Shoulder exercises

opinion guy

So I'm looking for any weird and wonderful shoulder exercises people might have.

Backstory is - injury to shoulder years ago. Had MRi's, got surgical opinions, saw a physio etc etc. None of it has helped brilliantly.

Story is I have several minor probs but nothing big and obvious that can be easily fixed. Theres a touch of AC arthritis, a mite of supraspinatus impingement and something else I can't quite remember.

Shoulder is weak for certain movements - abduction of the arm from rest position, lifting things over my head, external rotation if the elbow is bent and any kind of pull up or muscle up I can't do cause it hurts like hell.

I'm on a renewed effort to rehab the thing. I'm using the exercises the physio showed me which in truth don't do much - mainly pulley work - bent arm internal rotation, external rotation stuff like that. I've added in some of my own that seem to help more. Forward straight arm raises, side straight arm raises, military press etc. I haven't tried this weighted yet but from reading last night it seems straight arm raise to the side with the thumb pointing up might be a good one - even unweighted I noticed it was targeting my weak muscles more than the same motion with thumb facing forward which I have been doing.

I'm looking for anymore weird and wonderful shoulder exercises people might have for targeting things like supraspinatus, subscapularis, long head of biceps and medial deltoid (I know one or more of these is ineffective - I'm just not sure exactly which ones!)

Hanley

Far from an expert opinion, but considering everything you're doing seems focused on the rotator cuff, and the rotator cuff connects to the scap, and scap connects to the AC joint and the humerus fits in there too... I'd say you're only as good as your scapular function. So if that's borked, all the other stuff you're doing probably won't have much of an effect.

opinion guy

Hanley wrote: »

Far from an expert opinion, but considering everything you're doing seems focused on the rotator cuff, and the rotator cuff connects to the scap, and scap connects to the AC joint and the humerus fits in there too... I'd say you're only as good as your scapular function. So if that's borked, all the other stuff you're doing probably won't have much of an effect.

Yeah I think my scap is ok. the injury was pretty much me falling directly onto the AC joint so I think that's the main problem area.
Ah I remembered what the other thing on the scan was now that I say that - some reduction in the subacromial space.

howtomake

I feel for you. Like Hanley said, its my scap that's holding me back. Unlike you I can pull but can't push properly, so I'm not sure if any of the exercises I've done will help you. I've had to do a lot of pulling movements to stabilise that area. I'm just about 90% all fixed up but the last remaining 10% has been a pain! Good luck, you could try YWTL's too, I hate them because they put me to sleep.

Also just curious, how do they know your subacromial space has reduced? From what I've read certain people just have less space than others, it can be luck of the draw.

opinion guy

howtomake wrote: »

YWTL's too

Oh see thats the stuff now thats why I started the thread. I had to look that up but cool. was thinking to do something like the y just from how and where the shoulder feels weak but never would have thought of the WTL part. Awesome - will try that!

Thanks guys. Keep em coming!!! Any more weird and wonderful like that ????:D

Edit: re sub acromial space - in the radiologists report. I'll dig it out for exact wording
Edit2: it says 'some narrowing in the subacromial space'. Kinda vague really!
Edit3: just had a try of the YWTL on the floor there. The y and the L seem like they will help. Cheers thanks!

Scuba Ste

I'd second Hanley on the scapular work.

You say it's ok. In what way and how do you know? Poor scapular function can cause reduction in the subacromial space. How many scap pushups, pullups etc can you do?

From my own experience, I had some shoulder problems for about a year, I'd get a lot of pain if I did any overhead work and saw little or no joy from physio sessions. I joined Informed Performance and Will Heffernan had me do a lot of scapular stabilisation stuff below and now I feel a lot better. Last night I jerked a PR when I couldn't jerk at all at the start of the year so this has a worked very well for me.

