HEC: Munster vs Northampton Saints, Sat 12 Nov 6pm, Sky Sports

thomond2006

Munster Squad:
M Horan, W du Preez, BJ Botha, J Hayes, S Archer,
D Varley, D Fogarty, D Ryan, P O’Connell, D O’Callaghan, M O’Driscoll, B Holland,
P O’Mahony, N Ronan, J Coughlan, D Leamy,
C Murray, T O’Leary, P Stringer, D Williams,
R O’Gara, I Keatley,
D Barnes, W Chambers, L Mafi,
S Deasy, J Murphy, D Howlett, D Hurley.

Not considered because of injury: D Wallace (knee), F Jones (ankle), J Flannery (back/calf), K Earls (knee), M Sherry (ankle), Darragh Hurley (back), P Borlase (back), Dave O’Callaghan (knee), S Scanlon (neck), I Dineen (knee), D Cusack (jaw), T Smith (knee).

I'd like to see:
du Preez, Varley, Botha, Ryan, POC, Leamy, POM, Coughlan;
Murray, ROG, Hurley, Mafi, Barnes, Howlett, Murphy

Bench: Fogarty, Horan, Hayes, DOC, Ronan, TOL, Keatley, Chambers

I actually would have liked to see Keatley in the centre but Barnes and Mafi were the first choice pairing at training on Tuesday.

Rumour has it that Leamy isn't 100% fit and Ronan will start at 7 with POM at 6. I would prefer Ryan at 6 and POM at 7 in that case but McGahan for some reason rates Ronan!

Anyway, this game will be a tough one for Munster. Northampton have a stronger squad than last year. They are very strong up front and their back three of Artemyev (above), Foden and Ashton is lightning quick and will counterattack. Their weakness is potentially at halfback: Dickson at 9 is a no more than solid while Lamb has proven to be flaky if pressure is put on him. However if the pack in front of him is dominant, Lamb can be a big creative threat.

Munster played terribly last week and there will be the usual emotional backlash. Whether this is good enough to beat a very good English side remains to be seen. If Munster lose this game their European campaign will be on the rocks since winning away to Northampton and Castres will be difficult. So I'll sit on the fence and say Neil Francis will win!

castie

Northampton Saints

I you cant win at home you usually go out at the group stages.

Could be an early indication of how Munsters Heineken Cup campaign will go.

justsomebloke

Neil Francis

castie wrote: »

I you cant win at home you usually go out at the group stages.

Could be an early indication of how Munsters Heineken Cup campaign will go.

Agreed I think Munster got screwed with the timing of this game, between players just back from the WC and then with the injury list I think having to play Northampton at home in the first game I think may just be to big an ask.

I can see it being a tight game with but with Northampton putting the screw in in the last 15 minutes.

wixfjord

Neil Francis

justsomebloke wrote: »

Agreed I think Munster got screwed with the timing of this game, between players just back from the WC and then with the injury list I think having to play Northampton at home in the first game I think may just be to big an ask.

I can see it being a tight game with but with Northampton putting the screw in in the last 15 minutes.

Munster got screwed by having an evening home game first in the HEC?!
How many players did Northampton have in the WC? Around the same I'd say.

Injuries fair enough, but that's luck, don't see how they're being "screwed" by anyone.

justsomebloke

Neil Francis

wixfjord wrote: »

Munster got screwed by having an evening home game first in the HEC?

Basically carrying on from what Castie said, you need to win your home games to get out of the pool. So to have your most important game first when players mightn't be up to speed isn't exactly perfect. So that why I said they got screwed as I think from a Munster perspective it would of been better to have this game further down the line

GerM

justsomebloke wrote: »

Agreed I think Munster got screwed with the timing of this game, between players just back from the WC and then with the injury list I think having to play Northampton at home in the first game I think may just be to big an ask.

I can see it being a tight game with but with Northampton putting the screw in in the last 15 minutes.

