BBJ v Other Martial arts

cruasder777

The only martial arts I have seen compete with BBJ and give it trouble are Greco-Roman wrestling, especially the submission version (I prefer it to BBJ, although BBJ has "borrowed" some of its chokes, arm bars and tri angles), judo, although only high dan grades seem to be able to hold their own against BBJ and Sambo, something I hope to do more of in the future, it has alot of leg locks etc.

Things like Karate, Kung fu etc are left totally exposed by BBJ.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQXlg7DksvY

manga_10

Personally from my own experience I feel that Wrestling helps greatly against BJJ as far as controlling the hips and the various pressures. But in some ways bjj and wrestling can be seen as deriving methods from one another.
Barnett is a great example of this with his background in catch wrestling but being of a very high Grappling IQ to give most blackbelts problems

Richy06

cruasder777 wrote: »

The only martial arts I have seen compete with BBJ and give it trouble are Greco-Roman wrestling, especially the submission version (I prefer it to BBJ, although BBJ has "borrowed" some of its chokes, arm bars and tri angles), judo, although only high dan grades seem to be able to hold their own against BBJ and Sambo, something I hope to do more of in the future, it has alot of leg locks etc.

Things like Karate, Kung fu etc are left totally exposed by BBJ.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQXlg7DksvY

what is this mythical BBJ that you speak of?!

cruasder777

Richy06 wrote: »

what is this mythical BBJ that you speak of?!

BJJ, typo

cruasder777

manga_10 wrote: »

Personally from my own experience I feel that Wrestling helps greatly against BJJ as far as controlling the hips and the various pressures. But in some ways bjj and wrestling can be seen as deriving methods from one another.
Barnett is a great example of this with his background in catch wrestling but being of a very high Grappling IQ to give most blackbelts problems

My friend is British welter weight cage rage champion, has won 16/18 fights, European submission wresling welterweight champ, has just got a UFC contract to fight in the US.

Submission wrestling is alot faster to learn then BBJ.

When Royce Gracie fought Ken Shamrock it was a draw after 35 mins, first fight.

bjj-fighter

cruasder777 wrote: »

My friend is British welter weight cage rage champion, has won 16/18 fights, European submission wresling welterweight champ, has just got a UFC contract to fight in the US.

Submission wrestling is alot faster to learn then BBJ.

When Royce Gracie fought Ken Shamrock it was a draw after 35 mins.

Name?

cruasder777

bjj-fighter wrote: »

Name?

Ever heard of please ?


John maguire

Hes awsome to train with gypsy jiu jitsu is another name for submission wrestling.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUfBijskQAA


John Maguire submits BJJ black belt.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPZzqyibON0

Mellor

cruasder777 wrote: »

My friend is British welter weight cage rage champion, has won 16/18 fights, European submission wresling welterweight champ, has just got a UFC contract to fight in the US.

The British WW Cage rage champ is Paul Daley, he hasn't just got a contract with UFC, and he never will.

Che Millis is the World WW champ, he filled it after Daley Vacated the title. He's 13/18 though. He's fighting at 138, so guess that's who you refer to.

When Royce Gracie fought Ken Shamrock it was a draw after 35 mins, first fight.

nope. their first fight was over in less than a minute.
the rematch was stopped after 35minutes and declared a draw. That doesn't mean it was an even fight. In those days, there were no rounds or judges - so they didn't know what to do.

cruasder777

Mellor wrote: »

The British WW Cage rage champ is Paul Daley, he hasn't just got a contract with UFC, and he never will.

Che Millis is the World WW champ, he filled it after Daley Vacated the title. He's 13/18 though. He's fighting at 138, so guess that's who you refer to.



nope. their first fight was over in less than a minute.
the rematch was stopped after 35minutes and declared a draw. That doesn't mean it was an even fight. In those days, there were no rounds or judges - so they didn't know what to do.

Wrong.

John Maguire, STILL Cage Rage UK Welterweight Champion!

http://www.wwbrd.com/john-maguire-still-cage-rage-uk-welterweight-champion!


