ARE THE RAIDERS FOR REAL

neilster

With a coach who has shown real enthusiasm for the job an excellent '10 & '11 draft (reaffirmed by the thrusting of the two young corners into the Lineup against the Jets) and the giving an old-fashioned bloody nose to the Jets in their win the other night

The question has to be asked are they for real, they have a solid if not spectacular player at QBack, they have Seymour, Tommy Kelly and Jarvis Moss as 3 of a very good 4 man Front .

They have lost Asomugha but in Goodman and the new corners they may have found some good answers. They are strong at Safety for the most part with Michael Huff. At Linebacker they are strong and McClain is splendid.

The O-Line was seen as a weakness but Veneer looks good at tackle , they have a good centre with Satele and good cover with Wisniewski at Centre . Wisniewski is a starting Guard now and Barksdale has done ok at guard on the other side as a rookie. They have a fearsome running game and their pick in the draft of Moore has gone very well with the rest of the reciever corps chipping in and Boss is a good addition, could this team go far?

D3PO

depends how you define for real.

Are they a playoff calibre team ? Yes so long as Run DMC doesnt get injured

Do they have Superbowl potential for this season ? Not yet still a few pieces of the jigsaw missing. Plus Al Davis still is there

Chucky the tree

Campbell isn't good enough to win us a Superbowl but we could make the play-offs alright if things go our way. Chargers haven't looked great but they usually don't at the start of the season. Wildcard spots will be wide open with the Pats, Jets and Steelers all fighting it out for one. The team is certainly on the way up, funny to think all the stick people gave us for not renewing Cable contract was a clear sign of how terrible we were. :pac:

P.S Who's Goodman? I take it you mean Routt. Also, Veneer = Veldheer.

neilster

D3PO wrote: »

depends how you define for real.

Are they a playoff calibre team ? Yes so long as Run DMC doesnt get injured

Do they have Superbowl potential for this season ? Not yet still a few pieces of the jigsaw missing. Plus Al Davis still is there

I would say a play-off team this season and following it up with 10 win seasons. From where they have come from that would be a huge foundation. Im not really talking SuperBowl but 4 good years of drafting , a continuous improvement in terms of wins etc

They were a 8-8 team on an easy schedule. They look like having a winning season this year on a very hard schedule, i know its early but they were 21-3 up at halftime and were one goal-line stand away from 3-0

D3PO

neilster wrote: »

I would say a play-off team this season and following it up with 10 win seasons. From where they have come from that would be a huge foundation. Im not really talking SuperBowl but 4 good years of drafting , a continuous improvement in terms of wins etc

They were a 8-8 team on an easy schedule. They look like having a winning season this year on a very hard schedule, i know its early but they were 21-3 up at halftime and were one goal-line stand away from 3-0

I wouldnt look past this season right not being honest. Kansas next year with a fairly early draft pick I suspect, plus Charles and Berry back will be a much improved side.

I think Oakland will finished 9-7 but they need to fill gaps for next season to move forward.

I think they have needs at corner, d end, qb and reciever to be honest before they are genuine contenders, thats still quite a bit of upgrading to be done.

Plus as good as Seymour is he will be 32 next year so they will need to start looking at a DT aswell.

Chucky the tree

Why do we need a DE? We need a DT a lot more then a DE because of Kelly and Seymours age.

D3PO

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Why do we need a DE? We need a DT a lot more then a DE because of Kelly and Seymours age.

I did mention a DT due to age

RE DE I dont think Houston or Shaugnessy are good enough pass rushers for a team that wants to think about winning a superbowl. They are what I'd classify as adequate starters.

Granted they are young so maybe they will come on but right now Id think drafting or trading for a pass rushing DE would be advantageous to the team. Personal opinion of course. From what Ive seen which is probably a lot less than a raiders fan.

neilster

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Campbell isn't good enough to win us a Superbowl but we could make the play-offs alright if things go our way. Chargers haven't looked great but they usually don't at the start of the season. Wildcard spots will be wide open with the Pats, Jets and Steelers all fighting it out for one. The team is certainly on the way up, funny to think all the stick people gave us for not renewing Cable contract was a clear sign of how terrible we were. :pac:

P.S Who's Goodman? I take it you mean Routt. Also, Veneer = Veldheer.

Goodman as in Andre, he isnt back this season apologies and i mix up your tackle with the Titans guy .