No more than Northampton in reality. Foden, Ashton, Wood, Lawes, Hartley, Artemyev, Tonga'uiha and Pisi were all at the WC. I reckon seven of those will be in the starting line up for Northampton which will be as many as Munster.

Big test for Munster. They should be able to hold Northampton steady in the scrums these days so I wouldn't worry about them there. Tom Wood aside, Northampton's back row isn't anything fantastic. They're solid without being spectacular. Munster have to go with their best trio to take advantage of this. As Brent Pope always says, never give a sucker an even break. If Munster pick someone like Niall Ronan they'll play into Northampton's hands. Dowson isn't much of an openside but he's physical and a good worker and will gladly hammer Ronan.

It's going to be an interesting battle and a lot will be decided by the two outhalves. The packs are relatively even so whichever set of halfbacks can do more with the ball they get will win the game I think. Lamb is going to be given a rough ride from the locals I'd expect. If he can keep his head, he could put in a massive performance. He's much, much better at using his back three than Myler and Munster will not want to see the likes of Foden and Ashton getting flat ball at pace coming into the midfield. I think ROG is going to give Artemyev an old fashioned welcome and hoist a couple on him. He's lightning but he was always limited defensively and struggles with the ball in behind him.

Set piece and packs to be even. Northampton advantage in the backs but Munster half backs too be the difference and them to win by 8. Having Nigel Owens as referee is no bad thing either.

Fireball07

Northampton Saints

GerM wrote: »

No more than Northampton in reality. Foden, Ashton, Wood, Lawes, Hartley, Artemyev, Tonga'uiha and Pisi were all at the WC. I reckon seven of those will be in the starting line up for Northampton which will be as many as Munster.

Big test for Munster. They should be able to hold Northampton steady in the scrums these days so I wouldn't worry about them there. Tom Wood aside, Northampton's back row isn't anything fantastic. They're solid without being spectacular. Munster have to go with their best trio to take advantage of this. As Brent Pope always says, never give a sucker an even break. If Munster pick someone like Niall Ronan they'll play into Northampton's hands. Dowson isn't much of an openside but he's physical and a good worker and will gladly hammer Ronan.

It's going to be an interesting battle and a lot will be decided by the two outhalves. The packs are relatively even so whichever set of halfbacks can do more with the ball they get will win the game I think. Lamb is going to be given a rough ride from the locals I'd expect. If he can keep his head, he could put in a massive performance. He's much, much better at using his back three than Myler and Munster will not want to see the likes of Foden and Ashton getting flat ball at pace coming into the midfield. I think ROG is going to give Artemyev an old fashioned welcome and hoist a couple on him. He's lightning but he was always limited defensively and struggles with the ball in behind him.

Set piece and packs to be even. Northampton advantage in the backs but Munster half backs too be the difference and them to win by 8. Having Nigel Owens as referee is no bad thing either.

Wow, you're more confident in Munster than I am. I fear Northampton quite a lot, they're very good. Their back three will be a huge threat, and could cause massive problems. And Munster missing so many crucial players, with poorer replacements and some dodgy selection decisions means I'm hugely worried about this game. The home factor will make some sort of difference, but it'll be very very tough. I'm hoping we can scrape a win but I'm not sure at all. Going to need some massive performances from certain players.

cgpg5

Neil Francis

Can't see anything but a Saints win unfortunately

wixfjord

Neil Francis

Northampton certainly look the better team on paper, but luckily for Munster, they don't play on paper. This is Thomond Park on a dark, possibly wet Saturday Heineken Cup night, with the steam rising from the scrums and the fans half cut from multiple hot whiskeys. This is Munster with POC and ROG at home, against an English team with a flakey outhalf and players like Ashton and Lawes who we love to hate.

There will be nothing in this come the end, and if McGahan plays the right team, and the pack get on top, Munster should just do it. Northampton have Dickinson and Lamb at 9 and 10 ffs!

