Drink driving charge.

aimsirbia

Hey all
Firstly, sorry I'm not really sure how to start a thread on this forum ...so i'm "intercepting" this space for my own gain!! Cutting to the point, I face a drink driving charge to which I have to admit my stupidity/guilt - hands up, i've been burned and am happy to learn from this one no doubt. I seriously need informed advice about one aspect, I'm in college full time and will start a part time job soon (thankfully) and am confused as to whether getting a solicitor will "make a difference". It's my first offence and am on a provisional licence. It seems the penalty is fixed so would money spent getting legal representation make a difference. Am quite pressed for cash so need to weigh up my options. Thanks for yer advice, stay safe

Alanstrainor

Moved to a new thread.

robbie_998

i wouldnt see it worth while spending money on a solicitor to be honest.


all you can do is stand up in court and say sorry and hope they go lightly on you.

ResearchWill

aimsirbia wrote: »

Hey all
Firstly, sorry I'm not really sure how to start a thread on this forum ...so i'm "intercepting" this space for my own gain!! Cutting to the point, I face a drink driving charge to which I have to admit my stupidity/guilt - hands up, i've been burned and am happy to learn from this one no doubt. I seriously need informed advice about one aspect, I'm in college full time and will start a part time job soon (thankfully) and am confused as to whether getting a solicitor will "make a difference". It's my first offence and am on a provisional licence. It seems the penalty is fixed so would money spent getting legal representation make a difference. Am quite pressed for cash so need to weigh up my options. Thanks for yer advice, stay safe

Drink Driving law is one of the most technical areas of law. A solicitor may very well see a defence you do not see. Ask around as to who is good, ring them up explain your situation and how much is the max you can spend, you may be surprised.

Seth Brundle

Before any high horse brigade posters arrive please read the Op's point that "hands up, i've been burned and am happy to learn from this one no doubt".

Answer the OP if you wish but no posts saying "serves you right", etc.

daenerysstormborn3

If you're happy not to bother with a defence and admit your guilt then I don't see the point in putting yourself to the expense of hiring a solicitor. In fairness if you were interested in "getting off" which you say you're not, a decent solicitor could pick a hole somewhere and as it's your first offence you'd probably walk away.

You'll more than likely get a slap on the wrist, donation to the poor box type punishment, nothing mega.

L-M

Out of curiousity OP, was it the "morning after" or did you have a few pints and go driving?

I went into a court house once for a nosey and there was an appealed case granted where someone had gotten a job and needed there licence back for said job, or than that I haven't a clue and hope to never have to

mathepac

robbie_998 wrote: »

i wouldnt see it worth while spending money on a solicitor to be honest...

OP IMHO this is extremely bad advice, verging on idiocy in point of fact.

You need someone who is au fait with the entire process to be able to plead your case eloquently before the court. I suggest you are in need of legal advice and representation in the worst way possible. As an alleged drunk driver on a learner's permit on your own in court it could go very badly for you.

If you have to beg or borrow the money get the best solicitor you can and if he/she needs to get a barrister's opinion of options / legalities, go with their suggestion.

Best of luck.

ResearchWill

aimsirbia wrote: »

Hey all
Firstly, sorry I'm not really sure how to start a thread on this forum ...so i'm "intercepting" this space for my own gain!! Cutting to the point, I face a drink driving charge to which I have to admit my stupidity/guilt - hands up, i've been burned and am happy to learn from this one no doubt. I seriously need informed advice about one aspect, I'm in college full time and will start a part time job soon (thankfully) and am confused as to whether getting a solicitor will "make a difference". It's my first offence and am on a provisional licence. It seems the penalty is fixed so would money spent getting legal representation make a difference. Am quite pressed for cash so need to weigh up my options. Thanks for yer advice, stay safe

pixiebean22 wrote: »

If you're happy not to bother with a defence and admit your guilt then I don't see the point in putting yourself to the expense of hiring a solicitor. In fairness if you were interested in "getting off" which you say you're not, a decent solicitor could pick a hole somewhere and as it's your first offence you'd probably walk away.

