Passat TDI

johnos1984

Lets play a game of beat the diagnostics machine:

My 2006 Passat TDI 105bhp with 133k miles on the clock has decided to break down (last night at midnight in the middle of the crap weather)

Anyway:

Syymptons, loss of power, no turbo kicking in lots of white smoke, electrics started dieing (dim lights, cruise control gone, radio gone)

It cleared itself after turning it on and off for a while and i continued. happened again and the same thing to clear it.

Anyway I've just given it over for a diagnostics test to be done.

Anyone care to give me an idea of what they think it could be.

The only issue with it I know of is there exhaust manifold gasket needs replacing but the mechanic reckoned it was something else that was causing the issue.

I'll be picking it up after 3 so I'll be back with the answer after that

mad m

Could it be the fuel Injector? VW have admitted that the Siemens fuel injector is faulty and will replace with new one even if its out of warranty....

_Kaiser_

mad m wrote: »

Could it be the fuel Injector? VW have admitted that the Siemens fuel injector is faulty and will replace with new one even if its out of warranty....

Oh lots of IF's there...

- IF they can't blame "bad fuel"
- IF the car has a full service (preferably VW main dealer) history
- IF they can't get out of it some other way

Unfortunately unlike VW UK and VOSA, the Irish outfit are trying to avoid admitting it's a "known issue" at all (despite lots of evidence both here and in the UK to the contrary) by dealong with these on a case by case basis and then only IF the above conditions are true

There's a fairly long theread here somewhere about this too..

johnos1984

I'm hoping it isn't a fuel injector gone although i always believed that issue was just with the 2L TDI

The engine felt like it was being flooded with fuel, started chugging on any hills etc.

It does have a full service history and the last load of fuel was at an apple green garage which is busy and seems reputable enough as I've never had an issue before.

It was last serviced a week and a half ago

johnos1984

Just to add, fuel economy has dropped to 35mpg.......at best

johnos1984

8 pages of fault codes

Main points to note:

Glow plugs 2 and 3 are shot
No turbo boost (but it is spooling up)
gasket is shagged and has the fuel/air mixture fooked up

Advice:
Start fixing everything and hope there is no other issue (which there could be)

Any advice?

166man

johnos1984 wrote: »

8 pages of fault codes

Main points to note:

Glow plugs 2 and 3 are shot
No turbo boost (but it is spooling up)
gasket is shagged and has the fuel/air mixture fooked up

Advice:
Start fixing everything and hope there is no other issue (which there could be)

Any advice?

Impeccable reliability from VW as always...

richardsheil

Clear them all - then start afresh. Probably most of the codes were spurious.

166man

166man wrote: »

Impeccable reliability from VW as always...

In fairness no one with a car that has issues wants to read that after asking for opinions on the issue.

Tea drinker

The boost is going somewhere? Out the wastegate or a hose has popped? They would prolly see a popped hose, maybe not a ruptured one.

johnos1984

166man wrote: »

Impeccable reliability from VW as always...

It's made it to 133k miles in under 6 years with no issues.

Find me a 166 which has done that.

I'm slightly puzzled.

The glow plugs shouldn't make a difference when it's moving. i've also been informed it's a case of "they all do that sir" with glow plugs 2 and 3 showing up as not working. It's not the issue I believe.

The exhaust gasket shouldn't affect it to the point of not running.

Turbo is spooling up but......it doesn't sound the same as it did. hard to tell but I'm wondering if it has lunch the tubine vanes. Also boost+no turbo would indicate the waste gate is stuck open.

I forgot to check the sump for diesel which shall be done in a while but i think the oil level was high last night but then again it just may not of been on a level surface.

No hoses are cracked or off. I've check and the mechanic checked hoping for an easy fix.

johnos1984

richardsheil wrote: »

Clear them all - then start afresh. Probably most of the codes were spurious.

Done it but it's still running like a pig.

I'd say most of the 8 pages was rubbish. I never fully examined it tbh as i didn't have the time.

mechanic gave me the main points to note

166man

johnos1984 wrote: »

It's made it to 133k miles in under 6 years with no issues.