It will be tough, one of the biggest tests ever for Munster in the HEC, and Northampton have the added benefit of having been here before, but if there's any truth in this legend of Munster, they'll give it a right go on Sat.

vinny chase

Neil Francis

wixfjord wrote: »

Northampton certainly look the better team on paper, but luckily for Munster, they don't play on paper. This is Thomond Park on a dark, possibly wet Saturday Heineken Cup night, with the steam rising from the scrums and the fans half cut from multiple hot whiskeys. This is Munster with POC and ROG at home, against an English team with a flakey outhalf and players like Ashton and Lawes who we love to hate.

There will be nothing in this come the end, and if McGahan plays the right team, and the pack get on top, Munster should just do it. Northampton have Dickinson and Lamb at 9 and 10 ffs!

It will be tough, one of the biggest tests ever for Munster in the HEC, and Northampton have the added benefit of having been here before, but if there's any truth in this legend of Munster, they'll give it a right go on Sat.

Complete agreement. If rugby was just about putting the biggest, fastest and strongest fifteen on the pitch all the time, the All Blacks wouldn't have had to wait 24 years to bridge their WC gap, and even then they wouldn't have had to limp over the line in the end.

The mental element of rugby is still, and always will be, integral to winning the big games. I personally think Munster won HEC's for years not by being necessarily the best team in Europe, but by being the team who wanted it more than anything. Similarly I think Leinster's big win over Munster in '09 was more down to the sheer hurt and embarrassment of '07 and the inner belief in themselves, rather than simply being a question of playing ability.

Desire and belief is everything; and that's what makes the game so good for me. Northampton are unquestionably talented, but questions will always remain about their character and big game temperament. Munster would absolutely love to think people are writing them off for this.

Despite how I voted on this, I've now convinced myself the other way, and think that if Munster are close at half time, they'll win it by 6-9 in the end. Gonna back them in the bookies on this too!

GerM

Fireball07 wrote: »

Wow, you're more confident in Munster than I am. I fear Northampton quite a lot, they're very good. Their back three will be a huge threat, and could cause massive problems. And Munster missing so many crucial players, with poorer replacements and some dodgy selection decisions means I'm hugely worried about this game. The home factor will make some sort of difference, but it'll be very very tough. I'm hoping we can scrape a win but I'm not sure at all. Going to need some massive performances from certain players.

Northampton are a good side but they're beatable. Match their scrum and that's a big blow to them immediately. Keep the ball away from Ashton and Foden when you can. Rattle their half backs who can be very mediocre. Teams will struggle to win away from home in Europe with a flakey outhalf. If Lamb wobbles, then they're done for. They're a good side but they have a lot of filler in their team that wouldn't get into a lot of other top teams. Manoa, Clarke, Wilson, Dickinson, Lamb, May and Artemyev...Munster don't have much to fear from those players. They only shine when their team is well on top of the opposition. They somehow managed to only play one top level side in Europe last season. When it came to the HEC final and the Premiership play offs, they simply weren't good enough. If Munster lose this, it will almost certainly spell the end for the current side. In FG, I'd say Northampton but tomorrow I'll stick with Munster but it's going to be a close fought game.

[Jackass]

Neil Francis

It's the type of game where you can't see anything but an oppisition win, and then Munster will win! :pac:

On paper I fancy the Saints in this one by a long way, but paper means little in Thomond park.

If Munster lose this, their season will already be thrown into cardiac arrest.

.ak

Agree with the above comments. There's alot of talk about the Saints' back three, but if there's any team to that know how to shut the door on a fast backline it's Munster. I really can't see the Saints breaking the Thomond siege on saturday... For me I think the game will be won by the half-backs and what pace they decide to play at....

