Castle Estate Agents - stressing me out!

mikeystipey

Hi all

We're currently trying to buy a house and think we've found a really good deal. The thing is we're dealing with Castle Estate Agents and I'm finding their way of doing things very odd. If anyone has had any experience of them I'd be glad to hear about it. Here's the sequence of events:

Viewed the house last Wednesday, and put in an offer of only ten grand less than the asking price as it was already extremely good value (there had been a price drop of €120,000 in the space of a month on it). Got what now seems to be a spiel about the sellers wanting to close very quickly and the agent said he was "95% sure" a deal could be struck the next day.

Thursday - they haggled me up 5 grand which we had no problem with. Agent said he'd ring back but when I rang him back later he said the seller was gone playing golf.

Friday - agents says they want to give one more viewing on Saturday and asked me to come along just to make sure I was happy with the place. There was just one other couple there, who I could see liked the place. I told the agent I wanted a decision either way by lunchtime Monday and he said absolutely.

Monday - agent says the other couple put in a bid a grand above mine so I countered with a grand more. He rings back half an hour later saying they won't go any higher and the place should be mine. BUT - he can't quite get a final decision as the seller's wife is off playing bowls (wtf!). This was 1pm and he didn't call back all day (does a game of bowls take 5 hours?!)

Today - rang the agent at 10am, secretary said he would ring back, but no word since. Maybe I'm being quite impatient but is this really the way to close a deal? He even told me yesterday to get the booking deposit ready.

Sorry I've gone on a bit but any advice is welcome

cheers
Mikey

Zulu

He's taking the piss. And I reckon trying to drive the price up.

Give an offer. A final offer. Do not budge from it. It shouldn't be more than the others offer. ...and tell them the offer is off the table COB today. Then forget about it.

zac8

You gave him a deadline and after it passed you're still chasing him? He has you on the hook there. You need to be far more composed when dealing with estate agents.

tricky D

In this day of mobile phones, off playing golf or bowls is a bit less than credible. Viewing with another couple, is that normal? I'd be thinking of putting in the original lower offer.

odds_on

Was the "other couple" a real potential purchaser or a plant by the estate agent to get you to think that there was a real purchaser interested.

To me, it would be unethical to invite two potential purchasers at the same time, especially when one party had already seen the property (and put in an offer.

Just my thoughts.

Snakeblood

mikeystipey wrote: »

Hi all

We're currently trying to buy a house and think we've found a really good deal. The thing is we're dealing with Castle Estate Agents and I'm finding their way of doing things very odd. If anyone has had any experience of them I'd be glad to hear about it. Here's the sequence of events:

Viewed the house last Wednesday, and put in an offer of only ten grand less than the asking price as it was already extremely good value (there had been a price drop of €120,000 in the space of a month on it). Got what now seems to be a spiel about the sellers wanting to close very quickly and the agent said he was "95% sure" a deal could be struck the next day.

Thursday - they haggled me up 5 grand which we had no problem with. Agent said he'd ring back but when I rang him back later he said the seller was gone playing golf.

Friday - agents says they want to give one more viewing on Saturday and asked me to come along just to make sure I was happy with the place. There was just one other couple there, who I could see liked the place. I told the agent I wanted a decision either way by lunchtime Monday and he said absolutely.

Monday - agent says the other couple put in a bid a grand above mine so I countered with a grand more. He rings back half an hour later saying they won't go any higher and the place should be mine. BUT - he can't quite get a final decision as the seller's wife is off playing bowls (wtf!). This was 1pm and he didn't call back all day (does a game of bowls take 5 hours?!)

Today - rang the agent at 10am, secretary said he would ring back, but no word since. Maybe I'm being quite impatient but is this really the way to close a deal? He even told me yesterday to get the booking deposit ready.

Sorry I've gone on a bit but any advice is welcome

cheers
Mikey

Sounds like a big pile of crap. Go back to original offer, if you're feeling generous.

Zulu

Yea, I sounds really dodgy. I'd say tell them you've had a little time to think about it and you withdraw your offer.

Then make a new offer (the origional offer you made), and tell them they have 24/48 hours to consider it. Don't make any other offers. If they claim another offer has been made - so be it let the other people have it.

bobbyg

Looks like the estate agent is doing a fine job of getting the best price for the vendor, at this rate you will soon be offering more than the initial asking price!

