Manchester United V Arsenal, Sunday 28th August 2011

Blatter

Old Trafford, Manchester
Kick off 4PM
Live on Sky Sports 1


Arsenal will be hoping Laurent Koscielny and Kieran Gibbs will be available for selection after recent back and hamstring injuries. Armand Traoré may start after returning from injury in the closing stages of Arsenal's 2-1 win at Udinese. Jack Wilshere and Abou Diaby are ruled out due to injury, while Alex Song, Emmanuel Frimpong and Gervinho will all miss the game due to suspension.


Rio Ferdinand is likely to return for Manchester United in place of Jonny Evans or Phil Jones at centre back. However Nemanja Vidic is ruled out and is not likely to return for another month after he picked up a calf injury during Manchester United's 2-1 opening day win against West Brom at The Hawthorns. Brazilian fullback Rafael will also miss out due to a shoulder injury which should see him sidelined for another ten weeks. The game may be too early for Darren Fletcher(virus) to make a return to the first team squad but Javier Hernandez is fit and will travel with the squad. Antonio Valencia is also expected to be included in the 18 man squad.

Possible line ups;

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De Gea

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Smalling

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Ferdinand

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Jones

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Evra

Nani

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Cleverly

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Anderson

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Young

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Rooney

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Welbeck

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Van Persie

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Arshavin

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Traoré

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Rosicky

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Ramsey

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Walcott

Jenkinson

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Vermaelen----Djourou

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Sagna

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Szczęsny

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Redzer7

Vermaelen to be assessed before the game, would be a huge loss if he's not fit.

Mitch Connor

If Rio comes back in, it will be Jones that is dropped. Evans plays LCB, Rio RCB - they will be the partnership.

Rest of the team I can see staying the same.

Arsenal are hit horridly by injuries, but i don't think it will be the walk over for United some are making out. Firstly, United don't do things that easily! Secondly, Arsenal are a very good football team and won't be walked over.

Interesting to see Vermalen is a doubt for the game. I reckon he makes it, but he would be a massive loss if out - especially with all the other injury issues.

Will also be interesting to see if Arsenal add any defenders to the side before the game, will have to be signed in the next 26 hours.

Frisbee

If Vermaelen is indeed injured then:

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Szczesny

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Jenkinson----Djourou----Miquel

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Sagna

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Ramsey----Rosicky

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Walcott

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Arshavin

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Ryo/OX

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RVP

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It's a toss up of who will start between Jenkinson and Traoré now that both are fit. If Vermaelen is fit then he'll play ahead of Miquel.

Also Lansbury might start with Arshavin pushed out to the left and Ramsey advanced into the 'Cesc' role.

All in all, not the kind of squad you want to send to United...

Blatter

Jones played LCB for the England U-21s in the Summer and he was outstanding. Video clip here. But in saying that you're right that Jonny Evans may well start ahead of him. It also wouldn't surprise me if SAF doesn't play Ferdinand and plays Jones and Evans again given how well they performed against Tottenham.

If Vermaelen is missing for Arsenal it would be a HUGE blow but I also wouldn't be writing Arsenal off by any means but am confident of a win.

Blatter

Frisbee wrote: »

If Vermaelen is indeed injured then:

---

Szczesny

---

Jenkinson----Djourou----Miquel

---

Sagna

---

Ramsey----Rosicky

---

Walcott

---

Arshavin

---

Ryo/OX

---

RVP

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It's a toss up of who will start between Jenkinson and Traoré now that both are fit. If Vermaelen is fit then he'll play ahead of Miquel.

Also Lansbury might start with Arshavin pushed out to the left and Ramsey advanced into the 'Cesc' role.

All in all, not the kind of squad you want to send to United...

Do you not reckon he might play Traore LM to give some extra protection to the midfield/defense? Would make sense to me, given how depleted your squad is.

Mitch Connor

Blatter wrote: »

Jones played LCB for the England U-21s in the Summer and he was outstanding. Video clip here. But in saying that you're right that Jonny Evans may well start ahead of him. It also wouldn't surprise me if SAF doesn't play Ferdinand and plays Jones and Evans again given how well they performed against Tottenham.

If Vermaelen is missing for Arsenal it would be a HUGE blow.

It doesn't really matter where Jones played for England, not right now anyway. Ferguson, imo, has his defensive partnerships based on experience.

