winter socks vs winter tyres

davoxx

which is better (ignoring the initial cost)?
which lasts longer?

i'm torn between a set of tyres or a two pairs of socks.

rameire

may aswell ask
what is better?
a plastic bag
or a condom

winter tyres better then all, depending on conditions of course.

davoxx

rameire wrote: »

may aswell ask
what is better?
a plastic bag
or a condom

winter tyres better then all, depending on conditions of course.

for sex, if you are too poor to afford a condom, you should not be having sex

and for carrying shopping, a bag would suffice ...

but seriously, i've seen a few articles claiming that winter socks are better than winter tyres in terms of grip.

so i'm looking for people who have tried both ...

rameire

i always thought winter socks would be only for getting you out of a pickle and not to run on them continuously, as they would damage and degrade very quickly if worn continously, if there were snow in ireland.

Lord Trollington

Winter socks can only be used on thick snow or ice. One your on a clear road they must be removed or they will be in flitters.

endacl

Socks did the trick last year. Totally secure. Only problem was I was still stuck behind the people who didn't have them. Actually had a few moments where the back slid out due to front grip being so good. Closest analogy would be like driving on gravel. Used them according to manufacturers guidelines and the same pair are ready to go again this year. Can't recommend them highly enough. No experience of winter tyres. Honestly have no interest based on relatively short term snow conditions, cost of tyres, and storage. The snow socks live in the boot, tucked in beside the spare.

davoxx

thanks guys.

i think i'll invest in winter tyres ...
i was worried about how long snow socks would last and their grip.

biko

Some info from youtube on socks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2x8iHyLWWKw

CiniO

davoxx wrote: »

but seriously, i've seen a few articles claiming that winter socks are better than winter tyres in terms of grip.

Most likely thay are.
But are you going to put them on and off every time you see snow or ice on the road?

davoxx

CiniO wrote: »

Most likely thay are.
But are you going to put them on and off every time you see snow or ice on the road?

i would have if that was the better option, but seems like tyres might be the best option here (with socks as back up?)

CiniO

davoxx wrote: »

i would have if that was the better option, but seems like tyres might be the best option here (with socks as back up?)

I'd say way better backup would be snow chains.
In most conditions you drive on winter tyres, while you land up in some total extreme, you put chains on, which will get you out of anywhere.

deandean

Socks = in the boot of the OH's car in case of getting caught out locally.

Winter tyres = On my car 'cos I do 500+ miles a week and if I don't travel I don't earn.

IrishZeus

If you do 500+ miles a week then socks are useless to you. You could end up stopping every couple of miles to take them on or off based on conditions. This, I safely assume, would drive you nuts.

Tyres for you would be best I think.

endacl

IrishZeus wrote: »

If you do 500+ miles a week then socks are useless to you. You could end up stopping every couple of miles to take them on or off based on conditions. This, I safely assume, would drive you nuts.

Tyres for you would be best I think.

Seems that way alright. The socks do give an unholy amount if grip though, especially on steep inclines. If money/storage were no object, I'd go for the belt and braces...

endacl

Lord Trollington wrote: »

Winter socks can only be used on thick snow or ice. One your on a clear road they must be removed or they will be in flitters.

Word of the day! Flitters. :-)

bbam

I think one thing that's overlooked in the cost of winter tyres is the fact that your regular tyres are being saved from any wear and so will also last much longer..

Having used winters last year for the first time the difference is huge....
We live in a lane that isn't salted or cleared when it snows, last year my wife couldn't get through it until we changed to winters...

Some posters are claiming just because we don't get much snow they aren't worth it... If it means my wife & kids not getting stuck in the snow then it's well worth it...

I got winters fitted for the same price as regular tyres so there is no financial impact of having them on at all... It just takes the effort to get it done..

The socks look good enough but I'd be afraid my missus (being on the small side) wouldn't get them on..

endacl

bbam wrote: »

I think one thing that's overlooked in the cost of winter tyres is the fact that your regular tyres are being saved from any wear and so will also last much longer..

Having used winters last year for the first time the difference is huge....
We live in a lane that isn't salted or cleared when it snows, last year my wife couldn't get through it until we changed to winters...

Some posters are claiming just because we don't get much snow they aren't worth it... If it means my wife & kids not getting stuck in the snow then it's well worth it...

I got winters fitted for the same price as regular tyres so there is no financial impact of having them on at all... It just takes the effort to get it done..

The socks look good enough but I'd be afraid my missus (being on the small side) wouldn't get them on..

