Paul O'Connell signs 2 year international contract (until end of 2013/14)

thomond2006

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/9934.php

Great news!

.ak

He's in great form. Hope he sees some serious Irish silverware before he retires... or maybe a couple more Lions caps.

irishbucsfan

Hopefully not his last contract!

MungBean

Whats the reasoning behind the contract ? Fears that he would take a big money deal somewhere as his career comes to an end ?

thomond2006

Given he's been at the top of the ladder in Ireland for 8/9 years, his tax rebate would be enormous. Aside from his obvious commitment to Munster, from a financial POV he wouldn't finish his career outside Ireland unless he was offered a ridiculous salary.

sasta le

Tax Rebate??

JustinDee

MungBean wrote: »

Whats the reasoning behind the contract ?

To keep him playing for an Irish province for the next two years.

thomond2006

sasta le wrote: »

Tax Rebate??

Rugby players can currently claim a tax rebate when they retire for the last 10 years they paid tax in the Republic of Ireland. But a player is only eligible for the rebate if contracted in Ireland for the final year of his career.

In general, after 10 years as a professional, it represents a rebate of approximately 18 months’ salary.

Read more: http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/rugby/stringer-expected-back-at-munster-next-year-176128.html#ixzz1iVEkQbkx

phog

MungBean wrote: »

Whats the reasoning behind the contract ? Fears that he would take a big money deal somewhere as his career comes to an end ?

What's the reason for any contract? Keep a player where you want them, I suppose.

sasta le

thomond2006 wrote: »

Rugby players can currently claim a tax rebate when they retire for the last 10 years they paid tax in the Republic of Ireland. But a player is only eligible for the rebate if contracted in Ireland for the final year of his career.

In general, after 10 years as a professional, it represents a rebate of approximately 18 months’ salary.

Read more: http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/rugby/stringer-expected-back-at-munster-next-year-176128.html#ixzz1iVEkQbkx

Thats a disgrace,they are getting huge salarys,i wonder could i get get a rebate:rolleyes:

MungBean

But whats the point in a central contract to oblige him to stay in Ireland when realistically he wouldnt move abroad anyway ?

thomond2006

sasta le wrote: »

Thats a disgrace,they are getting huge salarys,i wonder could i get get a rebate:rolleyes:

I'm surprised it wasn't dropped in the budget. None of the players would have died!

MungBean wrote: »

But whats the point in a central contract to oblige him to stay in Ireland when realistically he wouldnt move abroad anyway ?

Interesting point!

sasta le

thomond2006 wrote: »

Rugby players can currently claim a tax rebate when they retire for the last 10 years they paid tax in the Republic of Ireland. But a player is only eligible for the rebate if contracted in Ireland for the final year of his career.

In general, after 10 years as a professional, it represents a rebate of approximately 18 months’ salary.

Read more: http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/rugby/stringer-expected-back-at-munster-next-year-176128.html#ixzz1iVEkQbkx

Thats a disgrace they get paid huge salarys.I wonder could i get a tax rebate:rolleyes:

irishbucsfan

sasta le wrote: »

Thats a disgrace,they are getting huge salarys,i wonder could i get get a rebate:rolleyes:

I wonder if people coming to watch you at your job generates millions each year?

WeeBushy

MungBean wrote: »

But whats the point in a central contract to oblige him to stay in Ireland when realistically he wouldnt move abroad anyway ?

I don't think it has anything to do with warding off foreign clubs. He (presumably) was coming to the end of his contract so signed a new one. And its a central contract because he's the best 2nd row in Ireland. Don't think there's anything more to it than that.

irishbucsfan

MungBean wrote: »

But whats the point in a central contract to oblige him to stay in Ireland when realistically he wouldnt move abroad anyway ?

Is it really surprising that Paul O'Connell is on a central contract...?

MungBean

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Is it really surprising that Paul O'Connell is on a central contract...?

No not really I'm just wondering about the nature of the contract is all. I had thought they were to keep players playing in Ireland for the time contracted and stop them moving abroad. I didnt realise it was a life long pledge to support a higher wage for influential players.

WeeBushy

MungBean wrote: »

No not really I'm just wondering about the nature of the contract is all. I had thought they were to keep players playing in Ireland for the time contracted and stop them moving abroad. I didnt realise it was a life long pledge to support a higher wage for influential players.

