Golden Vs White-Tailed Eagles

whyulittle

I was just reading on the BWI site that Golden Eagles are red-listed in Ireland, while the WTE are green-listed.

Justs seems strange that their status is different as they have both only been re-introduced into single areas, and if anything, the Goldens have already started to breed.

And on another note, they are twice the size of Buzzards?! :eek: Having only seen photos, I always just assumed they were about the same size.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Have you a link to where they state the WTE is green listed. It should not be Red listed as it's not yet classed as having an Irish population.

whyulittle

BWI wrote:

Conservation Concern: Green-listed in Ireland. The European population has been evaluated as Rare, as there are currently less than 10,000 pairs breeding in Europe. Suffered large declines due to persecution and use of pesticides, but key populations in Europe are increasing. In Ireland, several re-introduced birds have been found dead due to ingestion of poisoned baits.

http://www.birdwatchireland.ie/IrelandsBirds/Raptors/WhitetailedEagle/tabid/1153/Default.aspx

It wasn't me!

Saw one of the white tailed sea eagles in Kerry last year while deer hunting. Definitely an order of magnitude bigger than a buzzard. Stunning. Fantastic half hour we spent sharing the same clearing as him before he left. The one day I left the camera at home as well. Would have gotten some stunning shots as he took off and wheeled above us.

trebor28

whyulittle wrote: »

And on another note, they are twice the size of Buzzards?! :eek: Having only seen photos, I always just assumed they were about the same size.

yeah i remember the first time i saw a Buzzard, was thinking this lad could probably lift me clean off the ground.:eek:

i'd probably get a right fright seeing a WTSE or GE up close and personal they are that big!

LostCovey

Danielle Green Fir wrote: »

Have you a link to where they state the WTE is green listed. It should not be Red listed as it's not yet classed as having an Irish population.

Hi Danielle Green Fir,

This listing whyulittle has linked, where the WTE is green-listed and the GE is red-listed, reflects their European status - neither species is well enough established in Ireland to have a conservation status here - virtually all the stock is reintroduced birds (a few Golden Eagles have been hatched here)

LostCovey

Kess73

trebor28 wrote: »

yeah i remember the first time i saw a Buzzard, was thinking this lad could probably lift me clean off the ground.:eek:

i'd probably get a right fright seeing a WTSE or GE up close and personal they are that big!

You should go to the Bird of Prey centre at Aillwee caves. They have a beautiful sea eagle there and you can stand mere feet away to really take in it's size and sense of power.


They do excellent flying displays with a range of different raptors used in each display.

I would also recommend their hawk walk to anyone with an interest in raptors or nature in general. The Hawk walk costs €70 but you get paired with a Harris hawk and you go through the woodlands with him/her (depending on which bird you get) and you get to watch your bird up close and personal and watch it leave and return to you over and over.

LostCovey

Kess73 wrote: »

You should go to the Bird of Prey centre at Aillwee caves. They have a beautiful sea eagle there and you can stand mere feet away to really take in it's size and sense of power.


They do excellent flying displays with a range of different raptors used in each display.

I would also recommend their hawk walk to anyone with an interest in raptors or nature in general. The Hawk walk costs €70 but you get paired with a Harris hawk and you go through the woodlands with him/her (depending on which bird you get) and you get to watch your bird up close and personal and watch it leave and return to you over and over.

These places are not for everyone Kess.

I prefer my wildlife wild, and seeing unfortunate captives in zoos leaves me cold, and a bit uncomfortable.

Same with the idea that Irish falconers get to run a lottery under the auspices of the NPWS to take wild peregrines into captivity every year.

And falconry setups where people pay to walk around with a captive hawk on their arm seems like a very odd way to spend 70 yoyos. very Celtic Tiger.

I know not everyone feels like this, which is why these place keep their doors open - they are clearly getting paying customers.

They make me feel sad though, and I have tried to visit one with an open mind very recently. These wild creatures of the open skies tethered to posts to be gawped at were quite distressing to see.