Not an issue. Simplicity itself to put them on. Feck. I'm starting to sound like a salesman. Wonder how long it'll take us to adopt winter snow into our annual routine. Seriously though, I have to wonder if the Norwegian version if board would attract the same topic. if we do get hit again this year, I think that the long term way to go is a cheap set of steelies from a wrappers, with winter tyres permanently fitted. Should last a number of years. With me trusty socks as a backup.

slimjimmc

endacl wrote: »

Socks did the trick last year. Totally secure. Only problem was I was still stuck behind the people who didn't have them. Actually had a few moments where the back slid out due to front grip being so good. Closest analogy would be like driving on gravel. Used them according to manufacturers guidelines and the same pair are ready to go again this year. Can't recommend them highly enough. No experience of winter tyres. Honestly have no interest based on relatively short term snow conditions, cost of tyres, and storage. The snow socks live in the boot, tucked in beside the spare.

Winter tyres are not only for snow conditions, they're for, well you guessed it, winter conditions so that's at least 3 months. Winter tyres offer better grip at low temps and are great at cutting through heavy rain or slush.

headstar23

endacl wrote: »

Socks did the trick last year. Totally secure. Only problem was I was still stuck behind the people who didn't have them. Actually had a few moments where the back slid out due to front grip being so good. Closest analogy would be like driving on gravel. Used them according to manufacturers guidelines and the same pair are ready to go again this year. Can't recommend them highly enough. No experience of winter tyres. Honestly have no interest based on relatively short term snow conditions, cost of tyres, and storage. The snow socks live in the boot, tucked in beside the spare.

did you have to take them off on one roadtrip if you came to a clear road?

oldyouth

I live at the top of a mountain and the feeling of isolation when you get snowed in can be very unsettling. I got the snow socks last year and they are brilliant. Don't drive on them any way fast, don't let the wheels spin and ALWAYS take them off on a clear road. It's worth the hassle to be mobile. Mine are good to go again this year after many miles put on them last Christmas. They are what they are, for emergencies.

Nissan doctor

How long have all the posters in this thread been driving? And how come no-one has gone looking for winter tyres before? We had a couple of freak winters, last year in particular, global warming has not suddenly changed our climate over the last 2 years so IMO its extremely unlikely that winter tyres will be of any more benefit then they would have been since the last big snow in 82 or whenever it was.

I personally would rather have tyres that give their best for 10-11 months of the year then ones that are at their best for 1-2 months.

IMO the hysteria about winter tyres is as bad as the hysteria around everyone running out to buy diesels with low road tax.

barura

Nissan doctor wrote: »

How long have all the posters in this thread been driving? And how come no-one has gone looking for winter tyres before? We had a couple of freak winters, last year in particular, global warming has not suddenly changed our climate over the last 2 years so IMO its extremely unlikely that winter tyres will be of any more benefit then they would have been since the last big snow in 82 or whenever it was.

I personally would rather have tyres that give their best for 10-11 months of the year then ones that are at their best for 1-2 months.

IMO the hysteria about winter tyres is as bad as the hysteria around everyone running out to buy diesels with low road tax.

Don't winter tyres perform better in the rain? We get a lot of that. I'm sure there is some merit to them. Having 2 sets of tyres never hurt anyone. And considering the amount of cars running bald tyres, something that encourages people to be aware of them can't be a bad thing.

Owen

Nissan doctor wrote: »

IMO the hysteria about winter tyres is as bad as the hysteria around everyone running out to buy diesels with low road tax.

QFT - I drove last winter in the very worst of it around the mountains in Tralee/Lyxnaw for a wedding. I'd a normal FWD estate car, Sunny tires, and I made it up and down hills people were turning away from because of a small bit of slipping. And even when we had the snow and ice, it was only there for a week or three - not the endless weeks of snow and ice other countries get. My ex's father in Poland thought it was funny with all the people rushing out here to get Winter Tyres.

Nissan doctor

barura wrote: »

Don't winter tyres perform better in the rain? We get a lot of that. I'm sure there is some merit to them. Having 2 sets of tyres never hurt anyone. And considering the amount of cars running bald tyres, something that encourages people to be aware of them can't be a bad thing.

How well they perform in the wet depends on the brand, exactly like standard/summer tyres.

I agree that raising an awareness of tyres is certainly a good thing for Ireland, but the problem is that whats going on here is just pushing a type of tyre, that the tyre manufactures have never marketed here before due to our climate not warranting them, by playing on peoples irrational fear that we are going to get arctic winters from now on:rolleyes:

Anan1

Nissan doctor wrote: »

I personally would rather have tyres that give their best for 10-11 months of the year then ones that are at their best for 1-2 months.

