the mortgage? Sweet! 2003 here I come!

HellFireClub

Ah yes, the "Silly Billies" who worked for 20 years, had the audacity to buy a home for themselves and their family, and then lost their jobs, the selfish c*nts...

MugMugs

HellFireClub wrote: »

Ah yes, the "Silly Billies" who worked for 20 years, had the audacity to buy a home for themselves and their family, and then lost their jobs, the selfish c*nts...

I pity them. But people not paying and enjoying nice holidays and nice cars..... I don't pity them.

Sindri

Is this spam?

AngryBollix

HellFireClub wrote: »

Ah yes, the "Silly Billies" who worked for 20 years, had the audacity to buy a home for themselves and their family, and then lost their jobs, the selfish c*nts...

The same stupid c*nts who made a stupid investment and blame everyone but themselves

Plazaman

Rabidlamb wrote: »

Who will pick up the tab for these bad debt write offs

Thank you for paying your €100 Household Charge. We apologise that we may have mislead you into thinking this money would be going to local councils for local services but unfortunatley the money pit seems to have somehow gotten deeper due to writing off mortgage debts left, right and centre.

Not to worry, since you paid your €100 this year without a whimper, sure €250 next year won't bother you that much.

Don't worry, our financial and accounting advisers know what they are doing and know whats best for the country and work 24/7 (except for 11am-11.30am Coco Pops break, 1pm - 2pm Din Dins, 3pm - 4pm Nap Times, 5pm - 5.30pm The Barney Show)

smash

AngryBollix wrote: »

The same stupid c*nts who made a stupid investment and blame everyone but themselves

Sorry but the whole "stupid investment" thing just doesn't wash. They wanted their own house, lost their job and now can't afford it.

Take this scenario and multiple it by a few thousand and it's what happens when people buy cars every day! You don't hear people giving out about that.

SEPT 23 1989

Rabidlamb wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/latest-news/banks-will-take-back-homes-under-mortgage-writeoff-plan-2986613.html



The free gravy train is about to arrive, choo choo.
Who will pick up the tab for these bad debt write offs ?...
The Magic Money Fairy of course.
This is all great:rolleyes:

We have already picked up the tab for this when the banks were recapitalised

Rabidlamb

But the new debt-settlement scheme will not be a debt "free-for-all" as those who tap into it will lose their homes and still have to make repayments based on what they can now afford for between five and seven years before they have their debts cleared by the bank.

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Some free gravy train that is.

The additional repayments will be based on means & is decided by some independent body.
This is Ireland, people will claim the poor mouth & "fail" to inform the bank or body when their situation improves.
Great success.

Claasman

smash wrote: »

Sorry but the whole "stupid investment" thing just doesn't wash. They wanted their own house, lost their job and now can't afford it.

Take this scenario and multiple it by a few thousand and it's what happens when people buy cars every day! You don't hear people giving out about that.

just cos people want something, doesn't mean they can afford it like...

HellFireClub

AngryBollix wrote: »

The same stupid c*nts who made a stupid investment and blame everyone but themselves

People made the same "investments", insofar as people wanted to buy somewhere to live, for centuries and there wasn't a problem, it's the most human thing in the world to do to want to have security of tenure for you and your family. Given the inherently backward nature of this country and the gombeen element that exists in this country, I wouldn't want to expose myself or my family to the kind of ruthlessness and childishness that can be evident from buy to let landlords and amateur property investors/speculators, who might decide to move you on if they thought they could get another 100 Euro a month from someone else.

These are the speculative parasites who caused this problem, not the decent Joe or Josephine who just wanted to have a bit of security over his/her head for himself/herself and their family.

smash

Claasman wrote: »

just cos people want something, doesn't mean they can afford it like...

They could afford it. That's the thing.

HellFireClub

Another point that seems lost on a lot of people in this country... If you bought a property within the last 10 years, it was the bank who instructed their own valuation team to value the property, it was the bank who ultimately signed off on that valuation as having been a valuation that would stand up over the lifetime of the mortgage that the bank was giving you.

But yet now that their valuation was simply wrong, they want to be able to pull the customer over the coals for the full amount?!? The customer didn't put the valuation on the property, it was the banks who decided that the property had a long term value of what they were lending you to buy it at. Yet when the sh*t hits the fan, they are not responsible, I don't buy that for a second...

smash

HellFireClub wrote: »

it was the banks who decided that the property had a long term value of what they were lending you to buy it at.

