Changing The Words of National Anthem and the President

raymon

One of the candidates ( FF ) would favour changing the words of the national anthem .

I would be totally against this move . I am very proud of our history and traditions.

For that reason I'm out .

Would you vote for someone who would favour changing our anthem?

Victor

raymon wrote: »

One of the candidates ( FF )

Davis or Gallagher?

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

nesf

I like our anthem but you can't deny that it's fairly unkeeping with our current relations with the UK and our current culture. It's a product of a very different time. Now one can make a good case for having an anthem that represents such a crucial time at the foundation of the State but one can equally make the opposite case.

Regardless it's moot as the President has no power here.

Orion

Ireland Ireland Forever Standing Tall
Shoulder to Shoulder We'll Answer Ireland's Call.

nuff said!

Liam Byrne

I've no love for the anthem because of the wording but someone did point out in the debate tonight that lots of anthems - because of when they were written - are overly militaristic.

ildaite

Jesus. This is ridiculous. Most national anthems have less than peaceful lyrics, but you don't see them changing their lyrics. Our national anthem voices our history. Ireland's call is absolutely inappropriate. I cannot believe this is actually up for discussion. Another example of people's constant desire to disown our culture and try to be something else to keep people happy.

hotmail.com

ildaite wrote: »

Jesus. This is ridiculous. Most national anthems have less than peaceful lyrics, but you don't see them changing their lyrics. Our national anthem voices our history. Ireland's call is absolutely inappropriate. I cannot believe this is actually up for discussion. Another example of people's constant desire to disown our culture and try to be something else to keep people happy.

The national anthem has very little to do with Irish culture. Indeed there was no such thing as a national anthem up until the turn of the 20th century.

But people get emotional about these things for some reason...boggles the mind as to why. I don't know the words of the anthem and I'm happy to die without knowing them. Maybe if they sang it in English I might actually learn it.

raymon

ildaite wrote: »

Jesus. This is ridiculous. Most national anthems have less than peaceful lyrics, but you don't see them changing their lyrics. Our national anthem voices our history. Ireland's call is absolutely inappropriate. I cannot believe this is actually up for discussion. Another example of people's constant desire to disown our culture and try to be something else to keep people happy.

I totally agree. It was written in a different time so the lyrics are bound to reflect that era.

My biggest fear would be a Celebrity Anthem tv show with Judges like Twink, Jedward , Sean Gallagher and Amanda Brunker

ildaite

The Irish anthem does have something to do with Irish culture. It's a reflection of our history. Disowning it to be politically correct is insulting to those whose contribution to the establishment of the state it honours. No other country is running to change it's anthem. The French anthem... Err...hello?! Much worse that ours, but unlike us, the French have some pride in their country, history and culture.

shamrock55

who the f**k does gallagher think he is dont think he has done himself any favours here:mad:

riffmongous

raymon wrote: »

One of the candidates ( FF ) would favour changing the words of the national anthem .

I would be totally against this move . I am very proud of our history and traditions.

For that reason I'm out .

Would you vote for someone who would favour changing our anthem?

If the point of this is just to have another go at gallagher could you not have just put this in your current thread about him?
You were out well before he said this.

Personally i'd be against a new anthem, but perhaps only parts of the lyrics could be sung, like the german one.

cavedave

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApHj9vOu2eQ

Singing about being a soldier and wanting to kill Sasanachs is not really what/how I regard myself. What else could we use for an anthem?

1. Thunderstruck: Already is the unofficial redneck national anthem. Everyone has been in a barn of a county nightclub watching the local muldoons banging their feet as the cider courses through their veins to this song. ACDC are not Irish though
2. Where’s my jumper? Picture the football team jumping around to the moshing bit, the opposition would be terrified, we would never lose a game again.
3. Fields of Athenry: No no for the love of god no more.
4. Jimmy Jimmy: OOOOOOGG the Undertones pogo teen Romeo and Juliet using three chords all of them g
5. Fiesta:The Pogues. Most times you hear the anthem you are pissed and the pub is closing. You might as well have a song designed to be sung when plastered. Checkmate to the Pogues.
6. Nothing compares to you. Its ok to show our nations sensitive side
7. Irelands Call. Even more of a Dirge than Amhran na bhFiann

brendankelly

Our anthem is of little value to FF. Because if it was valuable like our oil, gas, forestry carbon etc it would be sold already

Wallflower

Gallagher doesn't really care about the anthem one way or the other - just thought it would be cool to say he'd like to update it. "I'm the candidate of change" type of thing

Narrow platform --- keep saying "young people" and "businessman" and who knows we might bluff our way intom this yet!!

