Aus v Samoa

Gracelessly Tom

Anyone else watching this game? Unbelievable stuff!! Samoa 12 mins away from a massive massive upset.

Fair play to them as well, more than deserved their win, been the hungrier, better and more determined team throughout the game.

Wales should be sweating now!

Gracelessly Tom

Aussie try! 7 mins left, Samoa lead by 9. Squeaky bum time.

csm

Lovely work by Higginbotham for the try there. You expect that from Quade Cooper but not a flanker!

Gracelessly Tom

Final Score - Australia 23 Samoa 32

Fully deserved win, they never let Australia into the game really. Aus never got a chance to control the match for any length of time and Samoa's defence was full of hard hits and huge effort.

Well worth watching if Sky are showing a repeat later in the day.

Gracelessly Tom

csm wrote: »

Lovely work by Higginbotham for the try there. You expect that from Quade Cooper but not a flanker!

Yeah, lovely skills from him and a class pick up from Giteau.

Judgement Day

23-32 to Samoa. WTF! :eek: Glad I didn't get up for that one and glad that I stayed away from the betting. I thought last night when I looked at the Samoan team sheet that the it looked very different to that which got beaten by Tonga.

Gracelessly Tom

Judgement Day wrote: »

23-32 to Samoa. WTF! :eek: Glad I didn't get up for that one and glad that I stayed away from the betting. I thought last night when I looked at the Samoan team sheet that the it looked very different to that which got beaten by Tonga.

You missed a good game! According to the commentators Samoa sent an experimental team to the Pacific Nations cup and kept the big guns in Sydney for this game.

I have Samoa to get to the RWC 1/4's @ 7/1, into 5/1 after todays game. Threw a fiver on them for the semi's at 35/1 and that's 25/1 now.

Judgement Day

Pool D is going to be an interesting one to watch - especially Wales vs Samoa and Wales vs Fiji. The credibility of Wales as a rugby nation is well and truly on the line. Looking forward to seeing highlights of today's game now.

JustinDee

A different Aussie side will be playing Tri Nations from next week. Samoa always a threat in RWC. Struggle against a strong set-piece gameplan however.

Gracelessly Tom

JustinDee wrote: »

A different Aussie side will be playing Tri Nations from next week. Samoa always a threat in RWC. Struggle against a strong set-piece gameplan however.

Aussie's will be much improved next week. Complacency played a slight part in today's game.

As for Samoa, not sure Wales have that strong set-piece gameplan.

thomond2006

Wow, what a result for Samoa.

JustinDee

Gracelessly Tom wrote: »

Aussie's will be much improved next week. Complacency played a slight part in today's game

A friend texted me from game this morning:
"Oh well. Aussie 2nd XV lost to NZ 3rd XV".

I thought it was funny anyway.

LeeroyJones

Great win for Samoa!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pfpgrSbTJE

GerM

Can't believe I woke up at 4am for this, knocked off the alarm and went back to sleep. Idiot.

There is a large element of a very different Australia side showing up for the Tri-Nations both mentally and in terms of the names on the team sheet but there's no doubting that Deans has to be deeply concerned. Realistically, 6 or 7 of those players are looking at being part of Australia's strongest 15. I would think a few of the players on the pitch just played themselves out of contention for the WC.

We shouldn't be too shocked though. That is not a bad Samoa side whatsoever with a several of them being amongst the top players in the AP. Leo, Stowers, Tuilagi, Pisi, Tagicakibau and Pisi are all players that would get into a lot of strong sides around Europe. Wales will be significantly more worried this morning now that an islander nation has actually managed to translate the talent and power they have into a coherent performance when their stars are available to them.

Anyone comment on the scrum and how it went? That was 2 of the likely Australian front row starting so could be indicative of where they are minus Robinson.

Wollwead

Don't sweat for anyone who didn't get to see the game or forgot to set the sky box to record it, it's on again at 2 this afternoon on sky sports 4.

