Gaming PC Build

Bloodwing

HI all, I'm planning on building a new gaming PC shortly and I'm looking for some advice and opinions on the setup I'm looking at. All told I'm lookin at €2000-€2400. Any advice or opinions are appreciated. I'm new to all this so I'm a bit nervous about jumping in head first.

Case: cooler master storm trooper.

PSU: I'm open to suggestions here as i don't know what sort of power I'll need.

MB: ASUS Sabertooth x79

CPU: Intel i7 3930k (BX80619i73930K)

CPU cooler: Cooler Master v8.

RAM: Corsair 4x2gb CMX8GX3M4A1600C9.

HD: seagate 2tb ST2000DL003.

SSD mainly for OS: intel 2.5" 120GB SSD 320 series. serial ata-300.

GPU: ASUS ENGTX580 DCII/2DIS/1536MD5 - GF GTX 580 - 1.5 GB

I'll probably go with a DVD burner optical drive, not too pushed about Blu-Ray.

Thanks in advance for any advice you can give me. I'm looking forward to the build but i don't want to make any major mistakes on the components.

kfish2oo2

As I pointed out in another thread, the 3960X is insanely overpriced for its real world performance, and the 3930K is no different. You can pick up a Core i7 2600K for about half the price and about 5% lower performance.

I'd also say to go for at least 8GB of RAM. Its cheap nowadays, so there's no point in getting less. Make sure its DDR3 1333MHz or higher

Bloodwing

Thanks for replying so quick.

The Ram is 8gb total. It's 4x2gb i believe it's 1600mhz will this be enough? If i was to go with the i7 2600k will it still work with the Motherboard? From what i can see the sockets are different?

Cheers.

MakeNine

you will need a motherboard with a LGA1155 socket for the i7-2600k.

Bloodwing

What would you recommend as a solid Mother board with LGA1155 that is some what future proof? Does Quad channel memory make much of a difference or will some other type do the job?

Thanks.

Monotype

The V8 cooler isn't great. What about the Mugen 2 or 3? Good for the price, although not the easiest to install.

There's faster SSDs around than that. You might as well go for the 128GB Crucial M4. It would be a bit more expensive but faster and matches Intel for reliability. Plus there's the extra 8GB.

+1 about a 1155 motherboard.
Look at P67 and Z68 boards. Do you have multiple graphics cards in mind for the future?

Where is this being bought?

MakeNine

the Gen3 motherboards are supposed to be compatible with the next generation of Intel processors due Q1 or Q2 of 2012 (Ivy Bridge). They will also support PCI Express 3.0 (twice the bandwidth of 2.0) with the new processors. Apparently they will need a BIOS update and then it will be possible to install an Ivy Bridge processor. I don't know how useful PCI 3.0 is going to be though

Here's a few examples:
ASUS P8Z68-V/GEN3
There are also PRO and DELUXE versions of this board.
Gigabyte GA-Z68XP-UD4
MSI Z68A-GD65 (G3)
ASRock Extreme4 Gen3

AFAIK, only X79 supports quad channel memory right now. But for gaming dual channel 8GB is enough anyway

Bloodwing

Thanks for all the replies.

I can't see myself getting dual graphics cards. I don't think I'll need them but if its not going to have a major effect on cost I wouldn't mind having the option. As for where I'll be buying the components I was planning on shopping around on the net for the best prices once I have everything confirmed.

I'll take a look at the suggested motherboards when I get a chance. Its all a bit hard to get the head around for a noob!

Cheers.

Serephucus

First off: What's your budget? Is is €2,000 or €4,000. Huge possibilities here.

With either, you have enough for two - even three - GPUs, so why not? You could spend the money on other things, but they wouldn't give you as much performance.

Might I suggest that you try to spend closer to €1,000 for your first rig. There's no question that we can get you the best rig for your money here, but maybe read up on things a bit more. Have a wander on forums with people asking similar questions and take in the responses. I'd have a look at Overclock.net first, they have one of the biggest communities around, and there are a lot of people there that really know their stuff.

=============

Now, about the build that you posted, and echoing what's already been said:

X79 just isn't worth the money. Sure, it's the newest thing out, and it costs the most, but it's just a waste. You're literally paying over twice as much for a 5% bump in performance. If it's just for gaming, have a look at the i5 2500K, or if you're going ot be doing media stuff, the i7 2600K*.