Set to be a corker of a match though!

for any of those seriously seeing nothing bar a Northampton victory; there are some very nice prices available for you if you are confident. http://www.oddschecker.com/rugby-union/club-rugby/heineken-cup/munster-v-northampton-saints/winner

I hate calling the first games of the first round, as nobody really knows which of the teams are going to show up and am steering clear of any betting this round.

profitius

Northampton Saints

I think people are overrating Northampton. They're a very good side but limited. Leicester stopped them last season in the AP semi final and Leinster blew them away in the HEC final when they upped the pace of the game at half time. I don't believe that Northamptons legs went in the dressing room at half time. Thats not giving Leinster the credit they deserve and its papering over the Northampton cracks.

They have to use their pack to win games. Northamptons biggest weapon is their scrum. You'd think Munster would be able to nullify that and maybe Botha and Co could turn the tables on Northampton. The lineout is also good but Munsters is too. Munster defense is also very hard to break down, as is Northamptons. It might come down to goal kicking.

I think Munster will try to play the game at pace and get the Northampton pack moving around the pitch. If they do manage it (the breakdown support needs improving from last week) gaps will appear. Northampton are solid defensively but their big pack are not so good when the game is played at pace.

Munster will need to watch how they kick the ball back to Northampton because they are very good on the counter attack. Ben Foden is a world class fullback and the wingers know where the try line is also. Thats an area where they have an advantage on Munster.

They're good at the breakdown too which Munster need to watch although they're not as good as Leinster there.

PhatPiggins

Northampton Saints

Big name English team come to Thomond park with a couple of over hyped hot headed star names. Temperamental stars get tageted for special attention in first 20 minutes and Munster win comfortably.

Has that ever happened before

wixfjord

Neil Francis

PhatPiggins wrote: »

Big name English team come to Thomond park with a couple of over hyped hot headed star names. Temperamental stars get tageted for special attention in first 20 minutes and Munster win comfortably.

Has that ever happened before

One thing I would say, this Northampton team is better than most others that have gone before it, and will have no problems in the physical stakes, while thi Munster team is arguably the worst in a while.

First time ever in a HEC game to start without Wallace, Quinlan or Foley in the 22.
How long is it since Hayes or DOC haven't been first choice too? The times they are a changin.

I'm really looking forward to this!

totallegend

profitius wrote: »

I think people are overrating Northampton. They're a very good side but limited. Leicester stopped them last season in the AP semi final and Leinster blew them away in the HEC final when they upped the pace of the game at half time. I don't believe that Northamptons legs went in the dressing room at half time. Thats not giving Leinster the credit they deserve and its papering over the Northampton cracks.

Absolutely, the cute hoorism on this thread is gas; I don't see Northampton winning this unless the Northampton scrum gets on top in a big way.
Northampton are a mix of world-class stars and bog-standard jersey fillers, their problem is that two of the latter are wearing 9 & 10 and they won't be able to exert any control over the game; Lamb can mix the brilliant with the atrocious but the fact that he's at his third AP team by the age of 25 reflects the fact that the balance is tipped the wrong way.

bamboozle

Munster will have to get used to playing HC games without some of their big names (Hayes, Horan, Quinlan, Wallace, Stringer) however on the flip side with Botha they finally have a strong scrum, Northampton are strong however, 6pm in Thomand on a saturday evening with a hostile crowd after an afternoon's few pints and i can only see one winner.

if this was a noon kick-off on sunday i'd go with Northampton. Crowd and atmostphere to bring the best out of munster.

danthefan

Northampton Saints

Munster to win imo. If they don't it's HEC season over more or less.

It's interesting now that the entire front and backrows have changed now from the '06 and '08 sides.

Digifriendly

Northampton Saints

bamboozle wrote: »

Munster will have to get used to playing HC games without some of their big names (Hayes, Horan, Quinlan, Wallace, Stringer) however on the flip side with Botha they finally have a strong scrum, Northampton are strong however, 6pm in Thomand on a saturday evening with a hostile crowd after an afternoon's few pints and i can only see one winner.

if this was a noon kick-off on sunday i'd go with Northampton. Crowd and atmostphere to bring the best out of munster.

AFAIK there has never been a noon KO on a Sunday for a HC game but maybe I'm wrong. Usual times are 1.00pm and 3.00pm to suit TV coverage.