You'll more than likely get a slap on the wrist, donation to the poor box type punishment, nothing mega.

Drink Driving is all or nothing. If guilty then minimum penalty is off the road, no poor box or slap on the wrist.

daenerysstormborn3

ResearchWill wrote: »

Drink Driving is all or nothing. If guilty then minimum penalty is off the road, no poor box or slap on the wrist.

Okay then.

daltonmd

See here the new guidelines regarding the offence.
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/driving_offences/drink_driving_offences_in_ireland.html

"Administrative penalty system
If you hold a valid licence/permit at the time of the offence and your alcohol level is below a certain limit, you will be issued with a fixed penalty notice. If you pay the fine stated on the notice within 28 days, the additional penalty stated on the notice will be imposed but you will not have to go to court. You are not eligible for a drink driving fixed penalty notice if you have received a similar notice within the previous 3 years. The alcohol limits and penalties applied under the fixed penalty notice scheme are as set out below:"

If it's fixed then it looks fairly straight forward to be honest, no need for a solicitor if you pay the fine within 28 days.

daenerysstormborn3

daltonmd wrote: »

See here the new guidelines regarding the offence.
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/driving_offences/drink_driving_offences_in_ireland.html

"Administrative penalty system
If you hold a valid licence/permit at the time of the offence and your alcohol level is below a certain limit, you will be issued with a fixed penalty notice. If you pay the fine stated on the notice within 28 days, the additional penalty stated on the notice will be imposed but you will not have to go to court. You are not eligible for a drink driving fixed penalty notice if you have received a similar notice within the previous 3 years. The alcohol limits and penalties applied under the fixed penalty notice scheme are as set out below:"

If it's fixed then it looks fairly straight forward to be honest, no need for a solicitor if you pay the fine within 28 days.

As per this post, just pay the fine.

seanybiker

I pleaded guilty when I got caught. Didn't even have to turn up in court as I was pleading guilty. Solicitor rang to tell me what I already knew.
400 fine and 3 years off the road. Dunno where some people get this first offence you'll be grand milarky.

JustLen

OP you would want to be crazy to go in with no solicitor. ignore conflicting posts as they are simply untrue. if you have been summonsed to court then the fixed penalty option above doesn't apply.

There are many factors that could help your case, were you breathalysed at a checkpoint or were you pulled? this is apart from how bad it looks walking in without a solicitor.

The fact that you are on a permit doesnt help and as mentioned without representation you could be torn apart, aside from that the garda/inspector are liable to say anything.you wont stand a chance.

you'll be glad to hear that if you dress smart and get a solicitor to explain you need your car for studying as well as work its unlikely you will lose your license

ResearchWill

JustLen wrote: »

OP you would want to be crazy to go in with no solicitor. ignore conflicting posts as they are simply untrue. if you have been summonsed to court then the fixed penalty option above doesn't apply.

There are many factors that could help your case, were you breathalysed at a checkpoint or were you pulled? this is apart from how bad it looks walking in without a solicitor.

The fact that you are on a permit doesnt help and as mentioned without representation you could be torn apart, aside from that the garda/inspector are liable to say anything.you wont stand a chance.

you'll be glad to hear that if you dress smart and get a solicitor to explain you need your car for studying as well as work its unlikely you will lose your license

If the matter is before a court, and the OP pleads or is found guilty he will be banned. Drink Driving has a minimum mandatory ban depending on level, there is no way around this.

JustLen

seanybiker wrote: »

I pleaded guilty when I got caught. Didn't even have to turn up in court as I was pleading guilty. Solicitor rang to tell me what I already knew.
400 fine and 3 years off the road. Dunno where some people get this first offence you'll be grand milarky.

:rolleyes: Just goes to show the importance of attending and making a good impression OP

robbie_998

JustLen wrote: »

OP you would want to be crazy to go in with no solicitor. ignore conflicting posts as they are simply untrue. if you have been summonsed to court then the fixed penalty option above doesn't apply.