RAM is one of the few things where it really only comes down to capacity. You can get crazy-expensive 2000MHz RAM if you want, but you'll be lucky to see 1% difference. Nope, not exaggerating either. It's all just marketing. Also, quad channel, dual channel? Poop, doesn't do anything for performance.

Now, on capacity: 4GB is plenty for games, but 8GB is common now just because it's so cheap, so go with a 2x4GB kit.

With all the money you have to throw at this, I could probably spec you a Tri-SLI watercooled insane-machine, but you have to decide what you want from your computer. Do you want it to play BF3 @ 1080p? Then a single 580 with stock cooling will do perfectly. You can always keep whatever money you don't use and buy a new graphics card down the line.

Bloodwing

Thanks Serephucus,

I'll put what I'm looking fo in the correct format and maybe you can advise me from there.

1. What is your budget? [Max €2500]

2. What will be the main purpose of the computer? Gaming and a bit of video production (bf3 and new games for a while at least)

3. Do you need a copy of Windows? [Yes, Home premium is all I'm looking for.]

4. Can you use any parts from an old computer? [No]

5. Do you need a monitor? [Yes]

5a. If yes, what size do you need. [23']

5b. If no, what resolution is your current monitor and do you plan to upgrade in the near future?

6. Do you need any of these peripherals? [Yes. Keyboard, Mouse and Wireless Card.]

7. Are you willing to try overclocking? [At some stage yes, once I'm more confident in what I'm doing.]

8. How can you pay? [cred card, paypal, bank transfer]

9. When are you purchasing? [ASAP]

10. If you need help building it, where are you based? [Will Self build]

You don't need to include the monitor in the budget but a suggestion of a good one would be appreciated. Somewhere around the €150 mark.

Really what I'm looking for is a machine that will play the most graphics intensive games on the highest settings with ease and will still be doing that in a years time if possible. Thats the main reason i was looking at the x79/ 3930k set-up, it looked like it was the most future proof option.

Thanks.

Serephucus

Ok, that's much better, now, let's see if we can nail this down further.

I'm going to tell you right now the i5 2500K is the right one to go for. There are two main platforms out at the moment, P67/Z68 and X79. X79 is an update to X58, and while X58 was good for games, X79 is much more geared toward servers. You can google for reviews, and they'll speak for themselves; there just isn't any appreciable (~5%) difference between X79 and Z68.

Now, the reason I say P67/Z68, is because there are actually two (main, there are others, but they're not important here, google if you're really interested) chipsets that socket 1155 processors can use. Many people say that Z68 is what P67 should have been from the beginning. The main difference (and again, Google is your friend here) between the two is that Z68 allows you to use the integrated GPU on the processor for certain tasks. In particular, the IGP is fantastic for certain video conversions. Beating even GPU-accelerated ones.

The two most powerful processors out for socket 1155 are the i5 2500K, and the i7 2600K (well, the i7 2700K came out a week or so back, but that's not worth it, you'll see why when I talk about overclocking). There are some slight differences between the two.

The i5 operates at 3.3GHz, while the i7 operates at 3.4GHz.
The i5 has 6MB of cache, while the i7 has 8MB.
The i5 has 4 cores, 4 threads, while the i7 has 4 cores, 8 threads.

The main one there is the cores/threads. The i7 has what's called Hyperthreading, which turns each physical core into two virtual cores. As far as Windows is concerned, you have a CPU with 8 physical cores, if you have the i7. Virtual cores aren't nearly as good as their physical counterparts though; usually you'll only see, at most, a 30-40% jump, and that's in something that actually uses 8 cores (most things, like games, don't).

So, you can get the i7 if you really want to, but my money would be on the i5.

Now, the reason I chose Z68, is that it will allow you to upgrade to Ivy Bridge processors later on (Google, again). Basically, it's a refined version of current 1155 processors, which a much better IGP - won't matter if you're gaming, but worth noting - and much better power consumption figures.

Your OS - Yup, can't fault you there. Home Premium is the best one to go for, as Ultimate has features almost no home user would ever look at.

Monitor: What are you looking for from it? Good response times to help with ghosting? High contrast ratios for brighter whites and darker blacks? Wide viewing angles? Power efficiency? Any reason you chose 23" at all? With your budget, you could shoot for a 30" 2560x1600 display if you wanted. Have a good read-up on monitors, they can make all the difference, especially if you're going to be watching movies or TV on your computer at all. Make sure to at least read something that gives you the differences on panel types. (TN, PVA, IPS, etc.)

Peripherals are a very personal thing, so I'll leave that up to you.