Last season the partnerships were: Rio and Vidic. Rio and Evans. Smalling and Vidic. Smalling and Evans. In RCB, LCB order.

If Rio comes back, he comes back in at RCB. Based on Jones playing at RCB on Monday night, and on Sunday vs West Brom when he came on, I think it is his position Rio will take.

Of course there is a chance Fergie will go with Jones beside Rio, but I think the partnership experience of Rio and Evans will carry through.

After all that though, I actually wouldn't be surprised to see Rio miss out with Jones and Evans retaining their places.

Jax Teller

Same team as Monday ? I'd go with that again .

edit
Of course if Rio is fit he should start I suppose .

killwill

Blatter wrote: »

Jones played LCB for the England U-21s in the Summer and he was outstanding. Video clip here. But in saying that you're right that Jonny Evans may well start ahead of him. It also wouldn't surprise me if SAF doesn't play Ferdinand and plays Jones and Evans again given how well they performed against Tottenham.

If Vermaelen is missing for Arsenal it would be a HUGE blow but I also wouldn't be writing Arsenal off by any means but am confident of a win.

If Ferdinand is fit he will play IMO. There is a huge difference playing against Defoe up front and van Persie. I think Ferdinands experience could be crucial. Overall I can't see past a United win

Frisbee

Blatter wrote: »

Do you not reckon he might play Traore LM to give some extra protection to the midfield/defense? Would make sense to me, given how depleted your squad is.

He might well do. I was thinking he might even just play him ahead of Jenkinson and that's why he gave him minutes last night. Would make sense to put him in midfield as he's better going forward than defending anyway.

Blatter

killwill wrote: »

If Ferdinand is fit he will play IMO. There is a huge difference playing against Defoe up front and van Persie. I think Ferdinands experience could be crucial. Overall I can't see past a United win

You're right, there is a huge difference between Van Persie and Defoe. But I was thinking that Ferdinand and Evans as a partnership would be a bit slow and having Jones in there with his pace would be a huge asset in dealing with RVP. Arshavin might be in terrible form at the moment but he's pretty quick too. They'll have Walcott drifting in aswell. That's why I was originally thinking Jones and Ferdinand(if fit).

super_furry

Can't help shaking the feeling that Arsenal will cause an upset. They were decent last night but United should still be able to take three points, but for some reason I can't explain, I think Arsenal will nick it.

killwill

super_furry wrote: »

Can't help shaking the feeling that Arsenal will cause an upset. They were decent last night but United should still be able to take three points, but for some reason I can't explain, I think Arsenal will nick it.

There is not a hope in hell that Arsenal are gonna turn up with a second rate team at Old trafford and have the balls to win. A draw could be a possibility but I really cannot see anything but a United win.

Mitch Connor

super_furry wrote: »

Can't help shaking the feeling that Arsenal will cause an upset. They were decent last night but United should still be able to take three points, but for some reason I can't explain, I think Arsenal will nick it.

If they had Song or that young lad Frimpong (or however it is spelled) I would give them a big chance, but without either I think United should be able to get on top in the midfield battle, and after that I rate our defence and forward line as better than theirs.

Blatter

killwill wrote: »

There is not a hope in hell that Arsenal are gonna turn up with a second rate team at Old trafford and have the balls to win. A draw could be a possibility but I really cannot see anything but a United win.

Besides the fact Arsenal have such a depleted squad, the thing that really hampers Arsenal's chances is the fact they had such a tough game on Wednesday night in Italy. English teams have traditionally found it very difficult to win away from home after a European night midweek. Add that to Arsenal's injuries, United's current form and incredible record at Old Trafford(18 PL wins out of 19 last season) and you have to say Arsenal re really up against it.

However as Mitch said, United rarely do things the easy way but at the same time you can't help being confident as a United fan coming into this.

killwill

Blatter wrote: »

Besides the fact Arsenal have such a depleted squad, the thing that really hampers Arsenal's chances is the fact they had such a tough game on Wednesday night in Italy. English teams have traditionally found it very difficult to win away from home after a European night midweek. Add that to Arsenal's injuries, United's current form and incredible record at Old Trafford(18 PL wins out of 19 last season) and you have to say Arsenal re really up against it.

However as Mitch said, United rarely do things the easy way but at the same time you can't help being confident as a United fan coming into this.

