Kempton 27th december

newuser89

Lads the treble of the year I think is at Kenton this day.10 euro on peddlers,grands crus and rock on ruby to win will get you 165 back.i expect them all to win fairly well.forget about binocular only danger is overturn in the hurdle

Plentyofice

Unbelievably competitive

Grand Crus and Bobs worth is a cracker
Peddlers and Sprinter sacre is a cracker
Rock on ruby was brill last time. Binocular will come on a tonne for last run. He's sticking over 2 miles whilst Henderson has move Sprinter, oscar whickey etc chasing or long distance hurdling..

Best of luck

NaiveMelodies

I'm seriously contemplating a Long Run, Rubi Light and Binocular treble.

Huntey

newuser89 wrote: »

Lads the treble of the year I think is at Kenton this day.10 euro on peddlers,grands crus and rock on ruby to win will get you 165 back.i expect them all to win fairly well.forget about binocular only danger is overturn in the hurdle

What makes you think they will all win "fairly well"? Maybe you could give a description as to why you think they have an advantage over the other major fancies in the fields?

Binocular is inconsistent but totally discarding him is a little naive.

Good Luck

ste2010

Ive backed big zeb, overturn and grands crus in a treble! Would have thrown peddlers cross In there If I could get a price at the time!
Big zeb and grands crus should win...overturn I have no questions over... but how good rock on ruby is will be on full display.. is ROR 4L worse off than grandouet! Woll binocular wreck my life and perform again just when he feels like it! In an of the topic note WTF is the story with fly in Istabraq hurdle!? Has anyone heard anything

newuser89

Peddlers is a better horse than sprinter sacre in my opinion.has the speed bar a hurricane fly in the field and has won over two and a half miles in hurdles races.so as long as theres no accidents he should win. Rock on ruby is on the upgrade and binocular is on the decline since his champ hurdle win.i like overturn but being a front runner I think he can be picked off by rock on ruby.grand crus would be my least confident selection just because I'm not sure how gd bobs worth is but because of grands crus staying hurdle form and his impressive chasing start and that cue card should of beaten bobs worth I've sided with grand crus.

RichieLawlor

BJG is mad on Sprinter Sacre

UrbanSea

Some cracking racing Stephen's Day.

Anyone fancy Wayward Prince in the handicap chase at Wetherby?

Johner

Peddlers Cross 11/10 is the bet for me. Probably double up with Grands Crus.

Colonel Sanders

While I am a Grand Crus fan I'm not 100% sure that he's great value at 5/4 or 11/8.

Firstly the opposition are no mugs. While Grand Crus was highest rated over hurdles and hasn't done much wrong over fences his record right handed is "only" 722. On closer examination it was 3 of his first 5 runs under rules and he made staggering progress since. But fact is Bobs Worth has won twice at Kempton. Pipe has also suggested he'd want the ground a but softer whereas Bob's Worth will love decent ground (don't think he's run on soft)

Add in Mr Moonshine and Silviniaco and while I think he will end up the best chaser among the bunch he may not be one I'll steam into at a short price

Harry Angstrom

Binocular is a great price at 2/1 for the Christmas Hurdle. He'll improve a lot for his Newcastle run and I think he'll turn the tables on Overturn. Rock On Ruby has plenty to prove. He'd be a much bigger price if he wasn't representing the Nicholls/Walsh combo. Thanks to this, Binocular is a very backable price.

Colonel Sanders

Harry Angstrom wrote: »

Binocular is a great price at 2/1 for the Christmas Hurdle. He'll improve a lot for his Newcastle run and I think he'll turn the tables on Overturn. Rock On Ruby has plenty to prove. He'd be a much bigger price if he wasn't representing the Nicholls/Walsh combo. Thanks to this, Binocular is a very backable price.

I'm half tempted to go in the same direction. Whereas Binocular hasn't looked the same horse as the one that hacked up in 2010 champion hurdle he still hammered Overturn here (who may have improved slightly since).