Here's a list of exercises I regularly do:

Scap pushups
Scap pullups
Scap Inverted rows
Overhead Shrugs
Horizontal band pull aparts
Vertical band pull aparts
Band dislocates
YTW's
Face pulls
Inverted rows

I do the first four in a circuit with ten reps of each, sometimes I do the same with the band stuff.

I do a lot of thoracic mobility work too. Thoracic extensions on a foam roll and general foam rolling on the thoracic spine, wall sweeps and these.

I also do a good bit of unilateral pressing; one arm overhead presses and alternating incline pressing.

I'd definitely try incorporating some scapular work and see if it improves. Don't do anything that hurts but give some of it a shot. Everyone could do with better scapular stabilisation but if you have shoulder problems it's the first place I'd look to improve.

Hope that helps.

opinion guy

Scuba Ste wrote: »

I'd second Hanley on the scapular work.

You say it's ok. In what way and how do you know? Poor scapular function can cause reduction in the subacromial space. How many scap pushups, pullups etc can you do?

Why wouldn't it be ok ?
Never tried scap pushups or pullups but I just googled them. So I just dropped and did 30 scap pushups without any problem. I can't try the pullups at home but will give it a go in the gym next day. Generaly with conventional pullups the problem is very specific to the AC joint area - it feels stuck and gets painful quickly - as in half a pullup and its screaming. I think scappulls up should be fine though - its only when I contract muslce on top of the AC-humeral joints that it happens.

I should say - I have full range of motion. Oh and I swim - frontcrawl 1 to 1.5k without any problems (Edit: swimming used to be a problem but I quit for a year and after I went back its been fine)

From my own experience, I had some shoulder problems for about a year, I'd get a lot of pain if I did any overhead work and saw little or no joy from physio sessions. I joined Informed Performance and Will Heffernan had me do a lot of scapular stabilisation stuff below and now I feel a lot better. Last night I jerked a PR when I couldn't jerk at all at the start of the year so this has a worked very well for me.

Here's a list of exercises I regularly do:

Scap pushups
Scap pullups
Scap Inverted rows
Overhead Shrugs
Horizontal band pull aparts
Vertical band pull aparts
Band dislocates
YTW's
Face pulls
Inverted rows

I do the first four in a circuit with ten reps of each, sometimes I do the same with the band stuff.

I do a lot of thoracic mobility work too. Thoracic extensions on a foam roll and general foam rolling on the thoracic spine, wall sweeps and these.

I also do a good bit of unilateral pressing; one arm overhead presses and alternating incline pressing.

I'd definitely try incorporating some scapular work and see if it improves. Don't do anything that hurts but give some of it a shot. Everyone could do with better scapular stabilisation but if you have shoulder problems it's the first place I'd look to improve.

Will check those out thanks very much!!!
Hope that helps.

Edit: Just tried some face pulls....haha without anything to pull but mimicked the movement...I can feel the anterior/superior part of the shoulder catching where is does at the very extreme of the face pull so I'll deffo give these a go.

lol its turning out useful that I worked it hard yesterday and it is a little DOMS-style tender today so I can feel when these movements are catching the spot without the weight

Hanley

Why would your scap be a problem? Because most peoples are. Poor posture, poor recruitment, bad movement patterns... all things that can feed into scap issue and shoulder pain. As was already said, everything connects to your scap, so if there's an issue there (ie if there's a posterior tilt/winging scap issue that you're unaware of) your shoulder function will be comprised because the entire joint is no longer structured the way it should be.

But it sounds like you don't want to listen to any advice other than what you already believe, maybe I'm wrong. Anyway, good luck with your recovery.

opinion guy

Actually lets throw this open a bit more.

Stretches. When I do get the pain its very specific to the anterior/superior aspect of the shoulder of the shoulder joint. I'm guessing insertion of subscapularis or superspinatus or both. I feels like something is stuck there. I started to stretch it but its very hard to 'reach' the precise point. about the best one is if I bend elbow to 90 degrees, external rotate the arm, wedge it against a wall and stretch into further external rotation - that kinda gets the front part of the shoulder but not quite the problem - it misses the superior part of it. I also do a supraspinatus stretch where you put the hand to small of the back an using other hand pull the elbow forward. (sorry don't know names of these). The stretches but is a bit meh - I don't really think it achieves anything.