I think you played your hand too soon by showing him how keen you are on the place and also going to the second viewing.

misschoo

Also remember that that estate agent will be earning a commission on the sale - so the more the house sells for the more commission the estate agent earns!

amdublin

misschoo wrote: »

Also remember that that estate agent will be earning a commission on the sale - so the more the house sells for the more commission the estate agent earns!

Freakeconomics...

Running out the door.
Will explain later

Offy

misschoo wrote: »

Also remember that that estate agent will be earning a commission on the sale - so the more the house sells for the more commission the estate agent earns!

If it was me Id tell the agent that because of all the messing about I dropping the offer to 5k less that what I first offered. You are been played. They want to get more out of you and they know how. Its a sales trick. With all the houses availavle at the moment agents are hurting, take advantage of it and say goodbye if they dont accept the original offer minus 5K.

RasTa

Why make an offer of 10k less then the asking? The estate agent knows that you will be willing to pay the full price so it just messing you about till you're there.

amdublin

Offy wrote: »

If it was me Id tell the agent that because of all the messing about I dropping the offer to 5k less that what I first offered. You are been played. They want to get more out of you and they know how. Its a sales trick. With all the houses availavle at the moment agents are hurting, take advantage of it and say goodbye if they dont accept the original offer minus 5K.

If the agent is getting 1.5% commission that's only €75 :pac:

Milk & Honey

amdublin wrote: »

If the agent is getting 1.5% commission that's only €75 :pac:

It is not so much the commission, it is the prospect of getting another sale. The neighbours will be interested in how much is achieved and will call him if they are thinking of selling and think he gets the best prices.

RasTa

amdublin wrote: »

If the agent is getting 1.5% commission that's only €75 :pac:

It's 1575 ... I doubt he is selling the house for 5k

amdublin

RasTa wrote: »

It's 1575 ... I doubt he is selling the house for 5k

Sorry, meant "additional"

I.e. You reduce by €5k he loses 75.....

You increase by €5k it's only an additional 75 to him....

mikeystipey

thanks for the responses everyone, I didn't actually think anyone had responsed as for some reason my email didn't alert me as it usually does. There was me feeling all rejected

Anyway, about 3 hours after I started this thread the agent rang back saying the place was ours at the price agreed on Monday. He said the sellers (who are in their 70's) had been waiting to speak to their daughter about the final selling price. Again I'm not sure how much of this was the truth or just stalling but we decided to take a chance and go with it as we really want this house and we'd be getting a lot more for our money than similarly priced houses. Paid the deposit and we'll see how things go.

Re some of the points made above (I don't know how to use the multi-quote thing):

zac8 / bobbyg: I admit we were over eager when making the initial offer, but we really want to get a place bought asap and we're prepared to pay a few grand more as a price on that. The few grand more would be a cheap price to pay for my sanity because this whole process does my head in.

tricky d: Didn't want to put in a lower offer because again this would just drag out the bidding process.

odds on: Most viewings we've been have had more than one viewer at them and I guess all viewers must be regarded as potential purchasers. I don't think the other couple were plants but I see your point.

Re more commission: I think Milk & Honey is right here...I doubt that the extra €30 or €50 the agent would get for haggling me up an extra 2 grand would be worth his while but the seller is more likely to recommend him to to other sellers if he maxes out the selling price.

Anyway, I'll follow up with how things go

Snakeblood

mikeystipey wrote: »

thanks for the responses everyone, I didn't actually think anyone had responsed as for some reason my email didn't alert me as it usually does. There was me feeling all rejected

Anyway, about 3 hours after I started this thread the agent rang back saying the place was ours at the price agreed on Monday. He said the sellers (who are in their 70's) had been waiting to speak to their daughter about the final selling price. Again I'm not sure how much of this was the truth or just stalling but we decided to take a chance and go with it as we really want this house and we'd be getting a lot more for our money than similarly priced houses. Paid the deposit and we'll see how things go.

Re some of the points made above (I don't know how to use the multi-quote thing):

zac8 / bobbyg: I admit we were over eager when making the initial offer, but we really want to get a place bought asap and we're prepared to pay a few grand more as a price on that. The few grand more would be a cheap price to pay for my sanity because this whole process does my head in.

tricky d: Didn't want to put in a lower offer because again this would just drag out the bidding process.

odds on: Most viewings we've been have had more than one viewer at them and I guess all viewers must be regarded as potential purchasers. I don't think the other couple were plants but I see your point.

