Closing your Boards.ie Account

Dav

Hello all,

We've now made the option of closing a Boards.ie Account available via your User Control Panel. Take a look at the menu on the left and it's the last option on the page in the Miscellaneous section.

This is a permanent and irreversible process, so I would encourage anyone who's thinking about it not to act "in anger" and take a day to think about it because we can't restore your account afterwards and we won't be dealing with any requests to do so.

OldGoat

Would it be possible to add a 7 day countdown before deleting the account? Might forstall a few hand-wringing puppy eyed begging and pleading posts from the wreckless and the "My brother did it..." brigade.

Tallon

Or even a 24-48 hour time frame

Also, if I click it now, will it prompt me, or just close it instantly?

justsomebloke

so are we taking bets on who will be the first re-reg to post on this thread saying that they have just accidentally closed their account after clicking on Dav's link

Daemos

Tallon wrote: »

Also, if I click it now, will it prompt me, or just close it instantly?

You're given a prompt to start the "process", but that's as far as I dare go. Anyone else care to try?

Dades

I can't see it in my Control Panel.

Oh - I think I found i

Boards.ie: Danny

Tallon wrote: »

Also, if I click it now, will it prompt me, or just close it instantly?

Clicking on the link brings you to a page where the details of the account closing are listed out (e.g. we won't delete your posts, your profile will be blanked and password scrambled).

Then when you click Close Account on that page you'll be prompted for your password and to confirm the account re-opening is simply not possible. You will be asked for a reason for the account closure too, if you want to choose one from the dropdown list (Atari Jaguar anybody? :pac:).

Then, finally, you click the Close Account button again and it is done. There is no timeout period for canceling your decision or rethinking it, the account is closed immediately.

seamus

Daemos wrote: »

You're given a prompt to start the "process", but that's as far as I dare go. Anyone else care to try?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/member.php?u=490501

Step 1:


Step 2:


Enter password, click the button et voila!

You'd have to be an idiot to do this by accident tbh.

seamus

On a side note, the anti-spam measures when signing up are likely to be turning people away.

I got an error message twice, before I noticed that there were two anti-spam measures, I couldn't see the second one below the captcha and it wasn't highlighted as being wrong. I just assumed I'd entered the captcha wrong.

If I was a casual user, I'd have given up and gone elsewhere.

May I ask why? Has there been a huge demand for this?

Tallon

Boards.ie: Danny wrote: »

Clicking on the link brings you to a page where the details of the account closing are listed out (e.g. we won't delete your posts, your profile will be blanked and password scrambled).

Then when you click Close Account on that page you'll be prompted for your password and to confirm the account re-opening is simply not possible. You will be asked for a reason for the account closure too, if you want to choose one from the dropdown list (Atari Jaguar anybody? :pac:).

Then, finally, you click the Close Account button again and it is done. There is no timeout period for canceling your decision or rethinking it, the account is closed immediately.

So it's not permanent permanent? :pac:

Could be a fun game, close your account and try to guess the password :P

meditraitor

Boards.ie: Danny wrote: »

Clicking on the link brings you to a page where the details of the account closing are listed out (e.g. we won't delete your posts, your profile will be blanked and password scrambled).

Then when you click Close Account on that page you'll be prompted for your password and to confirm the account re-opening is simply not possible. You will be asked for a reason for the account closure too, if you want to choose one from the dropdown list (Atari Jaguar anybody? :pac:).

Then, finally, you click the Close Account button again and it is done. There is no timeout period for canceling your decision or rethinking it, the account is closed immediately.

A quick question on this, if I closed my account and as pointed out the profile was blanked this would effectively prevent searching against my account or would it still be possible?

The reason Im asking is that superman forbid I decide to quit boards then I would like to prevent any searching of information posted by me over the years,

Boards.ie: Danny

Tallon wrote: »

So it's not permanent permanent? :pac:

Could be a fun game, close your account and try to guess the password :P

I wouldn't try it, the incorrect login strikes system is in place. There are other ramifications for closed accounts I won't go into but the account becomes useless even if somebody was able to log into it

Boards.ie: Danny

meditraitor wrote: »

A quick question on this, if I closed my account and as pointed out the profile was blanked this would effectively prevent searching against my account or would it still be possible?