LostCovey

Kess73

LostCovey wrote: »

These places are not for everyone Kess.

I prefer my wildlife wild, and seeing unfortunate captives in zoos leaves me cold, and a bit uncomfortable.

Same with the idea that Irish falconers get to run a lottery under the auspices of the NPWS to take wild peregrines into captivity every year.

And falconry setups where people pay to walk around with a captive hawk on their arm seems like a very odd way to spend 70 yoyos. very Celtic Tiger.

I know not everyone feels like this, which is why these place keep their doors open - they are clearly getting paying customers.

They make me feel sad though, and I have tried to visit one with an open mind very recently. These wild creatures of the open skies tethered to posts to be gawped at were quite distressing to see.

LostCovey

The Aillwee centre have breeding pairs on site which help raise the numbers for release programmes, and they are actively involved in the White Tailed Sea Eagle release/reintroduction programme as well as the programmes for Red Kites and Golden Eagles.

The team there do their best to give genuine facts and details during shows and between shows they mingle with the visitors passing on knowledge and info. They also educate people on the release programme and on the setbacks that have happened.


I agree that it is not always nice to see birds in enclosed spaces, but in some cases the negatives are far outweighed by the positives, as I firmly believe is the case at Aillwee. I have been lucky enough to be there outside of visitor hours and have seen various species get their out of pen time in which they get to roam the surrounding countryside and hunt. Have also seen how well conditioned the birds are there and once was there when one of the larger birds of prey came back from the nearby hills with a freshly killed feral cat.

In an ideal world all of the birds of prey would be free and living wild, but we don't have that ideal world, and in Ireland we have a hell of a lot of ignorance towards nature in general with many species simply not being given a fair chance to survive without man trying to kill them.

I don't generally like zoos and raptor centres and like you I prefer my wildlife to be wild,, but as I stated earlier, the Aillwee birds of prey centre is a lot more than simply a cash cow that makes money on the back of captive birds, it is a centre that is involved in trying to make a real difference in raptor numbers in this country and has people there who are truly excellent in their fields of work, so on that basis it is one of the few centres in Ireland that I would recommend to people to go visit and spend money at.

LostCovey

Kess73 wrote: »

The Aillwee centre have breeding pairs on site which help raise the numbers for release programmes, and they are actively involved in the White Tailed Sea Eagle release/reintroduction programme as well as the programmes for Red Kites and Golden Eagles.

What is their involvement in the reintroduction Kess?


The Golden Eagle Trust have been responsible for these reintroductions, and they make no mention whatever of the Aillwee Centre on their website www.goldeneagle.ie

LC

Mickeroo

Was lucky enough to see a Golden Eagle near my home in Achill christmas before last. I nearly put my van off the road trying to keep an eye on it! It was very high up on the thermals and looked too big to be anything I would usually see around the place like a Raven so I reported it on the trust's website, they confirmed it,so must have had a tracking device on it. Always wanted to see Eagles in Ireland when I was a kid, never thought I'd see the day

Kess73

LostCovey wrote: »

What is their involvement in the reintroduction Kess?


The Golden Eagle Trust have been responsible for these reintroductions, and they make no mention whatever of the Aillwee Centre on their website www.goldeneagle.ie

LC

I said they are involved with release and reintroduction programmes as in affiliated with them and involved in the breeding process for some species, I did not say that they were the ones responsible for the programmes.


They have people on their team that work with the programmes here in Ireland and abroad.

They also have a brilliant volunteer programme where people can go and be trained on the basics of bird handling, feeding etc which also includes a very good look at the set up in terms of the breeding process that takes place there for a number of species.


I know members of their team have been involved in the releasing and recording of information in Wicklow as part of the Red Kite Reintroduction project 2011 and that they were there at the asking of the Golden Eagle Trust. They also were involved in the rearing of red kite chicks in the UK as part of the Red Kite reintroduction programme.


They have had similar involvement with the sea eagle reintroduction programme and have had involvement with similar programmes abroad in both Europe and South America.