As you say Chris Johnson and Routt even though id say this will be Routt, Van Dyke, Chekwa and Johnson in that order pretty soon

Peyton Manning

neilster wrote: »

Goodman as in Andre, he isnt back this season

If by "isnt back" you mean "has never played for the Raiders in his life", then you're right.

mikemac

Possible push for a wildcard, the AFC is wide open

spiralism

Tom_Brady wrote: »

If by "isnt back" you mean "has never played for the Raiders in his life", then you're right.

In fact, given that he plays for the broncos, he couldnt be further from an oakland raiders player if he tried!

Danger_dave1

http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/5147/the-buzzworthy-nfl

Talks about the raiders and many other teams over performing

neilster

D3PO wrote: »

I wouldnt look past this season right not being honest. Kansas next year with a fairly early draft pick I suspect, plus Charles and Berry back will be a much improved side.

I think Oakland will finished 9-7 but they need to fill gaps for next season to move forward.

I think they have needs at corner, d end, qb and reciever to be honest before they are genuine contenders, thats still quite a bit of upgrading to be done.

Plus as good as Seymour is he will be 32 next year so they will need to start looking at a DT aswell.

Id say 9-7 is about right , they seemed to be winning close games , early days but a pounding running game wins close ones

I just started looking at their draft and if Chekwa and Van Dyke work out , i dont mean outstanding successes but adequate they would probably visit cornerback later than the second round

1) if picking a CB

If they picked with a 9-7 record that might be picks through 14-19 i would be seeing them picking Dre Kirkpatrick CB at Alabama or someone like Stephon Gilmore

If the Corners they have... and they did pick two this year which would lead you to conclude they wanted to sort the issue with Asomugha going ...work out and if Campbell has a solid year ...you would think Defensive End with a late round CB . I think they might go Corner at all , the corners are raw but i like them

2) if picking a DE

the consensus pick seems to be the hybrid End/Tackle Jared Crick from Nebraska...think of a more talented Muhammed Wilkerson which is no insult to Wilkerson

They also could go for a more traditional end in Brandon Jenkins from Florida St or Bruce Irvin DE from West Virginia , i think this may be their 1st rounder a DEnd

3) if they pick a Tackle

This would probbaly come down to trading up for Brandon Thompson from Clemson or taking someone like Jerrell Worthy , if the defensive front performs like they have recently this year (no 1 in defense) ...maybe they could draft a project in the later rounds...i think the Tackles will do well and it will be a late rounder unless Thompson fell in the draft

4) To finally draft a QB

Youd have to say two issues affect this - how Campbell plays , if solid i think they keep him - and Tyrelle Pryor ...i think he intrigues the Raiders and they will take a long look at him

but if those two options were not the solutions where would they be on a QB. If Luck , Barkley and Lance Jones are gone to the SeaHawks, Chiefs and Miami for instance ...what would the Raiders have left ?

There seems to be a drop-off after this . As McCoy and Dalton have shown , there is no shame in this if there is quality . Ryan Tannehill (Texas A&M) is an option , Nick Fowles from Arizona is another . I suspect if Campbell has anything but a terrible year and the running game may give him a pass here , they will pass on a QBack . Other teams like Denver will be picking in the middle to end of the draft also too

FreeOSCAR

Let's wait until they play a few more road games and we will see how good they are for that AFC West or Wildcard Spot.

Having watched the Jets game they were good in spells.
Jason Campbell was solid, not doing much wrong but not making big plays either.
Run DMC is the leader on the O, if he doesnt play the Raiders are half the team offensively. Along with AP, he really is the best runner in Football at the moment.
The D has a good game against an injury ravaged Jets O line and meh QB.

Again I could be wrong here but I think the Pats will light them up this week.

