Decisions Decisions

GreeBo

hey, looking to spend ~15k on a new car (98 Avensis is near death and owes me nothing)

Finding 08 versions of the following for around this price but not sure which is the better car.
I'm going to hold onto it for a good few years (i.e. drive it into the ground) and needs to be suitable for children in the back and a good sized boot for golf clubs etc and want as high a spec as possible (leather, heated seats)

Looked at Superb but only the older version is available for this price.

Saab 9-3 1.8T Linear Sport
Saab 9-5 1.9TID LINEAR SPORT 1.9 TIDS
Volvo S80 2.0 SE Leather
Mazda Mazda6 6 Executive SE
Lexus IS250 IS 250 EXECUTIVE 4DR AUTO (Insurance is a little scary)
Jaguar X-Type 2.2 D LE 09MY 4DR AUTO
Honda Accord 2.2 DIESEL SPORT ** SAT NAV
Audi A6 2.0 TFSI 170BHP MULTITRONIC

Appreciate any comments on any of the above or any other cars I should take a look at.

Cheers!

murphyebass

Well seen as I just bought an '08 Mazda 6 I can give you my opinion on it. Nice spacious car. The cabins a nice place to be in. Great handling. Nicely spec'd with cruise, a/c, etc but also has an aux port for your Ipod which I thought was a nice touch. Hate those radio channel jobs!

You've mentioned the 2ltr diesel. Now correct me if I'm wrong but I thought the 2ltr was the same one from the previous model and well eh not well thought of to say the least.
If you want diesel I think its the 2.2ltr your lookin for. That said I can vouch for the 2ltr petrol being a nice engine and having owned a mazda 6 before with a 2ltr petrol I'd go as far as saying bulletproof. Mines auto.. Theres a silver '08 2ltr petrol on carzone for about 8k I think if you do a search.

Anyway... other than that I like the S80 you listed. Was in an S40 recently. Nice cars.

Very strange list of motors by the way. Some petrol, some diesel, some auto, some manual. Doesnt seem to be a lot of consistency in your choices but we all have to start somewhere eh.

GreeBo

murphyebass wrote: »

Well seen as I just bought an '08 Mazda 6 I can give you my opinion on it. Nice spacious car. The cabins a nice place to be in. Great handling. Nicely spec'd with cruise, a/c, etc but also has an aux port for your Ipod which I thought was a nice touch. Hate those radio channel jobs!

You've mentioned the 2ltr diesel. Now correct me if I'm wrong but I thought the 2ltr was the same one from the previous model and well eh not well thought of to say the least.
If you want diesel I think its the 2.2ltr your lookin for. That said I can vouch for the 2ltr petrol being a nice engine and having owned a mazda 6 before with a 2ltr petrol I'd go as far as saying bulletproof. Mines auto.. Theres a silver '08 2ltr petrol on carzone for about 8k I think if you do a search.

Anyway... other than that I like the S80 you listed. Was in an S40 recently. Nice cars.

Very strange list of motors by the way. Some petrol, some diesel, some auto, some manual. Doesnt seem to be a lot of consistency in your choices but we all have to start somewhere eh.

Cheers for the info!
Regarding the inconsistencies, basically Im not tied to anything, Ive had the Avensis forever so dont know much else
I do like the S60, was in an s40 and didnt like it too much, I couldnt sit in the back seat without my head hitting the roof and the boot seemed really small.

I do less than 20k km a year so dont need a diesel, though I do drive to work everyday so want to be comfortable.
Wouldnt mind an automatic either, but again dont need one.

Thx again.

murphyebass

GreeBo wrote: »

Cheers for the info!
Regarding the inconsistencies, basically Im not tied to anything, Ive had the Avensis forever so dont know much else
I do like the S60, was in an s40 and didnt like it too much, I couldnt sit in the back seat without my head hitting the roof and the boot seemed really small.

I do less than 20k km a year so dont need a diesel, though I do drive to work everyday so want to be comfortable.
Wouldnt mind an automatic either, but again dont need one.