The two best men to give info on the work they do and who they are affiliated with would probably be Ben or James at the centre. Both are very easy to talk to and I would imagine both would have no problem telling you who the centre is affiliated with. I know that the website mentions what programmes the centre is affiliated with, but I have put the work emails of both below if you would like more details, or better yet if you are ever in Clare you should go to the centre and have a look at the birds and chat to those working there as they are great for chatting to members of the public and for explaining what they do.


ben@birdofpreycentre.com
James@birdofpreycentre.com

LostCovey

Kess73 wrote: »

I said they are involved with release and reintroduction programmes as in affiliated with them and involved in the breeding process for some species, I did not say that they were the ones responsible for the programmes.


They have people on their team that work with the programmes here in Ireland and abroad.

They also have a brilliant volunteer programme where people can go and be trained on the basics of bird handling, feeding etc which also includes a very good look at the set up in terms of the breeding process that takes place there for a number of species.


I know members of their team have been involved in the releasing and recording of information in Wicklow as part of the Red Kite Reintroduction project 2011 and that they were there at the asking of the Golden Eagle Trust. They also were involved in the rearing of red kite chicks in the UK as part of the Red Kite reintroduction programme.


They have had similar involvement with the sea eagle reintroduction programme and have had involvement with similar programmes abroad in both Europe and South America.


The two best men to give info on the work they do and who they are affiliated with would probably be Ben or James at the centre. Both are very easy to talk to and I would imagine both would have no problem telling you who the centre is affiliated with. I know that the website mentions what programmes the centre is affiliated with, but I have put the work emails of both below if you would like more details, or better yet if you are ever in Clare you should go to the centre and have a look at the birds and chat to those working there as they are great for chatting to members of the public and for explaining what they do.


ben@birdofpreycentre.com
James@birdofpreycentre.com

I am not sure what 'affiliated' means.

Personnel from the Ailwee falconry centre may have been invited to releases, like a lot of people with an interest in birds of prey, as guests.

I do not believe they had anything to do with the reintroductions here or with the Golden Eagle Trust.

There were no Red Kites reared in England for the Irish reintroductions.

It's not a big issue, but its worth clarifying.

People who are charging the public to see captive birds of prey have a very different agenda to the Golden Eagle Trust and the Irish wild raptor reintroduction programme, and I don't think it is helpful to suggest they are connected, when they really aren't.

I do not believe that these falconry centres have ever reintroduced any bird anywhere, apart from accidental Goshawk escapes! They occasionally rehabilitate wild birds (and fair play to them for that), but they do tend to suggest an enlarged role for themselves in other programmes, with no basis for that.

I don't think it's fair to the people in the Golden Eagle Trust, who have achieved a lot against the odds. Credit where it's due.

LostCovey

LostCovey

Sorry to labour the point, but this is what the Golden Eagle Trust's website lists as supporting organisations for the various programmes.

There is no 'affiliation' with any commercial falconry operation.

LostCovey


White-tailed Eagle

The White-tailed Sea Eagle Reintroduction Programme is managed by the Golden Eagle Trust Limited in partnership with the National Parks and Wildlife Service of the Dept. of Environment, Heritage and Local Government in Ireland and in collaboration with Prosjekt Havørn, the Norwegian Institute for Nature Research and the Directorate for Nature Management in Norway.

The programme seeks to reestablish a viable self-sustaining breeding population of sea eagles in south-west Ireland after an absence of 110 years.

The main financial sponsors are
the Dept. of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government
Killarney Town Council
Killarney Chamber of Commerce & Tourism
Liebherr Ltd, Killarney
The Heritage Council
The Lake Hotel, Killarney

Red Kite

The Red Kite Reintroduction Project is managed by the Golden Eagle Trust Limited in partnership with the National Parks and Wildlife Service of the Dept. of Environment, Heritage and Local Government and the Welsh Kite Trust.

The programme seeks to reestablish a viable self-sustaining breeding population of red kites in the east Ireland after an absence of over 200 years.