.ak

Is it just me, or should Stringer feel like he's got a raw deal for the amount of hard work he's put in? From what I saw of him last season he's one of those older players that seemed to be reaching his 'second wind' if you will, and was definitely on form. Scored that lovely try against Brive as well. But he definitely appears to be third choice now?

I probably haven't watched enough of the early season matches to make judgement, but do any of the Munster fans think he should be higher up in the pecking order? Or is he past it? Personally I think Murray could learn a thing or two about getting to a ruck quicker than a jack russel from Strings.

wixfjord

Neil Francis

Digifriendly wrote: »

AFAIK there has never been a noon KO on a Sunday for a HC game but maybe I'm wrong. Usual times are 1.00pm and 3.00pm to suit TV coverage.

Early kick offs make a huge difference though. Always sucks the life out of the home atmosphere, especially on a Sunday.
Remember games against Castres and Edinburgh that in particular Leinster struggled with.

totallegend

wixfjord wrote: »

One thing I would say, this Northampton team is better than most others that have gone before it, and will have no problems in the physical stakes, while thi Munster team is arguably the worst in a while.

First time ever in a HEC game to start without Wallace, Quinlan or Foley in the 22.
How long is it since Hayes or DOC haven't been first choice too? The times they are a changin.

I'm really looking forward to this!

Has DOC been dropped?

CIARAN_BOYLE

Northampton Saints

totallegend wrote: »

Has DOC been dropped?

Its not confirmed but Ryan was training with the first pack while DOC was working with the subs during the week

phog

totallegend wrote: »

Has DOC been dropped?

Assuming he's not starting , maybe it's squad rotation or giving the other guys some game time.

Cpt_Blackbeard

Anyone know where I'll be able to find a repeat of the game online? I'll be working the match so, I'll prob only see bits and pieces of it .I'm pretty sure that TG4 are showing the game but, they take an age to put it up online. An old Irish teacher is supposedly commentating on it though, which would make for entertaining listening.

totallegend

http://irishexaminer.ie/sport/rugby/leading-from-the-front-173540.html

Munster are the "plucky underdogs" apparently. If someone here posted that, he'd be slated for it. Bookies favorites with probably the best home record in the HC, I'm going to hope the journo is being somewhat tongue in cheek.

wixfjord

Neil Francis

totallegend wrote: »

http://irishexaminer.ie/sport/rugby/leading-from-the-front-173540.html

Munster are the "plucky underdogs" apparently. If someone here posted that, he'd be slated for it. Bookies favorites with probably the best home record in the HC, I'm going to hope the journo is being somewhat tongue in cheek.

"You’d rather be favourites, you’d rather be coming off a win against Leinster and we’d rather have qualified last year but those are the facts and that makes us underdogs."

Jaysus Paul. :rolleyes:
The bookies seem to think otherwise.
Plucky underdogs at home in Thomond Park?!

bamboozle

sky sports preview of this game on the rugby club last night was too positive for Munster...northampton best front row in club rugby bla bla bla, no mention of their plodders at half-back

Digifriendly

Northampton Saints

wixfjord wrote: »

Early kick offs make a huge difference though. Always sucks the life out of the home atmosphere, especially on a Sunday.
Remember games against Castres and Edinburgh that in particular Leinster struggled with.

Tend to agree with this. Remember Ulster playing Stade Francais on a Saturday lunchtime and atmosphere was nowhere near a Friday night at Ravenhill.

justsomebloke

Neil Francis

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Anyone know where I'll be able to find a repeat of the game online? I'll be working the match so, I'll prob only see bits and pieces of it .I'm pretty sure that TG4 are showing the game but, they take an age to put it up online. An old Irish teacher is supposedly commentating on it though, which would make for entertaining listening.

it's a sky sports game so won't be TG4 only have a highlights package, also not sure if they are allowed put the highlights package online

markest

Neil Francis

I think you underestimate Lee Dickson, he might not run too much but gets the ball out quick. We struggle when he's injured, although we have a good replacement now in Martyn Roberts. Saints to win by 10+ ha ha.

totallegend

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/9649.php

The Cup That Cheers Returns
11 November 2011, 9:15 am
By Pat Geraghty

Plenty of talking points after Munster named their side today for the Heineken Cup opener against Northampton Saints tomorrow with Donncha O'Callaghan, Denis Leamy and newcomer Will Chambers all relegated to the bench.