D3PO

neilster wrote: »

Id say 9-7 is about right , they seemed to be winning close games , early days but a pounding running game wins close ones

I just started looking at their draft and if Chekwa and Van Dyke work out , i dont mean outstanding successes but adequate they would probably visit cornerback later than the second round

1) if picking a CB

If they picked with a 9-7 record that might be picks through 14-19 i would be seeing them picking Dre Kirkpatrick CB at Alabama or someone like Stephon Gilmore

If the Corners they have... and they did pick two this year which would lead you to conclude they wanted to sort the issue with Asomugha going ...work out and if Campbell has a solid year ...you would think Defensive End with a late round CB . I think they might go Corner at all , the corners are raw but i like them

2) if picking a DE

the consensus pick seems to be the hybrid End/Tackle Jared Crick from Nebraska...think of a more talented Muhammed Wilkerson which is no insult to Wilkerson

They also could go for a more traditional end in Brandon Jenkins from Florida St or Bruce Irvin DE from West Virginia , i think this may be their 1st rounder a DEnd

3) if they pick a Tackle

This would probbaly come down to trading up for Brandon Thompson from Clemson or taking someone like Jerrell Worthy , if the defensive front performs like they have recently this year (no 1 in defense) ...maybe they could draft a project in the later rounds...i think the Tackles will do well and it will be a late rounder unless Thompson fell in the draft

4) To finally draft a QB

Youd have to say two issues affect this - how Campbell plays , if solid i think they keep him - and Tyrelle Pryor ...i think he intrigues the Raiders and they will take a long look at him

but if those two options were not the solutions where would they be on a QB. If Luck , Barkley and Lance Jones are gone to the SeaHawks, Chiefs and Miami for instance ...what would the Raiders have left ?

There seems to be a drop-off after this . As McCoy and Dalton have shown , there is no shame in this if there is quality . Ryan Tannehill (Texas A&M) is an option , Nick Fowles from Arizona is another . I suspect if Campbell has anything but a terrible year and the running game may give him a pass here , they will pass on a QBack . Other teams like Denver will be picking in the middle to end of the draft also too

Nice post but far to early to be projecting potential first rounders and where they mgith pick

As for QB's I dont think Miami will go from Hennie so I dont see them drafting one. Hes been solid so far this year. Anyway lets wait till about week 1 before we even get into this

I didnt put those needs in order BTW.

P. S Its Landry Jones not Lance and Nick Foles not Fowles :pac:

neilster

Tom_Brady wrote: »

If by "isnt back" you mean "has never played for the Raiders in his life", then you're right.

thats exactly what i meant haha how did you know ...he played against them in week 2 , its Routt i meant as explained before

me thinking you had gone up into the long grass for a sleep , nice to see you're back

Nice to see instead of starting threads and starting discussion and in an attempt to cause debate (typos and names get mixed up inevitably ) you choose to correct instead ...i think i did describe you as the ultimate OP for tackling the man and not the ball ..consistent as ever

Come to think of it , wondering how your Last in defense Pats will deal with the Raiders this weekend , by watching the Raiders chewing up the clock and keeping Brady off the field or the Woodson-coached secondary baiting Brady into 4 more interceptions this weekend like last (funny dont think i'll get to right that sentence again too often)

neilster

D3PO wrote: »

Nice post but far to early to be projecting potential first rounders and where they mgith pick

As for QB's I dont think Miami will go from Hennie so I dont see them drafting one. Hes been solid so far this year. Anyway lets wait till about week 1 before we even get into this

I didnt put those needs in order BTW.

P. S Its Landry Jones not Lance and Nick Foles not Fowles :pac:

I totally agree with you it is very early ..just a fun exercise ...Has Hennie not been good one game bad the other ...Sparanos future may be tied into it

I can see the Seahawks having an early pick and obviously unless the Chiefs turn around Cassel is on very big money to do badly but its just fun

Peyton Manning

neilster wrote: »

Nice to see instead of starting threads and starting discussion and in an attempt to cause debate (typos and names get mixed up inevitably ) you choose to correct instead ...i think i did describe you as the ultimate OP for tackling the man and not the ball ..consistent as ever

Here's a debate for you - when is the last time Neilster hasn't stolen an opinion from WalterFootball.com?

Was it when you referred to Landry Jones as Lance Jones above? Nope, because Walter has been calling him Lance as a joke for well over a year now.

Was it when you mocked Luck -> Seahawks, Barkley -> Chiefs and Jones -> Dolphins above, exactly as Walter has been doing for quite some time? Nope.

Was it when you updated your 2011 Mock Draft the same day Walter updated his every time during the offseason? Nope, because you practically stole 95% of his projections.

With your penchant for stealing opinions, lack of activity in match threads and the fact I could barely hazard a guess at what team you follow, I would say the only debate here is whether you actually watch football or not. I'd lean towards the "no" side of that one if that's okay with you.

mikemac

neilster wrote: »

I can see the Seahawks having an early pick

Everyone sees the Seahawks having an early pick, that's not saying much

Niners and Seahawks this season was the worst game I've seen in years

D3PO

There are two fouls on the post. One for each poster.