Wolfe Tone

Ridiculous idea. Why the hell should we care what other countries think about it? Why would other countries even care?

TeddyTedson

I'd love to change the anthem. It's stale, boring and while it does have that nostalgic pride thing about it, we could easily do better.

charlemont

Its a crazy idea, People lost their life's for us to have our own state and now people want to change it because they think its too militaristic, old fashioned too insulting for our neighbours, Well let me say the English people couldn't give two shíts about our anthem, the English are smart enough and mature enough not to be offended by it. Most English people only ever give Ireland a passing thought yet some people on here never stop thinking about England.

The anthem should only ever be changed if Ireland is reunited.

ildaite

I don't think a new anthem would mean as much to people as our current one, and would be a very unwise use of time and money that's sorely needed in other sectors, eg health, education. We's essentially be changing the anthem to avoid insulting England, and if we did so we'd end up insulting the memory of those who fought for our independence. I really don't think anyone else cares about our anthem. Can we try not to give into this OTT political correctness, revisionism and post-colonial hangup. You don't see France running to change its anthem, which is much more violent. Why on earth should we have to change? Running around trying to please other countries at our own expense hasn't exactly done us any favours recently. Sometimes I wonder if we as a nation have any spine at all.

raymon

I think removing or rewriting the anthem would be an assault on our heritage.
I would never support violence but these lyrics were written in a different time.

Irelands Call is a horrendous piece of work .

The national anthem should stay to document our past , not to plan our future

Seth Brundle

We already have an alternative anthem from Neil Hannon and Thomas Walsh...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVj7cwnFtYI

seamus

The question that should be asked is why do we have a national anthem? What is it supposed to convey?

IMO, it's supposed to be a symbolic piece of music that we can all get behind, that we sing to tell the world who we are and where we have come from.

Amhrán na bhFiann, in all honesty, it not such a song. It's a wartime chant, and anti-British song, a declaration of an intention to fight. A Soldier's Song, quite literally, written to be sung by soldiers in wartime.

It's no more representative of Irish history than "Come Out, Ye Black and Tans" or "A Nation Once Again". Yes, they convey a sentiment of a specific tim in history, but they do not capture the totality of Irish history, of what the people went through to get here.

To be more realistic, in the event that reunification did happen, it would be an utterly inappropriate song to use as the anthem for the entire island.

I don't mind Ireland's Call, but not for an anthem. Regardless of the words, I'm still hopelessly sentimental about Amhrán. I think a rewrite using the same tune would be a good idea. You wouldn't necessarily have to change everything, just alter it to be less of a rebel chant.

Ultimately this would allow those who feel it's necessary, to continue using the old words, while our children are taught the new version and the old one slowly fades away.

jonniebgood1

raymon wrote: »

I think removing or rewriting the anthem would be an assault on our heritage.
I would never support violence but these lyrics were written in a different time.

Irelands Call is a horrendous piece of work .

The national anthem should stay to document our past , not to plan our future

Is this part three of an anti-SG series? How is MDH doing today by the way?
I heard that Gallagher had 2 eggs for breakfast today- maybe a thread on that would be interesting!

By the way have you any idea where our anthem comes from?

0ph0rce0

I'm actually amazed that people would be in favour of this, and people saying its abusive towards the british.

The Brithish tried to RAPE the world and people fought to save thier land not just this country but many others and if the people who fought and got us and other countries what they have today then we should celebrate that tune no matter what the words are, not change it.

They want an anthem that could be played north and south, but yet the same people who want this dont recognise the north as ireland????