Gracelessly Tom

GerM wrote: »

Anyone comment on the scrum and how it went? That was 2 of the likely Australian front row starting so could be indicative of where they are minus Robinson.

Scrums were a non-event really, very little happened as far as pushing or dominance was concerned. Both teams held their own and Australia gave the impression they wanted the ball in and out quickly.

Ref gave a few penalties against Samoa for dropping the scrum due to non binding. I thought these calls were harsh (but replays weren't too extensive and didn't give good angles to judge properly). Looked to me like the Aussie TH wasn't making any effort to bind or stay up at the engage but will need to watch it again to confirm. Watching at 6 in the morning meant the brain hadn't fully booted up yet!

One thing I did note from the two packs was that Samoa counter rucked and won Aussie ball on a number of occasions. If Ireland can isolate Aussie runners and/or get numbers to the rucks quickly it is an area we can look to win turnovers from.

Aussies will be a different kettle of fish come RWC time mind you, and after a tough 3N campaign will be battle hardened and unlikely to be caught out as easily as today. Still, signs are there for a possible Irish win and top spot in the group.

One word of caution, Beale looked dangerous when he came on, he's some step on him and is very elusive in the tackle, he'll cause some serious problems if our defence is not on top form.

Stev_o

Not that shocking of a result given the Wallabies side that was out there. Yet again they are shown up for having a light weight backline which won't cut it at the RWC. Their backrow was AWFUL. Elsom is only starting because of his captaincy he was truly invisible.

A strong Samoan side playing at "home" don't think there was any cheers for Australia in that crowd. They ll be even tougher to beat at their 3rd home in New Zealand. Some serious amount of depth in their side too bar OH. Id expect them to qualify in their group.

Funk It

With their Tri Nations opener next weekend against South Africa coming up, it might just be a wake up call that they need. I don't think that Ireland can underestimate any team in our WC group, but there should be no chance of us fearing any of these, even when they are back to full strength. They were missing their star men, but delighted for Samoa, they are looking like a team going places. Elsom has hardly played this year, he needs these games.

Tri Nations leading into a world cup... awesome stuff for the armchair rugby nut

RuggieBear

the thompson try was awesome. good hands and the two 2nd rows combining to score.

JustinDee

On the breakdown, way too much leniency on players over-running the ruck. Its a Kiwi tactic. Hit ruck hard and fast then when over defenders side, take defender with you away from ruck any way possible.
Illegal and frustrating to see unpunished.

JustinDee

Stev_o wrote: »

Elsom is only starting because of his captaincy he was truly invisible

His main job all day was to get in the face of Stowers. Bar the Thompson try and one other run, he did it pretty well, especially considering the amount of rugby he has missed.

Zambia

Watching it now on the 9 Replay ....this bodes well for Irish chances. Aussie press not happy.

JustinDee

Zambia wrote: »

Watching it now on the 9 Replay ....this bodes well for Irish chances. Aussie press not happy.

Aussie press never are happy. They're as fairweather as the few Aussie union fans there are still following the game.

Aidric

Gracelessly Tom wrote: »

Wales should be sweating now!

Gracelessly Tom wrote: »

I have Samoa to get to the RWC 1/4's @ 7/1, into 5/1 after todays game. Threw a fiver on them for the semi's at 35/1 and that's 25/1 now.

So they rack up one win against a second string Australian side and now the whole rugby world has turned on it's axis. You have to love this reactionary stuff.

JustinDee

Aidric wrote: »

So they rack up one win against a second string Australian side and now the whole rugby world has turned on it's axis. You have to love this reactionary stuff.

Wales have been worried since the draw. Horrible group they're in.

basillarkin

Gracelessly Tom wrote: »

Scrums were a non-event really, very little happened as far as pushing or dominance was concerned. Both teams held their own and Australia gave the impression they wanted the ball in and out quickly.

Ref gave a few penalties against Samoa for dropping the scrum due to non binding. I thought these calls were harsh (but replays weren't too extensive and didn't give good angles to judge properly). Looked to me like the Aussie TH wasn't making any effort to bind or stay up at the engage but will need to watch it again to confirm. Watching at 6 in the morning meant the brain hadn't fully booted up yet!

