Pro12: Munster vs Connacht, Mon 26 Dec 7:45pm; Live on TG4

thomond2006

Munster Squad:
D Kilcoyne, W du Preez, M Horan, BJ Botha, J Hayes, S Archer,
D Varley, D Fogarty, S Henry,
D O'Callaghan, I Nagle, M O'Driscoll, B Holland,
T O'Donnell, J Coughlan, N Ronan, P Butler,

D Williams, T O'Leary,
I Keatley, S Deasy,
T Gleeson, K Earls, L Mafi, D Barnes,
L O'Dea, S Scanlon, D Hurley, J Murphy, S Zebo,

POC, Ryan, Murray and ROG all rested. Chambers left out of the squad.

With Ulster away on the following Friday a much more difficult prospect, I think we should rest a lot of the first teamers that have played a lot over the last 3 weeks. Realistically we should be able to beat Connacht with a weakened lineup, plus Connacht might rest players themselves and target their home game against Leinster. This is a good chance to give the kids a run out.

A 4 day turnaround would be a tall ask for players that have started the last 3 games IMO.

I'd like to see:
Horan, Henry, Hayes, DOC, Nagle, Holland, TOD, Butler;
Williams, Keatley, Zebo, Barnes, Earls, O'Dea, Scanlon

Bench: Varley, Kilcoyne, Archer, MOD, Ronan, TOL, Deasy, Hurley

This is probably taking resting players to an extreme and I doubt McGahan will go that for. At the very least I'd like Nagle, Barnes and O'Dea to start.

I'm going to this one and it's gonna be very hard to say goodbye to Hayes.

BBDBB

Im sure at the beginning and end of teh game the John Hayes factor will barely leave a dry eye in the house

On the game I think Connacht look dangerous, Im expecting a fairly tight and attritional first half, low scoring with Munster only just shading it in the final 20

seanin4711

Matt Williams

anyways I reckon a realistic losing bonus point for connacht at least!!!
they way we are playing its only a matter of time before we break our duck!
Winning in Thomond would be a massive boost but traditionally we are beaten before we get on the bus at the sportsground!
We will at least be competitive which is one thing lacking up until Glaws last weekend!
GWAN CONNACHT!!!!!

Fireball07

What's the story with Chambers? Is he injured, did he do something to McGahan, is his contract going to be renewed? Bit strange to see him left out like this...Leamy is rested too?

I miss Hayes already, such a legend.

I'd like to see:

Horan, Varley, Hayes, DOC, Nagle, Holland, TOD, Butler
TOL, Keatley, Zebo, Barnes, Earls, O'Dea, Hurley

Bench: Henry, Kilcoyne, Archer, O'Driscoll, Ronan, Williams, Deasy, Murphy

thomond2006

Munster by 1-10

Fireball07 wrote: »

What's the story with Chambers? Is he injured, did he do something to McGahan, is his contract going to be renewed? Bit strange to see him left out like this...Leamy is rested too?

Well he played the full 80 against Moseley so I don't think he's injured. (http://www.munsterrugby.ie/rugby/9827.php)

I don't think his contract will be renewed. I think there was a story back when he arrived that he had a Japanese club lined up once his sojourn at Munster ended. I don't know if that's true or not.

buck65

Better off not playing him if he is leaving, to me Chambers looked very raw and needs a year or two of good coaching to be HCup level, something he won't get in Munster.
Would expect to see something like the team that played Edinburgh with a strong bench if things are going badly.
Connacht really don't perform in Thomond hopefully we will see the Connacht from Kingsholm.

Robbo

Jaysus, I can't look at that picture of Hayes without seeing Al Murray's Pub Landlord.

No real Connacht news today in the Advertiser about this match. Thinking back to last weekend, McCrea, McCarthy and Muldoon would have picked up knocks.

seanin4711

Matt Williams

don't fancy our chances of a good performance without Macca and mul.

tommycahir

anybody know if this is on RTE or TG4?

Benny Cake

Munster by 1-10

tommycahir wrote: »

anybody know if this is on RTE or TG4?