Some irish people really are idiots

raymon

jonniebgood1 wrote: »

Is this part three of an anti-SG series? How is MDH doing today by the way?
I heard that Gallagher had 2 eggs for breakfast today- maybe a thread on that would be interesting!

By the way have you any idea where our anthem comes from?

Did you have something constructive to add?


Some people have given very good arguments on both sides of this discussion.


I would prefer not to engage in a what did Sean Gallagher have for breakfast or whatabout MDH

jonniebgood1

You talk about the anthem and Irelands heritage so I asked 'By the way have you any idea where our anthem comes from?'
Well?

jonniebgood1

Raymon checks google.......

hotmail.com

0ph0rce0 wrote: »

I'm actually amazed that people would be in favour of this, and people saying its abusive towards the british.

The Brithish tried to RAPE the world and people fought to save thier land not just this country but many others and if the people who fought and got us and other countries what they have today then we should celebrate that tune no matter what the words are, not change it.

They want an anthem that could be played north and south, but yet the same people who want this dont recognise the north as ireland????

Some irish people really are idiots

Did you have to use the word "rape" to describe what happened? Sheesh.

Basically our national anthem is an anti-British rant, what does that say about Irish people? That our sense of Irishness is based on an anti-English platform...pathetic. Change it and make sure it's in English so we can actually understand it.

ynul31f47k6b59

I was impressed with how Gallagher has handled himself throughout this campaign - up until now. Sean Gallagher should concentrate on coming up with something other than 'I'll make jobs' or 'I'll change the anthem' - he's getting repetitive, starting to look amateurish, and he's lost my vote.

raymon

jonniebgood1 wrote: »

You talk about the anthem and Irelands heritage so I asked 'By the way have you any idea where our anthem comes from?'
Well?

Yes I do ...... but this thread isn't about me

jonniebgood1

raymon wrote: »

Yes I do ...... but this thread isn't about me

It is when you write nonsense like

I think removing or rewriting the anthem would be an assault on our heritage

If you genuinely were concerned with this you would first consider the following:
When was our anthem written?
Who does it represent?
Could it be more representative of the full Island?

It is a shame to use this as a pawn in your anti- Gallagher campaign.

Zubeneschamali

A strange move by Gallagher, his handlers must have told him to try and distance himself from Fianna Fáil in some symbolic way.

Obviously, the younger, Celtic Tiger, in-it-for-the-money FFers won't care about this, but I think it will hurt him with the older, more nationalist FF voter.

raymon

jonniebgood1 wrote: »

It is when you write nonsense like
If you genuinely were concerned with this you would first consider the following:
When was our anthem written?
Who does it represent?
Could it be more representative of the full Island?

It is a shame to use this as a pawn in your anti- Gallagher campaign.

Do you have something useful to add ?

pubview

During the Kilmarnock v Celtic game last weekend the Bhoys' supporters piped up with The Soldier's Song - in English, of course. It was embarrassing and has nothing to do with SPL football.

I'd prefer to hear them trying this on as a National Anthem :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzYzVMcgWhg

Zubeneschamali

pubview wrote: »

During the Kilmarnock v Celtic game last weekend the Bhoys' supporters piped up with The Soldier's Song - in English, of course.

Eh, it was originally written in English. The Irish version is a translation.

pubview

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Eh, it was originally written in English. The Irish version is a translation.

My name's not 'Eh'.

blahfckingblah

what other options are there Irelands call? that song makes me feel sick.
I say leave well enough alone, look what our country's talent threw together to honour Ronnie Drew. :eek:

pubview

Try this for size :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbRuLOfHYfw&feature=related

jonniebgood1

raymon wrote: »

Do you have something useful to add ?

Yes.
It is a shame to use this as a pawn in your anti- Gallagher campaign.

raymon

pubview wrote: »

Try this for size :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbRuLOfHYfw&feature=related

Nice song pubview!! Better than Irelands call !!

Athough our national anthem is a relic from a different time I don't think it should be touched

pubview

Oh, I wouldn't be going touching relics and holy things, raymon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCVmc885-ns

Iwannahurl

Feel free to add a suitable title and more verses (and a better last line if you have one).