The main financial sponsors of the Red Kite Project are
the Dept. of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government
the Heritage Council

We would also like to acknowledge the support of Coillte, KPMG and Greenstar Ireland.

GOLDEN EAGLE
The Golden Eagle Reintroduction Project is managed by the Golden Eagle Trust Limited in partnership with the National Parks and Wildlife Service of the Department of Environment, Heritage and Local Government.

The programme seeks to reestablish a viable self-sustaining breeding population of golden eagles in north-west Ireland after an absence of almost 100 years.

The main financial Sponsors of the Golden Eagle Reintroduction Project are
The Department of Environment, Heritage and Local Government
EU LIFE Nature funding
The Heritage Council
The National Millennium Committee
We would also to acknowledge funding and sponsorship in kind from
KPMG
Údarás na Gaeltachta
Bank of Ireland
DID Electric

Kess73

There were no Red Kites reared in England for the Irish reintroductions.

Point out where I said that English reared Red Kites were used for Irish reintroductions. I said no such thing, that is from your mouth. I said that James was involved in the rearing and release of Red Kites in the UK (specifically Wales)as part of the Red Kite reintroduction programme 2011, and that he was involved in record taking and release in Wicklow as part of the Red Kite reintroduction programme 2011. I never said it was English bird being released in Ireland.

People who are charging the public to see captive birds of prey have a very different agenda to the Golden Eagle Trust and the Irish wild raptor reintroduction programme, and I don't think it is helpful to suggest they are connected, when they really aren't.

I am very sure that there would have been a very strong objection if the bird of prey centre had a fake list of affiliations on their website and in the centre itself. Especially given that RTE also ran with the same information some time back when they did a piece on the centre.

I do not believe that these falconry centres have ever reintroduced any bird anywhere, apart from accidental Goshawk escapes! They occasionally rehabilitate wild birds (and fair play to them for that), but they do tend to suggest an enlarged role for themselves in other programmes, with no basis for that.

I gave you two current email addresses that you could have contacted and found out more about the breeding process and what work gets done. If you want to simply write it off with a churlish remark about goshawk escapes, then knock yourself out. Have you ever even been in the centre itself to make the comments you have on it? You might not think they are doing good work but I have seen it first hand and respect the work they do and the knowledge and passion of the people there.

I don't think it's fair to the people in the Golden Eagle Trust, who have achieved a lot against the odds. Credit where it's due.

Not once have I tried to belittle the great work that the GE Trust do, nor have I tried to suggest that anyone of the many different organisation affiliated with them do more that the GE Trust itself. Feel free to point out where I said whatever you claim was not fair of me to say about the people in the GE Trust.

Kess73

LostCovey wrote: »

Sorry to labour the point, but this is what the Golden Eagle Trust's website lists as supporting organisations for the various programmes.

There is no 'affiliation' with any commercial falconry operation.

LostCovey


White-tailed Eagle

The White-tailed Sea Eagle Reintroduction Programme is managed by the Golden Eagle Trust Limited in partnership with the National Parks and Wildlife Service of the Dept. of Environment, Heritage and Local Government in Ireland and in collaboration with Prosjekt Havørn, the Norwegian Institute for Nature Research and the Directorate for Nature Management in Norway.

The programme seeks to reestablish a viable self-sustaining breeding population of sea eagles in south-west Ireland after an absence of 110 years.

The main financial sponsors are
the Dept. of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government
Killarney Town Council
Killarney Chamber of Commerce & Tourism
Liebherr Ltd, Killarney
The Heritage Council
The Lake Hotel, Killarney

Red Kite

The Red Kite Reintroduction Project is managed by the Golden Eagle Trust Limited in partnership with the National Parks and Wildlife Service of the Dept. of Environment, Heritage and Local Government and the Welsh Kite Trust.

The programme seeks to reestablish a viable self-sustaining breeding population of red kites in the east Ireland after an absence of over 200 years.