One thing I did note from the two packs was that Samoa counter rucked and won Aussie ball on a number of occasions. If Ireland can isolate Aussie runners and/or get numbers to the rucks quickly it is an area we can look to win turnovers from.

Aussies will be a different kettle of fish come RWC time mind you, and after a tough 3N campaign will be battle hardened and unlikely to be caught out as easily as today. Still, signs are there for a possible Irish win and top spot in the group.

One word of caution, Beale looked dangerous when he came on, he's some step on him and is very elusive in the tackle, he'll cause some serious problems if our defence is not on top form.

Beale is a class act, but will he play at 15? Cooper defends at 15 for the Reds but that is unlikely to happen for the Aussies. Il take a stab at naming there back-line for the RWC. 9. Genia 10. Cooper 11. O'Connor/Ioane 12. Giteau 13. McCabe/Adam-Ashley/O'Connor 14. Mitchell(if fit)/Ioane/O'Connor 15. Beale

What are peoples opinions of this backline?

danthefan

basillarkin wrote: »

Beale is a class act, but will he play at 15? Cooper defends at 15 for the Reds but that is unlikely to happen for the Aussies. Il take a stab at naming there back-line for the RWC. 9. Genia 10. Cooper 11. O'Connor/Ioane 12. Giteau 13. McCabe/Adam-Ashley/O'Connor 14. Mitchell(if fit)/Ioane/O'Connor 15. Beale

What are peoples opinions of this backline?

It's Cooper's non defence that has him sometimes standing at 15, they don't want big runners down his channel.

Beale as you said is a class act, last summer he was the form 15 in the world imo, no doubt he'll be starting at 15.

Zambia

Mate if you stuck a yellow jersey on a donkey the aussies would back it in in a horse race. They would also expect a win.

I would not write off union here just yet.

basillarkin

Zambia wrote: »

Mate if you stuck a yellow jersey on a donkey the aussies would back it in in a horse race. They would also expect a win.

I would not write off union here just yet.

I played for a couple of years with St.Ives in North Sydney and enjoyed it immensly, I even brought the hurls to a training session to show some of the Aussie lads, but attendances have been well down this year for Super Rugby in Sydney, even though they were still well in it right up to the end. Im not sure how the club rugby is there at the minute.

JustinDee

Zambia wrote: »

I would not write off union here just yet.

Aussie union needs a 'Sloe, Tri Nations or RWC win badly. Even that bananas hybrid game Ned Flanders and Mark Ella are popping up in support of, is not enough.
State of the game in Australia is a worry.

sock puppet

Entertaining game. Second string or not they were crap at the breakdown and it's a problem Australia have had for years no matter who they pick. I lost count of the amount of times there wasn't a single Australian forward contesting the ruck. Turning down the shots at goal reeked of arrogance too. Phibbs was shockingly bad. I expected him to be much better. I thought Vickerman had a decent cameo however. Compared to some of the others you wouldn't think it was him who'd spent the past 3 years playing amateur rugby.

Aidric wrote: »

So they rack up one win against a second string Australian side and now the whole rugby world has turned on it's axis. You have to love this reactionary stuff.

Nah people have been talking up Samoa for ages.

PhatPiggins

JustinDee wrote: »

Aussie union needs a 'Sloe, Tri Nations or RWC win badly. Even that bananas hybrid game Ned Flanders and Mark Ella are popping up in support of, is not enough.
State of the game in Australia is a worry.

They need to grasp the obvious truth that fans aren't going to pay to watch games against NZ 5 times a season

Gracelessly Tom

Aidric wrote: »

So they rack up one win against a second string Australian side and now the whole rugby world has turned on it's axis. You have to love this reactionary stuff.

If you had been reading the threads on here you'll see that myself and many others have been talking about Samoa finishing ahead of Wales in their group for quite some time now. As I had my bets on Samoa well before this game it's hardly reactionary stuff.:rolleyes:

Hardly a second string side either, 6 or 7 of these guys will start against us in the RWC.