After attending the most entertaining UK MMA event of 2011 in which John Maguire solidified himself as the Cage Rage UK Welterweight champion after a hard fought battle with Peter Irving. We caught up with John “The One” Maguire as he
turns up the heat in the Welterweight division going, 16-3-0.


http://www.fullmount.co.uk/index.php/mma-news/1-latest-news/1451-ucmma-23-welterweight-champ-john-maguire-interview


Harry Shoebridge caught up with Welterweight Champion, John Maguire who defends his silver wear for the 3rd time against at Cage Rage UK, Challenged by Peter Irving this September 17th, Live from London’s, Troxy Arena. Maguire is has been making people stand up and take notice of him with his recent performances that have seen him become UCMMA champion and defend the title twice in impressive fashion. The fact his wins have been against the usual top quality Cage Rage fighters and that his wins have been so impressive has set up this fight as an incredibly intriguing fight that almost guarantees action whilst having ramifications for the Welterweight division beyond even the UK shores.


http://www.fullmount.co.uk/index.php/mma-news/1-latest-news/1566-why-cage-rage-uk-champion-john-maguire-should-be-in-the-ufc

Is John Maguire, the best Welterweight in the UK? In this writers opinion, yes, and after Saturday nights successful title defence at Cage Rage UK 23 it seems that even Cage Rage promoter Dave O'Donnell thinks it's high time Maguire got his chance with the UFC. After John beat Peter Irving by unanimous decision to defend his Cage Rage welterweight title for the third time it does seem that John is running out of opponents at this level that can offer him the challenge he needs.


http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles/New-UFC-signing-John-Maguire-quotIts-about-timequot-35870



Friday, September 23, 2011

35870
(PRESS RELEASE) -- Multiple domestic welterweight champion John "The One" Maguire (16-3 MMA) has become the latest acquisition by the UFC.

Cage Rage UK and OMMAC welterweight champion John Maguire has signed a four fight contract with the world's largest organization.

Maguire was in competition this past weekend where he successfully defended his Cage Rage UK title against BJJ black belt Peter Irving (14-8-1 MMA) with an impressive victory via unanimous decision.




I look fwd to him submitting George st Pierre.

Mellor

I was talking about Cage Rage, as in the promotion that went bankrupt, all their titles were frozen. Isn't the current promotion and titles called UCMMA or something? I know they still use the Cage rage name in promos. But I thought it wasn't allowed to use the name officially because of the bankrupcy.

After Maguires last fight they were talking about signing for the UFC, has he done this yet? Does that mean that he has to vacate his title?


Edit: From your links above, I see they are using "Cage Rage UK". So are they using UCMMA at all?

arybvtcw0eolkf

cruasder777 wrote: »

The only martial arts I have seen compete with BBJ ....................blah

I'm reluctant to get involved in this stuff, 'tis like travelling back ten yrs but here goes..

Whats your background in martial arts?.

cruasder777

Melina Nutty Ice wrote: »

I'm reluctant to get involved in this stuff, 'tis like travelling back ten yrs but here goes..

Whats your background in martial arts?.

Started off boxing then got into Shotokan which I did for a number of years, but found it too rigid, then bought into the exotic eastern martial arts bs and got into wing chung, but found it too complex, why do 5 moves when only one is needed ? But stuck with it cause I had bought into the bs.

Then got into judo for a few years, then BJJ, once again which in parts I found over complex and its most effective parts nicked from greco Roman/submission wrestling.

These days Im into gypsy ju jitsu/ submission wrestling, both are very simple and highly effective, I train with the GB Olympic wrestling squad members.

Its a pity for so many yrs martial arts like submission wrestling were neglected for eastern martial arts bs, no pyjamas or attitude is needed, learning martial arts should be fairly informal and fun.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdDd0HzcvZM

da-bres

That lad Marcelo Garcia is handy at the BBJ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4heOnfjGSDs

Doug Cartel

OP, I'm not entirely sure you know exactly what Greco-Roman wrestling is.