Thx again.

20k km a year is borderline diesel territory imo. I'd probably be swayin towards petrol personally. Problems can be costly if they arent driven enough. (thats another conversation though)

The Mazda is my first auto, that said I've driven a few of them. I do a good bit of city drivin and to be honest its the best decision I've ever made. Really makes life so much easier.

oh and just to go against both of the points I've given you above I think one car you should put onto your list and one I couldnt find a good example of when I was lookin and still dont see a good one online currently is the Alfa 159. IMO has to have leather and all the toys and has to be manual and diesel and the 1.9JTD 150bhp 16valve engine not the 8V 120bhp one. One of the best diesel engines out there and I know its an Alfa but just believe me its a great engine.

So many 159s with cloth interiors out there at the moment and 8v ones. It baffles me why someone would but an Alfa without leather and a decent engine. Anyway rant over.

166man

murphyebass wrote: »

20k km a year is borderline diesel territory imo. I'd probably be swayin towards petrol personally. Problems can be costly if they arent driven enough. (thats another conversation though)

The Mazda is my first auto, that said I've driven a few of them. I do a good bit of city drivin and to be honest its the best decision I've ever made. Really makes life so much easier.

oh and just to go against both of the points I've given you above I think one car you should put onto your list and one I couldnt find a good example of when I was lookin and still dont see a good one online currently is the Alfa 159. IMO has to have leather and all the toys and has to be manual and diesel and the 1.9JTD 150bhp 16valve engine not the 8V 120bhp one. One of the best diesel engines out there and I know its an Alfa but just believe me its a great engine.

So many 159s with cloth interiors out there at the moment and 8v ones. It baffles me why someone would but an Alfa without leather and a decent engine. Anyway rant over.

The 8v diesel engine is a grand yoke, if you need more power just remap it to 150bhp. What's your beef with the engine anyway?

OP an Alfa 159 would be nice, my advice would be to go to the UK to find a nice spec one though.

bazz26

Alfa Romeo 159 is a good choice. Diesel engine is the same found in Saabs and Opel models.

Petrol:
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201142205098642

Diesel:
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=131583916402678

The only downside is that the boot on the saloon is not the most practical.

Bigus

I don't think you giving enough regard to how reliable your avensis was by not mentioning any Toyotas in your list.

More interesting cars get very dull when they don't start or let you down or cost a fortune to maintain.

How about a Prius for around 10k ?
Read about a million km prius below

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056163251

GreeBo

Bigus wrote: »

I don't think you giving enough regard to how reliable your avensis was by not mentioning any Toyotas in your list.

More interesting cars get very dull when they don't start or let you down or cost a fortune to maintain.

How about a Prius for around 10k ?
Read about a million km prius below

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056163251

That Alfa is quite a nice looking car actually, hadnt considered it at all tbh.

I dont like the interior of the new Avensis, the centre console, vertical radio thing really puts me off...

murphyebass

166man wrote: »

The 8v diesel engine is a grand yoke, if you need more power just remap it to 150bhp. What's your beef with the engine anyway?

OP an Alfa 159 would be nice, my advice would be to go to the UK to find a nice spec one though.

Yeah you'd need to go to the UK to find a good one but it means no trade in option hence I didnt go down that route.

As for the 8v diesel being grand... imo no its underpowered. And to be honest its just the case of waiting around for a 16v or going to the UK as you mentioned. Remapping no thanks.

bazz26 wrote: »

Alfa Romeo 159 is a good choice. Diesel engine is the same found in Saabs and Opel models.

Petrol:
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201142205098642

Diesel:
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=131583916402678

The only downside is that the boot on the saloon is not the most practical.

Is it the exact same engine? I thought it was a mix of that and GM that goes into the saabs and opels no?

Bigus wrote: »

I don't think you giving enough regard to how reliable your avensis was by not mentioning any Toyotas in your list.