Donnacha Ryan takes O'Callaghan's place along the skipper Paul O'Connell in the second row, James Coughlan supplants Leamy as the number 8 from the Leinster game while 21 year old Danny Barnes is preferred in the outside channel to Chambers, the Super 15 winning medalist. Prior to last year's final pool game against London Irish, you have to go back to 2002/03 season for the last time O'Callaghan didn't start in an entire Pool campaign (he played in 4 of their 6 games) for Munster in the Heineken Cup while Leamy has been an ever present in the side, injury aside, since making his debut in 2004.
Ryan, O'Callaghan's replacement has been seen more as a back-rower up to now but relishes the opportunity presented to him. Over the years I'd a been longing to play second row but obviously with the calibre of player that was there I had to play back-row and yeh I'd like to nail down a second row place but basically I'd like to play rugby so at the end of the day so I'll play where I'm put really."
Looking forward to Saturday's game the Tipperary native admits, " It's a really serious challenge, a huge night and one when we'll really look to have the crowd behind us cause we'll need them."
He's acutely aware of the challenge posed by last year's beaten finalists and particular individuals.
They'd a great run last year. Topped their Pool, got to the final. Maybe just ran out of steam in the second half.
Lawes is a key player. A really big guy, he's very powerful, very fast. We saw his quality in the World Cup and we'll have to be on our toes there. Then there's Dylan Hartley as well, a key member of their side, a leader for them.
First of all we have to play for 80 minutes, last week our discipline was poor as well and we were a bit sporadic in our performance So we're really going to have to concentrate on ourselves, on our own discipline and basically be as relentless as possible for 80 minutes."
The home comfort of an opener in Thomond Park Stadium is tempered by the need to secure a home win but Ryan only sees the positives. "There's probably always pressure playing with Munster and it's pressure we put on ourselves but that's the challenge we love rising to.
"Playing in Thomond Park is going to give us a real boost. Last year was a very hurtful year for us in our performance in the Heineken Cup so this time around we'll take every game as it comes. Home or away we're just set on going out there and doing our bes

wixfjord

Neil Francis

Ronan starts then?

Is the full team up?

ormond lad

Northampton Saints

wixfjord wrote: »

Ronan starts then?

Is the full team up?

Yes
No

wixfjord

Neil Francis

15 Ben FODEN
14 Chris ASHTON
13 Jon CLARKE
12 James DOWNEY
11 Vasily ARTEMYEV
10 Ryan LAMB
9 Lee DICKSON
1 Soane TONGA'UIHA
2 Dylan HARTLEY (capt)
3 Brian MUJATI
4 Courtney LAWES
5 Mark SORENSON
6 Calum CLARK
7 Tom WOOD
8 Roger WILSON

Replacements
16 Mike HAYWOOD
17 Alex WALLER
18 Paul DORAN JONES
19 Samu MANOA
20 Phil DOWSON
21 Martin ROBERTS
22 Stephen MYLER
23 George PISI

Downey starts for Northampton, Dowson on bench.
Strong team.

thomond2006

No full team up yet, BIG chance for Ryan. Writing was on the wall for DOC when he was subbed after 50 minutes against Leinster.