The reason Im asking is that superman forbid I decide to quit boards then I would like to prevent any searching of information posted by me over the years,

Your username/posts will still be searchable AFAIK, the posts you made remain untouched as per the terms & conditions.

Dav

The idea of a cooldown period: It's not without merrit, but at the same time, being very blunt, if you make the decision to click 3 links (User CP -> Close Account link -> Close Account Button), enter your password and tick a box agreeing to this and acknowledging the bold red text saying this cannot be undone, then it's not like you can say you weren't warned or are likely to have made a mistake.

Further to that, your account is your own responsibility, if you leave it logged in and unsecure and someone closes it "for the laugh" then there's only one person at fault and it's not us...

seamus: Thanks a million for posting the pics, I was just about to go and do that

Pappa Dolla: Has there been a demand: surprisingly, yes. In the past, we just told people to stop posting, but after a consultation with the Data Protection Commissioner, they told us that this is a service we have to offer as we hold some personal information (it's also one of the reasons I'd imagine they're auditing Facebook here in Ireland as at no stage do they say they're removing your personal info from their databases).

meditraitor

Boards.ie: Danny wrote: »

Your username/posts will still be searchable AFAIK, the posts you made remain untouched as per the terms & conditions.

Had a feeling that would be the case,

Hypothetically, say I registered before these terms and conditions were applied would it be possible to blank the user name..... or change it to say usernolonger.

I know deleting all the posts is not possible at the moment but a solution to offer anonimity to any users who decide to leave would be a step in the right direction considering the direction data use and user data on the internet is going.
Ownership and all that, Ive seen the "this is a private website" malarky a 1000 times but maybe offering a way to prevent search of posts of pre-leaving user names should be looked at.

And scrambling of data, who might own Boards in 10 years? in my time it has been taken over and I dont remember being asked if it was ok to sell the ownership of my posts to this company. There is a great responsibity on the owners to protect our posts as it is the post and not the owners that make this site.

TouchingVirus

meditraitor wrote: »

Had a feeling that would be the case,

Hypothetically, say I registered before these terms and conditions were applied would it be possible to blank the user name..... or change it to say usernolonger.

You've used Boards after the T&C change, tacit acceptance of the new terms & conditions.

I know deleting all the posts is not possible at the moment but a solution to offer anonimity to any users who decide to leave would be a step in the right direction considering the direction data use and user data on the internet is going.
Ownership and all that, Ive seen the "this is a private website" malarky a 1000 times but maybe offering a way to prevent search of posts of pre-leaving user names should be looked at.

Deleting posts shouldn't ever be done, this is a discussion forum and to remove posts disrupts the very basis of the site. You can always subscribe to change your username and then close the account. Your profile data is wiped when you close your account and I assume that also means your previous nicknames field too.

And scrambling of data, who might own Boards in 10 years? in my time it has been taken over and I dont remember being asked if it was ok to sell the ownership of my posts to this company. There is a great responsibity on the owners to protect our posts as it is the post and not the owners that make this site.

Boards.ie Ltd, who owned the site in 2004 when you registered is still the owner today, or so I can gather.

Dav wrote: »

Further to that, your account is your own responsibility, if you leave it logged in and unsecure and someone closes it "for the laugh" then there's only one person at fault and it's not us...

Other people should not know your boards password. No password, no account closure

Kadongy

meditraitor

TouchingVirus wrote: »

You've used Boards after the T&C change, tacit acceptance of the new terms & conditions.

What is the legal standing of this statement?

TouchingVirus wrote: »

Deleting posts shouldn't ever be done, this is a discussion forum and to remove posts disrupts the very basis of the site. You can always subscribe to change your username and then close the account. Your profile data is wiped when you close your account and I assume that also means your previous nicknames field too.

Could this be offered in the close account section? Is it time consuming for the admins? Can it be automated (programmed)

TouchingVirus wrote: »

Boards.ie Ltd, who owned the site in 2004 when you registered is still the owner today, or so I can gather.