More interesting cars get very dull when they don't start or let you down or cost a fortune to maintain.

How about a Prius for around 10k ?
Read about a million km prius below

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056163251

ARGH NOT A PRIUS !!! FOR THE LOVE OF GOD NOT A PRIUS....

Only kiddin, well kinda , was just thinking a car you didnt mention was the Skoda Superb.. again your talkin diesel here more than likely but not a bad lookin motor and nice and roomy inside...

http://www.carsireland.ie/detail.php?ad_id=692796&r=s.php%3Fm%3D80%26o%3D683%26g%3D0

...........I wouldn't be interested in the Mazda given the other options. The Lexus is a tad unfriendly motor tax wise and you have mentioned so too for insurance, I like X types and the 2.2 is a very decent engine, bit dated of a package overall though.

The 9 5 Saab would want to be a bit cheaper.

Nice thread though and a nice position to be in

GreeBo

Yeah looked at the superb alright, but couldnt find any of the newer models with a nice spec for the price range...

Review of the S80 seem to say that its underpowered and poor acceleration, anyone driven one?

murphyebass

RoverJames wrote: »

...........I wouldn't be interested in the Mazda given the other options. The Lexus is a tad unfriendly motor tax wise and you have mentioned so too for insurance, I like X types and the 2.2 is a very decent engine, bit dated of a package overall though.

The 9 5 Saab would want to be a bit cheaper.

Nice thread though and a nice position to be in

I dont know why you wouldnt take that generation Mazda 6 but would take a by your own admission dated package x type instead.
Quite small inside as well similar to the S40 which OP mentioned he felt was too small for him.

GreeBo wrote: »

Yeah looked at the superb alright, but couldnt find any of the newer models with a nice spec for the price range...

Review of the S80 seem to say that its underpowered and poor acceleration, anyone driven one?

Not a lot of superbs out there alright with a decent spec.
Problem with VAG's loads of them out there but serious amount of bogo specs around unfortunately.

Its like looking for a Highline Passat. Needle in a haystack wouldnt be in it and if you do find one they are at a serious price. :rolleyes:

Whereas the Lexus or Mazda you mentioned will have all the toys you want as standard a lot of the time. Not saying thats why you should go for one by the way but worth noting. Damn VAGs.. lol

R.O.R

GreeBo wrote: »

Review of the S80 seem to say that its underpowered and poor acceleration, anyone driven one?

Had a couple back to us earlier this year, and the review is on the money. All depends on what you are used to I suppose, but it really needed pushing to get any sort of performance out it.

Such a shame as they are sooo comfortable. White steering wheel on the one you linked would be a right PITA to keep in reasonable condition.

murphyebass

murphyebass wrote: »

I dont know why you wouldnt take that generation Mazda 6 but would take a by your own admission dated package x type instead. ...............

It's a 2.0 diesel Mazda 6

galwaytt

I know they say the new Mazda engine is different from the old.......but I'm not falling for it. I thought the 'new' engine was 2.2, and so anything remotely connected with the RF series 2.0 is to be avoided like the plague.

The A6 is a nice car, but the Multitronic is prone to trouble. We have an 09 one here with 44k kms on it, and the 'box is toast.

I drive a Saab myself and it's nice - not as light on juice as others, but it's a smooth comfy car. For a variety of reasons, they're cheap, so do go and have a look and see if you like them. The engine is well-regarded JTM (Opel, Fiat, Alfa), so no shortage of people to look after them.

IS250 is nice, but, imho, cramped in the back, and no auto would put me off (maybe not you, ymmv..)


I like the idea of the 159, tbh.

murphyebass

murphyebass wrote: »

You've mentioned the 2ltr diesel. Now correct me if I'm wrong but I thought the 2ltr was the same one from the previous model and well eh not well thought of to say the least.
If you want diesel I think its the 2.2ltr your lookin for. That said I can vouch for the 2ltr petrol being a nice engine and having owned a mazda 6 before with a 2ltr petrol I'd go as far as saying bulletproof. Mines auto.. Theres a silver '08 2ltr petrol on carzone for about 8k I think if you do a search.