The main financial sponsors of the Red Kite Project are
the Dept. of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government
the Heritage Council

We would also like to acknowledge the support of Coillte, KPMG and Greenstar Ireland.

GOLDEN EAGLE
The Golden Eagle Reintroduction Project is managed by the Golden Eagle Trust Limited in partnership with the National Parks and Wildlife Service of the Department of Environment, Heritage and Local Government.

The programme seeks to reestablish a viable self-sustaining breeding population of golden eagles in north-west Ireland after an absence of almost 100 years.

The main financial Sponsors of the Golden Eagle Reintroduction Project are
The Department of Environment, Heritage and Local Government
EU LIFE Nature funding
The Heritage Council
The National Millennium Committee
We would also to acknowledge funding and sponsorship in kind from
KPMG
Údarás na Gaeltachta
Bank of Ireland
DID Electric

You have put up a list of financial sponsors there, so not sure what your point is as I mentioned nothing about the centre being a financial sponsor in any way or form.

LostCovey

Kess73 wrote: »

You have put up a list of financial sponsors there, so not sure what your point is as I mentioned nothing about the centre being a financial sponsor in any way or form.

Kess,

There is no need to get upset about this. I have no axe to grind with you, but I do not want the Irish raptor reintroductions to be associated with commercial falconry, when there is no connection whatsoever.

I am sorry I typed England instead of UK. Total error on my part, so can I clarify: There have been no Red Kites reared in England, Wales, Scotland or anywhere in the UK for the Irish schemes, the birds have been taken from nests in the UK under permit and reared & released in Ireland.

LostCovey

Kess73

LostCovey wrote: »

Kess,

There is no need to get upset about this. I have no axe to grind with you, but I do not want the Irish raptor reintroductions to be associated with commercial falconry, when there is no connection whatsoever.

I am sorry I typed England instead of UK. Total error on my part, so can I clarify: There have been no Red Kites reared in England, Wales, Scotland or anywhere in the UK for the Irish schemes, the birds have been taken from nests in the UK under permit and reared & released in Ireland.

LostCovey

I never claimed that any UK reared birds were used for the Irish scheme. Yet you have come back to this point a second time. I clearly stated what was being done in Wales (the rearing and release of birds there) and what was being done in Wicklow (recording of released birds) and that they were two seperate things but both were part of the Red Kite reintroduction programme 2011 which as I am sure you know is being run in more than just Ireland.


You say there is no connection whatsover and you think that is 100% correct, well then I suggest you report the fact that both the centre itself and it's website have signage clearly stating that it is affiliated with the sea eagle programme and the red kite programme. If it is being claimed on totally false grounds I am sure it will be taken down quickly.

I have no problem if you want to claim that there is no affiliation at all in any way between the centre and any of the irish release programmes that are being done on a national level. You think I am wrong to beleive there is an affiliation, and I simply think you are wrong.

We might differ in our thinking/belief on this one topic, but I am pretty sure that in terms of the bigger picture with regards to Irish raptors and the reintroduction of raptors in Ireland that we will agree on the importance of
the release/reintroduction schemes, and also in our passion for raptors and wildlife in general.

Failing that I can get us the use of a ring and get you a pair of gloves to join me in that ring.

LostCovey

Kess73 wrote: »

We might differ in our thinking/belief on this one topic, but I am pretty sure that in terms of the bigger picture with regards to Irish raptors and the reintroduction of raptors in Ireland that we will agree on the importance of
the release/reintroduction schemes, and also in our passion for raptors and wildlife in general.

Failing that I can get us the use of a ring and get you a pair of gloves to join me in that ring.

I think we'll manage without the gloves!

Anyway here's some evidence of interaction between the two initiatives!

http://www.clarechampion.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2850:experts-stunned-by-eagle-encounter-over-aillwee&catid=67:human-interest&Itemid=60

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Just to be perfectly clear. None of the commercial falconry centre are involved in the re-introduction programmes.

greeneyedspirit

Danielle Green Fir wrote: »

Just to be perfectly clear. None of the commercial falconry centre are involved in the re-introduction programmes.