Any weird and wonderful stretches people have to really get into the anterior/superior part of the shoulder. The clasping hands behind your back one arm up one down thing doesn't do anything for it. Nor does stretching arm across the chest.

opinion guy

Hanley wrote: »

Why would your scap be a problem? Because most peoples are. Poor posture, poor recruitment, bad movement patterns... all things that can feed into scap issue and shoulder pain. As was already said, everything connects to your scap, so if there's an issue there (ie if there's a posterior tilt/winging scap issue that you're unaware of) your shoulder function will be comprised because the entire joint is no longer structured the way it should be.

But it sounds like you don't want to listen to any advice other than what you already believe, maybe I'm wrong. Anyway, good luck with your recovery.

I'm not most people :P I've had physio, orthopaedic and lots of bodywork and movement training over the years. I've good bodyawareness, full movement of my scapula, no scap winging or other positional issues with it, no pain with it and I know the anatomy. I haven't said so but I work on teres major/minor also and they are strong. Rhomboids are good. I can also do the scap pushups as long as I want and can swim as long as I want (with the exception of butterfly but thats just lack of fitness). I'm not concerned about my scap function tbh.

But I am listening to any and all suggestions for exercises and I'm gonna try some of the ones Scuba Ste suggested. I'm not so invested in any one idea or another so much as I'm just searching for weird exercises that I wouldn't have thought of to try. If it works great - I don't care how or why. Any and all suggestions are welcome and appreciated!

Scuba Ste

opinion guy wrote: »

Why wouldn't it be ok ?

Because you have a shoulder injury and the scapula forms a major part of your shoulder joint. Like Hanley said, if something is wrong there it could lead to a problem somewhere else.

Keep in mind that it won't be a quick fix. It took me the best part of 6 months to get to the point where I didn't get sore every time I jerked and that includes over a year of seeing physio's and doing other other stuff which included a lot of scap pushups. That's only one exercise and I think myself the pulling movements are more important.

Good luck with it anyway.

opinion guy

Scuba Ste wrote: »

Because you have a shoulder injury and the scapula forms a major part of your shoulder joint. Like Hanley said, if something is wrong there it could lead to a problem somewhere else.

Keep in mind that it won't be a quick fix. It took me the best part of 6 months to get to the point where I didn't get sore every time I jerked and that includes over a year of seeing physio's and doing other other stuff which included a lot of scap pushups. That's only one exercise and I think myself the pulling movements are more important.

Good luck with it anyway.

Cheers thanks. Oh this has been going on for years - original injury was 10+ years ago. I actually had alot more trouble with it 6,7 years ago when I had to stop swimming. But rest + physio etc sorted it out alot. But lately I want more !!!!! haha. Really it doesn't bother me day to day anymore except sometimes if carrying a heavy bag - but I do notice it in the gym and its one of those things if I leave it will probably cause troubles in 30/40 years time so I've decided its time for action!

Anyhow will try some of those exercises that seem to get to the issue for the next month and see how it goes

Mellor

opinion guy wrote: »

Yeah I think my scap is ok. the injury was pretty much me falling directly onto the AC joint so I think that's the main problem area.

I think you are missing the point regarding scap function. I think you are looking at it in isolation, which is bad. Maybe you have reasonably good scap function, which in itself is good. But that doesn't mean that working on it won't help.

As you said, the problem is your AC joint. As i'm sure you are aware, this is the joint between your scap and your clavicle. So while scap retraction might be fine, their is still an issue a part of your scap. There is a chance that working on working on the scap and not just the rotator cuff will strengthen the AC joint, even if scap function doesn't need to improve.