There are many factors that could help your case, were you breathalysed at a checkpoint or were you pulled? this is apart from how bad it looks walking in without a solicitor.

The fact that you are on a permit doesnt help and as mentioned without representation you could be torn apart, aside from that the garda/inspector are liable to say anything.you wont stand a chance.

you'll be glad to hear that if you dress smart and get a solicitor to explain you need your car for studying as well as work its unlikely you will lose your license

But sure he was caught drink driving. theres no excuse for it (not going against op, just like to make a point)

arguing it could piss a judge off and the op rightly already said he knows what he did was wrong and is sorry.

A judge would probably be happier if he said "yes i was under the influence while driving and im very sorry" rather than mucking about with solicitors and so on to try and fight something we all know he will be punished for no matter what.

daenerysstormborn3

OP doesn't actually mention being summonsed to Court aside from asking should he get legal representation. Maybe he/she could clarify this?

daltonmd

From 28 October 2011 (through the Road Traffic Act 2010) the penalties for drink driving offences are changed.
OP says it's his first offence and that the penalty is fixed - under the new guidelines he has to pay a fine and/or a ban depending on how over the limit he was....

Tigger

admit nothing get a brief

always

people get off on all sorts of reasons all the time

daenerysstormborn3

robbie_998 wrote: »

But sure he was caught drink driving. theres no excuse for it (not going against op, just like to make a point)

arguing it could piss a judge off and the op rightly already said he knows what he did was wrong and is sorry.

A judge would probably be happier if he said "yes i was under the influence while driving and im very sorry" rather than mucking about with solicitors and so on to try and fight something we all know he will be punished for no matter what.

Judges don't really operate like that. As I said before a decent solicitor could probably get you off.

seanybiker

JustLen wrote: »

:rolleyes: Just goes to show the importance of attending and making a good impression OP

Roll your eyes all you want. If you read my post you will see that since I was pleading guilty I didn't need to turn up.

robbie_998

pixiebean22 wrote: »

Judges don't really operate like that. As I said before a decent solicitor could probably get you off.

but they wouldn't as he was caught drink driving regardless of type of license.

i dont agree with this whole first offense "ah sure its grand" milark !

The fact is he was caught and there will be a minimum penalty regardless.


I would like to know if the OP has being summoned or is just getting a standard fine before we speculate further.

JustLen

robbie_998 wrote: »

A judge would probably be happier if he said "yes i was under the influence while driving and im very sorry" rather than mucking about with solicitors and so on to try and fight something we all know he will be punished for no matter what.

Fair enough, the point i was trying to make was that there's always a chance with a solicitor, ie a technacallity
This doesn't apply to the OP really anyway as he appears not to have any intention of fighting it.
Also made the presumption they were summonsed when they actually didn't make it clear

JustLen

seanybiker wrote: »

Roll your eyes all you want. If you read my post you will see that since I was pleading guilty I didn't need to turn up.

Did you get the minimum punishment or was it much harsher? not trying to be smart btw

daenerysstormborn3

robbie_998 wrote: »

but they wouldn't as he was caught drink driving regardless of type of license.

i dont agree with this whole first offense "ah sure its grand" milark !

The fact is he was caught and there will be a minimum penalty regardless.

I would like to know if the OP has being summoned or is just getting a standard fine before we speculate further.

I'm not referring to the type of licence or whether it's his first offence, a decent solicitor could get you off. There's a barrister in the South East and he is brilliant at this kind of stuff.

I don't think anybody is debating a minimum penalty, as per the information posted by daltonmd twice now, it's whether he has actually been summoned before the Court that is causing confusion as regards the penalty.

daltonmd

pixiebean22 wrote: »

I'm not referring to the type of licence or whether it's his first offence, a decent solicitor could get you off. There's a barrister in the South East and he is brilliant at this kind of stuff.

I don't think anybody is debating a minimum penalty, as per the information posted by daltonmd twice now, it's whether he has actually been summoned before the Court that is causing confusion as regards the penalty.