RoverJames wrote: »

It's a 2.0 diesel Mazda 6

If you'd looked at the rest of the thread you'd see what I had said earlier. See above.

GreeBo

cheers all, it might seem like a nice position to be in but its a pain in the ass tbh!

NCT is up on the Avensis in a couple of months and it needs 3 new corners....its also misting up something shocking at the moment, I think most of the seals have gone

Took a look at the leather A6 today, obviously no recession on in Glasnevin.
Dealer told me that he doesnt need to valet, service or NCT the car until someone pays him for it...its that good a deal and will be gone by Saturday.

What I saw was a filthy interior that may or may not clean up well with a full valet; A nice sized dent in the passenger door that has been pulled out but left a crease top and bottom, some deep scratches in the bodywork, 5 unmatched tyres, one of which is a slick!, 70km late for its service, low on the black sludge its calling oil and finally some lovely cheese in/under the oil cap.

Ahwell, time to keep looking

166man

murphyebass wrote: »

Yeah you'd need to go to the UK to find a good one but it means no trade in option hence I didnt go down that route.

As for the 8v diesel being grand... imo no its underpowered. And to be honest its just the case of waiting around for a 16v or going to the UK as you mentioned. Remapping no thanks.

I assume you have experience of the engine. Been driving my dads sportswagon for the last year and its not underpowered. Admittedly we got it remapped to 150bhp. However even the standard 120bhp wasn't too bad.

A 79bhp VW Golf is underpowered, a 120bhp diesel Alfa saloon isn't.

EPM

166man wrote: »

murphyebass wrote: »

Yeah you'd need to go to the UK to find a good one but it means no trade in option hence I didnt go down that route.

As for the 8v diesel being grand... imo no its underpowered. And to be honest its just the case of waiting around for a 16v or going to the UK as you mentioned. Remapping no thanks.

I assume you have experience of the engine. Been driving my dads sportswagon for the last year and its not underpowered. Admittedly we got it remapped to 150bhp. However even the standard 120bhp wasn't too bad.

A 79bhp VW Golf is underpowered, a 120bhp diesel Alfa saloon isn't.

It is for the class its in to be fair. Nice engine, and far from underpowered, but a car in that class needs more than looks. Evidence of Ireland being cheap again

murphyebass

murphyebass wrote: »

If you'd looked at the rest of the thread you'd see what I had said earlier. See above.

I did read the thread
I was referring to the Mazda 6 that the OP linked to, the 2.0 engined one.

That aside, though the x type has been around a while I like them They are very very decent cars and the 2.2 in them is a great diesel engine.

166man

EPM wrote: »

166man wrote: »

It is for the class its in to be fair. Nice engine, and far from underpowered, but a car in that class needs more than looks. Evidence of Ireland being cheap again

But sure the Mazda 6 has a 2.2 with 129bhp, Mondeo with 1.6TDCI, Audi A4 with 120bhp. I'm sure there is more too! Ireland being cheap again is a good way to put it too.

EPM

The Mazda and Ford are in another class. But I'd have a higher powered one of those before a lower powered A4/3 series/159.

That's just me being cheap though:)

166man

EPM wrote: »

The Mazda and Ford are in another class. But I'd have a higher powered one of those before a lower powered A4/3 series/159.

That's just me being cheap though:)

That's true about the Mazda and Ford, but even the A4 120BHP TDI, I mean that's hardly too underpowered is it?

And it's not being cheap, it's being wise picking the car over the badge on the front.

bazz26

murphyebass wrote: »

Is it the exact same engine? I thought it was a mix of that and GM that goes into the saabs and opels no?

Fiat make the 1.9 Multi-jet engine and put it in Alfa Romeos as they own them. They sold it to GM who fitted it their Opel and Saab range.

Gophur

Anything with over 100hp will come as a shock to someone who's been driving a '98 Avensis.