TG4

ouncer

mcccrea out for sure. either tonetti or vainikolo in at 14. sadly connacht do not have the option to rest players as suggested above. there is a limit to their ability and as such the first 15 will play every weekend based on their fitness. there are few alternates and I would be interested if members can suggest potential first team members other than has been selected to date. Yes I have bitched about 9 and 10 but have we an alternate or a potential signing we have missed

would be great to have choice that munster has. watched zebo many times at u-20 for ireland and that guy is a star of the future. I rate him equal to earls today.

cityman 18

Connacht by 10+

ouncer wrote: »

mcccrea out for sure. either tonetti or vainikolo in at 14. sadly connacht do not have the option to rest players as suggested above. there is a limit to their ability and as such the first 15 will play every weekend based on their fitness. there are few alternates and I would be interested if members can suggest potential first team members other than has been selected to date. Yes I have bitched about 9 and 10 but have we an alternate or a potential signing we have missed

would be great to have choice that munster has. watched zebo many times at u-20 for ireland and that guy is a star of the future. I rate him equal to earls today.

Not sure Tonetti is made for the wing, Had a chance late on against Glaws and didn't quite have the gas to get in. Would say he's very useful at 12 and 13 though and possibly even 10, from what iv heard here. Im expecting a similar team to the one that lost to Glaws. I expect Eric Elwood to play NOC (who in fairness wasn't bad last week) and POD at 9 and 10. We have an awful record in Limerick and i don't expect that record to change on Monday. Having said that i reckon that Connacht are more than capable of causing munster a lot of trouble.

porterbelly

Frank Murphy and NOC will be at half back I'd say

We've put up with a lot of muck from Murphy over the past couple of years and he has shag all gas anymore but his passing was extremely crisp the last day, the best I've ever see it. We must stick with the same half back partnership for a few games.

POD is physical but his passing is pretty shocking at times, very careless. Takes 3/4 steps sometimes before a pass. He needs alot of coaching. Clearly not much notice paid to him in Leinster in his last couple of years because some of his glitches are ridiculous

Risteard

Munster: Sean Scanlon; Luke O'Dea, Keith Earls, Danny Barnes, Simon Zebo; Ian Keatley, Tomas O'Leary; Marcus Horan, Denis Fogarty, John Hayes; Donncha O'Callaghan, Mick O'Driscoll capt; Billy Holland, Niall Ronan, Paddy Butler. Replacements: Sean Henry, Dave Kilcoyne, BJ Botha, Ian Nagle, James Coughlan, Duncan Williams, Scott Deasy, Tom Gleeson.

All Irish starting XV. An inexperienced enough back 3.

PhatPiggins

buck65 wrote: »

Better off not playing him if he is leaving, to me Chambers looked very raw and needs a year or two of good coaching to be HCup level, something he won't get in Munster.
Would expect to see something like the team that played Edinburgh with a strong bench if things are going badly.
Connacht really don't perform in Thomond hopefully we will see the Connacht from Kingsholm.

Depressingly true. You'd love to see Zebo,Barnes,Murray,Keatley,Earls(too late!) get the same level of coaching that the Leinster players get.

porterbelly

Connacht XV to face Munster in Thomond Park (St Stephens Day kick off 19.45)

15 Gavin Duffy (C)

14 Fetu’u Vainikolo

13 Eoin Griffin

12 Dave McSharry

11 Tiernan O’Halloran

10 Niall O’Connor

09 Frank Murphy

01 Brett Wilkinson

02 Ethienne Reynecke

03 Ronan Loughney

04 George Naoupu

05 Mike McCarthy

06 Dave Gannon

07 Johnny O’Connor

08 John Muldoon



16 Adrian Flavin

17 Dylan Rogers

18 Rodney Ah You

19 Mick Kearney

20 Eoin McKeon

21 Paul O’Donohoe

22 Matthew Jarvis

23 Kyle Tonetti

totallegend

This is a massive opportunity for Connacht to end their losing streak in spectacular fashion - a nearly full-strength team against an experimental Munster side.

buck65

The funny thing is that the Munster side still looks stronger - on paper anyway. I still think that Munster in Limerick will have an edge here.

porterbelly

Alot of our lads are battered with all the big games of late as well

Hopefully we can have a good cut at it. Muldoon is a big doubt, mightn't play yet, we need him fit.

