Raw 12/09/11 *Spoilers*

JP Liz V1

Source

Tonight’s episode of WWE RAW takes place from Ottowa, Canada. On Monday morning, WWE champion Alberto Del Rio appeared on a local radio station to promote the show.
Del Rio was asked if he will be wrestling tonight – and he responded that he will be doing a segment tonight with WWE Hall of Famer Bret Hart and it “may come to fisticuffs”.

D2D

I love Canadian shows, always a really good crowd at them

rovert

Bizarro World

GTR63

It's been a while since i've know heading into Raw that Kevin Nash won't turn up which is quite comforting. I'd bet everything I own that Bret turns up in the same jean shorts, hitman t-shirt & leather jacket(he'll wear them on Smackdown too).

Podge2k7

Can anyone remind me how last weeks show ended? Thanks:)

DM_7

Podge2k7 wrote: »

Can anyone remind me how last weeks show ended? Thanks:)

8 man elimination tag that Cena (well his team) won and he then fought off a Del Rio attack.

slicus ricus

GTR63 wrote: »

It's been a while since i've know heading into Raw that Kevin Nash won't turn up which is quite comforting.

I wouldn't be so confident! After all, Nash did get into Laurinaitis' limo last week - i smell shenanigans!

Loughc

GTR63 wrote: »

It's been a while since i've know heading into Raw that Kevin Nash won't turn up which is quite comforting. I'd bet everything I own that Bret turns up in the same jean shorts, hitman t-shirt & leather jacket(he'll wear them on Smackdown too).

How did you know what he was going to wear!

Strongbow10

christ bret

cian68

all style no stubstance

Strongbow10

cena is out now to piggy back on brets pop

WWE still desperately trying to get him over

GTR63

lockie1983 wrote: »

How did you know what he was going to wear!

I left out the highway cop glasses.

Eire-Dearg

I enjoyed Cena there

GTR63

Bret & Cena vs ADR & Mort bet the Nfl are shìtting themselves going up against that.

Eire-Dearg

Now's your moment Ricardo, do us proud! I believe in you!

Mr Trade In

been that sort of night again,I don't think I have ever turned off this early,enjoy the rest of Raw Is Bore.

Eire-Dearg

A Champion v Champion match! Wow! Much more at stake than their normal one-on-one match last week, this match actually has a title. Nice twist WWE.

D.Q

good ending segment there, very surprised there was so little activity on here!

Big Daddy Cool

D.Q wrote: »

good ending segment there, very surprised there was so little activity on here!

probably cos most people watching it ended up zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. even the ending was rather blah blah blah, could possibly be the worst raw i can remember heading into a ppv.

Lord TSC

Wow, the topic didn't even make the end of a second page :S

gimmick

As I said before, you can tell whether Raw is worth watching or not by the number of replies here on a Tuesday morning.

On a bords.ie PW forum ratings level, whcih I know Vince covets and treasures, this has to be the worst rating ever.

Machismo Fan

What a crappy, crappy show. Very little worth even half watching. HHH saved that show ending promo at the end but I think it was far too late after they spent ten minutes "shooting" on each other. Shoot style promos does not equal business. It didn't for WCW and it didn't for TNA. If it did TNA would be the biggest company on the planet.

jmolloy

well my internet was down last night, guessing wind related,so wasn't on here

didn't mind raw, last segment was quite good but that was to be expected as for the rest of the show it was a c+ not brilliant but not terrible. Miz and truth had a good interview segment and a decent match with kofi. Sheamus with King was good

DM_7

This board is a genuine reflection of how WWE are doing and this threads lack of activity says WWE have screwed up massively.

D.Q

D.Q wrote: »

good ending segment there, very surprised there was so little activity on here!

I think it's also because a lot have gone back to school/college.

GTR63

I went to bed during the Miz vs Kofi match the way I looked at it was that if they think I want to see Bret Hart wrestle ever again this doesn't deserve my attention. Just read the reports & I don't regret it what was missed Punk calling himself Phil & Triple H Paul what a lame duck of a show.

flahavaj

gimmick wrote: »

As I said before, you can tell whether Raw is worth watching or not by the number of replies here on a Tuesday morning.