Re more commission: I think Milk & Honey is right here...I doubt that the extra €30 or €50 the agent would get for haggling me up an extra 2 grand would be worth his while but the seller is more likely to recommend him to to other sellers if he maxes out the selling price.

Anyway, I'll follow up with how things go

Good luck with it anyway. It's not too much more than you wanted to pay initially so call it a win.

mikeystipey

Snakeblood wrote: »

Good luck with it anyway. It's not too much more than you wanted to pay initially so call it a win.

cheers Snakeblood!

Fergl

I'd pass on a house any house if it is being dealt with by Castle Estates.:eek:

Won't bore you with the details (pm if you want) but my experience with them was easily on of the most stressful experiences of my life.:mad:

I was pm'd a facebook page which is dedicated to highlighting their history:)

Supercell

So annoyed by Castle **SHAKES FIST GRRR!!***
We looked at a Castle house twice then on the second viewing there was a phantom bid at the max of our range(got just that morning he told us!!) which magically vanished a couple of days later when we told the agent we couldnt/wouldnt top it..

Then, only last week we signed contracts on a house that while is nice etc was a second choice to one they told us was sold. However I see today they've dropped the price on it...WTF!!!!

I'm really guite furious about it, if they told us it was sale agreed but there was problems and to wait another week or so we would have..but no, it was sold according to them. I would never ever buy or sell from this shower, too much stress and suspect dealings all round

amdublin

Supercell wrote: »

I'm really guite furious about it, if they told us it was sale agreed but there was problems and to wait another week or so we would have..but no, it was sold according to them. I would never ever buy or sell from this shower, too much stress and suspect dealings all round

Frustrating I know But sales can and do fall through....

You will never know tbh....

Good luck in your new house dude

Spiritofthekop

Castle are easily one of the worst estate agents ive ever dealt with.

Adrift

Had the same craic with these clowns a few years back. Nothing seems to have changed. It was our first house, there was a hell of a lot of pressure from them to buy the house we were looking at or indeed any house on their roster. We received a few texts and calls from them every day regarding one property or another. Everyone we dealt with there seemed to be a Lionel Hutz type character.


Anyway, we eventually were going to go with one of the properties on their roster when the same rubbish started, phantom clients, convenient last minute bids above our bid, so we pulled out and ended up buying in a different location with a different estate agent which proved to be a relatively smoother process. The funny thing was, a few months after moving into our new home I had a call from someone from Castle saying the owner, upon further consideration was now ready to entertain our initial offer on the property we had bid on. Complete joke.

P. Breathnach

I'm just wondering: how do sellers regard Castle?

Do remember that the estate agent works for the seller, not for the buyer.

TwoShedsJackson

P. Breathnach wrote: »

I'm just wondering: how do sellers regard Castle?

Do remember that the estate agent works for the seller, not for the buyer.

We used them to sell our house in Crumlin and were happy with the service. They got us about 20k more than we thought they would, do bear in mind though that this was in 2005...

Heisenberg1

mikeystipey wrote: »

thanks for the responses everyone, I didn't actually think anyone had responsed as for some reason my email didn't alert me as it usually does. There was me feeling all rejected

Anyway, about 3 hours after I started this thread the agent rang back saying the place was ours at the price agreed on Monday. He said the sellers (who are in their 70's) had been waiting to speak to their daughter about the final selling price. Again I'm not sure how much of this was the truth or just stalling but we decided to take a chance and go with it as we really want this house and we'd be getting a lot more for our money than similarly priced houses. Paid the deposit and we'll see how things go.

Re some of the points made above (I don't know how to use the multi-quote thing):

If you are dealing with stilorgan office beware they are absolute cowboys of the highest order tried to bully Mrs Luzon on more than one occasion

zac8 / bobbyg: I admit we were over eager when making the initial offer, but we really want to get a place bought asap and we're prepared to pay a few grand more as a price on that. The few grand more would be a cheap price to pay for my sanity because this whole process does my head in.

tricky d: Didn't want to put in a lower offer because again this would just drag out the bidding process.

odds on: Most viewings we've been have had more than one viewer at them and I guess all viewers must be regarded as potential purchasers. I don't think the other couple were plants but I see your point.