Not one for the rent money but I may well have a small bet on him on the 26th

Morgans

I've liked Mr. Moonshine since the start of the year, and he probably doenst have the scope to be an all-aged Grade 1 winner like some of the others in the field, but 22/1 is the wrong price. I thought his run in the Peterborough was very solid considering he led the field at a breakneck pace and was over too short a trip. I think he will lead a long way here and has more chase form in the book than some others at shorter prices. I'd rate him at about 8/1. 5/1 to place on betfair as well to no money at the moment.

For all that it is a fine clash. Bobs Worth has huge potential and he might show it here, but not convinced by the Newbury win.

Colonel Sanders

Morgans wrote: »

I've liked Mr. Moonshine since the start of the year, and he probably doenst have the scope to be an all-aged Grade 1 winner like some of the others in the field, but 22/1 is the wrong price. I thought his run in the Peterborough was very solid considering he led the field at a breakneck pace and was over too short a trip. I think he will lead a long way here and has more chase form in the book than some others at shorter prices. I'd rate him at about 8/1. 5/1 to place on betfair as well to no money at the moment.

For all that it is a fine clash. Bobs Worth has huge potential and he might show it here, but not convinced by the Newbury win.

While I can't say I'll back either I was thinking similar thoughts about Mr Moonshine and also possibly Teaforthree (although might need a more testing 3m)

With 2 outsiders possibly over priced it helps to add to my thoughts that Grand Crus may well win but is a bit on the short side

Harry Angstrom

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

I'm half tempted to go in the same direction. Whereas Binocular hasn't looked the same horse as the one that hacked up in 2010 champion hurdle he still hammered Overturn here (who may have improved slightly since).

Not one for the rent money but I may well have a small bet on him on the 26th

I'm a bit confused with McCain's approach with Overturn. After he won the Ascot Hurdle, he said they'd put him away until the Cheltenham Festival. Then the following week they run him in the Fighting Fifth, then the Bula, and now they're turning him out again in the Christmas Hurdle. Clearly he isn't anywhere near good enough to win a Champion Hurdle so they're probably trying to mop up these trials but I think Binocular was seriously undercooked at Newcastle when he went under to him. I was surprised by McCoy's comment afterwards that Binocular is beginning to disappoint. The horse hasn't won first time out for the past 3 seasons but always improves for a first run, like a lot of Henderson's horses. Admittedly, he won a poor enough Champion Hurdle but he looks a real cut above this lot for the Christmas Hurdle.

Colonel Sanders

Harry Angstrom wrote: »

I'm a bit confused with McCain's approach with Overturn. After he won the Ascot Hurdle, he said they'd put him away until the Cheltenham Festival. Then the following week they run him in the Fighting Fifth, then the Bula, and now they're turning him out again in the Christmas Hurdle. Clearly he isn't anywhere near good enough to win a Champion Hurdle so they're probably trying to mop up these trials but I think Binocular was seriously undercooked at Newcastle when he went under to him. I was surprised by McCoy's comment afterwards that Binocular is beginning to disappoint. The horse hasn't won first time out for the past 3 seasons but always improves for a first run, like a lot of Henderson's horses. Admittedly, he won a poor enough Champion Hurdle but he looks a real cut above this lot for the Christmas Hurdle.

Looking at the others:

Overturn - Pretty much agree with you on this one, was smashed by Binocular in this last year. Could easily be OTT at this stage

Rock On Ruby - A horse I respect and is improving from a good novice year. Still has a bit to find on the ratings and possibly needs a bit further. Nicholls spoke about him in the Racingpost on Tuesday (I think) and didn't sound overly optimistic. While if he won it wouldn't be the biggest surprise I can't see how he's favourite in some lists

Sanctuaire - You'd be worried that there won't be the breakneck gallop he probably wants. Is probably at least a few pounds below the best of these and is possibly a bit of a hound

Clerk's Choice - Surely not! His OR has to be flattering at this stage

Huntey

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

Whereas Binocular hasn't looked the same horse as the one that hacked up in 2010 champion hurdle

I disagree with this Colonel, Binocular was never the superstar that many made him out to be.

