Another Cycle Lane Thread

-Chris-

Mods - Apologies if this doesn't deserve its own thread, do as you wish with it!


I just came across this blog post, I'm wondering what everyone thinks of it...
http://dubbikecommuter.wordpress.com/2011/09/03/unbelievable-and-completely-pointless/

This weeks blog was supposed to be about fall weather, back to school, etc. Maybe it would include a tiny poke at the “summer cyclist” species that goes into hiding during the winter months.

However, today we quite spontaneously decided to pedal over to Rothar. Now this is no small errand since we are coming from Enniskerry. But the weather was improving and we had nothing else on for the day but tidying the house and yard so away we went.

It was a pretty uneventful ride. I took the helmet cam because I know that city center is the best place to get prime examples of inadequate cycle lanes, potholes that take the whole lane, awkward intersections, etc. I wanted to capture these so I could use them to put together a small video.

But to my surprise we had an encounter with someone that I think was a Guard. I’m not sure, but the blue light on his car plus his idea that he knows all there is to know about who has rights to occupy which particular piece of road and how much of that piece of road is allocated to whom let me to believe he was a guard.

I want to apologize in advance about the poor quality of the sound. This is my first experience with my new helmet cam and it didn’t occur to me that I would have to put my head in the car to be able to easily understand what he is saying. Here is a transcript more or less of what was said. I must admit that in some places no matter how loud I made it or how noise-cancelling the headphones, I still couldn’t get word for word. I had to get the main idea and try to infer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqgCol8xhuI

Me: What are you trying to do? Are you trying to hurt me?

Guard: You’re cycling down the middle of the road!

Me: I’m cycling in the bus lane!

Guard: Yeah, what’s the problem?

Me: Because you passed too close! You scared the hell out of me!

Guard: Because you should be cycling close to the curb.

Me: I’m cycling on the left side of the road!

Guard: Yes, but how hard is it to keep to the curb? You were miles away from it riding a bike down the middle of the street.

Me: He STILL scared the hell out of me.

Guard: But you’re still cycling down the middle of the street. He was within his right to take the bus lane.

Me: There’s no point in arguing with me, I mean with you. I mean, what’s the point?

From this point the sound gets very muddled and impossible to interpret even on noise-cancelling headphones, but he carries on to explain to me that the taxi driver was well within his rights to pass that close to me in the bus lane because I was not cycling sufficiently close to the curb and that I as a cyclist I should know to keep to the curb. I don’t have the right to take the road, even if I feel that potholes, broken glass or other obstructions on the left side of the road could be hazardous.

Me: Do you ever cycle on these roads?

Guard: I cycle all the time, yeah.

Simultaneously…

Me: So you would have seen the giant potholes and glass broken everywhere?

Guard: I cycle to work.

Me: I do too, and do you know that I know every pothole and every piece of broken glass on my way to work and back everyday but over here on this side of the city.

Guard: Taxis have every right to use the bus lane.

Me: I don’t care if they use the bus lane! I only care if they are trying to use the same space I’m using!

Guard: That man was kind enough to let you use the lane. You can’t give out on your bike.

>>Most of his speech about bus lanes here is unintelligible.<<

He proceeds to tell me that taxis have the right to use the bus lane and ask:

Guard: Is that right or what?

Me: I don’t know. Is it? It is absurd for you to tell me that I can’t cycle a comfortable space from the curb.

Guard: I didn’t say that. I didn’t say that.

As we cycled away, hubby M and I discussed the reason they stopped in the first place. It is still a mystery. A case of mistaken identity? Were they planning to be much harder on us until they saw the helmet cam? This is our working theory at the moment. You can’t see the other guy in the car but he was very nervous during the whole encounter. So much for thinking that Garda is here to help.

As I understood it then, and after watching the video back dozens of times now, his main point was that the taxi driver had right of way on the bus lane and his secondary point was that we (cyclists) were too far from the curb. So what I understand from that is that the taxi driver had rights and I didn’t. We (cyclists) don’t. Do I have this right?