Perhaps you should ask for some clarification next time you see your buddies from the GB team.

Charlie3dan

My style of kung fu is better than your style of kung fu.

You like BJJ, you should do BJJ then.
There's no ultimate art. It doesn't have to be the ultimate art to make it worthwhile for you.

Just keep training.

pablohoney87

BJJ to complex?????
Where were you learning it? The biggest key to bjj is simplicity

arybvtcw0eolkf

Charlie3dan wrote: »

My style of kung fu is better than your style of kung fu.

You like BJJ, you should do BJJ then.
There's no ultimate art. It doesn't have to be the ultimate art to make it worthwhile for you.

Just keep training.

+1.

This is like the discussions we had years ago in the old IRMAC martial arts forum, it was retarded then (IMO) and its still retarded now.

OP for the last few months I trained exclusively BJJ/sub wrestling and some MMA. My fitness/conditioning was brilliant, I dropped 9kgs and my sharpness & skills in those styles was improving all the time and I was on top of the world.

Went to a judo grading this weekend, in judo you fight for your grades - its exactly like a competition.. Anyway I went expecting to bag a few win's and an easy enough day.

I got SPANKED in every fight, lost six fights in a row and was knocked out with an Osoto Gari in the last fight by a lad half my weight (Luke, Keith Rogers buried me!!).

Does that result mean that judo now beats MMA/BJJ/sub wrestling?.. Not at all, unless its on a judo mat under judo rules.

If I went to a BJJ comp after the same training I've no doubt I'd have done very well, but if I went after training only Judo I'd get spanked.

Just enjoy martial arts, and stop comparing one with the other - its a bit silly, you'll be searching forever in that case.

slammer187

I just watched John Maguire's fight, wow is all I can say...he is absolutely sick!

paulmclaughlin

slammer187 wrote: »

I just watched John Maguire's fight, wow is all I can say...he is absolutely sick!

Where were you one month ago?

psychward

cruasder777 wrote: »

The only martial arts I have seen compete with BBJ and give it trouble are Greco-Roman wrestling, especially the submission version (I prefer it to BBJ, although BBJ has "borrowed" some of its chokes, arm bars and tri angles), judo, although only high dan grades seem to be able to hold their own against BBJ and Sambo, something I hope to do more of in the future, it has alot of leg locks etc.

Things like Karate, Kung fu etc are left totally exposed by BBJ.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQXlg7DksvY

I cant believe they got their asses kicked so comprehensively. It kind of backs up what I always thought.. that people get brainwashed into their particular style and are totally exposed as a result. Whats' the typical ju jitsu defense to a take down attempt ? The Karate guy seemed kind of slow and was moving back and forth in a straight line. He did look kind of slow even at that. I'd be tempted to do a bit more side stepping (just a millimetre) while looking for an opportunity to punish my opponent if someone rushed me in such a way. However in a busy crowded drunken club atmosphere finding space to move around wouldnt' be easy.

Michael O Leary

cruasder777 wrote: »

got into wing chung, but found it too complex, why do 5 moves when only one is needed ?

Hi,

Just out of interest, where did you do wing chung? One of the main things about Leung Ting wing chun (Wing Tsun) is that often it is a lot more direct than generic wing chun(g).

For example some wing chun people will apply a Bong Sau or a Tan Sau, etc against a punch and then follow up with a punch, where in Wing Tsun we counter a punch with a punch and the Bong/Tan Sau, etc is secondary if it is used at all. So the movements/positions can be the same but the strategy is different.

Regards,

Michael

cruasder777

pablohoney87 wrote: »

BJJ to complex?????
Where were you learning it? The biggest key to bjj is simplicity

BJJ is a superb martial art, BUT, it takes on average 10 yrs to be come a black belt, there are only 50 odd black belts, in the whole of the UK and Ireland, most are from overseas.