Foul on offense Tom Brady. Excessive handbags.

Foul on defense Nielster. Excessive handbags.

These handbags will offset. Replay the post :pac:

Tom could be worse he could be listening to Mel Kieper or the likes :eek:

neilster

mikemac wrote: »

Everyone sees the Seahawks having an early pick, that's not saying much

Niners and Seahawks this season was the worst game I've seen in years

Tell Tom Brady that as well ..instead of someone entering the spirit of the thing and putting their tuppence worth ...what do we get ?? try thinking about my input less and make your own input ...like a comment on the Raiders or the game this weekend , easier to tackle me than tackle the subject of a last ranked defence when you defended the non drafting of JJ Watt or Ryan Kerrigan with the words , Bill has a plan ..tackle the subject

The Seahawks , Chiefs and Miami are consensus Top5 2012 holders at this point with most sources from PFT, Yahoo, si.com or Walther or the draft experts making their predictions already . Someone could argue that which is worse TJackson , Whitehurst or Kansas. Maybe the schedule is pointing to a few more wins for Kansas . Miami are awful although the defense is better but they will probably sink into not playing for the coach

As for the "Lance" Jones thing , someone may correct me on this but he is often mentioned with Lance as a nickname and it predates college even , there is multiple sources using that name

As for the game day contributions i was involved in week 2 not week 3 due to time constraints

And as for the following slavishly Walther's mock draft that is rubbish , they are good but not gospel, certainly not this year ...beat writers often are far more accurate

again get into the debate , pick a draft and we'll debate it and drop the anti-me crap

neilster

Tom_Brady wrote: »

Here's a debate for you - when is the last time Neilster hasn't stolen an opinion from WalterFootball.com?

Was it when you referred to Landry Jones as Lance Jones above? Nope, because Walter has been calling him Lance as a joke for well over a year now.

Was it when you mocked Luck -> Seahawks, Barkley -> Chiefs and Jones -> Dolphins above, exactly as Walter has been doing for quite some time? Nope.

Was it when you updated your 2011 Mock Draft the same day Walter updated his every time during the offseason? Nope, because you practically stole 95% of his projections.

With your penchant for stealing opinions, lack of activity in match threads and the fact I could barely hazard a guess at what team you follow, I would say the only debate here is whether you actually watch football or not. I'd lean towards the "no" side of that one if that's okay with you.

Here's a debate for you - when is the last time Tom Brady started a debate

i watch what i can get to see , i wont be commenting on your match thread activity or opinions only to disagree or agree

Cowboys but we all know who you follow ...its Green Bay isnt it

neilster

D3PO wrote: »

There are two fouls on the post. One for each poster.


Foul on offense Tom Brady. Excessive handbags.

Foul on defense Nielster. Excessive handbags.

These handbags will offset. Replay the post :pac:

Tom could be worse he could be listening to Mel Kieper or the likes :eek:

i like that its good

Peyton Manning

neilster wrote: »

easier to tackle me than tackle the subject of a last ranked defence when you defended the non drafting of JJ Watt or Ryan Kerrigan with the words , Bill has a plan ..tackle the subject

Go on so, quote me where where I defended Bill not drafting either of those two, or where I said Bill has a plan.

Dont bring up any other points, don't dance around the subject - just back up the above claim you've made.

adrian522

mikemac wrote: »

Niners and Seahawks this season was the worst game I've seen in years

Check out Niners/Cincinnati from last Sunday for a game even worse.

I see a trend developing.

neilster

Tom_Brady wrote: »

Go on so, quote me where where I defended Bill not drafting either of those two, or where I said Bill has a plan.

Dont bring up any other points, don't dance around the subject - just back up the above claim you've made.