Gophur

Gophur wrote: »

Anything with over 100hp will come as a shock to someone who's been driving a '98 Avensis.

Even the entry 4A-FE versions weren't that slow to be fair. Flat out they wouldn't be hugely slower than the entry level 2.2 Mazda 6 and the Saab diesel certainly wouldn't be pulling away either.

GavMan

Slightly above budget and a year older than you want but, I reckon it could be got for 15odd if they were serious on shifting it. It will also

2007 Lexus GS450H

It'll do well into 30MPG. My Old boss had an 07 one and he recokened about 36MPG on a log spin. Hybrid will do you no wrong in heavy traffic either

racso1975

^^^ Infairness you'd want to get it for closer to 14k and spend the rest on sortin out that horrific wheel and driver interior. Lovely car but it is a 3.5 litre which may be a balls tax wise

Veloce

166man wrote: »

murphyebass wrote: »

Yeah you'd need to go to the UK to find a good one but it means no trade in option hence I didnt go down that route.

As for the 8v diesel being grand... imo no its underpowered. And to be honest its just the case of waiting around for a 16v or going to the UK as you mentioned. Remapping no thanks.

I assume you have experience of the engine. Been driving my dads sportswagon for the last year and its not underpowered. Admittedly we got it remapped to 150bhp. However even the standard 120bhp wasn't too bad.

A 79bhp VW Golf is underpowered, a 120bhp diesel Alfa saloon isn't.

My father had the 8V 1.9 159, I didn't think it was underpowered at all. There is one for sale in cork at the minute for less than 10k.

Rolli

Would you consider a GS300 ? I've got one atm, nice cars..

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Lexus/GS300/GS-300-E/613232622021790/advert?channel=CARS

GreeBo

Cheers lads, those two lexus's would kill me on tax and insurance Im afraid, engines are just too big.

Yeah the Avensis is the 7A-FE (109bhp when new )and it goes grand, its not slow, just not fast.
Honestly Im not looking for a fast car, I want a nice family cruiser with a good spec and easy on the juice/tax/insurance...not much I know

Rolli

What about this ?



http://www.carzone.ie/search/Mazda/Mazda6/TS2-EDIT/201143205252508/advert?channel=CARS

This is a cracking car. I had one for a weekend, if you looking for something fast & good looking this is what you want

GreeBo

Rolli wrote: »

What about this ?


http://www.carzone.ie/search/Mazda/Mazda6/TS2-EDIT/201143205252508/advert?channel=CARS

This is a cracking car. I had one for a weekend, if you looking for something fast & good looking this is what you want

not mad about it to be honest, prefer more bits and less speed to be honest.
Also looking for leather seats...

Rolli

This ? http://www.carzone.ie/search/Lexus/IS250/IS-250-E/201150206088588/advert?channel=CARS

GreeBo

Rolli wrote: »

This ? http://www.carzone.ie/search/Lexus/IS250/IS-250-E/201150206088588/advert?channel=CARS

colour is a bit manky...this sounds ok though...might take a look tomorrow

Rolli

GreeBo wrote: »

colour is a bit manky...this sounds ok though...might take a look tomorrow

That's a much better choice. 2.2 diesel as opposed to a 2.5 petrol. And I'd rather spend €15k on a car from a garage..

GreeBo

Rolli wrote: »

That's a much better choice. 2.2 diesel as opposed to a 2.5 petrol. And I'd rather spend €15k on a car from a garage..

should I be worried about the mileage though? 73K miles on it
Thats half as much as my avensis has after 14 years...

Rolli

GreeBo wrote: »

should I be worried about the mileage though? 73K miles on it
Thats half as much as my avensis has after 14 years...

Well if its got a good service history I wouldn't be too worried. TBH, I'd walk away if it had no history. If you don't know much about cars, I'd suggest bringing a friend or a mechanic who knows about cars to have a look at it and make sure its 100%.

bazz26

GreeBo wrote: »

should I be worried about the mileage though? 73K miles on it
Thats half as much as my avensis has after 14 years...