NORTHAMPTON SAINTS TEAM TO PLAY MUNSTER
15 Ben FODEN
14 Chris ASHTON
13 Jon CLARKE
12 James DOWNEY
11 Vasily ARTEMYEV
10 Ryan LAMB
9 Lee DICKSON
1 Soane TONGA'UIHA
2 Dylan HARTLEY (capt)
3 Brian MUJATI
4 Courtney LAWES
5 Mark SORENSON
6 Calum CLARK
7 Tom WOOD
8 Roger WILSON


Replacements
16 Mike HAYWOOD
17 Alex WALLER
18 Paul DORAN JONES
19 Samu MANOA
20 Phil DOWSON
21 Martin ROBERTS
22 Stephen MYLER
23 George PISI

http://www.northamptonsaints.co.uk/rugby/8000.php

I'm surprised they've left out Dowson, he's normally a key man for them, but they've been rotating their backrow all season IIRC.

Downey comes back in at 12 and Tom May drops out of the 23.

profitius

Northampton Saints

Who is playing 6 for Munster? Is the full team up yet?

thomond2006

Munster:
J Murphy; D Howlett, D Barnes, L Mafi, D Hurley; R O'Gara, C Murray;
W du Preez, D Varley, BJ Botha; D Ryan, P O'Connell capt; P O'Mahony, N Ronan, J Coughlan.

Replacements. D Fogarty, J Ryan, J Hayes, D O'Callaghan, D Leamy, T O'Leary, I Keatley, W Chambers.

I saw Marcus Horan limping at training on Tuesday so that's probably why he's left out. Good luck to John Ryan!

Ronan at 7 is a bad joke but at least O'Mahony is starting.

Fireball07

Northampton Saints

thomond2006 wrote: »

Munster:
J Murphy; D Howlett, D Barnes, L Mafi, D Hurley; R O'Gara, C Murray;
W du Preez, D Varley, BJ Botha; D Ryan, P O'Connell capt; P O'Mahony, N Ronan, J Coughlan.

Replacements. D Fogarty, J Ryan, J Hayes, D O'Callaghan, D Leamy, T O'Leary, I Keatley, W Chambers.

I saw Marcus Horan limping at training on Tuesday so that's probably why he's left out. Good luck to John Ryan!

Ronan at 7 is a bad joke but at least O'Mahony is starting.

It's not that bad...but it's not great either. I'm glad that POM and Coughlan are starting, but Leamy should really be playing ahead of Ronan. At least he's proven before that he's good enough for the HC. I'd rather Ryan in the backrow with DOC in the 2nd row too. POM should be 7.

Back-line doesn't look the most exciting, but at least Hurley is strong defensively and if Mafi hits some sort of form, he's dangerous. At least Chambers, DOC and Leamy are decent impact players off the bench aswell.

Risteard

Good to see POM start, albeit at 6. Not sure why Ronan is continually selected, McGahan might just not see POM as a 7.

Should anything happen to WdP this could be quite the baptism of fire for J. Ryan.

Also that is a phenomenal record for DOC. A testament to his professionalism and durability. D. Ryan is well worth his place though IMO, and if this lifts the performance of DOC who I'm sure will come on with a point to prove, it could prove quite beneficial.

Overall I'm happy enough with that team.

wixfjord

Neil Francis

Full team:
Munster: J Murphy; D Howlett, D Barnes, L Mafi, D Hurley; R O'Gara, C Murray; W du Preez, D Varley, BJ Botha; D Ryan, P O'Connell capt; P O'Mahony, N Ronan, J Coughlan. Replacements. D Fogarty, J Ryan, J Hayes, D O'Callaghan, D Leamy, T O'Leary, I Keatley, W Chambers.

Ryan on the bench is interesting.

ormond lad

Northampton Saints

thomond2006 wrote: »

Munster:
J Murphy; D Howlett, D Barnes, L Mafi, D Hurley; R O'Gara, C Murray;
W du Preez, D Varley, BJ Botha; D Ryan, P O'Connell capt; P O'Mahony, N Ronan, J Coughlan.

Replacements. D Fogarty, J Ryan, J Hayes, D O'Callaghan, D Leamy, T O'Leary, I Keatley, W Chambers.