Zzippy

Connacht by 10+

buck65 wrote: »

The funny thing is that the Munster side still looks stronger - on paper anyway. I still think that Munster in Limerick will have an edge here.

Disagree, except at front row and halfbacks, I reckon Connacht have the advantage on those lineups. Difference is Munster are playing at home, with fresher players, Connacht will be tired with no chance to rest players, and its John Hayes' last game, so I expect Munster to win, but for once I'm travelling to Limerick optimistic that we have a good chance to get a result.

shuffol

Is there any chance that Munster might be under instruction from Kidney to give Earls time at 13?

profitius

Good to see Scanlon getting a start! He looks a good player.

CatFromHue

shuffol wrote: »

Is there any chance that Munster might be under instruction from Kidney to give Earls time at 13?

It could also be that Munster are light on outside centres and heavy on outside backs.

Fireball07

Munster: Sean Scanlon; Luke O'Dea, Keith Earls, Danny Barnes, Simon Zebo; Ian Keatley, Tomas O'Leary; Marcus Horan, Denis Fogarty, John Hayes; Donncha O'Callaghan, Mick O'Driscoll capt; Billy Holland, Niall Ronan, Paddy Butler. Replacements: Sean Henry, Dave Kilcoyne, BJ Botha, Ian Nagle, James Coughlan, Duncan Williams, Scott Deasy, Tom Gleeson.

From an attacking point of view, the backline is impressive. If TOL has a decent enough game, Keatley will get the backs moving. Earls will offer a threat, both LOD and Zebo are lively and Scanlon is supposed to be a good counter-attacker (I haven't seen much of him myself). Might be slightly suspect defensively though.

Pity TOD and Nagle don't start, good to see Butler involved again. Hope they win now (and Hayes scores a try ).

thomond2006

Munster by 1-10

Great to see an all Irish side but what does Nagle have to do to get a start?!

Fireball07

thomond2006 wrote: »

Great to see an all Irish side but what does Nagle have to do to get a start?!

Kill MOD and DOC.

shuffol

CatFromHue wrote: »

It could also be that Munster are light on outside centres and heavy on outside backs.

Fair point, with Chambers frozen out and Zebo looking the part 13 is probably where Munster need him most. Its unfortunate for him that he gets shifted round quite a bit as he doesnt seem to be able to switch positions as easily as some players and needs a run of games to get up to speed. I think the no.22 jersey beckons for him in the 6N.

Amazotheamazing

Not just all Irish, only two non-Munster players starting with two more on the bench. Huge test of our young lads against a HEC team.

CatFromHue

I wouldn't be overly confident as a Munster fan. While Connacht haven't won in a while, they did have a very impressive showing against Gloucester last week with pretty much the same starting team as will play on Monday.

A back three of Scanlon, Zebo, and O Dea is extremely inexperienced. As is an Earls, Barnes centre partnership (have they ever played together before?). Counter that with McSharry and Griffin for Connacht who have played a lot so far this season together and will fancy their chances.

Also the back row area is where Connacht are stronger if you ask me. Muldoon, JOC, and Gannon is a pretty balanced and effective unit.

There will also be the distraction of Hayes last game which may mean Munster may lose some focus.

In the tight 5 Munster have an advantage but it's not as big as people may think.

Paddy Power have Munster at -14 for this but I think it will be a lot closer than that. Nothing against Munster but I'll be cheering on Connacht in this one. They've had some close calls away to Quins and Gloucester and I think it could be third time lucky for them.

Benny Cake

Munster by 1-10

thomond2006 wrote: »

Great to see an all Irish side but what does Nagle have to do to get a start?!

If he's genuinely not a better option than Billy Holland you would have to wonder if he will ever be of a standard to start for Munster in Europe....