It has over 2,000 moves which are nicked from submission wrestling others from sambo, judo, Jap ju-jitsu, vale tudo.

As an example there are more then 40 ways of doing an arm bar from the full guard.


Im not saying people should not study BJJ, but mix it up with sub wrestling/gipsy ju jitsu as well, it will give you an individual style which most will find a real hand full. Under pressure you want it to be as simple but effective.

cruasder777

Michael O Leary wrote: »

Hi,

Just out of interest, where did you do wing chung? One of the main things about Leung Ting wing chun (Wing Tsun) is that often it is a lot more direct than generic wing chun(g).

For example some wing chun people will apply a Bong Sau or a Tan Sau, etc against a punch and then follow up with a punch, where in Wing Tsun we counter a punch with a punch and the Bong/Tan Sau, etc is secondary if it is used at all. So the movements/positions can be the same but the strategy is different.

Regards,

Michael

I studied Wing Chun locally with a locally with a guy who had 30 years experience.

Because its not full contact, you cant tell how effective the defence technique is in real life.

Its a bit like the way traditional martial arts schools teach knife self defence, what knife attacker in real life leaves their arm in mid air ?

Wing Chun, is great for teaching, focus, discipline and making one feel connected to something powerful, even as a self defence system against the average aggressive guy, but against a grappler, it will get destroyed.

cruasder777

psychward wrote: »

I cant believe they got their asses kicked so comprehensively. It kind of backs up what I always thought.. that people get brainwashed into their particular style and are totally exposed as a result. Whats' the typical ju jitsu defense to a take down attempt ? The Karate guy seemed kind of slow and was moving back and forth in a straight line. He did look kind of slow even at that. I'd be tempted to do a bit more side stepping (just a millimetre) while looking for an opportunity to punish my opponent if someone rushed me in such a way. However in a busy crowded drunken club atmosphere finding space to move around wouldnt' be easy.

There are various defences against being taken down in BJJ and sub wrestling depends on the attack, from the front the old school wrestling simple two legged take down is very effective from a sub wresting pov.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1OvDhD5E8I&feature=related

cruasder777

slammer187 wrote: »

I just watched John Maguire's fight, wow is all I can say...he is absolutely sick!

Submission wrestling is where its at for its simplicity, he totally dominated that fight.

Heres the full fight


http://www.mmalinker.com/external/frames/49701/Justin_Edwards_vs_John_Maguire_UFC_138_fight_video

EnjoyChoke

cruasder777 wrote: »

As an example there are more then 40 ways of doing an arm bar from the full guard.

Say what?

cruasder777

EnjoyChoke wrote: »

Say what?

grip tease arm bar, octopus guard to arm bar, elbow pressure arm bar, posture leg over arm bar, arm bar off americana, neck crank counter to arm bar, pendulum sweep arm bar, arm pendulum to standard arm bar, arm bar sweep to pendulum sweep to arm bar, follow through arm bar, biceps slicer arm bar, various standing arm bars, decoy sweep to arm bar, ladder up arm bar, fake sweep to arm bar, posture break arm bar, fake sit up to underhook arm bar various types, whizzer grip to knee pressure arm bar,..............

Shall I go on ?

OLDMAN1

cruasder777 wrote: »

I studied Wing Chun locally with a locally with a guy who had 30 years experience.

Because its not full contact, you cant tell how effective the defence technique is in real life.

YES IT IS

EnjoyChoke

cruasder777 wrote: »

grip tease arm bar, octopus guard to arm bar, elbow pressure arm bar, posture leg over arm bar, arm bar off americana, neck crank counter to arm bar, pendulum sweep arm bar, arm pendulum to standard arm bar, arm bar sweep to pendulum sweep to arm bar, follow through arm bar, biceps slicer arm bar, various standing arm bars, decoy sweep to arm bar, ladder up arm bar, fake sweep to arm bar, posture break arm bar, fake sit up to underhook arm bar various types, whizzer grip to knee pressure arm bar,..............

