Political Campaigning

Liam Byrne

I'm a little concerned at the phrasing of some recent threads which seem to be a campaign / agenda slogan in their own right rather than presenting a topic for discussion.

Whatever about asking a question, or even adding a question mark to a statement to prompt discussion a la "Norris for President ?" threads with titles such as "release xxxxx" are surely borderline in terms of the ruling on blogging-style posts ?

If I posted a "Jail Bertie Ahern" thread it would probably fall foul of the rules, so why is a "release xxxxx" thread allowed ?

Wolfe Tone

You really are not a fan of me are you Liam?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056332804

Thats the thread he is on about. The thread Liam cant be arsed to read before replying.

I wrote that, and explained why I felt the man should be released. I ended asking why Justice Minister Ford is keeping the man in jail. Plenty of scope for discussion. You can agree, yo can partly agree, or all out disagree with what I say, and of course say why. I raised the issue (his incarceration) and gave my opinion on it.

The title of the thread is the title of the video, the main element of my thread.

As threads go on the politics forum its a decent enough one. I have a video, two political party press releases, a news article and my own personal opinion. Plenty of meat on the bone there, I don't do one line opening posts and bail off.

Its a political issue also, due to the manner in which he is held (license revoked).

I think its fine.

Bottle_of_Smoke

I've reported stuff like this on the nutrition forum, eg "Porridge is fattening" as a thread title. All I wanted was that it be changed to "Can porridge be fattening?" or something along those lines.

What I would fear is someone passing through the forum unconsciously, or even consciously picks up that info as if it were fact

So I agree statements which are not scientific facts, should not be allowed be used as thread titles in science/health/serious forums.

The thread in question here is definitely not a blogging-style post though, the topic is certainly a talked about political issue, (the man's partner referred to in the piece has been on radio ulster and radio foyle talkshows in the last few days)and it is a well constructed post.

Corsendonk

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

I've reported stuff like this on the nutrition forum, eg "Porridge is fattening" as a thread title. All I wanted was that it be changed to "Can porridge be fattening?" or something along those lines.

What I would fear is someone passing through the forum unconsciously, or even consciously picks up that info as if it were fact

So I agree statements which are not scientific facts, should not be allowed be used as thread titles in science/health/serious forums.

The thread in question here is definitely not a blogging-style post though, the topic is certainly a talked about political issue, (the man's partner referred to in the piece has been on radio ulster and radio foyle talkshows in the last few days)and it is a well constructed post.

Muck spreading is another one, ask a question in a certain way and mud sticks. The below thread was started by a poster who started the same thread in the Vegetarian Forium too and seem to have an anti GM agenda.


http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056309300

Extremely hard to police.

Liam Byrne

I've acknowledged that the post in question - although blatantly biased - isn't the objection. That bias can be challenged in-thread.

The issue is the casual scanner through the thread titles that sees the campaign slogan; it screams like a placard at a protest march.

Overheal

You PM'd the Political Mods and got some type of response/.non-response before making this thread, Liam?

It's not like canvassing and soapboxing rules aren't already clear. So I don't see why a feedback thread is necessary. If it's a lapse in enforcement you should speak to a Pol Mod.

nesf

If he was soliciting members to sign some petition or similar in that thread it'd be a problem Liam, as he's not it's not really an issue. He argued his case, he didn't just post a bunch of links etc.

While I don't agree with his politics, he's really not breaking any rules with that thread.


My advice: You two should just put each other on ignore and give the rest of us a break from your continuous arguing.

FlutterinBantam

Liam Byrne wrote: »

I'm a little concerned at the phrasing of some recent threads which seem to be a campaign / agenda slogan in their own right rather than presenting a topic for discussion.

Whatever about asking a question, or even adding a question mark to a statement to prompt discussion a la "Norris for President ?" threads with titles such as "release xxxxx" are surely borderline in terms of the ruling on blogging-style posts ?

If I posted a "Jail Bertie Ahern" thread it would probably fall foul of the rules, so why is a "release xxxxx" thread allowed ?

I would agree with you Liam.

In my opinion Boards.ie is being used to promulgate a particular political outlook and agenda by a small coterie of constant posters.

It's facilities are being used to highlight specific issues and general policy of a certain political part.

No big deal, just low level insidious,below the radar, promotion of a certain

viewpoint and I feel you are perfectly entitled to draw attention to that.