Amazotheamazing

Tbh, Connacht should win, it's their first team against what's probably our third.

shuffol

See Dave Mcsharry won Connacht player of the month, fair play

thomond2006

Munster by 1-10

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Tbh, Connacht should win, it's their first team against what's probably our third.

They probably should, Connacht +14 is free money but I never bet against my team!

[Jackass]

Connacht by 10+

A lot of pace in that Munster backline, if they cut loose they'll do some damage.

They'll have their hands full watching Griffin and O'Halloran though. Didn't realise Tonetti had gone to Connacht.

I'd say Connacht will be well up for this one, and very strong team from them. This game will show how much they've grown as a team from their Heineken Cup endevours. I think they'll have a better appreciation about what it takes to beat bigger teams and could be looking to upset here. In reality, just can't see it though.

Big day for Hayes, there'll be some ovation around the hour mark when he's haulled off.

porterbelly

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Tbh, Connacht should win, it's their first team against what's probably our third.

Yes Earls, O Callaghan, O Leary, Zebo, Horan, Keatley, Barnes and Micko are your 3rd team

We're 7/1 for a reason, haven't won in Thomond since 1986 no matter what team Munster have put out.

Lots of hungry players eager for more gametime playing for Munster and plenty of experience. They'll be up for it for Hayes send off as well. Connacht are fairly punch drunk from their exertions this season, and the same team goes to the well again

When you weight it up, 7/1 is generous, but it aint far off either. Big ask for our lads to turn it on again, but hopefully they can

durkadurka

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Tbh, Connacht should win, it's their first team against what's probably our third.

Come off it, there's a good few HEC 23 players in there.

wp_rathead

Connacht by 10+

McSharry/Griffin Vs Earls/Barnes
Looking forward to this match for this aspect alone.

Munsters half-backs and front-row will cause us alot of trouble- they the areas that have been Connachts Achilles this season. Never replaced Keatley, Hagan and Cronin- and haven't had a decent scrum half in years

freyners

centre battle will be tasty, would fancy mcsharry griffin even if i wasnt a connacht supporter, both of them have a real hope of a irish call up and this is the perfect stage to back it up. Mcsharry has been a revelation and griffin will be looking to make a statement v earls for an ireland call up
If we can get parity up front i would fancy us to win this game, however this is hayes last game and there will be a huge effort to see him get the send-off he deserves.
Game shows the huge gap in squads at the moment, munster can play what is nearly a whole new team while we are playing the same team for weeks now. Real hope for connacht but with the day thats in it i fear a big performance from munster, final 20 will be crucial

connacht +14 is free money imo

thomond2006

Munster by 1-10

When was the last competitive game where Munster named an all Irish XV? Must be years ago!

wixfjord

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Tbh, Connacht should win, it's their first team against what's probably our third.

Oh come off it. :rolleyes:
Once again, I find it hilarious that Munster supporting posters completely downplay the team before games, and then it's the best thing ever when they go out and fall over the line! That Munster team has an exciting young backline full of supposed future stars, a 10 that Connacht would kill for, a Lion 9 as we're so often reminded, and an incredibly experienced front 5, along with Botha, Nagle, Coughlan and a host of again supposed future stars on the bench.
Yet you think that Connacht will beat them in Thomond in The Bulls last game?! Come off it!

irishbucsfan

If Keith Earls and DOC get dropped from the international team in February we can at least remind Munster fans that they're only in their 3rd team.

Munster must be really strong to have three Lions (including an ex-midweek-captain) in their 3rd XV!

Cpt_Blackbeard

wixfjord wrote: »

Oh come off it. :rolleyes:
Once again, I find it hilarious that Munster supporting posters completely downplay the team before games, and then it's the best thing ever when they go out and fall over the line! That Munster team has an exciting young backline full of supposed future stars, a 10 that Connacht would kill for, a Lion 9 as we're so often reminded, and an incredibly experienced front 5, along with Botha, Nagle, Coughlan and a host of again supposed future stars on the bench.
Yet you think that Connacht will beat them in Thomond in The Bulls last game?! Come off it!

Bitter and jealousy isn't very Christmassy, is it Wixfjord?