I've always been under the impression central contracts are to reward very good players with a higher wage, that their province mightn't be able to provide. And also to give the IRFU a bit more control over their best players.

Nothing wrong with POC being one of the highest paid players in Ireland for an extended period of time. He's deserved it. And also it would be a bit ****ty to downgrade his contract just because they know that he's unlikely to leave Ireland due to the tax rebate.

profitius

Its a good signing from the IRFU's point of view. DOC getting 3 years last year was a bit of a joke.

buck65

I thought he might go to LA Galaxy.
In fairness is this even news/thread worthy, wtf was going to happen? Can you imagine O Connell not signing a contract? Now that would be news.

Mr.Applepie

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Is it really surprising that Paul O'Connell is on a central contract...?

It's shocking, absolutely shocking! An old player like that should be paid the average industrial wage and be lucky he's not on the dole! His earnings should also be taxed at 95% to pay for vital public services like throwing money at unions!

*Grows Jack O'Connor style beard*

Not the force at lineout time that he once was but any team he plays with seems to lift their perfomance a few notches when he's on the pitch. Like BOD, he's worth it for his presence alone

MungBean

WeeBushy wrote: »

I've always been under the impression central contracts are to reward very good players with a higher wage, that their province mightn't be able to provide. And also to give the IRFU a bit more control over their best players.

Nothing wrong with POC being one of the highest paid players in Ireland for an extended period of time. He's deserved it. And also it would be a bit ****ty to downgrade his contract just because they know that he's unlikely to leave Ireland due to the tax rebate.

I have no issue at all with his wage if thats what his contract is, I just thought central contracts were used to keep players in Ireland by the IRFU directly paying a portion of the wage. I didnt know it was a glory wage as such, I thought it was directly linked to the fact they want to keep that player in Ireland.

Or are all Irish players paid by the IRFU with some on central contracts and other just on provincial ones?

phog

MungBean wrote: »

I have no issue at all with his wage if thats what his contract is, I just thought central contracts were used to keep players in Ireland by the IRFU directly paying a portion of the wage. I didnt know it was a glory wage as such, I thought it was directly linked to the fact they want to keep that player in Ireland.

Or are all Irish players paid by the IRFU with some on central contracts and other just on provincial ones?

Why do you think the IRFU may not want to keep POC in Ireland?

MungBean

phog wrote: »

Why do you think the IRFU may not want to keep POC in Ireland?

I dont think they may not want to keep him in Ireland. I just cant see any reason they would need a contract to ensure he does stay in Ireland.

buck65

Mr.Applepie wrote: »

It's shocking, absolutely shocking! An old player like that should be paid the average industrial wage and be lucky he's not on the dole! His earnings should also be taxed at 95% to pay for vital public services like throwing money at unions!

*Grows Jack O'Connor style beard*

Not the force at lineout time that he once was but any team he plays with seems to lift their perfomance a few notches when he's on the pitch. Like BOD, he's worth it for his presence alone

Err , what? Am I missing something here?

smurphy29

buck65 wrote: »

Err , what? Am I missing something here?

Indeed, I must be missing something too. My understanding from watching him this season is that he's still the best lock in Europe. The much vaunted "Lions in waiting" like Gray and Lawes are still not fit to lace his boots. In additional to his lineout prowess, he is arguably the finest gatherer of restarts in world rugby. It won them the game in Castres.

If people are going to begrudge Paul O'Connell another central contract at the not so ripe age of 32, we might as well all pack up and go home. He's a second row; there's on reason he can't play on until 2015. Shaw, Nallet, Thorne and Matfield were all influential up to the age of 35/36. I expect him to be a test Lion in 2013 and at least an impact player in the 2015 world cup. A new generation of locks are coming through (Tuohy, Ryan, Toner) and playing alongside Paulie will be the best education possible.

CIARAN_BOYLE

MungBean wrote: »

I have no issue at all with his wage if thats what his contract is, I just thought central contracts were used to keep players in Ireland by the IRFU directly paying a portion of the wage. I didnt know it was a glory wage as such, I thought it was directly linked to the fact they want to keep that player in Ireland.

Or are all Irish players paid by the IRFU with some on central contracts and other just on provincial ones?