Now if you watch the video back again, you will notice a few things:

we only had trouble with those two cars (the taxi and the garda car)
all other cars including buses and taxis passed us without incident
there is a line on the road where the cycle lane used to be marked. At all times, we were inside the marked cycle track
Go ahead You know you want to. Watch it again, just for fun. Just to be appalled all over again. See if it is as shocking the 2nd, 3rd or 15th time. Believe you me, it certainly is.

Captain Havoc

That guard was cock.

-Chris-

I wonder how that would have gone if there wasn't a camera involved! :eek:

bikedude

She should report this guys here:

https://www.gardaombudsman.ie/complaints-about-garda-siochana/gsoc-online-complaints-form-db1.asp

The taxi driver and the Garda.

littlejp

bikedude wrote: »

She should report this guys here:

https://www.gardaombudsman.ie/complaints-about-garda-siochana/gsoc-online-complaints-form-db1.asp

The taxi driver and the Garda.

Definitely do this.

galwaycyclist

Wonder if the guy in the taxi is an off duty or retired guard?

BostonB

Theres no defending that kinda driving.

fat bloke

Needlessly and thoughtlessly - although actually I might suspect thoughtfully and deliberately - aggressive overtaking of a cyclist.

Simple as.

Happened to me, well it's happened to me a zillion times, thanks very much to the cement truck who nearly sucked me under his wheels near the blue gardenia, but a particular incident where I managed to catch up with the culprit, he passed super close to me when I was nearly home, and there aren't too many estates up our road, so there was a good chance that he was heading the same way I was - another indicator of stupididy - and lo and behold, I took a short cut to my own gaff, who comes sailing in a minute later? - Mo dhuine!

So I approached him. You can probably write the script -
That pass was needlessly aggressive there wasn't it?
I'm not an aggressive driver. You should've been using the cycle lane.
That's up to me though isn't it, it's not for you to physically enforce with your motor car, you were making a point weren't you?
Blah blah blah, we were both fcukin 30 seconds from home and he had a clear road to overtake if he wanted to:rolleyes:

tomasrojo

Guard: Taxis have every right to use the bus lane.

Me: I don’t care if they use the bus lane! I only care if they are trying to use the same space I’m using!

I'm not sure why there was any argument after that. The guard can't honestly believe the taxi's right to use the bus lane supersedes another road user's right to the preservation of life and limb. If he does, he's very prejudiced or thick.

seamus

They're either young lads taking the piss with a flashing light, or more likely they're not traffic corps, so they're not very familiar with the rules of the road. Rather they thought they could stop and give her an ear bashing on their own interpretation of the law.

While most people and Gardai will be well aware of the main points in terms of road law, outside of the traffic corps many of the Gardai don't know any specifics and instead talk out of their arse, as these two lads have quite neatly demonstrated.

I have had (friendly) debates with non-traffic members over the road traffic act, where they didn't actually know what they were talking about

Of course, the Garda car was well within his rights to pull her over for what he may have considered to be a rude gesture in his direction. So unless he actually did anything dangerous himself, I don't think a complaint to the Garda ombudsman will yield any success.

studiorat

Why do people commute with a friggin' camera on their heads? Are they looking for something to whinge about?

I wonder when the last time she looked behind her was? We don't see that happening on camera.

Surely these cycle lane threads should be in infrastructure or commuting and transport...

seamus

studiorat wrote: »

Why do people commute with a friggin' camera on their heads? Are they looking for something to whinge about?

Well she's blogging, presumably with a "cycling issues" slant, so it makes sense to take footage of places where cycling infrastructure is inadequate.

I wonder when the last time she looked behind her was? We don't see that happening on camera.