Before you make a fool of yourself ...there was a very detailed back and forth about amongst other things but especially the pass rush but also

-The playoff losses recently for the Pats
-The merits or not of the Jets and their strategy against the Pats
- The effect that this should have on their draft vis a vis in particular their extra pick in the first and second rounds
-Your defence of their defence
-Your defence of their linebacking corps in particular
-A detailed argument of their ranking on defense against all the stats

did this happen or not ? now in the case of JJ Watt , people speculated did he suit the scheme and with also with the Pats mixing up these looks ...these are all valid arguments as is the idea that it is the interior of the line that needed more work at DT

I have no problem finding this , you know i dont

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

Before you make a fool of yourself ...there was a very detailed back and forth about amongst other things but especially the pass rush but also

-The playoff losses recently for the Pats
-The merits or not of the Jets and their strategy against the Pats
- The effect that this should have on their draft vis a vis in particular their extra pick in the first and second rounds
-Your defence of their defence
-Your defence of their linebacking corps in particular
-A detailed argument of their ranking on defense against all the stats

did this happen or not ? now in the case of JJ Watt , people speculated did he suit the scheme and with also with the Pats mixing up these looks ...these are all valid arguments as is the idea that it is the interior of the line that needed more work at DT

I have no problem finding this , you know i dont

Honestly I would like to see you quote Tom Brady on this one. All well and good throwing up points you think he made, but anyone could do that. Why don't you find where he said all that and quote it into a post to prove it?

The problem here is you mix up all 3 of us Pats fans who have argued you on this especially in that conversation about our pass rush. It seems you are lumping in all the points made by ALL Pats fans as a basis to your points. Sure anyone can mix all the points together to make it look like one opinion even though it was many different ones.

tallaghtoutlaws

As for the Raiders what impresses me most about them is that WR corp especially Moore. Kid has a bright future in the NFL. One thing the Raiders are doing right now is playing smart football. It seems they are on the right path. But as someone pointed out keeping McFadden healthy will be key this season especially.

D3PO

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

Honestly I would like to see you quote Tom Brady on this one. All well and good throwing up points you think he made, but anyone could do that. Why don't you find where he said all that and quote it into a post to prove it?

The problem here is you mix up all 3 of us Pats fans who have argued you on this especially in that conversation about our pass rush. It seems you are lumping in all the points made by ALL Pats fans as a basis to your points. Sure anyone can mix all the points together to make it look like one opinion even though it was many different ones.

The moral of the story. Dont support the Pats follow the Eagles instead :D:D

TaosHum

I think it will come down to what they are able to achieve against the Chargers.

Peyton Manning

neilster wrote: »

Before you make a fool of yourself ...there was a very detailed back and forth about amongst other things but especially the pass rush but also

-The playoff losses recently for the Pats
-The merits or not of the Jets and their strategy against the Pats
- The effect that this should have on their draft vis a vis in particular their extra pick in the first and second rounds
-Your defence of their defence
-Your defence of their linebacking corps in particular
-A detailed argument of their ranking on defense against all the stats

did this happen or not ?

No, it didn't happen. You're talking out of your arse. I had absolutely nothing to do with that conversation.

I have no problem finding this , you know i dont

This should be good. Go on so, find me saying anything like the above list you've mentioned. I'll even give you a head start - here's the thread that discussion took place in.

Let's see you having "no problem" find it.

neilster

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

Honestly I would like to see you quote Tom Brady on this one. All well and good throwing up points you think he made, but anyone could do that. Why don't you find where he said all that and quote it into a post to prove it?

The problem here is you mix up all 3 of us Pats fans who have argued you on this especially in that conversation about our pass rush. It seems you are lumping in all the points made by ALL Pats fans as a basis to your points. Sure anyone can mix all the points together to make it look like one opinion even though it was many different ones.

On a light hearted note have you seen the number of posts ye guys make ...i've had to get secretarial help to find them

I think a lot of this beef was more with EagleE but all three may be lumped in...we were mostly on the smae page on draft choices or strategy ...the PassRush differences is mostly EagleEye ...on a placatory note ...TomB has shown th emost blind faith in Cam Newton so there ya go

Peyton Manning

neilster wrote: »

I think a lot of this beef was more with EagleE but all three may be lumped in

Wrong. I had nothing to do with it. Your continuing to claim that I was involved in that discussion is quite frankly embarrassing. I suspect you've gone back and looked at that thread and realised that your claims above are completely made up.

You were wrong. Admit it and get over it.

neilster

Tom_Brady wrote: »

No, it didn't happen. You're talking out of your arse. I had absolutely nothing to do with that conversation.



This should be good. Go on so, find me saying anything like the above list you've mentioned. I'll even give you a head start - here's the thread that discussion took place in.

Let's see you having "no problem" find it.