Pixie, he said it was a fixed penalty, looking at it as it's his first offence he will get a 200 euro fine and 3 months off the road. That's what it looks like to me...

seanybiker

JustLen wrote: »

Did you get the minimum punishment or was it much harsher? not trying to be smart btw

Don't really know to be honest because I don't know the normal punishment.
I knew I acted the bollox by drink driving so I decided, feck it I done it before and now I got caught. I can either take it on the chin and own up to it and take the kick in the arse or in can get off on a technicality and possibly do it again. Decided a kick in the arse and pocket would do me so pleaded guilty. Can apply for it back end of Feb. If I get it fair enough, if not then its only me to blame so ill see what happens.
I got blood results of 186. I think 150 was automatic 3 years at the time.

robbie_998

pixiebean22 wrote: »

I'm not referring to the type of licence or whether it's his first offence, a decent solicitor could get you off. There's a barrister in the South East and he is brilliant at this kind of stuff.

I don't think anybody is debating a minimum penalty, as per the information posted by daltonmd twice now, it's whether he has actually been summoned before the Court that is causing confusion as regards the penalty.

agreed

i would like to put a point to you though.

i would just like to state that im not trying to jump on the high horse here and put him down for this by any means and i am sorry if this comes across that way.

but

do you think the op should be let off the hook with this ?

he has admit himself what he did was wrong and he wants to learn from it which is great but should s/he be just let away with it in your opinion ?


i do believe in fair judgement and all sorts and if the OP needs his/her vehicle for work purposes then no problem let her/him drive but still slap then a penalty but i dont think they should be let away completely.


kinda reminds me of Liar Liar with Jim Carey !

daenerysstormborn3

daltonmd wrote: »

Pixie, he said it was a fixed penalty, looking at it as it's his first offence he will get a 200 euro fine and 3 months off the road. That's what it looks like to me...

Yeah that's what it looks like to me too.

robbie_998 wrote: »

agreed

i would like to put a point to you though.

i would just like to state that im not trying to jump on the high horse here and put him down for this by any means and i am sorry if this comes across that way.

but

do you think the op should be let off the hook with this ?

he has admit himself what he did was wrong and he wants to learn from it which is great but should s/he be just let away with it in your opinion ?

i do believe in fair judgement and all sorts and if the OP needs his/her vehicle for work purposes then no problem let her/him drive but still slap then a penalty but i dont think they should be let away completely.

kinda reminds me of Liar Liar with Jim Carey !

My opinion is from the legal side of things and everybody has the right to legal representation and in these type of cases there is a high rate of trip ups with the summons, with the procedure carried out by the gardai, that sort of thing and if a solicitor/barrister is representing somebody and finds one of these then it's up to them to work it out for the benefit of their client.

JustLen

seanybiker wrote: »

I got blood results of 186. I think 150 was automatic 3 years at the time.

reason I asked is because it seemed harsh but 186 is pretty high

do you think the op should be let off the hook with this ?

I don't think anybody would. Coming from someone who has been a victim in a pretty bad road accident where the the driver responsible was drunk id be against it myself as would any responsible person.

However if he wanted to fight it (its clear he doesn't) than I wouldn't blame him. Im not a judge. The justice system fails all the time we all see it but thats off topic

seanybiker

JustLen wrote: »

reason I asked is because it seemed harsh but 186 is pretty high

High enough I suppose. Being on two wheels probably didn't help either

kerplunkit

hey, i think some kind of professional legal advice is probably a good thing, even if its just over the phone, having some kind of idea of what you'll be facing when you're in court can't really hurt, can it?

Eoin

daltonmd wrote: »

See here the new guidelines regarding the offence.
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/driving_offences/drink_driving_offences_in_ireland.html

"Administrative penalty system
If you hold a valid licence/permit at the time of the offence and your alcohol level is below a certain limit, you will be issued with a fixed penalty notice. If you pay the fine stated on the notice within 28 days, the additional penalty stated on the notice will be imposed but you will not have to go to court. You are not eligible for a drink driving fixed penalty notice if you have received a similar notice within the previous 3 years. The alcohol limits and penalties applied under the fixed penalty notice scheme are as set out below:"

If it's fixed then it looks fairly straight forward to be honest, no need for a solicitor if you pay the fine within 28 days.