For some people it's a simple financial calculation - ie I get to work x days when I wouldn't have otherwise and the tyres are paid for. Remember also that the long-term cost of running winter tyres is only the price of a set of used wheels - in my case, €150.

Nissan doctor

Owen wrote: »

QFT - I drove last winter in the very worst of it around the mountains in Tralee/Lyxnaw for a wedding. I'd a normal FWD estate car, Sunny tires, and I made it up and down hills people were turning away from because of a small bit of slipping. And even when we had the snow and ice, it was only there for a week or three - not the endless weeks of snow and ice other countries get. My ex's father in Poland thought it was funny with all the people rushing out here to get Winter Tyres.

Anan1 wrote: »

For some people it's a simple financial calculation - ie I get to work x days when I wouldn't have otherwise and the tyres are paid for. Remember also that the long-term cost of running winter tyres is only the price of a set of used wheels - in my case, €150.

I agree with both comments, I too had no issues getting anywhere in a fwd car with decent summer tyres on it(and I went down roads that were closed and I live on a very steep hill) For certain people, living in certain areas(very mountainous etc) they would make sense.

The point I'm getting it that the reason for the VAST majority of people getting stuck was nothing to do with the type of tyres they had or what wheel drive their car was, it was simply a matter of not having a notion how to drive in the conditions.

Anan1

Nissan doctor wrote: »

The point I'm getting it that the reason for the VAST majority of people getting stuck was nothing to do with the type of tyres they had or what wheel drive their car was, it was simply a matter of not having a notion how to drive in the conditions.

And when that clown is in front of (or behind) you, would you rather they be on summer or winter tyres?;)

Nissan doctor

Anan1 wrote: »

And when that clown is in front of (or behind) you, would you rather they be on summer or winter tyres?;)

Well in front shouldn't be a problem if your driving at a safe distance and reading the road properly.

Yes behind could be an issue, I don't know how many times I pulled over last year to let idiots who were driving too close and way beyond the levels of grip available.

Matt Simis

Nissan doctor wrote: »

How well they perform in the wet depends on the brand, exactly like standard/summer tyres.

Thats not really true! At low temps on wet but not freezing roads Winters noticeably outperform Summers. Its not a mere difference in Brands, its a fundamental difference in tyre makeup.

Nissan doctor wrote: »

I agree that raising an awareness of tyres is certainly a good thing for Ireland, but the problem is that whats going on here is just pushing a type of tyre, that the tyre manufactures have never marketed here before due to our climate not warranting them, by playing on peoples irrational fear that we are going to get arctic winters from now on:rolleyes
The point I'm getting it that the reason for the VAST majority of people getting stuck was nothing to do with the type of tyres they had or what wheel drive their car was, it was simply a matter of not having a notion how to drive in the conditions.

Absolutely but even the biggest moron can make progress in a Winter tyre'd car. You could apply your thoughts to anything above an beyond the baseline of a minimum level car (ESP, ABS, Power Steering). You cannot magically make everyone else a good enough driver on icey, cold or snowed in roads just because you say it. You can however equip them to deal with the conditions. It benefits them and every other road user. For the minimal investment Winter Tyres return is massive. IMO Socks are a piss poor alternative (but they have their uses in an emergency but obviously they are not a tyre type alternative, making this poll misleading).

I have not seen anything even remotely close to hysteria on Winter tyres in the real world. To claim so shows you a victim of false consensus, ie its a super common topic on Irish forums, but outside of my immediate family I know of zero people with Winters. Many co-workers consider them something for people "in the sticks" to a joke. Extended family would have no clue. The difference between now and 2 years ago is that some more people know they exist, but to claim there is some sort of disaster panic buying going on that you feel you need to be "counteracting" is frankly absurd.


PS: If our Winter continue like it has so far this year (average temp +8c?) I agree there is no point in Winters obviously.

Anan1

Nissan doctor wrote: »

Well in front shouldn't be a problem if your driving at a safe distance and reading the road properly.

One shouldn't be a problem but if you want to make any sort of reasonable progress then thousands of them, all slithering along at 10km/h most definitely is.:)

Even a good driver on summer tyres is a PITA to get stuck behind on snow/ice - they simply don't have the grip to make reasonable progress in safety.

Nissan doctor

Matt Simis wrote: »

Absolutely but even the biggest moron can make progress in a Winter tyre'd car. You could apply your thoughts to anything above an beyond the baseline of a minimum level car (ESP, ABS, Power Steering). You cannot magically make everyone else a good enough driver on icey, cold or snowed in roads just because you say it. You can however equip them to deal with the conditions. It benefits them and every other road user. For the minimal investment Winter Tyres return is massive. IMO Socks are a piss poor alternative (but they have their uses in an emergency but obviously they are not a tyre type alternative, making this poll misleading).