It is the first time in history that I am actually confident going into a Utd/Arsenal game tbh. Looking back you have to fear Overmars, Vieira, Bergkamp, Henry. Now it is Walcott and Arshavin.
Defensively thay had Adams and Keown, now they have Djourou and Koschielny.
They are now without Nasri and Fabregas.
They are a team that will struggle big time and United won't have it easy because of the history bettween the clubs but I see it ending maybe 3-1.

VW 1

No matter the team that Arsenal put out I dont think that this will be an easy ride for United. Wenger did a very good job in picking them up to go again last night after losing Fabregas and Nasri. With Gervinho Song Walcott Gibbs Vermaelen and Frimpong missing I dont think Arsenal will have the strength to beat us but I reckon Wenger will have his troops ready to go for this one and I cant see it being easy, however I cant see past three points for us in this one.

smokedeels

Manchester United vs Manchester City B team

I can see United putting out the same team we fielded vs Spurs. It's a depleted Arsenal side so Park one of the usual picks against them can probably be left out. I do hope our forgotten Bulgarian gets a decent run out.

SDTimeout

killwill wrote: »

It is the first time in history that I am actually confident going into a Utd/Arsenal game tbh. Looking back you have to fear Overmars, Vieira, Bergkamp, Henry. Now it is Walcott and Arshavin.
Defensively thay had Adams and Keown, now they have Djourou and Koschielny.
They are now without Nasri and Fabregas.
They are a team that will struggle big time and United won't have it easy because of the history bettween the clubs but I see it ending maybe 3-1.

The team that beat United 1-0 is not too far from the team which will line up on Sunday you know.

53 Szczesny
03 Sagna
06 Koscielny
20 Djourou (Squillaci 69)
22 Clichy
08 Nasri (Arshavin 46)
14 Walcott (Eboue 78)
16 Ramsey
17 A Song
19 Wilshere
10 Van Persie

We may or may not have Verm back, We will have Arshavin from the start ( I assume ) and Song and Wilshere will be out but apart from that.

Blatter

SDTimeout wrote: »

The team that beat United 1-0 is not too far from the team which will line up on Sunday you know.

53 Szczesny
03 Sagna
06 Koscielny
20 Djourou (Squillaci 69)
22 Clichy
08 Nasri (Arshavin 46)
14 Walcott (Eboue 78)
16 Ramsey
17 A Song
19 Wilshere
10 Van Persie

We may or may not have Verm back, We will have Arshavin from the start ( I assume ) and Song and Wilshere will be out but apart from that.

Difference being then is you played us at the Emirates and we were sluggish after a European night midweek.

Rolls reversed now + more injuries.

L'prof

United to win, I just hope we can keep the score down and make a good game of it. To many injuries and suspensions to win at Old Trafford!

Noo

tbh it'd be a bit of an embarrassment if utd dont beat whatever team arsenal can scrape together. Maybe being expected to win so comfortably will have a negative effect on them.

flahavaj

The over confidence in here is a bit ridiculous tbh. I fully expect Arsenal to have Vermaelen and Koscielney at centre back. If so you could argue they'll only be missing Gibbs, Wilshire, Song and Gervinho from their best team. Hardly a disaster. They'll be buoyed by winning last night as well and will feel they have nothing to lose going to OT - most people seem to epect them to lose anyway so they might as well have a go.

This will be a tough game, make no mistake. Liverpool toiled to beat a weaker team until they went down to 10 men.

The_Kew_Tour

I dont see anything other then Arsenal having a right go at United on Sunday it wont be easy victory like some think...

United should win but Arsenal have nothing to lose..

This is first big test for some of the new United players

I will go 2/3-1 United

killwill

SDTimeout wrote: »

The team that beat United 1-0 is not too far from the team which will line up on Sunday you know.

53 Szczesny
03 Sagna
06 Koscielny
20 Djourou (Squillaci 69)
22 Clichy
08 Nasri (Arshavin 46)
14 Walcott (Eboue 78)
16 Ramsey
17 A Song
19 Wilshere
10 Van Persie

We may or may not have Verm back, We will have Arshavin from the start ( I assume ) and Song and Wilshere will be out but apart from that.

Arshavin is in serious decline in fairness. Song and Wilshere are huge losses for ye so ye will be missing the steel in midfield.
Is Koscielny fit?
Also no Clichy. That is 5 players. Quite a weaker team.