On a bords.ie PW forum ratings level, whcih I know Vince covets and treasures, this has to be the worst rating ever.

The Summer of Punk is over it seems.

Machismo Fan

flahavaj wrote: »

The Summer of Punk is over it seems.

It was more of a month or two of Punk really. It was all downhill once Nash was introduced..

Africa

The writers should have been shot. Poor after the initial awesomeness of MITB. I have never seen a show go downhill from such a peak so fast. Granted, it was on a slope for a very long time, but the original storyline must have exploded the ratings. Yet here we are not even 3 months later and its bland.

Think its time for me to stop watching it again... grumble......

In respect to Raw:

• King/Sheamus match was a squash match AGAIN... just being used to get guys over. Dont really see the point.
• Kelly Kelly/bulldog match was just to prop up Swagger/Ziggler, which may become a decent feud.
• Good skit for Truth/Miz, and good match here as well.
• Lack of Ryder who should have been on rolling from his pop last week.
• Tag match with Bret and ricardo... What was the point here!? It was awful. I would have been annoyed seeing that if I was actually there.
• Orton/Rhodes seemed bland for some reason.
• Final skit was good, real back and forth, and was two great personalities in the ring... but it just isnt what it was a few months ago. Ugh to Nash btw. So obvious he'll screw one of them at NoC.
• Oh, and yay for more American crap... ok. Fine. Have it. I was thankful for fast forward.

Lord TSC

RE: Zack Ryder.

This was always my worry about having the brand end. The last two weeks, we've had Randy Orton matches which were simply not that nessecary to the larger scheme of things. The match against Slater was a waste of time, and tonights match was how the one last Friday should have ended. Meanwhile, Ryder gets shoved off the card after being made a big deal of last week

SlickRic

it's fine, just not what it could've been.

either they're thinking REALLY longterm, and Cena is going to come back into this at a later point, or it's a wasted opportunity to push Punk to the stratosphere.

what the fúck is the point in having Punk feud so early with HHH?

Punk got over because he was "shooting" on the system, and Cena is the personification of the system. HHH is not, and Nash is too old for people to remember that he is.

they shot their load on the HHH match way, way too soon, and if anything, it should have been the culmination of the storyline. we're not even used to HHH as COO yet. there should've been months of baiting, HHH screwing Punk over, months of him belligerantly keeping his "guys" on top of Punk; create a real underdog story.

instead we have rushed through bollocks just to get a quick pay off, instead of having the balls to run with a long term build. challenge the writers to keep it interesting, which given Punk's skills, wouldn't be that difficult.

what we have now is fine, because HHH and Punk are good in their roles, but it shouldn't have just been meh.

it should've been THE story.

but, the only way for it to be THE story is for them to risk, or perhaps compromise, Cena's position, which they are just not willing to do.

jaykhunter

hang on, this can't be the live thread?? is this the least watched RAW in a long time? lol

i enjoyed the cena/bret/adr segment and stuff made sense but i lost interest when Cody/RKO came on, since i only watched SmackDown Sunday evening. lots of 'make the champion look weak' as the lead-in. miz/truth i'm a big fan of (do they have a name yet?) but i need quintessentially 80s total babyfaces Air Boom to retain! I would've saved vs miz/truth until down the line, give Air Boom some credibility with other guys first.

THIS IS WHY WE NEED JOBBERS!

Is Bret just Cena from the 90s? If he had a loud pink t-shirt he would be, what with his jean shorts, sneakers and total babyface attitude!

More interested to find out that Otunga actually has a Bachelor's degree in psychology and passed the Bar exam after attending Harvard Law school. I'm very impressed! He must be the smartest guy to become a WWE wrestler (after Chris Nowinski - bachelors in Sociology). It doesn't come across, lol. Charisma vacuum! What happened?!

rovert

Schools are back lads get some perspective.

Lord TSC

I THINK I read that Miz/Truth are being called "The Real Truth" or "The Awesome Truth", or something like that....

Penn

rovert wrote: »

Schools are back lads get some perspective.

Plus with the weather, some people may not have had internet last night. Or electricity at all

Connorzee

i get the feeling they have something else lined up for Punk leading up to WM. Hopefully it involves a Steve Austin return!!