How is that relevant? We don't see when the taxi last had an NCT either or whether the Gardai had licences. But how are these relevant things? They are entitled to ride two abreast (presumably they were) and there was plenty of room to overtake safely, so there was no need for them to file in.

Rovi

studiorat wrote: »

Why do people commute with a friggin' camera on their heads? Are they looking for something to whinge about?

This from the original article:

I took the helmet cam because I know that city center is the best place to get prime examples of inadequate cycle lanes, potholes that take the whole lane, awkward intersections, etc. I wanted to capture these so I could use them to put together a small video.

km991148

seamus wrote: »

or more likely they're not traffic corps, so they're not very familiar with the rules of the road. Rather they thought they could stop and give her an ear bashing on their own interpretation of the law.

While most people and Gardai will be well aware of the main points in terms of road law, outside of the traffic corps many of the Gardai don't know any specifics and instead talk out of their arse, as these two lads have quite neatly demonstrated.

Its bad enough the general ignorance demonstrated by road users - but regardless of what division of the force they work in they are professional drivers (as is the taxi driver I guess..!) and should have no excuse. Dont most companies and especially the police ensure that all drivers are put on specialist training to ensure there driving is up to scratch - so even if they are not familiar with the finer points of some of the laws they are upholding - they would at least know the basics of good driving - especially the parts involving common sense (i.e keep more that inches away from other at speed!)..

seamus

Well they're trained alright, but I wouldn't expect someone who's not traffic corps to know all the ins and outs of road traffic law any more than I'd expect someone in the drugs squad to be an expert on computer crime.

But you're right in that a highly trained driver should recognise when another driver has driven dangerously, regardless of what anyone else was doing. If he actually gave a crap about the incident, he would have pulled the taxi driver over straight away. I suspect he was more pissed because he thought the cyclist was giving him the finger.

Dermot Illogical

km991148 wrote: »

Dont most companies and especially the police ensure that all drivers are put on specialist training to ensure there driving is up to scratch .

No. That would cost money. A guard with a full licence can drive official vehicles with authorisation from a chief superintendent.
The one in the video wouldn't last a day on the driving course. Very poor driving.

petethedrummer

studiorat wrote: »

I wonder when the last time she looked behind her was? We don't see that happening on camera.

The cycling portion of this video lasted 24 seconds. Do you look over your shoulder every 24 seconds going down a perfectly sraight road?

cython

seamus wrote: »

They're either young lads taking the piss with a flashing light, or more likely they're not traffic corps, so they're not very familiar with the rules of the road. Rather they thought they could stop and give her an ear bashing on their own interpretation of the law.

While most people and Gardai will be well aware of the main points in terms of road law, outside of the traffic corps many of the Gardai don't know any specifics and instead talk out of their arse, as these two lads have quite neatly demonstrated.

I have had (friendly) debates with non-traffic members over the road traffic act, where they didn't actually know what they were talking about

Of course, the Garda car was well within his rights to pull her over for what he may have considered to be a rude gesture in his direction. So unless he actually did anything dangerous himself, I don't think a complaint to the Garda ombudsman will yield any success.

RT66 wrote: »

No. That would cost money. A guard with a full licence can drive official vehicles with authorisation from a chief superintendent.
The one in the video wouldn't last a day on the driving course. Very poor driving.

This. If you watch the video back again, the (presumed) Garda car actually passed the cyclist even closer than the taxi, so if the taxi's driving was dangerous, then the Garda's was even more so. And if she was pulled over for a gesture, why was no mention made of it afterwards, and the focus instead to tell her (wrongly, IMHO) that she was cycling in an inappropriate manner.

There are definite grounds for a complaint to the Ombudsman here, if the blogger was so inclined, and while I accept that not every Garda may know the ins and outs of laws that they do not find themselves personally enforcing on a day to day basis, they should really learn to STFU unless they are certain that they are right. Otherwise they end up looking like an idiot (especially if there is a helmet cam like here!), and causing needless hassle to people for what is ultimately no good reason. One of these days, hopefully, it might come back to bite some of them in the ass if they wrongly prosecute someone, and that person decides to make an example.

km991148

RT66 wrote: »

No. That would cost money. A guard with a full licence can drive official vehicles with authorisation from a chief superintendent.
The one in the video wouldn't last a day on the driving course. Very poor driving.