LoLth

There's a difference between promoting a political agenda and presenting an issue for discussion. Just because its not popular or is disagreed with by some posters, does not mean that it cant be open for discussion, in fact, if only agendas that were universally accepted were posted, there would be no discussion, just a whole thread of "i agree" "+1" etc.

This particular issue though is not really a boards.ie feedback issue, its a specifically politics forum issue and if the politics mods are ok with it and it doesnt break any boards.ie rules then I dont see a problem with the thread. It is a current event that is open for discussion and views. The OP of the thread didnt try to start a petition, he just presented his views and supported them with links and a video. Whether you agree with the issue or not is up to you and if you feel the urge to object or present a coutner arguement or correct a misconception/misrepresetnation then you are free to do so, within the rules of the forum and boards.ie (ie: non abusive).

Bottle_of_Smoke

Lolth would you have an opinion on the point I raised, ie using non-factual authoritave statements as thread titles?

Obviously tabloids do this all the time with headlines to grab attention, but we're not selling newspapers here.

FlutterinBantam

LoLth wrote: »

There's a difference between promoting a political agenda and presenting an issue for discussion. Just because its not popular or is disagreed with by some posters, does not mean that it cant be open for discussion, in fact, if only agendas that were universally accepted were posted, there would be no discussion, just a whole thread of "i agree" "+1" etc.

This particular issue though is not really a boards.ie feedback issue, its a specifically politics forum issue and if the politics mods are ok with it and it doesnt break any boards.ie rules then I dont see a problem with the thread. It is a current event that is open for discussion and views. The OP of the thread didnt try to start a petition, he just presented his views and supported them with links and a video. Whether you agree with the issue or not is up to you and if you feel the urge to object or present a coutner arguement or correct a misconception/misrepresetnation then you are free to do so, within the rules of the forum and boards.ie (ie: non abusive).

Indeed, indeed, indeed Sir.

However, when a certain,some might call it a minority viewpoint, is constantly, now listen to that word...C O N S T A NT L Y posted on these here Fora,a reasonable person might be led to opine that there is an agenda somewhere.

No rules broken or anything like that,but would common sense not break into to the equation:cool:

Hmmm.....

Ludo

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Indeed, indeed, indeed Sir.

However, when a certain,some might call it a minority viewpoint, is constantly, now listen to that word...C O N S T A NT L Y posted on these here Fora,a reasonable person might be led to opine that there is an agenda somewhere.

No rules broken or anything like that,but would common sense not break into to the equation:cool:

Hmmm.....

Current front page of politics forum...possibly 3 threads which are related to this "agenda" out of 20. Roughly 10% / 15%...isn't that about the level of support for this "minority viewpoint" ?

I don't agree with the political viewpoint of these posts myself but as a reasonable person I can accept that they are as entitled to be posted as any other viewpoint.

Liam Byrne

Ludo wrote: »

Current front page of politics forum...possibly 3 threads which are related to this "agenda" out of 20. Roughly 10% / 15%...isn't that about the level of support for this "minority viewpoint" ?

I don't agree with the political viewpoint of these posts myself but as a reasonable person I can accept that they are as entitled to be posted as any other viewpoint.

No issue with them posting or having the opposing view to me.

The issue is the phrasing of the thread title as a campaign slogan, and not asking "Should XXXX be jailed / released ?".....as FlutterinBantam said, it's an insidious attempt to get the phrase into the heads of casual readers - almost like "subliminal advertising".

Insect Overlord

Let the casual readers worry about themselves! You can't legislate for every single little possibility on a message board. If someone isn't bright enough to read both sides of a story before making their mind up, then that's their problem.

FlutterinBantam

Insect Overlord wrote: »

Let the casual readers worry about themselves! You can't legislate for every single little possibility on a message board. If someone isn't bright enough to read both sides of a story before making their mind up, then that's their problem.

Sorry buddy, Boards.ie is very diligent in stamping out and locking stuff which might bring a reaction against themselves.

Surely they might see the use of their facilities to shunt out propaganda for a certain point of view.?

Not one off mate, constant.

Would have thought that was a given


M'kay.

Insect Overlord

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Sorry buddy, Boards.ie is very diligent in stamping out and locking stuff which might bring a reaction against themselves.

Surely they might see the use of their facilities to shunt out propaganda for a certain point of view.?