Really, Who owned Boards.ie Ltd in 2004 and who owns it now? Essentially who owns the Data? I would be happy if it was the same people as 2004. and if the same poeple owned it 2024


My queries are purely out of interest,

Dav

You make your posts voluntarily, they are not covered under data protection issues. You choose your own username, you don't have to choose your actual name (in a past version of the site Ts & Cs we actively encouraged people not to) for this nor do you ever have to publically post anything about yourself that could identify you - so from the very start of your time on this site, you are at a default level of "publically anonymous" which I would define as "unless you have access to someone's IP address and can match that to their ISP, you cannot definitivly confirm their identity" - it would take a Section 8 request to both us and the ISP for these details by the way and you need to be a Garda or a Court for that.

So ultimately, you decide your level of "anonymity" and you have to be responsible for it.

TouchingVirus

meditraitor wrote: »

What is the legal standing of this statement?

Very strong AFAIK. Your continued use of Boards.ie after notification of the changes of Terms & Conditions and subsequent implementation of these T&C changes is deemed to confirm your acceptance of the changes.

Questions regarding your anonymity were answered by Dav. I guess this is why name changes are a subscription-only thing too, they're not simple things to do and require effort by Boards.ie for your own indiscretion regarding your own anonymity.

meditraitor

Dav wrote: »

You make your posts voluntarily, they are not covered under data protection issues. You choose your own username, you don't have to choose your actual name (in a past version of the site Ts & Cs we actively encouraged people not to) for this nor do you ever have to publically post anything about yourself that could identify you - so from the very start of your time on this site, you are at a default level of "publically anonymous" which I would define as "unless you have access to someone's IP address and can match that to their ISP, you cannot definitivly confirm their identity" - it would take a Section 8 request to both us and the ISP for these details by the way and you need to be a Garda or a Court for that.

So ultimately, you decide your level of "anonymity" and you have to be responsible for it.

OK, seems very clear, you dont have to look into this, and here is the BUT,

Could Boards.ie look into this? There are a lot of people who post thins they regret and your edit functions are time effected.

Say for example you posted 10,000 posts, this should effectively give enough information to nail who you are, then someone you dont want knowing finds out your nick, how do you prevent or help this person regain their annonimity? Or do you just leave them with thier arse in the wind?

I get the personal responsibity notion but something you posted 3 years ago may not accuratley reflect your point of view now and refusing any form of edit seems odd,

meditraitor

TouchingVirus wrote: »

Very strong AFAIK. Your continued use of Boards.ie after notification of the changes of Terms & Conditions and subsequent implementation of these T&C changes is deemed to confirm your acceptance of the changes.

Questions regarding your anonymity were answered by Dav. I guess this is why name changes are a subscription-only thing too, they're not simple things to do and require effort by Boards.ie for your own indiscretion regarding your own anonymity.

Seems a bit harsh, "tough shit" policies dont sit well with me. But if thats the T&C so be it.

I am not considering leaving just pondering the structure of the opt out process,

Were I see holes you see a solid wall..... thats why boards works.

Kadongy

meditraitor wrote: »

Seems a bit harsh, "tough shit" policies dont sit well with me. But if thats the T&C so be it.

I am not considering leaving just pondering the structure of the opt out process,

Were I see holes you see a solid wall..... thats why boards works.

Honestly, most Web forums have less in the way of privacy options. Experts exchange, for example, still do not offer the ability to change your username at all; though it has been on their to-do list for ages according to their own representatives.

meditraitor

Kadongy wrote: »

Honestly, most Web forums have less in the way of privacy options. Experts exchange, for example, still do not offer the ability to change your username at all; though it has been on their to-do list for ages according to their own representatives.

This is Ireland's biggest and most respected web forum, a privacy policy that allows full anonimity or opt out solution with extended anonimity is obviously not the most important thing but why should it not be on the table.......

Plenty of talent in boards, surely someone could have a look at it.

Anyway, I am probably taking up too much of your time with my musings,

Back to afterhours for some fart jokes;)

seamus

meditraitor wrote: »

Say for example you posted 10,000 posts, this should effectively give enough information to nail who you are, then someone you dont want knowing finds out your nick, how do you prevent or help this person regain their annonimity? Or do you just leave them with thier arse in the wind?

Well, pretty much. Otherwise, what do you suggest? You can't nuke their post history. For starters it would destroy any threads where that person had been actively involved. But the main issue is that if the facility was there, lots of people would want to use it, for whatever reasons. Jaysus, I'd even consider it.

Ask yourself the same question in a real-life scenario - someone who you don't want knowing, finds out what boozer you go to. Should the barman assist you in some way to restore your anonimity?