Authorisation from the chief super? What does that mean? Is that for general driving? i.e. not emergencies? That cant be right? - sorry going off topic, but eh?

EDIT: so a bit of googling found this for forces over the water

http://www.ukpoliceonline.co.uk/index.php?/topic/24805-police-driver-training/

presumably the cheif super bit means a-b driving and courses are only required for high speed etc? (hopefully at least.. not every cop straight from police college (or like the one in the footage who shows incompetence at traffic speed) can flick on the blues and drive like a maniac!)

Dermot Illogical

km991148 wrote: »

Authorisation from the chief super? What does that mean? Is that for general driving? i.e. not emergencies? That cant be right? - sorry going off topic, but eh?

To drive patrol cars etc. Including emergencies/pursuits/anything..
About 25 years ago it was decided that all gardai should do a driving course in Templemore as part of their initial training. It never happened.
As an Irish solution to an Irish problem, the chief super gives out annual authorisation to those who haven't completed a driving course but do have a full licence. The only exception is someone who has done the driving course and failed. They're grounded.
The result is that a large number of gardai drive official cars without any greater training than anyone who's been to ISM for a brush-up before doing the test.

seamus

cython wrote: »

This. If you watch the video back again, the (presumed) Garda car actually passed the cyclist even closer than the taxi, so if the taxi's driving was dangerous, then the Garda's was even more so. And if she was pulled over for a gesture, why was no mention made of it afterwards, and the focus instead to tell her (wrongly, IMHO) that she was cycling in an inappropriate manner.

Well he didn't stop because she was cycling in the bus lane to be fair. He did stop when she gestured, but rather than ball her out of it for that, he felt like arguing what he thought was his point. Maybe the camera did put some manners on him.

When watching videos where people claim a close overtake, I have real difficutly figuring out scale and placement in the video. In the above video posted, that doesn't actually look like a particularly close pass to me. Closer than the average, but not so close that I would be concerned. But like I say, in a video, distances are much more difficult to discern and both cars may have brushed off her for all I know.

If she thought that the Garda's driving was poor, then a complaint to the ombudsman may be appropriate. She has a video to back it up and everything.
However, in the case of stopping her, I feel it would be a waste of time - the Garda will say that he pulled her over for making a gesture (plainly visible in the video) and the conversation is practically inaudible so either side could make up the conversation between them.

km991148

RT66 wrote: »

To drive patrol cars etc. Including emergencies/pursuits/anything..
About 25 years ago it was decided that all gardai should do a driving course in Templemore as part of their initial training. It never happened.
As an Irish solution to an Irish problem, the chief super gives out annual authorisation to those who haven't completed a driving course but do have a full licence. The only exception is someone who has done the driving course and failed. They're grounded.
The result is that a large number of gardai drive official cars without any greater training than anyone who's been to ISM for a brush-up before doing the test.

Yikes! :eek:

Rew

RT66 wrote: »

To drive patrol cars etc. Including emergencies/pursuits/anything..
About 25 years ago it was decided that all gardai should do a driving course in Templemore as part of their initial training. It never happened.
As an Irish solution to an Irish problem, the chief super gives out annual authorisation to those who haven't completed a driving course but do have a full licence. The only exception is someone who has done the driving course and failed. They're grounded.
The result is that a large number of gardai drive official cars without any greater training than anyone who's been to ISM for a brush-up before doing the test.

Is there not normally a drive with a traffic Sgt before they can get cheifs?

Dermot Illogical

Rew wrote: »

Is there not normally a drive with a traffic Sgt before they can get cheifs?