Well... involved, what does involved mean? Taking the aforementioned Burren Birds of Prey centre, they have provided funding for a satellite backpack for one WTE and one for a red kite. Also, one of their falconers has been over in Wales to help collect red kite chicks with the team from the Golden Eagle Trust... does that not count as 'involved'?

Kess73

greeneyedspirit wrote: »

Well... involved, what does involved mean? Taking the aforementioned Burren Birds of Prey centre, they have provided funding for a satellite backpack for one WTE and one for a red kite. Also, one of their falconers has been over in Wales to help collect red kite chicks with the team from the Golden Eagle Trust... does that not count as 'involved'?

That was James. I mentioned it already in the thread. Same guy was also invited by the GE Trust to be involved in some of the red kite recording work in Wicklow.

LostCovey

GreeneyedSpirit wrote:

Well... involved, what does involved mean? Taking the aforementioned Burren Birds of Prey centre, they have provided funding for a satellite backpack for one WTE and one for a red kite. Also, one of their falconers has been over in Wales to help collect red kite chicks with the team from the Golden Eagle Trust... does that not count as 'involved'?

Kess that is rather different to what you said at the outset:

Kess73 wrote: »

The Aillwee centre have breeding pairs on site which help raise the numbers for release programmes, and they are actively involved in the White Tailed Sea Eagle release/reintroduction programme as well as the programmes for Red Kites and Golden Eagles.

Ok Kess, but what does that mean ? Anyone who pays their taxes has "provided funding" for a satellite back-pack.

However if the Aillwee Centre has sponsored a satellite tag, which costs several thousand to buy and hundreds/thousands per year to run, then that is an admirable contribution, if its two, then that is a substantial contribution and the Golden Eagle Trust should acknowledge that on their website.

I took issue with your initial message that suggested the Aillwee Centre was breeding birds of prey for release as part of the scheme, and that is not the case. The Irish reintroduction scheme is based on wild birds from the UK and Norway.

LostCovey

greeneyedspirit

Kess73 wrote: »

That was James. I mentioned it already in the thread. Same guy was also invited by the GE Trust to be involved in some of the red kite recording work in Wicklow.

Yup, I know that volunteer programme you mentioned? I'm one of them talked to a guy yesterday that is going to put up owl nest boxes after visiting the centre. and if that comes out of seeing the birds there, and learning about them, then that's a good thing in my books.

greeneyedspirit

LostCovey wrote: »

Kess that is rather different to what you said at the outset:




Ok Kess, but what does that mean ? Anyone who pays their taxes has "provided funding" for a satellite back-pack.

However if the Aillwee Centre has sponsored a satellite tag, which costs several thousand to buy and hundreds/thousands per year to run, then that is an admirable contribution, if its two, then that is a substantial contribution and the Golden Eagle Trust should acknowledge that on their website.

I took issue with your initial message that suggested the Aillwee Centre was breeding birds of prey for release as part of the scheme, and that is not the case. The Irish reintroduction scheme is based on wild birds from the UK and Norway.

LostCovey

that first quote wasn't Kess at all, but me
To be honest, I would say given the lack of information from the government about these reintroduction programmes, the centre is doing a fantastic job in educating people, and that's such an important part of the entire project. During almost every flying display, people are asked who's Irish and who knows about the three reintroduction programmes going on at the moment. Very few hands are raised. People just don't know about them! If they come away from the centre having met Sika the sea eagle up close(ish), with new appreciation of these beautiful birds, and a newfound interest in birds of prey, then that can only be good, no?

LostCovey

greeneyedspirit wrote: »

that first quote wasn't Kess at all, but me
To be honest, I would say given the lack of information from the government about these reintroduction programmes, the centre is doing a fantastic job in educating people, and that's such an important part of the entire project. During almost every flying display, people are asked who's Irish and who knows about the three reintroduction programmes going on at the moment. Very few hands are raised. People just don't know about them! If they come away from the centre having met Sika the sea eagle up close(ish), with new appreciation of these beautiful birds, and a newfound interest in birds of prey, then that can only be good, no?