He won an extremely weak Champion Hurdle and has just been found out at the top end of Grade 1 races. He probably wasn't right the tail end of last year but I don't necessarily think he has declined since his CH win.

Still a very good horse but just not the superstar that many expected, and as a result people think he has drastically underperformed which isn't the case.

Colonel Sanders

Huntey wrote: »

I disagree with this Colonel, Binocular was never the superstar that many made him out to be.

He won an extremely weak Champion Hurdle and has just been found out at the top end of Grade 1 races. He probably wasn't right the tail end of last year but I don't necessarily think he has declined since his CH win.

Still a very good horse but just not the superstar that many expected, and as a result people think he has drastically underperformed which isn't the case.

I agree it was a relatively weak Champion Hurdle but he did hack up

Add in his Christmas Hurdle win last year (against a horse like Overturn, who I'm opposing here but have always hugely respected) and you still have a horse worthy of a rating at least in the mid 160's

Overturn is probably in that ballpark too but was beaten comprehensively last year (and could be OTT now) and while again I respect ROR he still has a few pounds to find and I can't believe he's jolly in some lists

Huntey

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

I agree it was a relatively weak Champion Hurdle but he did hack up

Add in his Christmas Hurdle win last year (against a horse like Overturn, who I'm opposing here but have always hugely respected) and you still have a horse worthy of a rating at least in the mid 160's

Overturn is probably in that ballpark too but was beaten comprehensively last year (and could be OTT now) and while again I respect ROR he still has a few pounds to find and I can't believe he's jolly in some lists

I think a rating of the mid 160's is probably fair, but I'm referring to the view that he has declined since his Champion Hurdle win which probably isn't the case.

I do think Bino has the beating of this field though and have outlined the reasons in my log.

Colonel Sanders

Huntey wrote: »

I do think Bino has the beating of this field though and have outlined the reasons in my log.

Win or lose I think he's the value. With the usual battle for turnover (hopefully ) on the morning of the race you might see 9/4 Binocular which is surely value

Harry Angstrom

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

Win or lose I think he's the value. With the usual battle for turnover (hopefully ) on the morning of the race you might see 9/4 Binocular which is surely value

I think it's important to get on early with Binocular. I reckon the punters will smash into him on-course and he'll be a lot shorter than 2/1 by the time of the off.

Colonel Sanders

Harry Angstrom wrote: »

I think it's important to get on early with Binocular. I reckon the punters will smash into him on-course and he'll be a lot shorter than 2/1 by the time of the off.

He was well backed on Betfair the last 2 years.

In 2009 (when he lost to Go Native) there was a spectacular late move on Betfair

Colonel Sanders

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

He was well backed on Betfair the last 2 years.

In 2009 (when he lost to Go Native) there was a spectacular late move on Betfair

And when I say late I mean in the last 120 seconds before the off

Morgans

I think Binocular is unreliable and will never back him at any price. I think he was the only 2m in his champion hurdle that ran its race. I'd prefer Overturn who wanted it a lot more at Newcastle, and Ruby was on Rock On Ruby at Newbury ahead of a handicap good thing - Empire Levant - I think they think a lot of the horse. I think Nicholls is deliberately quiet on the horse. 2m round Kempton isnt what you would think ideal for him, but he looks to be the one most obviously progressing.

newuser89

Please dont throw your money away on binocular he will be third.

UrbanSea

I just wouldn't be able to bring myself to back Binocular no matter what the price

mdwexford

Binocular needs a decent size field and a breakneck pace to show his best.

Kind of like Rooster Booster did.

Dont agree his Champion Hurdle was poor either.

gudede

I'm really looking forward to some of the racing on Monday and I have done two early bets as I feel the price will come in and there both NR money back bets so I'm covered it they don't run.