I have not seen anything even remotely close to hysteria on Winter tyres in the real world. To claim so shows you a victim of false consensus, ie its a super common topic on Irish forums, but outside of my immediate family I know of zero people with Winters. Many co-workers consider them something for people "in the sticks" to a joke. Extended family would have no clue. The difference between now and 2 years ago is that some more people know they exist, but to claim there is some sort of disaster panic buying going on that you feel you need to be "counteracting" is frankly absurd.

I don't feel I should be counteracting it at all, I couldn't care less what people buy for their car.

In fact, I'm saying what I'm saying despite the company I work for selling winter tyres like hotcakes, so its actually helping me....but, from speaking to the majority of customers, they are buying them because word of mouth says the'll need them to be able to drive in snow and thats as far as their knowlege of them extends.

IMO if someone has done the research and understands winter tyres and how and when they will give benefits and they come to the conclusion that they will work for them thats fine...everyone else is panic buying IMO exactly as those who will listen to the advertisements and run out and spend thousands trading in their car for one of the several 4x4 cars that are now being marketed like crazy.

JJJJNR

This is a thread about winter socks v's winter tyres, yis are wrecking me buzz!

Anyway someone already nailed it on the head, winter tyres for big mileage users and snow socks for the local run abouts.

Anan1

But they do need them to drive safely at any kind of speed on snow.

Matt Simis

Nissan doctor wrote: »

I don't feel I should be counteracting it at all, I couldn't care less what people buy for their car.

In fact, I'm saying what I'm saying despite the company I work for selling winter tyres like hotcakes, so its actually helping me.

What part of the country are you in? Around Dublin/Meath Ive been in a few Tyre places and Winters are still special order (and at that, limited stock). They may have one brand/tyre on display, thats it. Definately not selling like hotcakes from what Ive seen and as I said no one I know has actually bought them, but are considering this year.

Nissan doctor

Matt Simis wrote: »

What part of the country are you in? Around Dublin/Meath Ive been in a few Tyre places and Winters are still special order (and at that, limited stock). They may have one brand/tyre on display, thats it. Definately not selling like hotcakes from what Ive seen and as I said no one I know has actually bought them, but are considering this year.

In Drumcondra, North Dublin. We have a large stock of winters, mainly Bridgestone a001's but some Kumhos or Hankooks as well(can't remember which) and we have had to re-order the stock almost every week for the last few weeks.

Marcin_diy

Nissan doctor wrote: »

In Drumcondra, North Dublin. We have a large stock of winters, mainly Bridgestone a001's but some Kumhos or Hankooks as well(can't remember which) and we have had to re-order the stock almost every week for the last few weeks.

hankooks are the worst tyres. No point to save few quid and get sh.. .
Check online for winter tyres tests.

Winter tyres are always worth to buy. If you cant afford 4 get just one pair for driving wheels. Just be carefull when turning :-)
You can use winter tyres safely if temperature get belo plus seven degree. Doesnt matter if it is dry or snow on the road.

I used socks all last winter and it helped me many times. To put them on it takes max 3 min per wheel so in just over 5 min u have much better control and can start up the hill or on ice.

Also again - check google for tests of winter vs summer tyres. Braking distance is 50% less for winter thres on snow....

voojeq

winter tyres FTW, you buy one set and you're sorted for few seasons, just remember to change back to summer tyres when spring comes or you will have to buy new winter set every year

I defo recommend Debica Frigo, brilliant, cheap and not chinese.

davoxx

i think the reason why people are panicking is quite simple, dublin can to a stand still from the snow.

people can't drive at the best of times, and then they venture out in the snow when they should stay at home ...

i'm getting tyre/sock so that i am not stuck anywhere, for the money it is worth it in terms of safety and piece of mind ...

there will be people out there with rwd driving and spinning, endangering lives, all for the sake of socks/tyres ...

so personally i want everyone who is out driving in snow after it has fallen, not to cause an accident ...

i think i'll go with winter tyres ... it's expensive but i believe the poll

tossy

If it does snow we should organise a little boards test/meet and compare the various options on various drive trains i.e FWD RWD 4WD with as many different options as possible.

davoxx

tossy wrote: »

If it does snow we should organise a little boards test/meet and compare the various options on various drive trains i.e FWD RWD 4WD with as many different options as possible.

if we can all get there

tossy

davoxx wrote: »

if we can all get there

The winter tyre people can tow the socks brigade :D:D

haminka

Summer tyres' grip decreases in temperatures below 7 degrees and it takes longer to stop the car when breaking. Also the wear and tear is bigger in winter so I'll be investing in winter tyres. I drive about 40 miles every day and the added safety is worth it, even if the roads are dry.