About the part above that I've put in bold text: if the OP was driving without a fully licensed driver, could that mean that s/he did not have a valid license at the time of the offence?

ottostreet

I wouldn't dream of showing up in court for such an offence without a solicitor. Drink driving is not a minor charge, and together with being on a provisional and unaccompanied....you'd be a foolish man to go without legal help.

slimjimmc

OP, you received a fixed penalty notice which will keep you out of court if you pay it and accept the ban. There is nothing legal representation can do unless you go to court so if you accept the fixed penalty you don't even need legal representation.

On the other hand you are free to contest the DD charge in court, in which case I recommend you get yourself legal representation. If you are convicted in court even the minimum penalties are much higher and you'll have to pay for your solicitor.


[edit]
OP has since clarified she has received a summons hence the above statement is irrelevant - please ignore at will.

Going to court for a serious offence - get a solicitor.
[/edit]

aimsirbia

JustLen wrote: »

OP you would want to be crazy to go in with no solicitor. ignore conflicting posts as they are simply untrue. if you have been summonsed to court then the fixed penalty option above doesn't apply.

There are many factors that could help your case, were you breathalysed at a checkpoint or were you pulled? this is apart from how bad it looks walking in without a solicitor.

The fact that you are on a permit doesnt help and as mentioned without representation you could be torn apart, aside from that the garda/inspector are liable to say anything.you wont stand a chance.

you'll be glad to hear that if you dress smart and get a solicitor to explain you need your car for studying as well as work its unlikely you will lose your license

Needless to say that (very pertinent) issue of my having only a learner permit has been weighing on my mind. I wasn't sure if this can be raised in court despite no mention of it from any member of the gardaí at period of time in question. Reading your post, it seems possible anything at all could be introduced at the court hearing. I will bit the bullet, get a solicitor and count my lucky stars that the only consequences here are to myself. (and no, i wasn't drunk by any means but nonetheless over the limit). Thanks to everyone for offering advice, do yourselves a favour & learn from my oversight, all the best for 2012 )

MugMugs

Don't look for advice on such a serious matter off strangers on an internet forum. Speak to a professional, your solicitor. And best of luck too..... Can't imagine what you're going through.

aimsirbia

robbie_998 wrote: »

but they wouldn't as he was caught drink driving regardless of type of license.

i dont agree with this whole first offense "ah sure its grand" milark !

The fact is he was caught and there will be a minimum penalty regardless.


I would like to know if the OP has being summoned or is just getting a standard fine before we speculate further.

yes, i have been summoned, isn't that standard?

aimsirbia

i'm female by the way!!

aimsirbia

MugMugs wrote: »

Don't look for advice on such a serious matter off strangers on an internet forum. Speak to a professional, your solicitor. And best of luck too..... Can't imagine what you're going through.

that's a really fair point, just given the time of the year it's hard to get in touch with anybody. strangely just a couple of weeks ago, i saw a poster publicising legal advice clinics run by the ucc legal society, so i'll drop into that first thing next week to see if they could recommend somebody. all the best

Galwayguy35

aimsirbia wrote: »

Hey all
Firstly, sorry I'm not really sure how to start a thread on this forum ...so i'm "intercepting" this space for my own gain!! Cutting to the point, I face a drink driving charge to which I have to admit my stupidity/guilt - hands up, i've been burned and am happy to learn from this one no doubt. I seriously need informed advice about one aspect, I'm in college full time and will start a part time job soon (thankfully) and am confused as to whether getting a solicitor will "make a difference". It's my first offence and am on a provisional licence. It seems the penalty is fixed so would money spent getting legal representation make a difference. Am quite pressed for cash so need to weigh up my options. Thanks for yer advice, stay safe

I got caught myself when i was 23. Like you i was undecided as to whether i would bother with a solicitor. In the end i did and as it was my first and only time in a courthouse i was glad he was there as its an intimidating place for an ordinary person. It was hard being off the road at the time but i learned from my mistake. We are all only human.