Re more commission: I think Milk & Honey is right here...I doubt that the extra €30 or €50 the agent would get for haggling me up an extra 2 grand would be worth his while but the seller is more likely to recommend him to to other sellers if he maxes out the selling price.

Anyway, I'll follow up with how things go

If you are dealing with the stillorgan office beware absolute cowboys. Tried to bully Mrs Luzon on more than one occasion to increase our offer on a place. Sale fell though in the end but the bull they came out with was a joke.

handlemaster

Supercell wrote: »

So annoyed by Castle **SHAKES FIST GRRR!!***
We looked at a Castle house twice then on the second viewing there was a phantom bid at the max of our range(got just that morning he told us!!) which magically vanished a couple of days later when we told the agent we couldnt/wouldnt top it..

Then, only last week we signed contracts on a house that while is nice etc was a second choice to one they told us was sold. However I see today they've dropped the price on it...WTF!!!!

I'm really guite furious about it, if they told us it was sale agreed but there was problems and to wait another week or so we would have..but no, it was sold according to them. I would never ever buy or sell from this shower, too much stress and suspect dealings all round

I think the lesson there is not to jump in with both feet. They know how to play the game and if they see your really interested they will play you for all they can get. It is their job after all.

odds_on

handlemaster wrote: »

I think the lesson there is not to jump in with both feet. They know how to play the game and if they see your really interested they will play you for all they can get. It is their job after all.

And end up losing the sale!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Supercell

handlemaster wrote: »

I think the lesson there is not to jump in with both feet. They know how to play the game and if they see your really interested they will play you for all they can get. It is their job after all.

Some lesson, It cost them an easy sale, I bought somewhere else for the same price they are asking for that one!!
When the time comes to sell my new gaff most definitely wouldn't want Castle to be selling it.
My strong suspicion is the poor vendor is being told that there are no offers and that when they get him dropped to a certain level an offer will magically appear...

iratira

Yep similar bad experiences.
Went to view a house and the guy was late, and not sorry for it.
I then emailed them to ask for more info on the house and 3 days later no reply. How rude, unless he's in bed with the flu which, I strongly doubt.
My feeling is that they don't respect the prospective buyers.
Interesting to find this thread.

Victor

iratira wrote: »

I then emailed them to ask for more info on the house and 3 days later no reply.

Maybe they are waiting on the client for information or instructions.

ronjo

Victor wrote: »

Maybe they are waiting on the client for information or instructions.

Surely a one liner saying this or asking for a few days wouldnt be too much to expect?

Duckjob

Victor wrote: »

Maybe they are waiting on the client for information or instructions.

Hi Buyer,
The sellers are still deciding what they want to do re. the house. I'll let you know the situation as soon as I have further information.
Regards,
Agent

Pretty bog standard, 1 minute communicative email used all the time by professional businesses.

domcq

I've called a few times recently to arrange a viewing and been told that the person dealing with the property isn't in the office but that they'll ring me back later - they rarely call back.

nibtrix

I've looked at several houses advertised by Castle in the last couple of months, and every time it's been a nightmare trying to communicate with them. Constant promises to "ring back today" followed by a call a week later offering a viewing the same day at a ridiculous time etc. etc. The one house we bid on suddenly developed lots of bidders so we dropped out sharpish.

A lot of sellers in the same area seem to have gone with Castle, probably because they don't charge any fees unless the house sells. So if the seller is just "testing the waters" then Castle are a good agent to go with as it will cost them nothing if they pull out.

mikeystipey

OP for this thread here...I never followed up on how things went for us on the house purchase through Castle. Well to make a long story short, over 3 months after paying our deposit the deal fell through as the sellers wouldn't close the deal (they hadn't found where they wanted to move to yet). However, Castle were also a nightmare to deal with, stringing us along and making up excuses to defend the sellers delays, lying to us about letters they said had been sent to our solicitor, and having to be asked several times to issue a refund for our deposit. My advice would be to avoid them like the plague. Totally unprofessional outfit in my opinion.

Dice75

We dealt with Castle when buying our house & had a hard time with them (they worked hard to get the price up - good for the seller).

However, a friend of mine also bought from them & had a demand from them which I'm sure the sellers wouldn't be too happy about.

repsol

Sounds to me like an estate agent who is very focused on sellers and not too bothered about purchasers.Can't really blame them when it is after all the sellers who employ the agent.