I think the main issue is that online posting is still relatively new and unexplored. Your normal person using any online service like facebook or boards doesn't consider that they're published information which can be archived and researched for all of eternity. Such a thing was previously only something which happened to journalists. It's not something which most of us had to even consider before.

So naturally when it comes back to bite us in the ass we think that someone else should have been watching our back and telling us about the possibilities.

I think what might be a good idea is a deletion request facility, for a fee.

So a user can go back through their post history and provide a list of specific posts that they want deleted, with a justification for that deletion. A member of staff then reviews the request and justification and deletes it. The fee should represent a reasonable amount for the employee's time. So if they can delete 10 posts in an hour (remember that they would have to review each post), you charge €50/hour for this service. So if someone wants one post deleted, that's €5 please. 100 posts? €500 please.

I think that would represent a fair compromise between the importance of anonimity to someone and the effort required by boards to assist them in that request. Blanket deletion of posts or nuking of accounts simply isn't a reasonable possibility.

Dav

meditraitor wrote: »

OK, seems very clear, you dont have to look into this, and here is the BUT,

Could Boards.ie look into this? There are a lot of people who post thins they regret and your edit functions are time effected.

Say for example you posted 10,000 posts, this should effectively give enough information to nail who you are, then someone you dont want knowing finds out your nick, how do you prevent or help this person regain their annonimity? Or do you just leave them with thier arse in the wind?

I get the personal responsibity notion but something you posted 3 years ago may not accuratley reflect your point of view now and refusing any form of edit seems odd,

You raise some very fair and valid points and these are issues we've wrestled with for a long time here in the office over the last couple of years. Cutting to the chase - the main reason we do things how we do them is one of scale.

Taking your example of someone with 10,000 posts, it takes quite a bit of time and no inconsiderable amount of effort to match someone's nickname to their real identity if they've been smart about how much information they give away about themselves, I concede the point that it is entirely possible. The bigger issue of online privacy and annonymity is quite a new ground to break for society and there is still a rather alarming level of ignorance amongst people using the internet every day as to how much of themselves they're making public and just who's reading. Ultimately, it's the person who has to decide and deal with this, not the service provider and whilst that may seem like me trying to say "tough s**t, it's not our problem" I am a huge believer in people learning and doing for themselves and not having to rely on someone else to do their thinking for them or protecting them from themselves.

It's not that we would ever say "no" to someone in a real bind, we often receive requests to delete a post or a selection of posts from someone who's identity has been compromised through whatever means and for whatever reason and we're not indifferent to someone's issues. We do this on a case-by-case basis and we do it quietly and without fuss where possible, but we have to be mindful that we're not, in some extreme cases, leaving ourselves open to an appearance in court where we've supposedly become an accessory to a crime in giving someone the means to remove evidence/confessions/contemptuous postings on the site - so to that end, we can't just have a blanket approach to such things. As these sorts of things take a huge amount of our (rather limited) time this is not an option for us to be able to offer for everyone especially when, as I previously mentioned, it shouldn't really have to be our responsibility in the first place.

To offer the ability for someone to simply delete all their posts would kill our site overnight. It is, as you have quite rightly said, the posters and their posts that make this place what it is, but if someone gets bent out of shape because they've been pulled up for breaking our rules and they demand (you should see the emails we get along these lines, the sense of entitlement and rudeness of these numpties is unbelievable) we remove all their content, or worse still, have the facility to do so automatically, then that's game over for us.

So, you ask "Could Boards.ie look into this?" The answer is we have and at length and this is what we think is the fairest response and policy in such matters.

jor el

If deleting of old posts (with or without charging a fee) were allowed, I'm not sure how quoting of those posts would be handled. I know from a moderator point of view, if I delete someone's old post then any quote of that post will remain in place. There's also no way to find quoted references to a post, so you'd have to manually check each entire thread where a delete post is made to make sure there are no quotes. There may be an easier way for an admin/developer to find quoted posts, but I'm not sure.

I think this would just not be worth offering at all, even for a fee, unless there is some legal requirement behind it.