DM_7

rovert wrote: »

Schools are back lads get some perspective.

No,

When RAW has people interested we see a lot more posts before the show is on and a lot more posts the day after.

The lack of activity before RAW in this thread is a genuine indicator of how poor WWE is going.

The biggest indicator of how **** WWE have been at pushing people or storylines properly is that Punk is the only guy with an active thread here. Everyone else is an after thought. Remember the interest in Sheamus a while back, Nexus last year or Miz or recently truth? Nobody really cares now as WWE completly failed to follow through with them and it reading comments about him it looks like they are screwing up Punk too.

the activity in the night of champions thread also tells me about the lack of interest people have in WWE now compared to a few weeks ago.

I defended the whole Nexus thing last year and seeing where Wade and the rest of Nexus are now I was totlally wrong. I refuse to get my hopes up again, hoepfully they turn it around soon but the signs are not good. I am happy enough with Punk but the rest of RAW comes of an unimportant. Its like the build up to Mania all over again, a HHH match and the impending return off the Rock are the only interesting things happening on RAW.

Dwayne to the rescue again....

Hang on i'm wrong again, ryder has an active thread, but he did all the work himself and WWE can't even find a way to get him on RAW.

Charisteas

So am I the only one around here who thought the Phil/Paul promo at the end was frigging amazing? It was gripping from first word to the last and I was hanging off every word. I'm not bothered if shoot promos aren't good for business, i'm not a WWE shareholder, I just want to be entertained. And I was. Besides that, the crowd were hot during this segment so obviously they enjoyed it too. I think this PPV is going to do relatively well due to the Punk/HHH feud.

Hopefully Shredder didn't tear a bicep when he turned off the mics.

Have to say though that when I was watching this morning on my laptop, I decided to listen with earphones for the final segment as I knew the commentators had already finished for the night. Turned the volume up to 100% and it sounded unreal as if I was actually in the arena, could hear the faint echo from the microphone when each guy spoke, really added something to the segment for me.

Charisteas

rovert wrote: »

Schools are back lads get some perspective.

I don't think many here are still in school. When everyone was posting their age in the off topic thread, the majority were between 24-28 years old.

Loughc

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

I THINK I read that Miz/Truth are being called "The Real Truth" or "The Awesome Truth", or something like that....

I heard somewhere they were called The Awesome Truth, for the life of me I can't remember where I read or heard that now tho!

rovert

Charisteas wrote: »

I don't think many here are still in school. When everyone was posting their age in the off topic thread, the majority were between 24-28 years old.

College then :P and evenings are getting darker etc. Not get me wrong they have killed interest greatly but there are other factors at play too.

-Kenny-

rovert wrote: »

College then :P and evenings are getting darker etc. Not get me wrong they have killed interest greatly but there are other factors at play too.

Ah to be fair most lads I know in college would gladly stay up and watch raw and miss a 9am monday morning lecture:D Wasnt watching it myself but cant believe this is the live thread ! :eek: I honestly think it went downhill when Del Rio cashed in, anyway I dont wanna criticise the way the stories go in the WWE (even though I always do :P)

D2D

-Kenny- wrote: »

Ah to be fair most lads I know in college would gladly stay up and watch raw and miss a 9am Tuesday morning lecture:D Wasnt watching it myself but cant believe this is the live thread ! :eek: I honestly think it went downhill when Del Rio cashed in, anyway I dont wanna criticise the way the stories go in the WWE (even though I always do :P)

FYP;)

Bounty Hunter

-Kenny- wrote: »

Ah to be fair most lads I know in college would gladly stay up and watch raw and miss a 9am monday morning lecture:D Wasnt watching it myself but cant believe this is the live thread ! :eek: I honestly think it went downhill when Del Rio cashed in, anyway I dont wanna criticise the way the stories go in the WWE (even though I always do :P)

In an odd way I do think that Del Rio is actually one of the problems. People mostly dont dislike or have a big problem with regards him but they simply dont care about him. Therefore him + Cena = complete apathy for many imo and with the Punk angle loosing steam Raw is suffering.

Its not as easy as this but if the main event title picture was a draw and Punks story was still at the heights oit could be Raw would probably be really good atm because the sub stories are actually improving somewhat imo for example Air Boom vs The Awesome Truth is argueably the most interesting thing on the show imo, though I do think the name air Boom sucks the big one.