No.

studiorat

petethedrummer wrote: »

The cycling portion of this video lasted 24 seconds. Do you look over your shoulder every 24 seconds going down a perfectly sraight road?

On that particular stretch, yes, yes I do. And I'd be pretty wary of cycling two abreast along there also.

BostonB

seamus wrote: »

Well he didn't stop because she was cycling in the bus lane to be fair. He did stop when she gestured, but rather than ball her out of it for that, he felt like arguing what he thought was his point. Maybe the camera did put some manners on him....

Kinda suggests he felt the need to look back at the cyclist.

petethedrummer

studiorat wrote: »

On that particular stretch, yes, yes I do. And I'd be pretty wary of cycling two abreast along there also.

Fair enough if you do. I don't look over mine that often. But looking over the shoulder can cause some people to drift out into traffic.

BostonB

Commuting I'd have to look behind a fair bit.

studiorat

petethedrummer wrote: »

Fair enough if you do. I don't look over mine that often. But looking over the shoulder can cause some people to drift out into traffic.

So maybe she did after all...

monument

studiorat wrote: »

On that particular stretch, yes, yes I do. And I'd be pretty wary of cycling two abreast along there also.

Who was cycling two abreast? It only looks like her partner pulled along after she stopped along side the car.

She was cycling in the left side of the lane, but just a bit away from the kerb.

I can see her cycling position fairly well, because that's exactly where I cycle on that road -- when you cycle in further cars and buses try to pass you closers and often within that lane at speed!

Rew

So what if she was in the middle of the bus lane anyway, 2 lanes there no big deal to safely go around

manwithaplan

seamus wrote: »

When watching videos where people claim a close overtake, I have real difficutly figuring out scale and placement in the video. In the above video posted, that doesn't actually look like a particularly close pass to me. Closer than the average, but not so close that I would be concerned. But like I say, in a video, distances are much more difficult to discern and both cars may have brushed off her for all I know.

It didn't look madly close to be honest but, as you say, it's hard to tell. The guard was a gob****e but I, perhaps wrongly, got the impression that she went out on her bike just waiting to be wronged.

I wouldn't be looking over my shoulder on a straight stretch of road when I'm not planning a maneouvre. I suppose I might if I was the outside one of two cycling beside each other.

monument

BTW this is the design the NTA's Cycle Manual suggests for this size of bus lane:



Note the bicycle symbols and the position of cyclists.

studiorat

She didn't see the car coming simple as...

My main issue is the bloody "cycle commuters", whining about something or other. The blog starts off with "I was going to give out about summer cyclists" or some other self-aggrandising rubbish. Then a car drives a bit close and she, with her video camera begins with the indignity.

She should get over herself, people like her give cyclists a worse image than a hundred people running through red lights.

Off to Commuting and Transport or Infrastructure with this thread IMO.

seamus

studiorat wrote: »

She didn't see the car coming simple as...

...and? Are you trying to say that she has a duty to watch out for cars behind her and pull in if they get too close?

Or are you just trying to say that she got a fright and went OTT about it?

monument

studiorat wrote: »

She didn't see the car coming simple as...

My main issue is the bloody "cycle commuters", whining about something or other. The blog starts off with "I was going to give out about summer cyclists" or some other self-aggrandising rubbish. Then a car drives a bit close and she, with her video camera begins with the indignity.

She should get over herself, people like her give cyclists a worse image than a hundred people running through red lights.

Off to Commuting and Transport or Infrastructure with this thread IMO.

What exactly is your point about her not seeing the cars coming?

The start of the blog seems like a bit for humour.

A garda overtook her dangerously and she should "get over herself"?

This section of boards isn't just for sports related topics. In threads that come up ever so often, the bulk of people keep disagreeing with suggestions to have a commuting cycling board.

coolbeans

studiorat wrote: »

She didn't see the car coming simple as...