Both bets are at Kempton

14:00 - Bobs Worth @ 11/4 (William Hill)
I think 11/4 is a cracking price as I can see him going off below 2/1. The horse has ran seven times under rules and only lost once (a bumper at Kempton). He jumped well on his return to the racing against Cue Card in a 2.4 Mile race. You could argue that the 2.4 miles is on the short side for Bobs Worth and the step back up to 3miles will suit the horse. He is 1/1 in races over 3 miles and that came at last year Cheltenham festival in the Albert Bartlett Novices' Hurdle. The horse also has form at Kempton, he won twice here and came second in a bumper. Here is what Geraghty has said about Bobs Worth.

Geraghty schooled a number of Henderson big guns on Friday, and said in his At The Races blog: "He gave me a very good feel as we jumped the five schooling fences twice, jumped brilliantly, and it was a very nice little sharpener for the big one.

"He was very good and I couldn't have been happier with him. I got the distinct impression that he'd improved a lot for the Newbury chase debut when he just got up to beat Cue Card in the last strides. When he got the bump four out it knocked the wind out of him and he took a good blow. He still managed to beat a good horse that day and he'll be much sharper on Boxing Day. I don't think we know how good this fella is because he's unbeaten since he was second on his bumper debut in February 2010 - and he's been operating at the highest novice level.

He's very laid back about everything but seems to beat whatever's put in front of him. In some respects you could still call him a bit of an unknown. There's no doubt that the move up from two and a half at Newbury to three at Kempton will be much in his favour."

His main rivals are Grand Crus, Silviniaco Conti and Teaforthree. Grand Crus as never won going right handed and the only real grade one horse he raced against was Big Bucks who beat him well both times. He's a good horse but against real grade one horses I think he'll come up short. Teaforthree could be interesing but he was 8th in the Albert Bartlett Novices' Hurdle so Bobs Worth should have him covered on that form but Teaforthree has raced well against Join Together and Restless Harry in chases. It's a pity there isn't 8 running because he would of been a great each way bet then.

14:35 - Rock on Ruby @ 9/4 (Ladbrokes)
I think Rock on Ruby will go off favourite on Monday. In his last race is was priced 6/1 in the afternoon and the money came flooding on him and he went off at 7/2. He was top weight in that race and gave nearly everyone over a stone. I taught the distance would be too short for him and the weight would be a factor but Rock on Ruby pissed it. I taught it was very impressive and the form of that race looks very strong with Raya Star winning last week and Alarazi third, also Empire Levant won by 29 lengths two days before finishing 6 lengths behind Rock on Ruby.

People should know by now that I don't rate Binocular and his form is crap and seeing him last year at Punchestown has made my mind up about him. Overturn is a good horse but isn't going to be winning any of the competitive grade one races at the business end of the season. So at 9/4 Rock on Ruby is worth a punt even though I think he needs further, but Overturn should ensure a strong pace and that will suit Rock on Ruby.

Huntey

mdwexford wrote: »

Dont agree his Champion Hurdle was poor either.

I don't see any evidence to suggest it was anything otherwise.

Colonel Sanders

Binocular is pretty strong in the Christmas Hurdle, 2/1 is drying up. He's 2.94 to lay on Betfair

Long Run relatively weak in the KG, over 6/4 on Betfair with cash for Kauto and Captain Chris

RichieLawlor

gudede wrote: »

His main rivals are Grand Crus, Silviniaco Conti and Teaforthree. Grand Crus as never won going right handed and the only real grade one horse he raced against was Big Bucks who beat him well both times.

Big Bucks is the best jumps horse in training imo so I wouldn't see this as a negative. Personally I think Bobs Worth might outstay him if they go a good clip

mdwexford

Huntey wrote: »

I don't see any evidence to suggest it was anything otherwise.

Khyber Kim had been rock solid prior to the CH and went on to win the Grade 1 hurdle at Aintree.

Zaynar was a good Triumph winner who had progressed that season and who ran a very good race. He has since fallen apart for some reason.

Celestial Halo again a good Triumph winner and the previous years CH runner up.
Went novice chasing next year which didnt pan out and again he seemed to fall out of love with the game.

Starluck who was 2nd in two grade ones and was suited by the pace of the race, Solwhit who was a multiple grade 1 winner.