Yes, these are some benefits from educating the public about wildlife, and captive wildlife have been used for that purpose for centuries, and I recognise that.

However I personally don't believe that wild raptors belong in captivity, and I know I am not alone in that, but I recognise that other feel differently. I do not believe the benefits that accrue are proportionate to the price that these birds pay, and I feel the same about zoos. I also strongly resent the fact that the Irish Government, through the NPWS runs an annual lottery for falconers to win the right to take wild Peregrines from the nest.

This extensive chain of correspondence, which is close to being off-topic, would never have arisen if Kess had said the falconry centre at Ailwee educates people about reintroductions and has sponsored satellite tags for two species.

LostCovey

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

I too was referring to the comment that a falconry centre was breeding birds for release. I was not referring to personnel from these centres assisting in their private capacities.

As for

I would say given the lack of information from the government about these reintroduction programmes

I can't agree with that. I visited a falconry centre (large well known one but I'll not name it) non-Native birds were the order of the day. The guy knew nothing of the natural history of the birds (only about falconry). Even referred twice to our Swallows heading back to Mexico! Hawks need "terminals" to soar and the Vulture followed sick Caribou! Everthing was about the force and speed of the birds but was greatly exaggerated.
I actually think the info on the various programmes has been very good. I have met many people with little interest in wildlife who were well versed in them from media reports. The websites also get a lot of traffic.
I must confess to having a problem with the concept of Falconry Centres and much prefer to see my raptors in the wild.

Kess73

LostCovey wrote: »

Kess that is rather different to what you said at the outset:




Ok Kess, but what does that mean ? Anyone who pays their taxes has "provided funding" for a satellite back-pack.

However if the Aillwee Centre has sponsored a satellite tag, which costs several thousand to buy and hundreds/thousands per year to run, then that is an admirable contribution, if its two, then that is a substantial contribution and the Golden Eagle Trust should acknowledge that on their website.

I took issue with your initial message that suggested the Aillwee Centre was breeding birds of prey for release as part of the scheme, and that is not the case. The Irish reintroduction scheme is based on wild birds from the UK and Norway.

LostCovey

I said nothing about the sat packs so why are you asking me?

Kess73

Danielle Green Fir wrote: »

I too was referring to the comment that a falconry centre was breeding birds for release. I was not referring to personnel from these centres assisting in their private capacities.

As for I can't agree with that. I visited a falconry centre (large well known one but I'll not name it) non-Native birds were the order of the day. The guy knew nothing of the natural history of the birds (only about falconry). Even referred twice to our Swallows heading back to Mexico! Hawks need "terminals" to soar and the Vulture followed sick Caribou! Everthing was about the force and speed of the birds but was greatly exaggerated.I actually think the info on the various programmes has been very good. I have met many people with little interest in wildlife who were well versed in them from media reports. The websites also get a lot of traffic.
I must confess to having a problem with the concept of Falconry Centres and much prefer to see my raptors in the wild.

Well you were not at the Aillwee centre if you heard that info. I can possibly guess as to which one you were at as one in particular in Ireland is pretty much nothing more than a cash cow.

greeneyedspirit

Danielle Green Fir wrote: »

I too was referring to the comment that a falconry centre was breeding birds for release. I was not referring to personnel from these centres assisting in their private capacities.

Ah right, sorry, mis-understood that one so. You're absolutely right in that comment, no birds are bred for release.

greeneyedspirit

LostCovey wrote: »

However if the Aillwee Centre has sponsored a satellite tag, which costs several thousand to buy and hundreds/thousands per year to run, then that is an admirable contribution, if its two, then that is a substantial contribution and the Golden Eagle Trust should acknowledge that on their website.

You're right, it should be acknowledged on the GET website. I'm not sure if it is, but it definitely should be. (http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=153939418004277 - that was the fundraising event for these sat packs)