Dav

I'll interject with this - I don't ever see us offering something like a formal post deletion service - even for a fee! It'd be a really nice money maker if I'm honest, but all that aside, there is still the bigger issue of how much time it takes for us to manage.

pickarooney

From a technical point of view it shouldn't be too difficult to have an account called DeletedUser and reassign all the posts from closed accounts to this user's ID, should there be a need to. Obviously replies to posts which refer to the user's name are a different matter.

Nody

Another question not relating directly to the data protection but what about regging again? Lets say I've concluded this account has shared to much personal information/I rage quit/what ever and I want a clean start on the forum 6 months later (not due to being banned as that's covered under the usual rereg banning).

I go through the process and "delete" my account; would I now be free to set up a new account (as this would throw of flags for duplicate account most likely)?

Mickeroo

Dades wrote: »

I can't see it in my Control Panel.

Oh - I think I found i

And we never saw Dades again *sniff*

Conor

Nody wrote: »

Another question not relating directly to the data protection but what about regging again? Lets say I've concluded this account has shared to much personal information/I rage quit/what ever and I want a clean start on the forum 6 months later (not due to being banned as that's covered under the usual rereg banning).

I go through the process and "delete" my account; would I now be free to set up a new account (as this would throw of flags for duplicate account most likely)?

It depends.

It depends on your internet connection. Some identify you more clearly than others. After six months though it's relatively hard to be sure that two accounts are the same for most net connections though it's still possible with some.

It also depends on your posting style. This is the most reliable way of spotting most re-reg accounts because it's the hardest for you to change. If you take a poster's favourite topics, common misspellings/grammar faults, punctuation styles, etc. you can often spot a re-reg. It's labour-intensive though, so you'd have to come to the notice of someone who's willing to trawl through a bunch of posts in order to link the two accounts.

Nody

Well Conor let me rephrase it like this for clarity (and no I don't have any such plans but I can see the issue coming up quick enough):

If I "delete" my account and my account is in good standing (i.e. not site banned, banned from a forum I wish to post in etc.) and I for the first time (and not as a regular "get a clean slate" every half a year for trolling kind of thing) decide I wish to register again would this be allowed as my account is "deleted"?

For the sake of clarity assume I'm spotted via IP as I cooled down the following day after my rage quitting, drunk, high on weed deletion spree of my accounts on the web.

If yes I can see it being used to get around posting history (i.e. get a clean slate every so often to troll more as there is no link per say) and throw false positives for "normal" posters; if no I can see people being upset they can "never" return

4zn76tysfajdxp

If this ever happens to dr.bollocko at four in the morning, you can just blame me.

Conor

Nody wrote: »

If I "delete" my account and my account is in good standing (i.e. not site banned, banned from a forum I wish to post in etc.) and I for the first time (and not as a regular "get a clean slate" every half a year for trolling kind of thing) decide I wish to register again would this be allowed as my account is "deleted"?

Yes, and this has always been the case. You could always just stop using one account and start using another. Provided you didn't use both concurrently or use one to evade a ban given to another no action is taken.

As a practical matter, if you're banned and then you come back as a "well behaved" user you won't come to the notice of a mod and hence they'll never check up to see if you're a re-reg.

Wibbs

Conor wrote: »

As a practical matter, if you're banned and then you come back as a "well behaved" user you won't come to the notice of a mod and hence they'll never check up to see if you're a re-reg.

From what I recall there have been a couple of very good posters here today who that happened with.

pwd

Conor wrote: »

Yes, and this has always been the case. You could always just stop using one account and start using another. Provided you didn't use both concurrently or use one to evade a ban given to another no action is taken.

As a practical matter, if you're banned and then you come back as a "well behaved" user you won't come to the notice of a mod and hence they'll never check up to see if you're a re-reg.

Yes people do it for privacy reasons often enough I expect

Insect Overlord

pwd wrote: »

Yes people do it for privacy reasons often enough I expect

What a way to go! :eek:

Conor

pwd wrote: »

Yes people do it for privacy reasons often enough I expect

Not that it's a particularly useful method, but if it makes them happy...

There's only one way of keeping stuff private: don't tell anyone.

As soon as it's on the internet, someone somewhere else has a copy and there's not a damn thing you can do about it. You can try playing whack-a-mole to have the copies you know about removed but long term that's a losing battle.

Act as if you're signing every post and you won't go far wrong.

MitchKoobski

When I saw the "Why do you want to leave?" box I thought "I really hope Atarii Jaguar is in there."