That's not entirely true. They know full well the value could rise or fall, same with a car loan. They know the value will drop but they'll take the chance that you'll repay the full amount.

Tordelback

Not fishing for sympathy or anything like, just throwing out a personal anecdote by way of balance.

When my wife and I bought our 1000sq ft 3-bed terrace in the fringes of Dublin 24 in 2004, we did so with the intention of raising our family in it. We took an 85% mortgage, using our savings for the 15%, at a value of just under 3 times our combined salaries. Our combined total income is now 1/3 of what it was then, between unemployment and savage pay-cuts, and with all our savings now gone we have little hope of keeping up our repayments to the end of this year, and the supposed market value of the house (if you could sell it at all) is considerably less than the remaining mortgage . Incidentally we have no car- or holiday-loans to cover, driving a 14 year old 1 litre, and holidaying in a tent in Wicklow or Galway.

We were stupid, yes, but c*nts? Up to you.

Sindri

HellFireClub wrote: »

Another point that seems lost on a lot of people in this country... If you bought a property within the last 10 years, it was the bank who instructed their own valuation team to value the property, it was the bank who ultimately signed off on that valuation as having been a valuation that would stand up over the lifetime of the mortgage that the bank was giving you.

But yet now that their valuation was simply wrong, they want to be able to pull the customer over the coals for the full amount?!? The customer didn't put the valuation on the property, it was the banks who decided that the property had a long term value of what they were lending you to buy it at. Yet when the sh*t hits the fan, they are not responsible, I don't buy that for a second...

This is what I find most angering about the whole ordeal...


But, we need the banks, they're too powerful and integral to our society.

jackal

HellFireClub wrote: »

Another point that seems lost on a lot of people in this country... If you bought a property within the last 10 years, it was the bank who instructed their own valuation team to value the property, it was the bank who ultimately signed off on that valuation as having been a valuation that would stand up over the lifetime of the mortgage that the bank was giving you.

But yet now that their valuation was simply wrong, they want to be able to pull the customer over the coals for the full amount?!? The customer didn't put the valuation on the property, it was the banks who decided that the property had a long term value of what they were lending you to buy it at. Yet when the sh*t hits the fan, they are not responsible, I don't buy that for a second...

Nobody is asking you to buy it, mortgages are FULL RECOURSE in Ireland, and although secured on the property, they can pursue the borrower for the outstanding amount if selling the property does not clear the loan, so really, the banks thought they were operating in a win-win environment.

Also keep in mind the (re-elected multiple times by the people of this country) government was in property pimp mode, and were asleep at the wheel, letting the banks do whatever they wanted.

Anyway, what do you propose? Do you want to keep the asset while being forgiven the loan by any chance? :pac:

smash

jackal wrote: »

Also keep in mind the (re-elected multiple times by the people of this country) government was in property pimp mode, and were asleep at the wheel, letting the banks do whatever they wanted.

Then they were f*cked out though.

fedor.2.

Woo hoo

jackal

smash wrote: »

Then they were f*cked out though.

Does that mean we should tear up any contracts made before the new government came in?

TheZohanS

Anyone that's interested in house prices click here. House prices are now at 2001 levels and still dropping.

pickarooney

Who came up with the idea of a mortgage in the first place? It's a terribly flawed system. A house is the last thing in the world you want to take a massive gamble with so why is not standard practice for people to save up until they can afford to buy a house, the same as it is with everything else?

Phill Ewinn

This will cost FF/FG feck all really and make people feel ''a part of'' the global debt crisis. As if to justify the Anglo bailout osme years after that criminal act.

Hope everyone signs up for this. There'll be all kinds including those driving merc jeeps to the dole office, or driving a taxi on a Saturday while signing on etc....

Chance away people. Everyone please apply and give those government people something to do.

Buford Tannen

AngryBollix wrote: »

The same stupid c*nts who made a stupid investment and blame everyone but themselves

The same stupid comment made by the same stupid c**ts who probably still live at home with mammy & daddy

flanders1979

Both our incomes are down roughly 30% because other peoples debt have to be paid.
I realise that its a selfish way of looking at it.
But we could be able to afford to buy our own home in a few years barring more disasters. I don't know whether I should be talking to the bank or stocking up on tinned food. Maybe a bit of both.
I always felt like crap when my friends working in higher paid jobs told me how much the value of their houses had gone up as I despaired that I would be renting forever.