Doop

repsol wrote: »

Sounds to me like an estate agent who is very focused on sellers and not too bothered about purchasers.Can't really blame them when it is after all the sellers who employ the agent.

Do sellers not want every potentially interested purchaser to be able to view their property?? the more people who view it the better. The sellers employ them aright.... to find them a buyer.

These guys are cowboys not affiliated to any professional body.

gaius c

odds_on wrote: »

Was the "other couple" a real potential purchaser or a plant by the estate agent to get you to think that there was a real purchaser interested.

To me, it would be unethical to invite two potential purchasers at the same time, especially when one party had already seen the property (and put in an offer.

Just my thoughts.

Yeah, the fact that you were invited to come along and see the "competition" for yourself is a dead giveaway.
Edit: blast. Just saw the date of the OP.

iratira

gaius c wrote: »

Yeah, the fact that you were invited to come along and see the "competition" for yourself is a dead giveaway.
Edit: blast. Just saw the date of the OP.

Yeh sorry resurrected the thread but seems people still getting frustrated with these guys.
Now if I see their name on a property, I skip over it.
Not on for being messed around.

Had a really bad experience with them personally as a purchaser so I expect as mentioned above they are all about the vendor which is understandable.

That said - here is a summary of my dealings.

Called about a house on the market for 2 days and told if I couldn't attend a viewing that weekend I'd probably miss out... Laughed and said this wasn't 2007 and hung up. Got called back by someone else a few minutes later to be told that the market had completely turned around and they had cars queueing up outside to view this place.

Went and viewed it and made a conservative and possibly a little unrealistic offer. Over the next 24 hours they called me 4 times each call the latest offer going up by 10 - 20k which I was dubious about but had to accept at face value. Each time I said I'd think about it and come back but they kept calling and asking if "I was still interested at that level".

It got silly and was 100k clear of my initial offer and around 70 over the asking and I said I had no interest. I got a call around a week later and the top asking had dropped by over 45k as "some messing" had gone on and people had gotten a little excited.

I think I know which people they were referring too.

Vivienne123

Am very nervous reading this thread, went sale agreed on a house on 23rd December with Castle Estates and am concerned about what we have let ourselves in for now! To be fair, we didn't have the same exeprience with them as other users have had - we refused to budge from an initial offer and while it did take some time for the vendors to accept it, I don't think that was the EA's fault, the vendors were just holding out for more. EA we dealt with was very helpful with viewings and also put up a "sale agreed" sign as soon as we paid our deposit but we are now waiting for contracts to be sent from the vendors solicitors to our solicitors (valuation done, survey done). Think will put a call into the EA now to see how it's going, we only have 9 weeks to complete before we have to move out of our rented house so will keep the pressure on!

Vivienne123

Vivienne123 wrote: »

Am very nervous reading this thread, went sale agreed on a house on 23rd December with Castle Estates and am concerned about what we have let ourselves in for now! To be fair, we didn't have the same exeprience with them as other users have had - we refused to budge from an initial offer and while it did take some time for the vendors to accept it, I don't think that was the EA's fault, the vendors were just holding out for more. EA we dealt with was very helpful with viewings and also put up a "sale agreed" sign as soon as we paid our deposit but we are now waiting for contracts to be sent from the vendors solicitors to our solicitors (valuation done, survey done). Think will put a call into the EA now to see how it's going, we only have 9 weeks to complete before we have to move out of our rented house so will keep the pressure on!

Sounds like you are getting a reasonable service. Performance and attitude doesn't necessarily have to be uniform across a company, no matter how many bad experiences people have had.

We had an ok experience with our EA, though they didn't do anything to help get us closed and it took around 4 - 5 months of waiting and stressing.

mikeystipey

Vivienne123 wrote: »

Am very nervous reading this thread, went sale agreed on a house on 23rd December with Castle Estates and am concerned about what we have let ourselves in for now! To be fair, we didn't have the same exeprience with them as other users have had - we refused to budge from an initial offer and while it did take some time for the vendors to accept it, I don't think that was the EA's fault, the vendors were just holding out for more. EA we dealt with was very helpful with viewings and also put up a "sale agreed" sign as soon as we paid our deposit but we are now waiting for contracts to be sent from the vendors solicitors to our solicitors (valuation done, survey done). Think will put a call into the EA now to see how it's going, we only have 9 weeks to complete before we have to move out of our rented house so will keep the pressure on!