I'm happy now.

Chris P. Bacon

pwd wrote: »

Yes people do it for privacy reasons often enough I expect

If you had made 2 more posts you could of left with 5,000,ah goodbye anyway

Stercus Accidit

Under the upcoming 'right to be forgotten' amendments to the European Data laws, it's likely boards.ie will have to do more than this, you will have to facilitate the removal of past posts too. Like it or lump it, it is user submitted information.

Have the admins looked at the proposals and do they plan to facilitate them?

Strengthening individuals' rights so that the collection and use of personal data is limited to the minimum necessary. Individuals should also be clearly informed in a transparent way on how, why, by whom, and for how long their data is collected and used. People should be able to give their informed consent to the processing of their personal data, for example when surfing online, and should have the "right to be forgotten" when their data is no longer needed or they want their data to be deleted.

http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=IP/10/1462&format=HTML&aged=1&language=EN&guiLanguage=fr

A lot of people grow out of online discussions and personas, and want to simply erase that part of their life so that it cant be dragged up again in future for whatever reason.

Thrill

Given that your username and posts will remain intact then.....

Will "registered user" change to something else, as you would no longer be one? It might be misleading to allow anyone to think the account was still active now that they are permanently shut.

Will there be confirmation of the exact date the account was closed that can be easily checked (Join date, date closed).

Will a list be available to see if a poster has left boards? (Probably not necessary if "registered user" is updated to "no longer registered")



.

Chris P. Bacon

Thrill wrote: »

Will "registered user" change to something else, as you would no longer be one? It might be misleading to allow anyone to think the account was still active now that they are permanently shut.

Will there be confirmation of the exact date the account was closed that can be easily checked (Join date, date closed).

This person a few posts above yours just closed their account.

Thrill

Chris P. Bacon wrote: »

This person a few posts above yours just closed their account.

Thanks.




"Closed Account" is there, doesn't appear to be a "Date closed" though.

Overheal

Dav wrote: »

The idea of a cooldown period: It's not without merrit, but at the same time, being very blunt, if you make the decision to click 3 links (User CP -> Close Account link -> Close Account Button), enter your password and tick a box agreeing to this and acknowledging the bold red text saying this cannot be undone, then it's not like you can say you weren't warned or are likely to have made a mistake.

WOOOOAH WOAAAH woah there buddy: No Captcha?

aidan_walsh

Is the "here" in the "you can contact us here or at hello@boards.ie" supposed to lead somewhere?

Conor

Stercus Accidit wrote: »

Under the upcoming 'right to be forgotten' amendments to the European Data laws, it's likely boards.ie will have to do more than this, you will have to facilitate the removal of past posts too. Like it or lump it, it is user submitted information.

Have the admins looked at the proposals and do they plan to facilitate them?


http://europa.eu/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=IP/10/1462&format=HTML&aged=1&language=EN&guiLanguage=fr

A lot of people grow out of online discussions and personas, and want to simply erase that part of their life so that it cant be dragged up again in future for whatever reason.

Your posts are not "personal data" in the context of data protection law as far as I'm aware, therefore they're not covered by any of the proposals I've seen.

The close account script takes care of the personal data covered by the current data protection legislation. If they expand the meaning of personal data to include everything you write then we'll revisit it, but the implications of that kind of stupidity on their part would be em... interesting.

For example, I quoted you above. Is that yours, mine, ours or what? If you decide to delete that post, should you have the right to force me to edit/delete mine? What about if I paraphrased you?

Overheal wrote: »

WOOOOAH WOAAAH woah there buddy: No Captcha?

What would a CAPTCHA add past what's already there?

You're required to explicitly re-authenticate with your password and there's a (time-limited) token to frustrate CSRF-style attacks. To successfully exploit this to close someone's account you need the cleartext of someone's password. If you have that there's more interesting stuff to do.

pablomakaveli

The "Atari Jaguar" option in the reasons for leaving is my favourite thing about it.

Overheal

Conor wrote: »

What would a CAPTCHA add past what's already there?

You're required to explicitly re-authenticate with your password and there's a (time-limited) token to frustrate CSRF-style attacks. To successfully exploit this to close someone's account you need the cleartext of someone's password. If you have that there's more interesting stuff to do.

I was joking, of course.