DM_7

I agree with that BH. Del Rio is another guy who WWE built up managed to mess it up long before he became Champion. Now he genuinely comes across as just another guy instead of something special.

WWE need to be careful that Tuth and Miz don't end up being cheered. Evan and Kofi are portrayed as bland and as exciting as they are in the ring Miz and Truth will overshadow them. Bring back the Krazy Kofi that wrecked Ortons car and beat him up as MSG. Bourne needs to be allowed give his persona some backbone.

SlickRic

yup, the obsession with getting the title on del Rio was thick.

it succeeded in helping de-rail Punk's steam, while also giving us Cena v generic heel for the 14628th time.

i have high hopes, funnily enough that a month or 2 down the line, that Cena and Punk will interact again, but it was just so stupid to separate them when they did IMO.

they promo'd well together, their matches were great, they were drawing pretty well as far as i was aware.

back in the days gone by, did they separate the likes of HHH and Rock as quickly?

or even Orton and Cena?

i just don't get it at all.

you've a ready made angle that is hot, and is not difficult to keep hot, because the crowd cares for Punk AND Cena, and actually believes Punk is on his level.

and, funnily enough, after the amount of feuds where the Championship is an after-thought, their feud even fits well with the title being the centrepiece!

it just gets more baffling the more you think about it; just how badly they're dropping the ball. the only way it's not fully dropped, is through the fact Punk is awesome, and HHH, for all his flaws, is doing a good job of selling the animosity between them.

Nash was just a dumb move. they obviously wanted a guy who was "manufactured" to step in to that role. but aren't WWE the company who like to think the audience have a 6-month memory span? and we've been treated like that for years? how did they expect the audience to remember, and care, about Kevin Nash, with the aid of zero video packages to build him?

i'd love to be in a WWE Creative meeting to just see what the fúck goes on...

Bounty Hunter

DM-ICE wrote: »

I agree with that BH. Del Rio is another guy who WWE built up managed to mess it up long before he became Champion. Now he genuinely comes across as just another guy instead of something special.

WWE need to be careful that Tuth and Miz don't end up being cheered. Evan and Kofi are portrayed as bland and as exciting as they are in the ring Miz and Truth will overshadow them. Bring back the Krazy Kofi that wrecked Ortons car and beat him up as MSG. Bourne needs to be allowed give his persona some backbone.

Thats true and tbh one of WWEs biggest problems imo if character creation is left up to WWE creative, faces seem to always be very bland. I too would much prefer the Kofi who faced Orton and would fear The Awesome Truth would get pops from the crowd because tbh id be much more likely to cheer for them myself than I would Kofi/Bourne.

wait Bourne has a character.... I musta missed that week of Raw.

Furious-Red

Joey Styles wrote the following on Twitter during tonight’s RAW:

“I’m watching Raw in disbelief as a Mexican Millionaire is wearing a $5 necklace and a Hall of Famer is in $5 Old Navy cargo shorts.”

JP Liz V1

I care more about Riccardo now than Alberto and did Del Rio claim again to have "retired" Edge ffs Edge beat him and his car

Charisteas

A few other pointers I noticed about Raw that may have slipped under the radar-

-Michael Cole and Jerry Lawler making fun of Ricardo Rodriguez using hair gel (Lawler's hair always looks wet so uses product himself, and Michael Cole had N'Sync style highlights in his earlier days)

-Kelly Kelly saying "What did you call me?" and being angry with Vickie because Vickie called her a Barbie (Barbie is actually her real name, short for Barbara)

-We're meant to believe that Ricardo Rodriguez can't do a push-up, amazing considering the impressive mass size of his arms (which the camera was focusing directly on by the way!)

-Phil Brooks - the name really doesn't suit CM Punk does it, then again it's no worse than Paul La Feck

DM_7

I have enjoyed the HHH v Punk thing the last few weeks. It was/is Nashs involvement that has taken something away and made it feel less special. But it still has me interested.

I do wish they could do something with Cena that isn't just him v a random Heel Champion. Del Rio v Cena would be more interesting WITHOUT the Title.