Theoretically the provinces are part of the IRFU so you could say that all Irish players are paid by the IRFU but to be honest for the most part the provinces take care of non central contract salaries out of their own pocket. That said the provinces supposedly have a limit on the amount that they can pay in salaries to IQ players. So if say POC wants 500,000 a year and the IRFU won't offer a central contract with that sum Munster can't go out and say we have the money

Quint2010

Great player. Great news.

profitius

smurphy29 wrote: »

Indeed, I must be missing something too. My understanding from watching him this season is that he's still the best lock in Europe. The much vaunted "Lions in waiting" like Gray and Lawes are still not fit to lace his boots. In additional to his lineout prowess, he is arguably the finest gatherer of restarts in world rugby. It won them the game in Castres.

That reminds me of some debates last year when POC was out injured. Hes not only a great leader and lineout operator but he is one of the best second row athletes you could find. If he was South African or a New Zealander he'd be far higher rated in world rugby.

Cpt_Blackbeard

Its great to see an Irish player signing a contract without involving agents and "interest" from France to earn himself a bigger wage and longer deal.

Hagz

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Its great to see an Irish player signing a contract without involving agents and "interest" from France to earn himself a bigger wage and longer deal.

It's always a joy reading your posts.:)

Ciaran-Irl

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Its great to see an Irish player signing a contract without involving agents and "interest" from France to earn himself a bigger wage and longer deal.

Don't forget the Miami Dolphins. Its not just France.

PhatPiggins

profitius wrote: »

Its a good signing from the IRFU's point of view. DOC getting 3 years last year was a bit of a joke.

Do your kids look like DOC ?

desertcircus

profitius wrote: »

If he was South African or a New Zealander he'd be far higher rated in world rugby.

He's hardly a shrinking violet. He's captained a Heineken Cup-winning team and been selected ahead of a Grand Slam-winning captain to lead the 2009 Lions tour. I'm slightly lost as to who's been underselling him.

profitius

PhatPiggins wrote: »

Do your kids look like DOC ?

?

desertcircus wrote: »

He's hardly a shrinking violet. He's captained a Heineken Cup-winning team and been selected ahead of a Grand Slam-winning captain to lead the 2009 Lions tour. I'm slightly lost as to who's been underselling him.

Last year Lawes and Gray were better than him according to some. There was a big debate about it.

Hagz

profitius wrote: »

?
Last year Lawes and Gray were better than him according to some. There was a big debate about it.

I'd argue that they were in better form not too long ago, but that doesn't mean they're better players, just means they're in form.

vinny chase

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Its great to see an Irish player signing a contract without involving agents and "interest" from France to earn himself a bigger wage and longer deal.

Paul O'Connell has agents, he's represented by BSM like a huge chunk of Irish players. You have no idea as to whether or not he did receive other offers or not either, from France or anywhere, and whether or not he used these as a bargaining chip for the terms of his deal.

phog

vinny chase wrote: »

Paul O'Connell has agents, he's represented by BSM like a huge chunk of Irish players. You have no idea as to whether or not he did receive other offers or not either, from France or anywhere, and whether or not he used these as a bargaining chip for the terms of his deal.

I think the point was we've all read about players supposedly looking at trying out a new life in France (and Miami Dolphins) when it's contract renewal time, in the majority of cases most of the players have stayed put, O'Connell on the other hand seemed to just get on with himself and/or his agent dealing with the IRFU.

I've often wondered should the IRFU have let one of the players slip away and see how many more fly that kite again.

profitius

Hagz wrote: »

I'd argue that they were in better form not too long ago, but that doesn't mean they're better players, just means they're in form.

They were alright, when POC was out injured!

vinny chase

phog wrote: »

I think the point was we've all read about players supposedly looking at trying out a new life in France (and Miami Dolphins) when it's contract renewal time, in the majority of cases most of the players have stayed put, O'Connell on the other hand seemed to just get on with himself and/or his agent dealing with the IRFU.

I've often wondered should the IRFU have let one of the players slip away and see how many more fly that kite again.

I doubt it was always just rumour-mongering from some of the players involved.

Specifically, Sexton, Kearney & Heaslip; they were all young enough that weren't at a point of being anywhere close to earning a rebate so if they could have moved at that point for a substantially higher salary than they'd earn in Ireland, it probably wouldn't have been hugely financially different for them to do it one way or another.

I also don't doubt there was legitimate interest in those three players from French clubs at the time when it was touted, as they are all exactly the sort of player who would thrive in French rugby.

And, as I stated, we don't actually know what negotiating tack O'Connell's people took in this negotiation with the IRFU, so the speculation is just pointless in any event.

phog

vinny chase wrote: »

I doubt it was always just rumour-mongering from some of the players involved.