Shall I go on ?

Is the armbar not executed in almost exactly the same way, off the setups you've just listed?

cruasder777

OLDMAN1 wrote: »

YES IT IS

Lol, students practice by throwing fake punches, usually leaving their arm in the air, if thats full contact Im a China man.

If it was full contact its weakness against grapplers would have been discovered years ago.

Like Karate it was promoted by Hollywood cause it looks great on film.

I bought into the bs I read in martial arts mags as a kid, picture scenarios of fight seqences where exotic MA always won, but was never anything like a street fight.

Secret moves, ninjas and other bs, taught by "professors" who had never had a real fight in their lives.

The reason we produce so few decent MMA fighters is cause we were sold this BS for years.

Effective and genuine martial arts like submission wrestling were not glam enough, thus they were never promoted, it will take years to catch up.

At least many have seen through the BS.

cruasder777

EnjoyChoke wrote: »

Is the armbar not executed in almost exactly the same way, off the setups you've just listed?

No, there are even various ways of doing a standard arm bar from a closed guard, alot of differences are pretty subtle.

People are always develping their own take on standard technquies, which is how it should be.


All Im is saying is people should study a variety of grappling styles, then form an effective style that works for them, rather then just trying to be text book.

Michael O Leary

cruasder777 wrote: »

I studied Wing Chun locally with a locally with a guy who had 30 years experience.

Because its not full contact, you cant tell how effective the defence technique is in real life.

Its a bit like the way traditional martial arts schools teach knife self defence, what knife attacker in real life leaves their arm in mid air ?

Wing Chun, is great for teaching, focus, discipline and making one feel connected to something powerful, even as a self defence system against the average aggressive guy, but against a grappler, it will get destroyed.

Just out of interest, where is "locally"?

Doug Cartel

cruasder777 wrote: »

Im not saying people should not study BJJ, but mix it up with sub wrestling/gipsy ju jitsu as well, it will give you an individual style which most will find a real hand full. Under pressure you want it to be as simple but effective.

OK, you do realise the "I'm a pink belt in Gypsy Jiu Jitsu" is just Maguire taking the piss right? I'm pretty sure he trains in a regular BJJ/Muay-Thai/MMA place.

Also, most BJJ places have both gi and no-gi, so I don't know where you're getting this idea that there are loads of BJJ people out there who are completely oblivious to sub-grappling.

pablohoney87

cruasder777 wrote: »

EnjoyChoke wrote: »

Is the armbar not executed in almost exactly the same way, off the setups you've just listed?

No, there are even various ways of doing a standard arm bar from a closed guard, alot of differences are pretty subtle.

that's called improvisation. an armbar is an armbar. and bjj can have as many or as few techniques as you want. anyone who is at the top level isn't winning with a swiss army knife of techniques. they learn how to stay safe on bottom good base posture passing guard controlling their opponent and winning most of their matches with very few finishing techniques.

cruasder777

Doug Cartel wrote: »

OK, you do realise the "I'm a pink belt in Gypsy Jiu Jitsu" is just Maguire taking the piss right? I'm pretty sure he trains in a regular BJJ/Muay-Thai/MMA place.

Also, most BJJ places have both gi and no-gi, so I don't know where you're getting this idea that there are loads of BJJ people out there who are completely oblivious to sub-grappling.

"Gipsy Ju-Jitsu" is a mixture of BJJ, sub wrestling and other styles.

Which is why he is so good against BBJ black belts, it means he has an un orthodox style they have not come across.

Obviously he also trains in Muay Thai.

da-bres

cruasder777 wrote: »

"Gipsy Ju-Jitsu" is a mixture of BJJ, sub wrestling and other styles.

Which is why he is so good against BBJ black belts, it means he has an un orthodox style they have not come across.

Obviously he also trains in Muay Thai.

absolute LOL

Doug Cartel

cruasder777 wrote: »

"Gipsy Ju-Jitsu" is a mixture of BJJ, sub wrestling and other styles.