CiniO

haminka wrote: »

Summer tyres' grip decreases in temperatures below 7 degrees and it takes longer to stop the car when breaking.

That's what the tyre company marketing guys tell us.
Road test doesn't seem to confirm this fact.
I always put winter tyres, but it's because I drive a lot on snow.
If I didn't I wouldn't bother changing summers to winters, as better grip on dry surface when cold is very questionable, the same as grip during big rain might not be great on winter tyres.

Also the wear and tear is bigger in winter so I'll be investing in winter tyres. I drive about 40 miles every day and the added safety is worth it, even if the roads are dry.

Winter tyres are softer, and therefore will definitly wear faster.

haminka

CiniO, I don't think it's the lobby of the tyre manufacturers who make it a law for drivers to change tyres from summer version to a winter version.
I wouldn't use winter tyres in summer because they are softer so you just end up slowing down your car and use more petrol/diesel.
Do you have any comparison between the wear and tear of summer tyres in winter and winter tyres in winter? Because I would say that the summer ones will suffer more in winter than they winter ones.

Nissan doctor

haminka wrote: »

CiniO, I don't think it's the lobby of the tyre manufacturers who make it a law for drivers to change tyres from summer version to a winter version.
I wouldn't use winter tyres in summer because they are softer so you just end up slowing down your car and use more petrol/diesel.
Do you have any comparison between the wear and tear of summer tyres in winter and winter tyres in winter? Because I would say that the summer ones will suffer more in winter than they winter ones.

By what logic would summer tyres wear more in winter?
In low temperatures summer tyres become less supple, which is why their grip is reduced, but harder tyres also wear less.

Winter tyres are much softer to start with so they can remain soft(good grip) in the cold weather, meaning that in summer they will get even softer and so wear faster,

TheZ

For most people the hassle of changing winters to summers and storing a set of tyres is more than a few days of snow. Problem with snow is that (in Dublin anyway) the city grinds to a halt so even if you have winter tyres you are stuck in that.

I live in an area which gets its share of snow and so there is a 4 x 4 as one car in the family which next time we change it I might swap for winter tyres on a two wheel car as it is cheaper.

The last two winters seem to have been freak weather in most of Ireland - if it snows again this year then maybe it is a new normal and people will start to buy winter tyres and other snow gear - snow shovels, snow blowers, show grips, portable cookers etc

voojeq

the truth is that dublin needs a metro badly :P

CiniO

haminka wrote: »

CiniO, I don't think it's the lobby of the tyre manufacturers who make it a law for drivers to change tyres from summer version to a winter version.

Could you please give any example of such law?

I wouldn't use winter tyres in summer because they are softer so you just end up slowing down your car and use more petrol/diesel.

Right. + they have less grip, especially on wet hot days.

Do you have any comparison between the wear and tear of summer tyres in winter and winter tyres in winter? Because I would say that the summer ones will suffer more in winter than they winter ones.

Summer tyres rubber is way more harder than winter, and in low temperature becomes even more hard, so wear on summer tyres in winter wouldn't be any bigger than in summer.

Hence i'm not saying that winter tyres doesn't make sense.
On dry tarmac at -20 degrees, you will definitely have better grip on winter tyres than on summer tyres.
I just don't really believe in this 7 degrees magical border line advertised by tyre industry. Considering temperature in Ireland barely anytime goes below -5, if I didn't have to drive on the snow, I wouldn't use winter tyres.

headstar23

can anyone explain the difference between front wheel drive and rear wheel drive please? Is it common to be able to change a car from 2 wheel drive to four or is that final in the making fo the ALL cars?

Nissan doctor

headstar23 wrote: »

can anyone explain the difference between front wheel drive and rear wheel drive please? Is it common to be able to change a car from 2 wheel drive to four or is that final in the making fo the ALL cars?

Seriously??

Ok, in a Front wheel drive car the engine drives the front wheels, in a rear wheel drive the engine drive the rear wheels and in a 4 wheel drive car the engine drives all 4 wheels.

There is no option to change the type of drive your car has.

CiniO

Nissan doctor wrote: »

There is no option to change the type of drive your car has.

Except from 4wd where you can engage or disengage one axle, making it front or rear wheel drive depending on construction.