Your preciousness knows no bounds ...its the NFL draft thread but seeing that you ve gassed about everything as well as NFL and it spans 77 (yes 77 pages on search ) id rather paint the house

still havent heard any chat about that vaunted defence by the way or are we tackling the man still

neilster

Tom_Brady wrote: »

Wrong. I had nothing to do with it. Your continuing to claim that I was involved in that discussion is quite frankly embarrassing. I suspect you've gone back and looked at that thread and realised that your claims above are completely made up.

You were wrong. Admit it and get over it.

its 70 pages but lets play the game not the man ...that defence

and since when did you need to "bold" my entries for effect ...i didnt bold that last line and so you did

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

its 70 pages but lets play the game not the man ...that defence

and since when did you need to "bold" my entries for effect ...i didnt bold that last line and so you did

Ah here now come on dude you clearly said TB took part in the discussion, Now that he has told you he didn't you are now trying to deflect that you were wrong.

As for that discussion there was 3 Pats fans including myself but excluding TB who debated in that discussion. All 3 of those Pats fans were saying different things and there were clear mixed views on the issue. You clearly confuse us all as the same and its tiresome at this point trying to debate with you when you consistently get things wrong including names, You clearly reference the wrong things and when you are wrong you can't admit it.

Its funny though you make a big deal about it and when someone asks you to prove your accusation you make excuses.

and since when did you need to "bold" my entries for effect ...i didnt bold that last line and so you did

Because you accused him of something he didn't do maybe?

As for the Pats defense issue its been done to death and everyone but you has moved on.

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

I think a lot of this beef was more with EagleE but all three may be lumped in.

And see this is your biggest problem when debating with myself or EE or TB. You try lump us all as one opinion when in actual fact the 3 of us don't agree on a lot of things the Pats have done including me and EE on that 70 or so pages for the most part.

Peyton Manning

neilster wrote: »

its 70 pages but lets play the game not the man ...that defence

and since when did you need to "bold" my entries for effect ...i didnt bold that last line and so you did

You created a thread about whether the Raiders are legitimate playoff contenders or not, and now you want to talk about the Patriots defence in here?

I don't know why you're being so anal about that point, I never even mentioned the Patriots. I simply pointed out you were judging the Raiders defence while including players who dont - and never have - played for the Raiders. Was that not a valid point for me to bring up? Or can I go ahead answer your Patriots defence question and tell everyone we have a great pass rush with Clay Matthews on our team? No, we dont because he doesn't play for us, so don't get so bloody precious when someone points out a mistake you made.

Your petty attempts at trolling and bringing up the Patriots defence because you think it might be a sore point to a poster who pointed out a mistake you made who just happens to support the Patriots is pathetic.

You then went on to list 6 detailed points I supposedly made about the Patriots in a previous discussion which never happened. So all of a sudden Im attacking you, because you're claiming players who don't play for the Raiders do in fact play for them, and you're claiming that I've said things that I haven't. (You still haven't admitted that I didn't say anything like that at all by the way, I'm still waiting for you to post where I said them - as you said - you would have no problem doing so).

The sad part is I've actually been hugely critical of the Pats defence in almost every match thread so far this season, so Im not sure why you think you pointing out how bad they are would irk me.

Seriously neilster, a bit of cop on wouldn't go astray. You need to grow up.

eagle eye

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

And see this is your biggest problem when debating with myself or EE or TB. You try lump us all as one opinion when in actual fact the 3 of us don't agree on a lot of things the Pats have done including me and EE on that 70 or so pages for the most part.

Well I think we'll agree on this one.

Anybody who thinks he knows more about Defense than Bill Belichick is not worth replying to. And neilster comes across like he thinks he does.

And that Walter football thing is correct too. Actually his attempts to make it look like his own draft were lolbad. He actually had different sized text just like their draft.

neilster

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

Ah here now come on dude you clearly said TB took part in the discussion, Now that he has told you he didn't you are now trying to deflect that you were wrong.

As for that discussion there was 3 Pats fans including myself but excluding TB who debated in that discussion. All 3 of those Pats fans were saying different things and there were clear mixed views on the issue. You clearly confuse us all as the same and its tiresome at this point trying to debate with you when you consistently get things wrong including names, You clearly reference the wrong things and when you are wrong you can't admit it.

Its funny though you make a big deal about it and when someone asks you to prove your accusation you make excuses.



Because you accused him of something he didn't do maybe?