Nalz

I'll go with a 1-0 frustrating win for United...

too much hype surrounding Uniteds young guys after one impressive 45mins.

ironbluedun

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I dont see anything other then Arsenal having a right go at United on Sunday it wont be easy victory like some think...

i agree there is a sense that arsenal have their backs to the wall, and that might strengthen their resolve a bit, it wont be a walk in the park for utd, but i do expect utd to win in a competitive game.

Mitch Connor

Trilla wrote: »

I'll go with a 1-0 frustrating win for United...

too much hype surrounding Uniteds young guys after one impressive 45mins.

Two, arguably 3, apart from 2 goals against the run of play. We were very good in the first half vs City and excellent in the second half.

But yeah - the hype over the midfielders especially is a worry, as I still don't think Cleverley and Anderson are a strong enough partnership defensively, though Ando is doing his best to prove me wrong.

The_Kew_Tour

ironbluedun wrote: »

i agree there is a sense that arsenal have their backs to the wall, and that might strengthen their resolve a bit, it wont be a walk in the park for utd, but i do expect utd to win in a competitive game.

Yes United should, but dont expect Arsenal to stroll..

If Arsenal score first it could get interesting.

Nalz

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Ando is doing his best to prove me wrong.

I said this year would tell how good he is, and if he can go on a run now of 5 or 6 games playing well then there is more than hope for him to be an almost world class midfielder. Potential first namer on the pitch for Brazil almost already!

I didnt see the charity shield unfortunately, just the highlights.

Cleverly went missing a little from what I could see in the first half vs Spurs. Wellbeck was a little sloppy on the ball first half. Something was said second half by SAF I'm sure of it! In the end he just did enough to pip Ando, Evans, Jones and Rooney for MOTM. All 5 were excellent vs Spurs.

flahavaj

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Two, arguably 3, apart from 2 goals against the run of play. We were very good in the first half vs City and excellent in the second half.

But yeah - the hype over the midfielders especially is a worry, as I still don't think Cleverley and Anderson are a strong enough partnership defensively, though Ando is doing his best to prove me wrong.

I would actually happily trade a little openness defensively for the style of Football we played the other night and second half vs City. It was great stuff at times.

Mitch Connor

Trilla wrote: »

Cleverly went missing a little from what I could see in the first half vs Spurs. Wellbeck was a little sloppy on the ball first half. Something was said second half by SAF I'm sure of it! In the end he just did enough to pip Ando, Evans, Jones and Rooney for MOTM. All 5 were excellent vs Spurs.

Agree with this.

I said at the time that the game was passing Cleverley by in the first half and this was affecting Anderson too as it was putting more pressure on him. There was a marked improvement in the involvement of Cleveley in the second half, which helped Ando (sharing the load) and both did generally very well in the second half.

Again though, it should be pointed out the CM pairing they were up against was Livermore and Kranjcar. The fact they struggled in the first half was a big worry for me.

I would also agree re. Welbeck - I thought his game improved dramatically after his goal, which indicates to me that he was feeling the pressure in the first half (and vs West Brom imo) and lacking confidence in himself to do what he can. Once he got the goal that pressure lifted and you could see the increase in his confidence and enjoyment. Hopefully he is given the chance to keep it going this weekend.

Mitch Connor

flahavaj wrote: »

I would actually happily trade a little openness defensively for the style of Football we played the other night and second half vs City. It was great stuff at times.

With a bit more confidence in the defence and keeper, on my part, I would most likely agree. I just feel there is a vunerability at the back, and that worries me when the midfield is so open.

I have also said previously that while I worry about the defensive ability of an Anderson and Cleverley partnership - I only really worry about it right now. Cleverley is still learning the CM role (don't think he has ever really played there) and on top of that himself and Anderson are clearly a new partnership. While Tom will learn more about the defensive aspects of the game and what is required of him - himself and Ando will also learn how to play together; when to go, when to stay, how the other plays and how best to compliment them etc. Work in progress for both players individually and as a pairing.

Blatter

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Agree with this.

I said at the time that the game was passing Cleverley by in the first half and this was affecting Anderson too as it was putting more pressure on him. There was a marked improvement in the involvement of Cleveley in the second half, which helped Ando (sharing the load) and both did generally very well in the second half.

Again though, it should be pointed out the CM pairing they were up against was Livermore and Kranjcar. The fact they struggled in the first half was a big worry for me.