Find me a 166 which has done that.

I'm slightly puzzled.

The glow plugs shouldn't make a difference when it's moving. i've also been informed it's a case of "they all do that sir" with glow plugs 2 and 3 showing up as not working. It's not the issue I believe.

The exhaust gasket shouldn't affect it to the point of not running.

Turbo is spooling up but......it doesn't sound the same as it did. hard to tell but I'm wondering if it has lunch the tubine vanes. Also boost+no turbo would indicate the waste gate is stuck open.

I forgot to check the sump for diesel which shall be done in a while but i think the oil level was high last night but then again it just may not of been on a level surface.

No hoses are cracked or off. I've check and the mechanic checked hoping for an easy fix.

My old man had a 6 year old 166 with 135k km with no issues. But in truth I didn't mean for that comment to be directed at your car at all just at many VW's in general. Surprised you are having trouble with a 1.9TDI too, only ever heard good things about that engine reliability wise.

johnos1984

166man wrote: »

Surprised you are having trouble with a 1.9TDI too, only ever heard good things about that engine reliability wise.

I was surprised too tbh.

It had been feeling low on power but I had put it down to me driving a lot of different cars with more power.

In other words i thought it was in my head up until last night.

Like everything VAG they are great until you have to pay the repair bill.

EPM

johnos1984 wrote: »

Done it but it's still running like a pig.

I'd say most of the 8 pages was rubbish. I never fully examined it tbh as i didn't have the time.

mechanic gave me the main points to note

If old codes aren't cleared they still show. If you have a printout there will be a date on them. I remember getting a print out on my Leon once - I was a bit worried until I realised half were blown bulbs!

Clear them and try again.

@166man - no need to kick someone when they're down.

johnos1984

EPM wrote: »

If old codes aren't cleared they still show. If you have a printout there will be a date on them. I remember getting a print out on my Leon once - I was a bit worried until I realised half were blown bulbs!

Clear them and try again.

Cleared now after having them read.

I'll flick through the pages later on but I'd imagine as you said it's spurious fault codes and nothing t worry about for the most part.

johnos1984

Just to update this:

I got around to plugging out the maf this evening but it made little difference.

However I noticed an audiable 'whoosing' noise between 2-3k rpm.

Could be exhaust gases getting forced out the split exhaust gasket but i'm currently thinking split hose somewhere I can't see.

Any other ideas?

Still no kick from the turbo when driving and it's eating diesel

MugMugs

Sorry to state the obvious John but is the Turbo fully connected ?

And are you happy the Turbo isn't actually knackered ?

johnos1984

MugMugs wrote: »

Sorry to state the obvious John but is the Turbo fully connected ?

Straight answer no.

Got a mechanic where I'm living to read the fault codes and have a look to see if he could spot anything obvious.

Basically the diagnosis I got from the computer was that there was no or limited boost. He said he done a visual inspection and could see no split pipes or disconnected pipes. I've also checked and spotted nothing but I'm not a mechanic. He said he couldn't hear anything a miss but this could be down to the leaking exhaust gasket (against the engine block)

MugMugs wrote: »

And are you happy the Turbo isn't actually knackered ?

Could very well be but the car is still running and revs freely in neutral.

I'm ****ed off really, having a **** week in work, hence I'm expecting the worst

L-M

If you disconnected the MAF and there was no difference I'd be putting in a MAF. 50 euro from a scrappy.

Edit: Or, if you're near Limerick you can borrow mine, which is out of a 07 Passat

johnos1984

Limerick man wrote: »

If you disconnected the MAF and there was no difference I'd be putting in a MAF. 50 euro from a scrappy.

Edit: Or, if you're near Limerick you can borrow mine, which is out of a 07 Passat

I'll be getting one on Saturday to swap over to test it out. Common failure on the older TDI's but didn't realise it was still happening.

Any idea of the price of a new one?

Hopefully it's an easy fix in the end

L-M

johnos1984 wrote: »

I'll be getting one on Saturday to swap over to test it out. Common failure on the older TDI's but didn't realise it was still happening.