My main issue is the bloody "cycle commuters", whining about something or other. The blog starts off with "I was going to give out about summer cyclists" or some other self-aggrandising rubbish. Then a car drives a bit close and she, with her video camera begins with the indignity.

She should get over herself, people like her give cyclists a worse image than a hundred people running through red lights.

Off to Commuting and Transport or Infrastructure with this thread IMO.

You're talking some load of ****e in fairness to you. Cyclist wasn't given adequate room and you set out to find an extremely tenuous reason to blame her when any fool can see that they were quite clearly buzzed by the taxi and the cops. If you look at the video right through you'll note the 5-O giving the cyclist an appropriately wide berth when passing the second time. I wonder why that was?

Also, these issues affect all cyclists including roadies. I think you're just tired of reading any thread that doesn't refer to the TdeF or Lance. If I'm out training and this kinda thing happens I think I'm entitled to a little indignation and I'll write about it in the cycling thread. Cycling isn't tennis you know. It's much more than just a sport even to those of us who find themselves cycling exclusively for recreation. These issues affect us all.

HivemindXX

I've not watched the video but from the description it appears that this is an example of a driver who thinks cyclists are allowed on the road as some sort of favour from motorists and not as a right.

A guard shouldn't have that attitude and in an ideal world he'd be pulled up on it.

studiorat

monument wrote: »

What exactly is your point about her not seeing the cars coming?

The start of the blog seems like a bit for humour.

A garda overtook her dangerously and she should "get over herself"?

This section of boards isn't just for sports related topics. In treads that come up ever so often, the bulk of people keep disagreeing with suggestions to have a commuting cycling board.

No doubt it was an attempt at humor, but like I said, loaded with self importance.

She was taken by surprise and she blames the driver, it happens to everyone who cycles. As another poster mentioned already she looked like she was out looking to be wronged.

Sometimes I wonder do people like her even enjoy cycling.

monument

studiorat wrote: »

She was taken by surprise and she blames the driver, it happens to everyone who cycles.

No. The problem isn't her surprise, it's the drivers passing her out far too closely.

studiorat wrote: »

As another poster mentioned already she looked like she was out looking to be wronged.

Why? Because she has a camera?

Or because she's cycling in a way advance cycling training says to? Backed by advice by our Department of Transport, the NTA's cycle manual, and the UK cycling training standard.

studiorat wrote: »

Sometimes I wonder do people like her even enjoy cycling.

Yes, I'm sure she does enjoy cycling, but that doesn't mean

Bunnyhopper

seamus wrote: »

Well he didn't stop because she was cycling in the bus lane to be fair. He did stop when she gestured,

I think he stopped when he looked in the mirror and saw that his attempt at intimidating her with his car hadn't worked.

CramCycle

The garda was far closer than the taxi (you can tell by the line taken by their wheels). It wouldn't have bothered me but I think she is right about both cars being to close. I'm just used to it on my route, suppose I shouldn't be but I am, so these things get ignored by me.

Also I thought the Garda pulled over because she raises her hand after he nearly hits her, not because of anything done to the taxi (her hand goes up after the boys in blue zip along). (No sound in work so maybe something else happens).

Also I don't think she is out to get "wronged", as someone else mentioned she looks to document potholes/dangerous intersections on her cycle. Having a camera on her head didn't invite the situation, it just gave her the chance to record it. Nothing wrong with that.

ThisRegard

The passenger looks a little sheepish alright, probably embarrassed for the driver. And as others have said, I reckon he was going to be a right smart arse until he saw the camera.

Fantasminha

Hello! I'm really surprised at the amount of "airplay" my little video has gotten. I have to say that I never imagined more than 50 people total would view it!

I am not a particularly "talented" rider. Someone recently said that anyone can be a fast rider in pretty short order but to be a "good" rider takes years. I'm still working on it. My best tool is persistance.