Which is why he is so good against BBJ black belts, it means he has an un orthodox style they have not come across.

A mixture of BJJ, sub wrestling and other styles doesn't sound very unorthodox at all, unless those other styles are pretty far out. Could you tell us what they are?

pablohoney87

cruasder777 wrote: »

Doug Cartel wrote: »

OK, you do realise the "I'm a pink belt in Gypsy Jiu Jitsu" is just Maguire taking the piss right? I'm pretty sure he trains in a regular BJJ/Muay-Thai/MMA place.

Also, most BJJ places have both gi and no-gi, so I don't know where you're getting this idea that there are loads of BJJ people out there who are completely oblivious to sub-grappling.

"Gipsy Ju-Jitsu" is a mixture of BJJ, sub wrestling and other styles.

Which is why he is so good against BBJ black belts, it means he has an un orthodox style they have not come across.

Obviously he also trains in Muay Thai.

Gypsy ju jitsu is just the same as Jake shields 'American jiujitsu' or Jon fitchs 'guerilla jiujitsu' its submission wrestling. ie nogi bjj cross training with freestyle wrestling. unless they're in a gi its not judo as any judo throws done nogi are in wrestling.

cruasder777

Doug Cartel wrote: »

A mixture of BJJ, sub wrestling and other styles doesn't sound very unorthodox at all, unless those other styles are pretty far out. Could you tell us what they are?

Sambo, vale tudo, judo.

I train with John Maguire, I try to practice techniques not practised much or some now illegal in judo or simply not used alot in MMA much, ude-hiji-ashi-kansetsu, (google is your friend), shime-garami, atama-hishigi, or my favourite the kata gatame choke

If you train in the same style as the next guy, the more experinced guy will read you like a book.

In MMA top guys can pull moves out no-one is expecting.

cruasder777

pablohoney87 wrote: »

Gypsy ju jitsu is just the same as Jake shields 'American jiujitsu' or Jon fitchs 'guerilla jiujitsu' its submission wrestling. ie nogi bjj cross training with freestyle wrestling. unless they're in a gi its not judo as any judo throws done nogi are in wrestling.

Ultimately its all "submission wrestling" even BJJ.

cruasder777

da-bres wrote: »

absolute LOL

Why is that funny ?

There are lots of Vids of John Maguire defeating BJJ black belts.

I even fancy John Maguires style over UFC No1 welterweight George St Pierre, I am yet to see anyone who can trouble him on the ground.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPZzqyibON0


Notice Johns unorthodox butterfly guard 1.min 45 the standard BJJ one is more difficult to defend against an experienced opponent.

arybvtcw0eolkf

pablohoney87 wrote: »

Gypsy ju jitsu is just the same as Jake shields 'American jiujitsu' or Jon fitchs 'guerilla jiujitsu' its submission wrestling. ie nogi bjj cross training with freestyle wrestling. unless they're in a gi its not judo as any judo throws done nogi are in wrestling.

I wonder will Paul Cowzer grade me as a Gypsy now?.

'Gypsy JJ' ffs its laughable actually.

Tim_Murphy

Melina Nutty Ice wrote: »

'Gypsy JJ' ffs its laughable actually.

Sounds pretty good IMO. :pac: It's as good as as other made up name really.
He was a ref on a show I cornered in a while back if I'm not mistaken. Looks like a pretty good grappler.

Doug Cartel

cruasder777 wrote: »

Sambo, vale tudo, judo.

I train with John Maguire, I try to practice techniques not practised much or some now illegal in judo or simply not used alot in MMA much, ude-hiji-ashi-kansetsu, (google is your friend), shime-garami, atama-hishigi, or my favourite the kata gatame choke

Kata gatame perfectly legal in judo and is a very common choke in BJJ. They call it an arm triangle.

Ude hishigi ashi gatame (interesting way you chose to romanise it) is also legal, not sure what it's called in BJJ, but it's basically an arm-bar done with the legs.