Any idea of the price of a new one?

Hopefully it's an easy fix in the end

I wouldn't bother with a new one, when they go they go.

I have my used one in since May ish and it's been perfecto.

bbability

johnos1984 wrote: »

8 pages of fault codes

Main points to note:

Glow plugs 2 and 3 are shot
No turbo boost (but it is spooling up)
gasket is shagged and has the fuel/air mixture fooked up

Advice:
Start fixing everything and hope there is no other issue (which there could be)

Any advice?

When you say "spooling" what type of noise is it? Sounds to me like a vacum hose leak at best or blown turbo at worst.

Don't rely on readouts for this one. Its back to the old skool to get to the bottom of this problem.

Check all hoses for leaks. After that, head to turbo specialist.

johnos1984

bbability wrote: »

When you say "spooling" what type of noise is it?

Press your lips together and blow out hard.

That's the best immitation of the noise I can do. Not very loud but certainly there. Although I'm fairly certain this noise was there before this started happening.

I was dismissing it as just being part of the turbo boot characteristics.

Not there while ticking over or reving while in neutral, if it is I can't hear it.

George Dalton

Unplugging the MAF is a pretty useless test and proves nothing in my experience.

From your description it sounds like the code you are getting is this one:

17964/P1556 - Charge Pressure Control: Negative Deviation

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/17964/P1556/005462

Which means that there is not enough boost.

So thinking about it the possibilities are:
1. The turbo isn't getting the vacuum supply to the actuator which it needs to generate boost (if this is the case then it is likely to be a simple issue)

2. It is getting vacuum ok but is incapable of generating boost (possibly a turbo issue)

3. It is generating boost ok but it is either escaping (split intercooler hose) or being read incorrectly by the ECU (faulty MAP sensor or wiring)

johnos1984

P0299-000-

Boost Pressure regulation: Control range not reached

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/16683/P0299/000665

George Dalton

Same applies as for the other code really:

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/16683/P0299/000665

bbability

Sounds like a leak to me. Hopefully thats all it is..

johnos1984

Glow plugs 2 and 3 are also showing faults but I don't see how this would be connected to the loose of power

George Dalton

They won't be the cause. Most 2006 1.9TDIs will have at least one glow plug gone at this stage but it never causes any running issues with them.

johnos1984

George Dalton wrote: »

They won't be the cause. Most 2006 1.9TDIs will have at least one glow plug gone at this stage but it never causes any running issues with them.

Confirms what my regular mechanic told me.........although one wanted to sell me 4 and was kindly offering to install them for a small* fee

MugMugs

johnos1984 wrote: »

Confirms what my regular mechanic told me.........although one wanted to sell me 4 and was kindly offering to install them for a small* fee

Hard times, etc etc

Keep us updated anyway lad.

johnos1984

MugMugs wrote: »

Keep us updated anyway lad.

Will do.

I'm rather interested in what it could be

McP2011

Post up the faults to we have a look...someone with vcds will be able to do different tests to determine if say it was a boost sensor maf etc.

MugMugs

Any joy ?

johnos1984

I was going to wait until the weekend to do the update but here it is at this point.

The Passat is now in the garage getting the work carried out. The exhaust gasket has gone and this had the effect of messing up all of the engine readings going to the ECU hence the car was going into limp home mode or was working on reduced power.

I may need a new MAF and another sensor which name escapes me now.

The other effect of this was very high fuel consumption. We were able to get a better pricture of what was going on as the garage I normally use has a very good/expensive computer system which gave all the readings for what was going on (I was pretty impressed)

After that we decided to upgrade the power with a remap and I think he said a turbo boost remap (something to do with the turbo anyway). Not sure who is doing it but he has used them before and reckons it's a good job.

After that I'll have to go to Halfords and get a red 'I' to stick on the boot so everyone knows not to mess with me on the roads

Hopefully thats the end of it all, oh last worry is a misfire but I'm going to chuck a load of cleaner through the system and hope for the best it's just dirt causing it. I'll get the name of the cleaner next week when I pick up the car

dgt

Yaw sensor?

johnos1984

Just to add to that I'm also getting a full set of new glow plugs into the car as two have failed.