Overclocking/Cooling: What sort of cooling were you thinking of? With your budget you could go with either air or water. If you're not sure of the differences, google and read up. Don't rely on preconceptions!

---

The reason I go into this detail is that I bought my first computer thinking I knew what I wanted from it I thought it would be fantastic. Three years later, and my computer's completely changed. Gone is the flashy case with the LEDs and side window. Gone is the top-notch air cooler, and gone is the Extreme-Crazy-Uber-Expensive processor. In is a high-quality case with no windows or LEDs what-so-ever, and in is watercooling, and extremely silent components.

Just my experiences, dunno if it helps any.

Bloodwing

Lots of detail there, cheers.

I'm definitely leaning towards the i5 2500k. Do you know much about the ASRock Z68 Extreme4 Gen3? Looks good to me and doesn't seem overly expensive.

Monitor wise I really didn't realise there was so many option and specs. I'm going to have to look into it a lot more. I won't be using it for films or TV anyway.

Cooler wise I'd like to go for water cooling. From the reviews and videos I've seen it's the better option performance wise and noise wise. A closed system would be preferable.

As for the case I'm not interested in flashing lights and windows. Seen as it's my first build I'm looking for a spacious one with good cable management.

Is it worth my while going for two Graphics cards or would one high end be better? Based on other threads around here I'm thinking about the Club 3D Radeon 6990 4096MB or the EVGA GeForce GTX 580, 3072MB.

Thanks again for all your help. It's been very helpful.

Serephucus

I've never used ASRock, but I've heard a lot of things about them. Some good, some bad. To be honest, if I were building a rig now, I'd probably go with an MSI board, maybe ASUS. I'll leave that one to one of the others who're more familiar with 1155's specifics.

If you're interested in WC, but you want a close system, that limits you to CPU-only. Were you wanting GPUs as well?

Take a look at the 600T, and xxxD series from Corsair. Great cases, roomy, plenty of cable management. There's also the Fractal Design Define R3 and Define XL.

As for GPUs, it depends on your monitor, and if you like using AA in your games. Also, don't be fooled by RAM. Unless you're running three monitors, a 3GB 580 won't do anything for you that a 1.5GB one can't.

Bloodwing

Yeah i like the corsair 600T, it looks like exactly what I'm looking for.

The reason I would prefer a closed WC system again boils down to the fact that I'm new to all this and the fear of making a mistake that could have major consiquences. (ie: leaks)

As for the monitor i really am lost. I've been looking around on the net for a while now and I'm not really getting anywhere. You mentioned earlier i could go for a 30" 2560x1600 display, what model would you recommend. the main thing I'm looking for is sharpness and and good contrast.

Serephucus

Have a look at the Dell U3011. It's not cheap, but by jesus is it a nice display.

asif2011

Serephucus wrote: »

Have a look at the Dell U3011. It's not cheap, but by jesus is it a nice display.

7ms display? For gaming I rather a 24" with 2/3ms... it sucks juice like no tomorrow! Maybe Asus VE248H, bit hard to come by though...

Bloodwing

Wow it is nice but it's a nice price too! Not sure if i can justify that much of an outlay on a monitor even if I am saving money on the mobo/ cpu.

Serephucus

7ms for a 25x16 display is excellent. Yeah, maybe some people will notice a difference with 2/3ms, but I'd go for picture quality myself.

@Nelios, told ya, it's not cheap. Try the U2412M instead. You could get four for the same price.

Bloodwing

Yeah that's a bit more like it. At least I won't have to cancel Christmas if I buy it!

Will THE EVGA GeForce GTX 580 (Art No. HV1028EODE) do the job with this monitor?

Serephucus

Yup, but save yourself some money and get the standard version.

http://www4.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=39637&agid=707

The SC version only helps if you're going for very high overclocks.


I should also mention that EVGA are the only company that will happily cover waterblock installations on their cards. Nice not having to lie through your teeth to someone who knows perfectly well why you're returning your card.


(*Ahem* I'm also selling a 360 radiator and a GTX 580 waterblock)

Bloodwing

Yeah I'd like to try water cooling but I just don't think I'd be able for it. How idiot proof are those systems, because knowing my luck I'd mess it up.

What sort of power supply would I be looking at? Is 750w enough?

Serephucus

If you're planning to add a second 580 down the line, then you'll want around 850, maybe 900 to be safe. If it's just the one, 600W will do.