If your 14 year old Avensis has such low mileage for the year then why would be looking at buying a diesel car? They are designed to be driven, it sounds like you don't really need a diesel car. There is great value out there on petrol cars at the moment especially 2008 onwards, as average joe and his uncle wants a diesel because of the cheaper motor tax.

Here is a nice Volvo S80 within budget:
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201145205513593

BTW the 2.2 diesel in the IS is not the most reliable around, they are known for blowing head gaskets. The Mazda 6 2.0 diesel also has a reputation for imploding.

166man

bazz26 wrote: »

If your 14 year old Avensis has such low mileage for the year then why would be looking at buying a diesel car? They are designed to be driven, it sounds like you don't really need a diesel car. There is great value out there on petrol cars at the moment especially 2008 onwards, as average joe and his uncle wants a diesel because of the cheaper motor tax.

Here is a nice Volvo S80 within budget:
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201145205513593

BTW the 2.2 diesel in the IS is not the most reliable around, they are known for blowing head gaskets. The Mazda 6 2.0 diesel also has a reputation for imploding.

If you're going to get a petrol S80, surely might as well go ahead with something like this for the same money

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Volvo/S80/S80-2.5-/201141204919984/advert?channel=CARS

Bit more tax and MPG can't be that different. Get the garage to put it through the NCT again too.

R.O.R

bazz26 wrote: »

Here is a nice Volvo S80 within budget:
http://www.driving.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=201145205513593

Hmmmm - looks familiar

Full main dealer service history, no accident damage, Winter Pack and integrated Bluetooth. Definately worth a test drive, can't imagine it will be that poor to drive in comparison to a 98 Avensis. Might be a bit thirsty and service every 10k, but one of the comfiest, best spec things in budget.

GreeBo

R.O.R wrote: »

Hmmmm - looks familiar

Full main dealer service history, no accident damage, Winter Pack and integrated Bluetooth. Definately worth a test drive, can't imagine it will be that poor to drive in comparison to a 98 Avensis. Might be a bit thirsty and service every 10k, but one of the comfiest, best spec things in budget.

For 15k Id expect it to be a lot nicer than my 14 year old heap!

How thirsty are we talking here...the Avensis is pathetic in that regard.

Rolli

This ?

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Jaguar/X-Type/2.2-DIES/201147205695220/advert?channel=CARS

166man

Rolli wrote: »

This ?

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Jaguar/X-Type/2.2-DIES/201147205695220/advert?channel=CARS

I thought that the 2.2D in the X-Type only came with an auto, and that the 2.0D came with a manual, open to correction though..

Rolli

166man wrote: »

I thought that the 2.2D in the X-Type only came with an auto, and that the 2.0D came with a manual, open to correction though..

I always thought they had manual or auto. Carzone have 4 2.2 diesel manual X-Types for sale though.

ninty9er

E-Class?

IMO you shouldn't buy one unless you can afford a proper one, but clearly the person who bought this new could

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Mercedes-Benz/E-Class/E280-CDi/201145205466261/advert?channel=CARS

Rolli

That E-Class looks awful

GreeBo

Realistically, since Im in Dublin Im not going to go to travel 3 hours+ to see a car and then have to get a mechanic to take a look and then look at it again to pay...

Thinking about it more I think what I want is:
- Spacious, needs a big boot, that IS220D just looked too small in the back, even though I loved the spec
- Room in the back to allow easy access to child seats (ISO Fix)
- Diesel/Petrol/Manual/Auto no bothered about any of this really.
- All leather interior but not cream, too hard to keep clean.
- Heated seats, A/C, auto lights/wipers
- Bluetooth
- Engine not much bigger than 2L for tax/insurance reasons
- Economical to run/service

Not too demanding huh

Rolli

What about the Jag ?

GreeBo

Dont like the inside at all Im afraid...

Rolli

What would be the oldest year you'd consider ?