Tell you what though whenever I go to sell this someone is going to get a well sorted car with all the wear and tear sorted out.

Price for all of this will probably be near a 4 figure sum

dgt

With all the work and parts your'e putting in I'd keep the car and run it into the ground. Get your value from the work you've put in

johnos1984

dgt wrote: »

With all the work and parts your'e putting in I'd keep the car and run it into the ground. Get your value from the work you've put in

I'll certainly be taking it to 160k miles when the next t/belt change is due and I'll rethink things then.

If the remap works well that would be the biggest issue I had with the car sorted out. I was reluctant to do it earlier in the year fearing a large bill soon after but now that that has happened I may as well go ahead with it.

Plus as all of the weaknesses and mileage related issues will have been sorted (hopefully) , and I have receipts to prove it, it should make the car more attractive to a well tuned in buyer who can ignore the mileage and actually get themselves a well sorted out car whenever I decide to sell.

johnos1984

Passat BACK!

And running a lot better than before.

Issues:

Exhaust gasket gone

EGR gone

Some return pipe to the egr (I think) had split in two and brackets had started to work loose.

The car is running far better now.

Currently I'm running two bottles of cleaner through the fuel system at a very strong mix (1 bottle to 10L of diesel). Lots of black smoke but the idle tickover misfire appears to of cured itself.

I'm dropping back this evening to have the car plugged in to have the ECU read. I'll then go back around Christmas to have the remap loaded on. The mechanic has recommended some bedding in time for the new parts before the remap is done just in case there is any other issues.

While he was in there he also reconditioned the turbo so it should be happy motoring for a while now

johnos1984

:mad:

Parking brake warning light is now on.

It's an orange light with a line gone through it, i can't link a picture due to the server blocking it.

Anyway, any ideas before I start to kick the car

EPM

johnos1984 wrote: »

any ideas before I start to kick the car

put on steel toe caps.

There was a thread not so long ago about that issue afaik.

johnos1984

Dash board switch has gone.

Common fault.

Incidentally I've also found my replacement for the MGF next summer.....

johnos1984

johnos1984 wrote: »

......
While he was in there he also reconditioned the turbo so it should be happy motoring for a while now

not many garages do that, new seals and balanced etc ?

johnos1984

RoverJames wrote: »

not many garages do that, new seals and balanced etc ?

By seals do you mean gaskets? If so yes. Balanced also.

In fairness it was there for two weeks so the parts may of been sent away to be done. Either way it has been done and the car is driving like new. The power difference is incredible as is the economy improvements. He is a VAG and BMW enthusiast so knows his stuff about them. The diagnostic equipment he has for working on them is pretty impressive.

It's booked in for the first weekend in Dec to have the glow plugs done and a remap :cool:

So I'll give the final price then and also a report on any performance improvement.

Finally, he is getting in a 2002 BMW 330CI as his winter project. I've gotten first refusal on it when he gets board of it :cool:

MugMugs

Sell German, Buy Jap. Simples

-Corkie-

johnos1984 wrote: »

By seals do you mean gaskets? If so yes. Balanced also.

In fairness it was there for two weeks so the parts may of been sent away to be done. Either way it has been done and the car is driving like new. The power difference is incredible as is the economy improvements. He is a VAG and BMW enthusiast so knows his stuff about them. The diagnostic equipment he has for working on them is pretty impressive.

It's booked in for the first weekend in Dec to have the glow plugs done and a remap :cool:

So I'll give the final price then and also a report on any performance improvement.

Finally, he is getting in a 2002 BMW 330CI as his winter project. I've gotten first refusal on it when he gets board of it :cool:

Did he do anything with the nut behind the wheel?????:)

I'd be thinking twas sent away, not many folks balance turbos.

johnos1984

-Corkie- wrote: »

Did he do anything with the nut behind the wheel?????:)

Yes he is prescribing more power

johnos1984

RoverJames wrote: »

I'd be thinking twas sent away, not many folks balance turbos.

Very possible to be fair.

I'm happy as long as it is done right