Buggered are we,
Stuck in this bankrupt dire land
Thousands more have gone
To lands beyond the wave
Mortgaged excessively
In negative equity we stand
Yet to shelter developers and banks we slave
Every month the size of the gap just grows
Between our bills and our income flows
As the IMF makes us pay through the nose
So kiss this nation's arse goodbye.

ildaite

I wouldn't stand up to sing anything but our current anthem, on principle. It's our anthem. Why should we change it? We're forever rolling over like submissive puppies when someone even hints at displeasure with us. Political correctness has gone ott these days.

hallelujajordan

jonniebgood1 wrote: »

Yes.
It is a shame to use this as a pawn in your anti- Gallagher campaign.

Here Here !!

More than a shame . . a pathetic attempt to throw something at Gallagher because the OP considers him to be FF and has some pretty outspoken views re : FF . .

Honestly @raymon, you were 'out' long before this as far as Gallagher is concerned.

The truth is that Gallagher was asked his opinion and shared it honestly. . it is not something that he as president would have any control over and is pretty irrelevant to the debate tbh ..

raymon

hallelujajordan wrote: »

Here Here !!

More than a shame . . a pathetic attempt to throw something at Gallagher because the OP considers him to be FF and has some pretty outspoken views re : FF . .

Honestly @raymon, you were 'out' long before this as far as Gallagher is concerned.

The truth is that Gallagher was asked his opinion and shared it honestly. . it is not something that he as president would have any control over and is pretty irrelevant to the debate tbh ..

Ahh Hallelujajordan , long time no hear. Last time we talked was the Callely thread about a year ago


You are correct , I would probably not have voted for Sean Gallagher anyway for reasons I outline in other threads.

But this thread is showing some good arguments for changing the national anthem as well as for keeping it as is. Do you have an opinion yourself ?

Jimoslimos

seamus wrote: »

IMO, it's supposed to be a symbolic piece of music that we can all get behind, that we sing to tell the world who we are and where we have come from.

Amhrán na bhFiann, in all honesty, it not such a song. It's a wartime chant, and anti-British song, a declaration of an intention to fight. A Soldier's Song, quite literally, written to be sung by soldiers in wartime.

Nonsense it's no more or less a wartime chant or inclusive than many other anthems around the world.

Why doesn't GSTQ be abandoned in favour of something non-royalists and atheists can get behind?

And if you want wartime chants look no further than La Marseillaise, an anthem which makes Amhrán na bhFiann sound like a lullaby about cuddling kittens:pac:

hallelujajordan

raymon wrote: »

Ahh Hallelujajordan , long time no hear. Last time we talked was the Callely thread about a year ago


You are correct , I would probably not have voted for Sean Gallagher anyway for reasons I outline in other threads.

But this thread is showing some good arguments for changing the national anthem as well as for keeping it as is. Do you have an opinion yourself ?

As it relates to the presidential election, I think it is pretty irrelevant tbh . .

My personal view is that we should maintain the tune but maybe rewrite some of the lyrics to reflect a more modern Ireland. .

skimac

0ph0rce0 wrote: »

I'm actually amazed that people would be in favour of this, and people saying its abusive towards the british.

The Brithish tried to RAPE the world and people fought to save thier land not just this country but many others and if the people who fought and got us and other countries what they have today then we should celebrate that tune no matter what the words are, not change it.

They want an anthem that could be played north and south, but yet the same people who want this dont recognise the north as ireland????

Some irish people really are idiots

the british empire was the biggest terriost group throgh out the worlds history. i would hate to see the national anthem changed i would never stand up for the anthem at the all ireland if it was changed

gurramok

Gallagher is very lucky the debate was on TG4 rather than on the mainstream channels and the bad publicity might not hurt him as the media didn't pick up on his assertion that big.
Coming out with language like that is a dent in his armour, can the Dragon Den man keep it going till the the 27th? Me thinks he is starting to slip up and the media will dig hard for a bit of dirt as he is supposedly topping the polls.

phog

I think it should be changed to "There is an Isle"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGM4zcXuFjI

gurramok

phog wrote: »

I think it should be changed to "There is an Isle"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGM4zcXuFjI

Irish Isle or British Isle?