RE: watercooling. It's like everything else with computers - if you take your time, and do what you're supposed to (I can help here), then you'll be fine, and the only way you're looking at leaks is with faulty components (which, if you do it right, will be ruled out very early on). I've been running WC for close to a year, chopping and changing all over the shop, and I haven't had a single problem. ... Yet.

Seriously though, it's not nearly as difficult / risky as many people seem to think.

Bloodwing

I'm tempted to give it a shot. What WC system would you recommend that's reliable and user friendly?

Also with the motherboard I think I'm going to go with the ASUS P8Z68 Gen3. There's about €30 in the difference between the standard and the Pro and then there's about €40 in the difference between the Pro and the Deluxe. Would I be right in thinking the standard is good enough for my needs?

If I don't go for a full WC system I'm looking at the Corsair H100. It seems to be getting good reviews. Have you heard much about it?

Cheers.

MakeNine

I've just built my first PC with the P8Z68-V/GEN3. AFAIK the pro version adds 2 SATA 6 ports and maybe a firewire. I'm not sure what else it has but the basic version is enough for me.

Serephucus

Neilos wrote: »

I'm tempted to give it a shot. What WC system would you recommend that's reliable and user friendly?

If I don't go for a full WC system I'm looking at the Corsair H100. It seems to be getting good reviews. Have you heard much about it?

Well, the H100 is good for a CPU-only loop, it's about the same price - maybe a bit more - than a self-built loop, but I suppose you pay for the lack of setup there.

If you wanted to cool your 580 as well, I could give you a 360 rad (XSPC RX360), tubing, a 580 block (EK FC 580), and fans (Akasa Apache) for €190, then all you'd need is a pump, CPU block, and fittings, which would be another €90-ish. (MCP-355 pump, and XSPC Rasa CPU block from Specialtech.co.uk)

I should tell you that while a dedicated setup looks more expensive than a H100 on the surface, it will be a lot more powerful. What you're paying for is that you can cool a lot more with what you'd pay for now. The radiator I have could easily support a second 580, RAM, and motherboard in the future if you wanted it.


That's only a very brief run-down, if you want more specific help/answers, Skype or something might be a better idea.

Bloodwing

I'll pass on the self built loop for now, thanks for the advice though. It's always an option for the future i suppose.

This is what my basket is looking like at the minute, bit of a difference from my first post! If nothing else I feel like I've learnt a lot from posting here.

Total build cost: €1,766.69 + €30 shipping
Corsair Graphite 600T, ATX, ohne Netzteil €135.65
Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155 €185.73
Dell UltraSharp U2412M (schwarz) €240.71
EVGA GeForce GTX 580, 1536MB DDR5, PCI-Express €419.56
Corsair Hydro Series H100 (Sockel 775/1156/1366/AM2/AM2+/AM3/FM1) €85.54
8GB-Kit Corsair Vengeance DDR3 1600 MHz CL9 €36.71
WD Caviar Green 2TB Sata 6Gb/s €189.00
ASUS PCE-N10 €17.99
Crucial M4 128GB SSD 6,4cm (2,5") €173.24
Samsung SH-222AB bare schwarz SATA €15.23
Arctic Cooling Wärmeleitpaste MX-2 Tube 4g €3.16
ASUS P8Z68-V/GEN3, Sockel 1155, ATX, DDR3 €147.89
Cooler Master Silent Pro Series - 850 Watt €116.28

So what's the opinion on this? I know the HD prices are way over the top at the moment but I don't particularly want to go down the second hand route.

Thanks again.

asif2011

That's a nice build Neilos!

I might go with a Corsair AX850 for the PSU, but that's cause I'm a Corsair nut

Bloodwing

Are there any extra cables that people find they need when they're doing builds? I know I'll be needing a kettle lead for the PSU but are there any other cables or bits and pieces in general that i should add to my order?

asif2011

SATA cables, you get some with the board, but it's always handy to have a few spare so you have them to hand if you hook up another hard drive or two in the future. Maybe check if you can get them cheaper on eBay though... Good PSUs come with a power cable...

Bloodwing

asif2011 wrote: »

... Good PSUs come with a power cable...

Is that a hint to go for the Corsair PSU?? I have a few leads lying around anyway so I'll make use of those.

Thanks for the advice Re. SATA cables.

Serephucus

http://www2.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=49231&agid=1347

Better thermal paste. Probably not much difference, but if you're getting some, you might as well get good stuff.

Looks like a nice build. I take it you're planning on a second 580 at some point? Otherwise the 600W Silent Pro would be perfectly ok with handling all that.