As for the Pats defense issue its been done too be fair death and everyone but you has moved on.

To be fair my central point is TomBradys treatment of me is about tackling me not the NFL ...he started in this thread talking about an inaccuracy in my post and never mentioned the Raiders and he has continued talking about anything but the Raiders,i mentioned the Pats cos its the game thats up next

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

To be fair my central point is TomBradys treatment of me is about tackling me not the NFL ...he started in this thread talking about an inaccuracy in my post and never mentioned the Raiders and he has continued talking about anything but the Raiders,i mentioned the Pats cos its the game thats up next

Yes he pointed out you were wrong which is hardly a new thing a round here. Hell if i get a name wrong I hope someone points it out to me. And your Pats reference that he was referring to had nothing to do with this weekends game. The first time you brought up the Pats game, To be fair you got snarky with him as you took offense to what he said back to you and then you tried asking him about the game this weekend.

Nice to see instead of starting threads and starting discussion and in an attempt to cause debate (typos and names get mixed up inevitably ) you choose to correct instead ...i think i did describe you as the ultimate OP for tackling the man and not the ball ..consistent as ever

Had you not said this you probably would have gotten an answer to this:

Come to think of it , wondering how your Last in defense Pats will deal with the Raiders this weekend , by watching the Raiders chewing up the clock and keeping Brady off the field or the Woodson-coached secondary baiting Brady into 4 more interceptions this weekend like last (funny dont think i'll get to right that sentence again too often)

But you then brought up the Pats Pass rushing after TB called you out again taking the thread of course and you accused him of something he didn't do.

Remember the first time me and you debated you accused me of moving the goalposts?

neilster

eagle eye wrote: »

Well I think we'll agree on this one.

Anybody who thinks he knows more about Defense than Bill Belichick is not worth replying to. And neilster comes across like he thinks he does.

And that Walter football thing is correct too. Actually his attempts to make it look like his own draft were lolbad. He actually had different sized text just like their draft QUOTE

I never mentioned that i knew more about defense than Belichek ...he has those SuperBowls remember ..i thought we were talking Raiders and their next game

I simply mentioned that a seriously winning team has a blindspot in parts of their defense and their pass rush.I pointed out that not winning a play-off game since 2007 and the losses to the Jets were a trend and a team which has been arguably the finiest of that era has underachieved .

I think their win-loss ratio versus the play-off success stands out across the league. This is compounded by probably the leagues finest QB in his finest vein of form possibly being outdone by their defense. I suggested some things about the draft and some agreed and some disagreed , TBrady for instance lauded Kerrigan which was a good idea

What i was reminded was players were returning ..the Linebacker Corps was young and about to shine and it would be ok

We now know what happened , those extra picks werent used on the Pass Rush and we are where we are which is a bad defense

Peyton Manning

neilster wrote: »

To be fair my central point is TomBradys treatment of me is about tackling me not the NFL ...he started in this thread talking about an inaccuracy in my post and never mentioned the Raiders and he has continued talking about anything but the Raiders,i mentioned the Pats cos its the game thats up next

Eh, I did mention the Raiders.

You said:

They have lost Asomugha but in Goodman and the new corners they may have found some good answers.

To which Chucky replied:

Who's Goodman? I take it you mean Routt.

To which you followed up with:

Goodman as in Andre, he isnt back this season

You didn't clarify you meant Routt, you actually got more specific about Goodman. So I pointed out that Andre Goodman is with the Broncos and has never played with the Raiders in his life.

You then said to me:

its Routt i meant as explained before

But you hadn't explained it before, so it was a perfectly valid point for me to raise.

You can say whatever you like about bringing up the Patriots as a valid discussion, but anyone with half a brain realises you only brought them up because you somehow thought I was taking a shot at you and thought it would wind me up by mentioning how bad our defence is....

...a point I have made several times already this season. Neilster logic right there.

And to think you have the nerve to accuse others of making fools of themselves.

Peyton Manning

neilster wrote: »

TBrady for instance lauded Kerrigan which was a good idea

That is correct - I did heap praise on Ryan Kerrigan.

Matter of fact, on draft day I was very vocal about hoping a pass rusher fell to us. So why would you earlier make up lies saying I defended the Pats not picking one?

Just answer the above question, please.

neilster

Tom_Brady wrote: »

You created a thread about whether the Raiders are legitimate playoff contenders or not, and now you want to talk about the Patriots defence in here?