Shime-garami, not sure what that is, sounds like a choke and lock at the same time, could you describe it?

Atama-hishigi, sounds like you're trying to describe bending someone's head back. I guess it's supposed to be some kind of neck crank. If you want the actual Japanese names for them they are available here http://judoinfo.com/kubiwaza.htm

arybvtcw0eolkf

Tim_Murphy wrote: »

He was a ref on a show I cornered in a while back if I'm not mistaken. Looks like a pretty good grappler for a gypsy.

Admit it, thats what your dying to say

cruasder777

Doug Cartel wrote: »

Kata gatame perfectly legal in judo and is a very common choke in BJJ. They call it an arm triangle.

Ude hishigi ashi gatame (interesting way you chose to romanise it) is also legal, not sure what it's called in BJJ, but it's basically an arm-bar done with the legs.

Shime-garami, not sure what that is, sounds like a choke and lock at the same time, could you describe it?

Atama-hishigi, sounds like you're trying to describe bending someone's head back. I guess it's supposed to be some kind of neck crank. If you want the actual Japanese names for them they are available here http://judoinfo.com/kubiwaza.htm

Dont patronise me, do you think I dont know what a basic BJJ triangle choke is ?

Lol, keep trying, I meant a reverse kata gatame choke. Where did I say it was illegal ? I forgot to write reverse.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLr4dYAzLQA


Ude hishigi ashi gatame is an elbow lock, where did I say it was illegal ?

Its not an arm bar.


Shime-garami is a two armed arm bar kodokan technique, on your back, pull your opponents arms towards you while you have your ankles around his neck. not illegal.



Atama-hishigi is an illegal head crush, very painful.

Banned nowadays in judo.


They are the Japanese names you mug :rolleyes:

slammer187

Doug Cartel wrote: »

Ude hishigi ashi gatame (interesting way you chose to romanise it) is also legal, not sure what it's called in BJJ, but it's basically an arm-bar done with the legs.

It's called a crucifix armbar in BJJ, there was a good opportunity to catch it during John Maguire's fight, it would be a nice way to debut your UFC career finishing with that :P

pablohoney87

a reverse katagatama or a head crush would never work without a gi against a resisting opponent in your own weight class. they can both be used to set up the much simpler and much more effective rear naked choke.
interesting how simplicity and effectiveness go hand in hand with grappling

arybvtcw0eolkf

cruasder777 wrote: »

They are the Japanese names you mug :rolleyes:

I'm not sure what the Japanese word for banned it.. Your banned anyway.

Doug Cartel

cruasder777 wrote: »

Dont patronise me, do you think I dont know what a basic BJJ triangle choke is ?

I'm trying not to make assumptions. Though if you knew the English names, why were you using the Japanese names (and not even the standard judo ones at that) and telling me to google them?

Lol, keep trying, I meant a reverse kata gatame choke. Where did I say it was illegal ? I forgot to write reverse.

You said illegal or rare, I was pointing out that it is neither illegal nor rare. You "forgot" to write reverse - what am I a mind reader? Anyway a reverse kata-gatame doesn't sound that unusual - I would guess that would be a D'Arce choke? (Or is that a Brabbo? I get confused sometimes.)

Ude hishigi ashi gatame is an elbow lock, where did I say it was illegal ?

Its not an arm bar.

You are getting a bit caught up in semantics here, it's a straight armlock with the leg acting as the fulcrum. That's pretty similar to an arm-bar.

Shime-garami is a two armed arm bar kodokan technique, on your back, pull your opponents arms towards you while you have your ankles around his neck. not illegal.

Wow! The mythical double arm-bar. You win a lot of competitions with that one Broseph?

EDIT: woops, didn't notice he got banned, I guess that makes this post a bit pointless.

Doug Cartel

slammer187 wrote: »

It's called a crucifix armbar in BJJ

OK I'm going to sound pedantic here, but ude-hishigi-ashi-gatame covers more situations than just the crucifix armbar.