I would also agree re. Welbeck - I thought his game improved dramatically after his goal, which indicates to me that he was feeling the pressure in the first half (and vs West Brom imo) and lacking confidence in himself to do what he can. Once he got the goal that pressure lifted and you could see the increase in his confidence and enjoyment. Hopefully he is given the chance to keep it going this weekend.

Yeah, I though both Welbeck and Cleverly were only a few mins away from being subbed on Monday before the opener. They were fantastic after the goal though and to be fair Cleverly was very good after half time.

I'm not sure SAF will go with the same team though, difficult to tell. Gary Neville said on Sky after the win that he was expecting him to introduce some of the old guard for this game and slowly bring them back into the team for Bolton and Stoke away and the Chelsea and Liverpool games. He was making the point that experience in the team will be crucial for those games, which is very true. It wouldn't surprise me to see either Park or Giggs play on Sunday.

ShamoBuc

Hard to see anything other than a united win. The last place arsenal would want to be going is up there. United have started well and judging by their last 45 mins look extremely hard to beat in that form and should win by a couple of goals in a tense game but one united will win.

Joeyjoejoe43

My head tells me that United will win this, but I am going to go with a 2-2 prediction. Arsenal must show resolve and character in this game and I feel they will. United to get a dubious penalty fitting of Old Trafford..

Sean Bateman

United have a great chance tomorrow to pile more pressure on Arsenal and Wenger by hammering them. They must be tired after their midweek exploits and they seem to be taking one hit after another these days.

Can't see how Jones can be dropped. Wellbeck was a silly choice for man of the match in the Spurs game...Jones was immense. I called for us to sign him a long time ago after watching a random Blackburn game. He's like a young Tony Adams or John Terry only better. There's no way that he should be dropped. No way.

dahat

Sean Bateman wrote: »

United have a great chance tomorrow to pile more pressure on Arsenal and Wenger by hammering them. They must be tired after their midweek exploits and they seem to be taking one hit after another these days.

Can't see how Jones can be dropped. Wellbeck was a silly choice for man of the match in the Spurs game...Jones was immense. I called for us to sign him a long time ago after watching a random Blackburn game. He's like a young Tony Adams or John Terry only better. There's no way that he should be dropped. No way.

Both good points..3 points tomorrow and it makes us 9/9,a cracking start in anyones book.I would take a 7 point start but Arsenal are weak just now and must be there for the taking...

L'prof

Sean Bateman wrote: »

United have a great chance tomorrow to pile more pressure on Arsenal and Wenger by hammering them. They must be tired after their midweek exploits and they seem to be taking one hit after another these days.

Can't see how Jones can be dropped. Wellbeck was a silly choice for man of the match in the Spurs game...Jones was immense. I called for us to sign him a long time ago after watching a random Blackburn game. He's like a young Tony Adams or John Terry only better. There's no way that he should be dropped. No way.

There won't be any pressure until the transfer window closes I'm afraid!

CorkMan

It is good that Rosicky is fit, he is a good player.

Kylo Ren

The second you go out on the pitch thinking you have the win is the start of your demise.

Pepe LeFrits

No thread for Sunday's potential pillaging?

Sagna is ill and a doubt for the game. Vermaelen also picked up an injury during the Udinese game and may not feature. Francis Coquelin will make his debut according to Young Guns. This leaves Arsenal's starting XI as likely:

Szczesny
Jenkinson Djourou Miquel Traore
Ramsey Coquelin Rosicky
Walcott van Persie Arshavin

Hopefully the exuberance of youth will help Arsenal to a performance, otherwise another 6-1 could be on the cards.

The KO time translates to 8am for me; I can hardly wait for this hangover cure :pac:

dreamers75

Jenkinson looks a bit dodgy, Young will have a field day vs him.

Pepe LeFrits

Traore makes Jenkinson look like Maldini.

Mars Bar

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056367964

Professey Chin

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056367964
DAMN YOU SNICKERS CAKE!

d22ontour

Theres a thread already but probably been swamped already.

Yakult

Arsenal to win 3-0. Rvp getting a hat-trick.

BOHtox

Thread title fail!

Mars Bar

BOHtox wrote: »

Thread title fail!

I think it's a thread fail in general!

Blatter

Keno 92 wrote: »

The second you go out on the pitch thinking you have the win is the start of your demise.

SAF will have drilled that into them. He will demand they start with a high intensity and try to get an early goal, especially as Arsenal may experience a European hangover after Wedsnday night.