I don't know why you're being so anal about that point, I never even mentioned the Patriots. I simply pointed out you were judging the Raiders defence while including players who dont - and never have - played for the Raiders. Was that not a valid point for me to bring up? Or can I go ahead answer your Patriots defence question and tell everyone we have a great pass rush with Clay Matthews on our team? No, we dont because he doesn't play for us, so don't get so bloody precious when someone points out a mistake you made.

Your petty attempts at trolling and bringing up the Patriots defence because you think it might be a sore point to a poster who pointed out a mistake you made who just happens to support the Patriots is pathetic.

You then went on to list 6 detailed points I supposedly made about the Patriots in a previous discussion which never happened. So all of a sudden Im attacking you, because you're claiming players who don't play for the Raiders do in fact play for them, and you're claiming that I've said things that I haven't. (You still haven't admitted that I didn't say anything like that at all by the way, I'm still waiting for you to post where I said them - as you said - you would have no problem doing so).

The sad part is I've actually been hugely critical of the Pats defence in almost every match thread so far this season, so Im not sure why you think you pointing out how bad they are would irk me.

Seriously neilster, a bit of cop on wouldn't go astray. You need to grow up.

i started off a thread about the Raiders ...i was speaking about Stanford Routt who i used the wrong name on ...you pointed out that inaccuracy without talking about the Raiders...i know you are a Pats fan and i asked you about Sundays game against the Raider which you proceeded to not speak about again

are you going to continously post about anything other than Oakland

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

i started off a thread about the Raiders ...i was speaking about Stanford Routt who i used the wrong name on ...you pointed out that inaccuracy without talking about the Raiders...i know you are a Pats fan and i asked you about Sundays game against the Raider which you proceeded to not speak about again

are you going to continously post about anything other than Oakland

Pot kettle black and trying to avoid the issue again and again as usual an issue you caused. But hey good man sums you up really. Love the way you pretend the thread didn't derail because of you in the first place.:rolleyes:

neilster

Tom_Brady wrote: »

That is correct - I did heap praise on Ryan Kerrigan.

Matter of fact, on draft day I was very vocal about hoping a pass rusher fell to us. So why would you earlier make up lies saying I defended the Pats not picking one?

Just answer the above question, please.

careful with the loose use of the word lies ...careful you can lay that on someone else ...or i dont deal with you

i dont call you that and you dont lay this on anyone until the mention the Patriots and you still havent mentioned the Raiders

neilster

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

Pot kettle black and trying to avoid the issue again and again as usual an issue you caused. But hey good man sums you up really. Love the way you pretend the thread didn't derail because of you in the first place.:rolleyes:

Tom the kettle never gets called black though by you and again when is anyone going to talk about the Raiders and how the Pats defence might handle it or has held up so far

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

Tom the kettle never gets called black though by you and again when is anyone going to talk about the Raiders and how the Pats defence might handle it or has held up so far

Tom? See once again not reading who replied to you.

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

careful with the loose use of the word lies ...careful you can lay that on someone else ...or i dont deal with you

i dont call you that and you dont lay this on anyone until the mention the Patriots and you still havent mentioned the Raiders

In TBs defense you wrote this earlier in the thread:

neilster wrote: »

Before you make a fool of yourself ...there was a very detailed back and forth about amongst other things but especially the pass rush but also

-The playoff losses recently for the Pats
-The merits or not of the Jets and their strategy against the Pats
- The effect that this should have on their draft vis a vis in particular their extra pick in the first and second rounds
-Your defence of their defence
-Your defence of their linebacking corps in particular
-A detailed argument of their ranking on defense against all the stats

did this happen or not ? now in the case of JJ Watt , people speculated did he suit the scheme and with also with the Pats mixing up these looks ...these are all valid arguments as is the idea that it is the interior of the line that needed more work at DT

I have no problem finding this , you know i dont

Hardly him making up stuff you actually wrote to be fair. Seriously dude do you type things and forget you wrote them? You keep avoiding the fact that you actually de-railed the thread with the above post.

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

Raiders and how the Pats defence might handle it or has held up so far

With all the Injuries at WR they have 2 real threats in McFadden coming from the back field on screens and dump passes and Moore out wide.

If the Pats can contain that run game our secondary should be able to handle Campbell and those WR.