I saw Marcus Horan limping at training on Tuesday so that's probably why he's left out. Good luck to John Ryan!

Ronan at 7 is a bad joke but at least O'Mahony is starting.

Ryan for DOC is a clear form call, and will be a welcome kick up the hole for DOC too.
You cant argue with the call for barnes over chambers, who hasnt really clicked yet.
Delighted for Donnacha and Danny, But cant understand Ronans inclusion,
he is too light and not good enough to play in our back row especially as it means excluding O Mahony.
If Leamy was dropped because of penalties, cards given away etc then why wasnt Ronan who gave away 3 really stupid penalties.
Hopefully leamys impact of the bench will be massive.

Noticed the Bull is on the bench hopefully he comes on for HEC cap 100 at some stage. Gwan the Bull!!!

Fireball07

Northampton Saints

ormond lad wrote: »

Ryan for DOC is a clear form call, and will be a welcome kick up the hole for DOC too.
You cant argue with the call for barnes over chambers, who hasnt really clicked yet.
Delighted for Donnacha and Danny, But cant understand Ronans inclusion,
he is too light and not good enough to play in our back row especially as it means excluding O Mahony.
If Leamy was dropped because of penalties, cards given away etc then why wasnt Ronan who gave away 3 really stupid penalties.
Hopefully leamys impact of the bench will be massive.

Noticed the Bull is on the bench hopefully he comes on for HEC cap 100 at some stage. Gwan the Bull!!!

Forgot about that actually. 100 HC caps is simply incredible for any player. I hope he gets it...there's only one word to describe him.....ligind!

Benny Cake

Northampton Saints

Delighted Ryan gets nod the ahead of DOC.. great to see Mcgahan has the balls to make the call Kidney couldn't..

CatFromHue

ormond lad wrote: »

Ryan for DOC is a clear form call, and will be a welcome kick up the hole for DOC too.
You cant argue with the call for barnes over chambers, who hasnt really clicked yet.
Delighted for Donnacha and Danny, But cant understand Ronans inclusion,
he is too light and not good enough to play in our back row especially as it means excluding O Mahony.
If Leamy was dropped because of penalties, cards given away etc then why wasnt Ronan who gave away 3 really stupid penalties.
Hopefully leamys impact of the bench will be massive.

According to ESPN Ronan only gave away 1 penalty last week as did Leamy. Leamy was yellow carded though.

http://www.espnscrum.com/rabodirect-pro12-2011-12/rugby/match/144631.html

Also O'Mahony is in the team.

wixfjord

Neil Francis

I've changed my mind to a Northampton win after the announcements.
Stronger in most facets imo, and Downey and Clarke could make hay against that centre combo.

vinny chase

Neil Francis

wixfjord wrote: »

I've changed my mind to a Northampton win after the announcements.
Stronger in most facets imo, and Downey and Clarke could make hay against that centre combo.

Stronger in a lot of facets, but significantly weaker at 9 and 10 imo.

On a wet night in Limerick, if the pack can get parity it mightn't matter a whole lot who is wearing the 11, 14 & 15 jerseys. If this is a close game I'd back RO'G over Ryan Lamb every day of the week.

Hype710

I think there was a time to drop O' Callaghan, but not for this game. NH are an extremely physical side and O' Callaghan puts in a huge shift defensively. Ryan could revert to the blindside and POM to openside. The selection of Ronan is simply incredible.

[Jackass]

Neil Francis

Good to see O'Mahony and Barnes starting. Time to see if they're up to this level at all.

Amazed DO'C has been dropped! According to Kidney he's undroppable at national level! Right call for Munster though.

I don't know what it is, maybe it's the chills I used to get from looking at Munster teams, but these days they just look like patchwork mediocre side on paper. No doubt I'll be proven wrong, but Northampton team looks far superior all over the park.

It's do or die time now for Munster, status as a top tier European team is on the line now. Another group exit and it's game over.