In fairness it was mostly the fault of the sellers themselves that our deal fell through in the end, so since you've sale agreed already there's no need to be overly concerned about Castle Vivienne. What really stressed me out about Castle was getting them to return calls, send letters etc. Because the guy we dealt with only gave us a hand-written receipt for our deposit I was anxious for our solicitor to get something in writing re price agreed etc. However he put us in the embarassing situation of calling our solictior several times asking had letters or faxes been received when I'm certain he never sent them. We had to go their Office eventually to confront him and even then he was insistent about having sent promised correspondence.

I'm sure everything will work out fine for you, just keep a bit of pressure on the sellers.

Dymo

Because the guy we dealt with only gave us a hand-written receipt for our deposit I was anxious for our solicitor to get something in writing re price agreed

No good solicitor would act on a sale or exchange contracts with out this information, how did your solicitor even put the sale in motion if they didn't have this information? When a sale is agreed the estate agent sends these details to the purchasers solicitors who in turn draws up the contracts and sends them to the vendors solicitor. They need the address of the vendors solicitor, the address of the house, the sale price, the deposit paid and fixtures and fittings amount.

Once a Sale Agreed is done it's then down to the solicitors to work out the deal and contracts

mikeystipey

Dymo wrote: »

No good solicitor would act on a sale or exchange contracts with out this information, how did your solicitor even put the sale in motion if they didn't have this information? When a sale is agreed the estate agent sends these details to the purchasers solicitors who in turn draws up the contracts and sends them to the vendors solicitor. They need the address of the vendors solicitor, the address of the house, the sale price, the deposit paid and fixtures and fittings amount.

Once a Sale Agreed is done it's then down to the solicitors to work out the deal and contracts

indeed Dymo, the Sale Agreed letter is very important in kick-starting the conveyancing process, that's why we were anxious that Castle would send this letter to our solicitor asap. We were particularly keen to get the sale closed as quickly as possible as it was Autumn 2011 and there was talk of mortgage interest relief coming to an end (the estate agent was aware of this too). But yet a week after we had paid our 10K booking deposit, our solicitor hadn't received this letter. If the EA had said he hadn't got round to sending it yet I would have said fair enough but he kep insisting that the letter had been sent. After my rather irate wife rang him again he promised to fax a copy of it. Another phone call to our solicitor and no fax had been received. So we went to his office in person to confront him and only then did our solicitor get the fax. Our solicitor never received the promised letter by post (the fax was sufficient) so we could rule out delays in the post. The whole thing was quite perplexing and embarassing.

Re some points from other posters that an estate agent is employed by the seller - well there's no seller without a buyer so it helps for the EA to keep the buyer onside too.

Dymo

Sorry my last post I mixed up vendor and purchaser

mikeystipey wrote: »

But yet a week after we had paid our 10K booking deposit, our solicitor hadn't received this letter.

The estate agent doesn't send anything to your solicitors he sends it to the sellers solicitor and then it's down to the sellers solicitor to organise the contracts before sending them to your solicitor. This could easily take longer than 10 days.

If the EA had said he hadn't got round to sending it yet I would have said fair enough but he kept insisting that the letter had been sent.

If he sent the letter he can't control what the sellers solicitor does, its the sellers solicitor that is then looking after the legal part of the sale not the estate agent. From my experience an awful lot of solicitors are very slow in dealing with things plus if then send over a rushed contract of sale it could delay the sale even more.

AlanG

These guys are amazing. Rang about a property they have advertised that include pictures of the side garden, converted garage and measurements for a converted garage. Arranged a viewing. Only at the viewing I heard someone else ask about the side garden and they were told that actually the garden was not included in the sale. Upon further questions the revealed that the garage would also be demolished. None of this information was volunteered by Castle. A crazy operation. Their explanation was that they never specifically said the garden was included with the house.
Beware, they think it’s 2007. Although mortgage approved I wouldn't even view any house they have again.

Vector56

I was laughing when I saw the OP. Went through almost the identical process when bidding on a house recently with a EA from Castle (EA now works for Wilson Moore). Fund the whole process odd, unnecessarily messily and of no benefit to the Vendor.