Specifically, Sexton, Kearney & Heaslip; they were all young enough that weren't at a point of being anywhere close to earning a rebate so if they could have moved at that point for a substantially higher salary than they'd earn in Ireland, it probably wouldn't have been hugely financially different for them to do it one way or another.

I also don't doubt there was legitimate interest in those three players from French clubs at the time when it was touted, as they are all exactly the sort of player who would thrive in French rugby.

And, as I stated, we don't actually know what negotiating tack O'Connell's people took in this negotiation with the IRFU, so the speculation is just pointless in any event.

Are you not speculating on whether Sexton, Kearney & Heaslip had a real interest in trying out rugby in another country ot kite flying in the hope of a better deal?

PhatPiggins

profitius wrote: »

?



Last year Lawes and Gray were better than him according to some. There was a big debate about it.

I was wondering if their was a non rugby reason to why you dislike O Callaghan so much. I've seen you post at least 45 non complementary comments about him.

Hagz

profitius wrote: »

They were alright, when POC was out injured!

Ho,ha,ho! Very witty indeed!! Happy New Years.

profitius

PhatPiggins wrote: »

I was wondering if their was a non rugby reason to why you dislike O Callaghan so much. I've seen you post at least 45 non complementary comments about him.

I think hes gone past his best. Thats all. None of my comments were anything personal they all have to do with rugby. DOC seems to be a nice fella and is popular.

CIARAN_BOYLE

profitius wrote: »

I think hes gone past his best. Thats all. None of my comments were anything personal they all have to do with rugby. DOC seems to be a nice fella and is popular.

He is still a good player but I have to agree that a three year deal (central contract so high enough wages) for a 32 year old who seems to have began decline and whose form is intermittent is comedic at best.

buck65

Correct me if I'm wrong here - Central contracts are given to aprox 30 players who are consistently in the Irish squad?
Why such surprise that O Callaghan got a 3 year contract a year ago, would it not be expected that he would be on the panel for the remainder of this season and next season? He is still starting most of Ireland's games remember.
Can't really understand the fuss.

Burgo

buck65 wrote: »

Correct me if I'm wrong here - Central contracts are given to aprox 30 players who are consistently in the Irish squad?
Why such surprise that O Callaghan got a 3 year contract a year ago, would it not be expected that he would be on the panel for the remainder of this season and next season? He is still starting most of Ireland's games remember.
Can't really understand the fuss.

Didn't he get the contract when he was playing pretty poorly? I thought that was the reason quite a few people were unhappy with it.

phog

Burgo wrote: »

Didn't he get the contract when he was playing pretty poorly? I thought that was the reason quite a few people were unhappy with it.

In whose opinion? A few internet posters or the team managment of both Ireland and Munster?

Zzippy

phog wrote: »

In whose opinion? A few internet posters or the team managment of both Ireland and Munster?

In fairness it was a lot more than a few internet posters, it was a common topic of debate amongst rugby people around the country - never mind online - as to why DK continued to pick DOC when Cullen, McCarthy and Tuohy were all in much better form. You could arguably add Toner to that list this year, but it seems that no matter how well any of the others play DOC will get the starting berth.

phog

Zzippy wrote: »

In fairness it was a lot more than a few internet posters, it was a common topic of debate amongst rugby people around the country - never mind online - as to why DK continued to pick DOC when Cullen, McCarthy and Tuohy were all in much better form. You could arguably add Toner to that list this year, but it seems that no matter how well any of the others play DOC will get the starting berth.

Impossible to quantify really. What is certain is that rugby players have more analysis done now than ever before, players are measured in training and during games, I know if I was handing out contracts I'd be lead by those that have the facts rather than whatever amount of rugby supporters around the country may say. If you were to believe some rugby supporters you'd be dropping Heaslip after the world cup he is supposed to have such a poor tournament.

Zzippy

phog wrote: »

Impossible to quantify really. What is certain is that rugby players have more analysis done now than ever before, players are measured in training and during games, I know if I was handing out contracts I'd be lead by those that have the facts rather than whatever amount of rugby supporters around the country may say. If you were to believe some rugby supporters you'd be dropping Heaslip after the world cup he is supposed to have such a poor tournament.

Careful now, you're starting to sound like a certain IRFU employee from around these parts!