The time was also very fast.

Look back on any CH from several years ago and you can pick apart most if you want to. It was not a noticably weak renewal.

Huntey

mdwexford wrote: »

Khyber Kim had been rock solid prior to the CH and went on to win the Grade 1 hurdle at Aintree.

Zaynar was a good Triumph winner who had progressed that season and who ran a very good race. He has since fallen apart for some reason.

Celestial Halo again a good Triumph winner and the previous years CH runner up.
Went novice chasing next year which didnt pan out and again he seemed to fall out of love with the game.

Starluck who was 2nd in two grade ones and was suited by the pace of the race, Solwhit who was a multiple grade 1 winner.

The time was also very fast.

Look back on any CH from several years ago and you can pick apart most if you want to. It was not a noticably weak renewal.

Hindsight is a great thing when judging the quality of a race and most of those animals have been thoroughly exposed since that Champion Hurdle.

The form may have been decent prior to the race but all of those you have mentioned have shown to be mediocre animals, Solwhit being the exception and even he was a sick horse at the time.

mdwexford

No grade 1 festival winner is mediocre.

Zaynar and Celestial Halo for some reason just went to pot.
At the time they were much better than they are now.

Morgans

I know what you are saying, and I believe it was Binocular's best day. But I think it was a medicore champion hurdle - against champion hurdle standard. You are certainly taking a very rosy view of the horses behind that day. Celestial Halo and Zaynar had shown some form if you look hard enough Celestial Halo was hammered unplaced in Ireland before Cheltenham and Zaynar was beaten at Kelso. Khyber Kim would have been one of the worst winners and Go Native was the worst favourites.

Hulk Hands

I love Sprinter Sacre as a prospect. Even though he was third in the Supreme Novices, he traveled like the winner for a long way and I firmly believe he was the best horse out of the 4 excellent horses that fought out that race.

He should be much better over fences also, being a big strapping chasing type. He also has serious scope for improvement having ran so few races.

I also like Peddlers Cross as a chaser. But I envisage him going off a very short price tomorrow, which might make Sprinter Sacre a very backable price. Plenty of people rate Peddlers as a banker but I certainly wouldn't be going heavy on him as he is up against a potential future superstar of national hunt

Colonel Sanders

Big punt on Binocular with Overturn the drifter

Colonel Sanders

Grand Crus looked very good there, jumps and travels very well.

Bobs Worth will be a different horse over the RSA but doesn't seem to jump anywhere near well enough

RichieLawlor

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

Grand Crus looked very good there, jumps and travels very well.

Bobs Worth will be a different horse over the RSA but doesn't seem to jump anywhere near well enough

Impressive but ****in Pipe will now want to win tr Gold Cup this year

Colonel Sanders

Nice bet on Binocular there at 2/1.

My only bet so far

mdwexford

Grands Crus was good.

Not sure how Rock On Ruby didnt win that.

Morgans

Think Ruby chickened out of the last. Very nice horse but going as quick as he could. Well done to Binocular to win it again but nothing to be frightened of if Hurricane Fly gets there.

newuser89

Didnt think Walsh was too confident in the horse as he started niggleing too soon.his horse was always goin to stay.if he held on longer it wuda won.it shoulda won only for the last

mdwexford

Binocular wasnt impressive today but he still got in front of a decent yardstick and id love to see him in the Champion Hurdle with a field of 10+, proper good ground and a lightning pace.

Just to see if hes as good as i think under those conditions.

Starting to become a worry that we havent seen HF yet, lot of rumours going round of course given his history.

I thought ROR would definitely outstay them in the straight.

mdwexford

Love to see Kauto do it.

UrbanSea

Absolutely delighted

mdwexford

FCUKING HERO, MACHINE, BEST HORSE EVER

markc1184

Fantastic run!! What a horse!

sonnky

What a legend, 5 King Georges and beats a horse six years his younger! Unreal!

mailburner

we might just have seen the best of all time right there

thought he was past it myself

UrbanSea

I wonder how long it'll take for people to blame Sam.