aimsirbia

pixiebean22 wrote: »

OP doesn't actually mention being summonsed to Court aside from asking should he get legal representation. Maybe he/she could clarify this?

yes, i have been summoned to attend court.

aimsirbia

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

I got caught myself when i was 23. Like you i was undecided as to whether i would bother with a solicitor. In the end i did and as it was my first and only time in a courthouse i was glad he was there as its an intimidating place for an ordinary person. It was hard being off the road at the time but i learned from my mistake. We are all only human.

ya definitely one of those things that offers serious life experience anyway.ta

ResearchWill

aimsirbia wrote: »

that's a really fair point, just given the time of the year it's hard to get in touch with anybody. strangely just a couple of weeks ago, i saw a poster publicising legal advice clinics run by the ucc legal society, so i'll drop into that first thing next week to see if they could recommend somebody. all the best

The SU in UCC have a solicitor who deals with students who have legal issues. The consultation is free, he will then tell you if you have a chance of fighting etc.

Contact the SU the Welfare Officer, should be able to help. The Union are a good bunch and will be able to help you out.

Galwayguy35

aimsirbia wrote: »

ya definitely one of those things that offers serious life experience anyway.ta

Not sure how it works now as i was caught in 1997 but that time the severity of the ban went by the amount of booze in the system. I crashed as well so i got the book thrown at me but a solicitor will explain all that to you before the court date anyway.

ResearchWill

aimsirbia wrote: »

Needless to say that (very pertinent) issue of my having only a learner permit has been weighing on my mind. I wasn't sure if this can be raised in court despite no mention of it from any member of the gardaí at period of time in question. Reading your post, it seems possible anything at all could be introduced at the court hearing. I will bit the bullet, get a solicitor and count my lucky stars that the only consequences here are to myself. (and no, i wasn't drunk by any means but nonetheless over the limit). Thanks to everyone for offering advice, do yourselves a favour & learn from my oversight, all the best for 2012 )

How many summons did you get, have you been summonsed for no licence etc. to be honest it will make no difference that you are on leaners permit, may be an extra fine but that's it, most DJ's will take it into account in a DD case.

In relation to what can be introduced at the court hearing, what happens if you are pleading to the DD charge your solicitor will have a chat with the Guard about what he will be saying. If you are fighting then your solicitor will before the hearing get a copy of the Garda statements so you will have a very good idea of what will be said by the Garda.

HellFireClub

ResearchWill wrote: »

Drink Driving law is one of the most technical areas of law. A solicitor may very well see a defence you do not see. Ask around as to who is good, ring them up explain your situation and how much is the max you can spend, you may be surprised.

I was in court the other day at the Bridewell there behind the Four Courts and 30 cases were thrown out in a row because either the Garda didn't turn up, or else both parties didn't turn up.

Topper Harley

I wouldn't plead guilty straight away. I'd wait until I'd spoken to a solicitor with experience in these matters. A solicitor will be able to advise you on the routine of what will happen and advise on whether or not you may be able to get off on a technicality. If the solicitor doesn't think you can get off and the Garda turns up, then you can start thinking about pleading guilty.

And I don't mean to make you feel worse but keep in mind that when your ban is up and you try to get insurance with a learner permit and a previous conviction on your licence, you will be savaged. I think there's something like a five year probationary period with insurance companies. So just beware of this as well while you consider whether or not to get a solicitor.

ieoinu

Given your financial circumstances you may be entitled to Free Legal Aid. Get a Solr to plead your case, won't make any difference to period of disqualification but will to your fine.

ResearchWill

ieoinu wrote: »

Given your financial circumstances you may be entitled to Free Legal Aid. Get a Solr to plead your case, won't make any difference to period of disqualification but will to your fine.

After the recent SC case, it may well be possible the get legal aid for DD, but to be honest almost impossible. I don't think I have ever seen legal aid granted for a DD case. But sure no harm asking especially after the Joyce case.