Not one off mate, constant.

Would have thought that was a given


M'kay.

FlutterinBantam

Thought I was in the Cuckoo's Nest buddy.

You don't want to engage eh?

I'm cool with that.

southsiderosie

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

However, when a certain,some might call it a minority viewpoint, is constantly, now listen to that word...C O N S T A NT L Y posted on these here Fora,a reasonable person might be led to opine that there is an agenda somewhere.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Surely they might see the use of their facilities to shunt out propaganda for a certain point of view.?

Not one off mate, constant..

Given that you {snip} take any opportunity to take a jab at WT in Feedback since you can't over in Politics, I find these posts to be highly ironic.

edit: removed the word constantly from your post as it appears that FlutteringBantam was not referring to Wolfe Tone in this instance so he obviously does not "constantly" take an opportunity to take a jab (he may more often than not but not constantly).

LoLth

@Flutteringbantam: are you accusing Wolfe Tone of Constantly posting the same political message in the fora, as in, if I go looking for posts by Wolfe Tone I wont find any other posts on any other topic?

FlutterinBantam

LoLth wrote: »

@Flutteringbantam: are you accusing Wolfe Tone of Constantly posting the same political message in the fora, as in, if I go looking for posts by Wolfe Tone I wont find any other posts on any other topic?

No, I mentioned no names at all, and I am not accusing anyone of anything.

I am merely responding to a very pertinent thread which seeks feedback on the opinion, if I understand it correctly, that Fora in Boards.ie are being used to broadcast a certain political point of view.

If one takes into account the amount of threads started by certain posters,purveying the same general political outlook and agenda,one would,as I do,come to the conclusion that the facility is being used to that effect.

The OP has a very legitimate point, I would opine.

I am merely in agreement with that gentleman.

LoLth

well, if you see someone constantly posting the same material then please report the post to the moderators and let them deal with it.

As for fora in boards.ie being used to broadcast a certain political view.... I'm sure they are being used as a means to promote several political views and I am sure that there are posters here who staunchly believe that their view is the only correct view. As long as there is room for discussion and polite disagreement I have no problem with that. Its when a user dive bombs a forum with a political message and fecks off or when they aggressively try to stamp out any form of opinion that differs from their own, thats when I would find issue and take the appropriate action as, I am sure, the mods would if the matter is reported to them.

The OPs point is that a "casual scanner" is being subjected to a form of "subliminal advertising" by beign made familiar with certain phrases or slogans. To address this I will answer the question raised by Bottle of Smoke : if a user posts "porridge is fattening" and post up support for that statement then there is no issue. if a casual user happens to see that thread title and then, without reading the thread, goes off porridge because they believe it to be fattening, then that person is going to have a lot more problems in life than what they eat for breakfast. They'll be too busy buying pheromones, signing up for organic alternatives that work just as well at enhancing the size of body parts and sending their bank details along with power of attorney to every Nigerian Prince that drops them a line.

FlutterinBantam

LoLth wrote: »

well, if you see someone constantly posting the same material then please report the post to the moderators and let them deal with it.

As for fora in boards.ie being used to broadcast a certain political view.... I'm sure they are being used as a means to promote several political views and I am sure that there are posters here who staunchly believe that their view is the only correct view. As long as there is room for discussion and polite disagreement I have no problem with that. Its when a user dive bombs a forum with a political message and fecks off or when they aggressively try to stamp out any form of opinion that differs from their own, thats when I would find issue and take the appropriate action as, I am sure, the mods would if the matter is reported to them.

The OPs point is that a "casual scanner" is being subjected to a form of "subliminal advertising" by beign made familiar with certain phrases or slogans. To address this I will answer the question raised by Bottle of Smoke : if a user posts "porridge is fattening" and post up support for that statement then there is no issue. if a casual user happens to see that thread title and then, without reading the thread, goes off porridge because they believe it to be fattening, then that person is going to have a lot more problems in life than what they eat for breakfast. They'll be too busy buying pheromones, signing up for organic alternatives that work just as well at enhancing the size of body parts and sending their bank details along with power of attorney to every Nigerian Prince that drops them a line.

Hmmm... I actually had a lot of respect for your views until you went over the top in the last paragraph.

I would have expected that someone in your position would not have overdone it like that.

No worries though, I will still say it as i see it.;)


Hope you have no problems with that