For that reason, I don't like for people to ride beside me. If I am climbing some painful hill or if the road gets too rough, I'm afraid I will wobble and bump into them. It's the reason I can't join a riding club (as much as I think I would enjoy it). My husband knows how nervous I get so he doesn't even bother to try to ride beside me anymore. So to answer one question: he was riding about half a bike length behind me. Both of us were in what looks like it had been previously marked as a bike lane.

For the question as to why I didn't turn my head to see the car coming, I have a small mirror on my helmet. Again, this is because I'm not particularly "talented". Competent, but not great. The good thing of the mirror is that you can see what is coming up behind you but the drawback is that sometimes distances get distorted, which is what happened here. I didn't notice that they were coming so far into the lane that I was already occupying.

Yes, I LOVE my bikes - all of them! We use our bikes for everything: commuting to work, running errands, and grocery shopping. Just because I will never be able to ride without both hands firmly on the handlebars shouldn't preclude me from having a safe spot on the road, and wanting to use it!

The rude gesture to the Garda was shaking my fist. It is the reason I won't pursue any kind of action with the Garda. I don't want the discussion of safe passing distance to be derailed by the totally irrelavant gesture.

BTW, the "poke" at summer cyclists was humor. I plan to discuss fall and winter cycling in future blogs: dangers of wet leaves, condensation on manhole covers, the reflective paint on the road, etc.

Thanks everyone for the support. I'm overwhelmed.

-Chris-

Welcome!

monument

The lines within the combined bus / cycle lane are parking markings which likely predate the lane. Out of the bus lanes hours, it still reverts to parking.

galwaycyclist

petethedrummer wrote: »

The cycling portion of this video lasted 24 seconds. Do you look over your shoulder every 24 seconds going down a perfectly sraight road?

Yes its called checking your six and it should be done on a regular basis when being followed by motor traffic. Particularly in a restricted space situation. If I feel following traffic is coming up too fast I might even throw in the odd small wobble or swerve if I have space.

It keeps them on their toes it sends a message that this is not just some "cyclist" who I can skim past but a person on a bike who might do something.

galwaycyclist

Oh yea and it was crass driving I was wounded once by a taxi that hit me with a wing mirror in one of the Drumcondra bus lanes

littlejp

galwaycyclist wrote: »

petethedrummer wrote: »

The cycling portion of this video lasted 24 seconds. Do you look over your shoulder every 24 seconds going down a perfectly sraight road?

Yes its called checking your six and it should be done on a regular basis when being followed by motor traffic. Particularly in a restricted space situation. If I feel following traffic is coming up too fast I might even throw in the odd small wobble or swerve if I have space.

It keeps them on their toes it sends a message that this is not just some "cyclist" who I can skim past but a person on a bike who might do something.

You look over your shoulder twice a minute?
You should get a wing mirror if you're that concerned about what's behind you.

CramCycle

littlejp wrote: »

You look over your shoulder twice a minute?
You should get a wing mirror if you're that concerned about what's behind you.

Your meant to look in your rear view mirrors in a car every 15 seconds (according to the test). Most people would cover a lot of ground in 30 seconds or at the very least the scenery behind them can change quite alot, I'd say 30 seconds is a minimum while in a built up area, I never thought about it before but I probably look behind me alot more while cyclng in town as its less than 30 between lights and then changing lanes, watching for turning traffic coming up on you, looking out for ambulances/gardai/firemen (don't always have the siren on) etc. Giving a guess, I'd say its closer to 10seconds in town out of habit rather than force of will.

Wertz

Fantasminha wrote: »

The rude gesture to the Garda was shaking my fist. It is the reason I won't pursue any kind of action with the Garda. I don't want the discussion of safe passing distance to be derailed by the totally irrelavant gesture.

I wouldn't for a minute let that stop me from making a complaint. It's as you say irrelevant...chances are the car wouldn't even have stopped if you hadn't waved your fist. In your situation it was completely understandable.
A ruder gesture too would have been understandable.