It's a 2nd/3rd choice Munster team playing against a first choice Connacht team that is desperate for a win and one that always ups its game for the interpros. They should be targeting the win. I don't think they will as, it will be an emotional occasion but, they have a great chance.

wixfjord

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Bitter and jealousy isn't very Christmassy, is it Wixfjord?

Please point out that for me there Cpt. Straight out, where is the jealousy and bitterness in that?

Jesus the need to be underdogs is hilarious tbh!

Cpt_Blackbeard

wixfjord wrote: »

Please point out that for me there Cpt. Straight out, where is the jealousy and bitterness in that?

Jesus the need to be underdogs is hilarious tbh!

Please stop. You're ruining Christmas for everyone.

GerM

Munster by 1-10

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Tbh, Connacht should win, it's their first team against what's probably our third.

Munster's third side (it's really a second string with some HEC starters in there too) is significantly better than Connacht's first. Throw in the fact that the game is in Thomond and Munster have this in the bag barring a massive upset. Connacht are in serious difficulty at the moment. They threw everything they had at getting something against an average Gloucester side and came away with nothing. They've lost 10 in a row and it's not going to stop this round.

A 14 point spread sounds about right. The gap will be determined largely by how well TOL and Keatley do.

wixfjord

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Please stop. You're ruining Christmas for everyone.

Well you've made the accusation. Back it up or continue to try back out of it?

CatFromHue

Zebo, Earls, Barnes, Keatley, TOL, Horan, Fogarty, DOC, and Ronan (there is only 1 game this season where he didn't start or come on so far this season for Munster. He is much maligned, a lot of the time unfairly, but should get his century of caps for Munster before this season is out) were all involved in the 22 last week. That's over half the team.

It is a weakened team all right but has far far more 1st/2nd choice players than 3rd choice.

GerM

Munster by 1-10

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

It's a 2nd/3rd choice Munster team playing against a first choice Connacht team that is desperate for a win and one that always ups its game for the interpros. They should be targeting the win. I don't think they will as, it will be an emotional occasion but, they have a great chance.

Being up for it and being desperate for a win means very little when you're not very good at the moment. They're a side in massive difficulty. They might be up for inter-pros but that doesn't translate into results; away from home against their fellow provinces since the introduction of the Celtic League they've won once in about 25 attempts. The Munster line up is very similar to the one that topped the league last season. Their front five will win the game in cruise control. Unreal depth at lock.

RuggieBear

wixfjiord and cpt blackbeard, take it to pm. don't post again on this thread or respond to each others posts on other threads for a few days.

Cpt_Blackbeard

CatFromHue wrote: »

Zebo, Earls, Barnes, Keatley, TOL, Horan, Fogarty, DOC, and Ronan (there is only 1 game this season where he didn't start or come on so far this season for Munster. He is much maligned, a lot of the time unfairly, but should get his century of caps for Munster before this season is out) were all involved in the 22 last week. That's over half the team.

It is a weakened team all right but has far far more 1st/2nd choice players than 3rd choice.

The team would be a middle ground between 2nd and 3rd has we a full squad to pick from. Just so we can cut this tangent short:

Sean Scanlon - Realistically ~4th choice.
Luke O'Dea - 3rd choice at best.
Keith Earls - 1st choice but, maybe not at 13.
Danny Barnes - Probably 1st choice but, not at 12.
Simon Zebo - 2nd choice at best.
Ian Keatley - 2nd choice.
TOL - 2nd choice.
Paddy Butler - 3rd choice at best.
Niall Ronan - 2nd choice but, playing brilliantly.
Billy Holland - 3rd choice at best.
MOD - 2nd choice.
DOC - 2nd choice.
John Hayes - 3rd choice.
Denis Fogarty - 4th choice.
Marcus Horan -2nd choice.

And, we get an average of 2.4th choice with the actually pecking order probably likely to be slightly closer to 3rd. The reason why so many of those players could be thrown into a HC match without anyone batting an eyelid is due to the strength of the Munster squad and little else.

CatFromHue

The Munster team has a combined appearances total of 1217.