JustinDee

Didn't start with first-choice tight-five, backrow, halfback, centres, wings or fullback.
That's a second-string XV. Three or four of that team will be likely start in TriNations.
Not a prob though. That's what these games are for.

sock puppet

JustinDee wrote: »

Didn't start with first-choice tight-five, backrow, halfback, centres, wings or fullback.
That's a second-string XV. Three or four of that team will be likely start in TriNations.
Not a prob though. That's what these games are for.

Do you mean three or four in light of today's loss? Because I would have thought more than that would start before the game anyway.

Gracelessly Tom

JustinDee wrote: »

Didn't start with first-choice tight-five, backrow, halfback, centres, wings or fullback.
That's a second-string XV. Three or four of that team will be likely start in TriNations.
Not a prob though. That's what these games are for.

After today's performance a few of them probably played themselves out of contention but don't see how you can say none of the team today will start in the RWC against us. Two of the front row, Elsom, Ioane, Ashley Cooper could start and Giteau, Sharpe and McCalman are not beyond the realms of possible selections either.

JustinDee

sock puppet wrote: »

Do you mean three or four in light of today's loss? Because I would have thought more than that would start before the game anyway.

Nope. I meant from initial selection.
One front rower (Alexander), lock (Sharpe), backrower (Elsom), and possibly both centres. Giteau would be likely nr.21. I defo wouldn't start with Ioane who is great in attack but smarts-wise and in defence I've never rated.

.

GerM

Aidric wrote: »

So they rack up one win against a second string Australian side and now the whole rugby world has turned on it's axis. You have to love this reactionary stuff.

You obviously haven't paid much attention to rugby in the past year then. Whilst few expected it to be Australia in Sydney, a big scalp has been coming Samoa's way for a while. They gave us a good rattle in Dublin, were beating England at half time before losing by a couple of scores and lost in Scotland due to the last kick of the game. They've a group of players that are key players in top sides across Europe. Stowers, Mapasua, Johnston, Leo, Tuilagi and Paulo amongst others. When they actually manage to get their best players together for a stretch of time, they can be a very dangerous side. I expect 6 of that Australian side to start against us in the WC.

The bet on them to come out of the group ahead of Wales is a very tempting one given the generous odds and where the respective sides are right now; Samoa are on the crest of a wave and Wales are in turmoil with players escaping the country and constantly in trouble off the pitch.

GerM

JustinDee wrote: »

Nope. I meant from initial selection.
One front rower (Alexander), lock (Sharpe), backrower (Elsom), and possibly both centres. Giteau would be likely nr.21. I defo wouldn't start with Ioane who is great in attack but smarts-wise and in defence I've never rated.

.

Moore not to be involved either? I'd reckon Moore, Alexander, Sharpe, Elsom, AAC and either Giteau or Ioane depending on how they end up using JOC. Basing this on Mitchell and Barnes both not being available.

JustinDee

GerM wrote: »

Moore not to be involved either? I'd reckon Moore, Alexander, Sharpe, Elsom, AAC and either Giteau or Ioane depending on how they end up using JOC. Basing this on Mitchell and Barnes both not being available.

For some reason or other, Moore keeps getting edged out. Unless Giteau rediscovers form in TriNations, I see him on bench.

basillarkin

JustinDee wrote: »

For some reason or other, Moore keeps getting edged out. Unless Giteau rediscovers form in TriNations, I see him on bench.

Giteau had a good Super Rugby season imo and is well worth his place in the backline, he is far better at defending than Cooper but he is more likely to be used at 12.
Who do you see starting in the centre? It is a pity that Mitchell is likely to miss out as himself and Beale in the back three are a serious threat going forward.
I have watched alot of rugby this season in both hemispheres and Beale has been the standout player for me although Fruean started off his super 15 campagin brilliantly also.
Really looking forward to this world cup. I have been to the last two but due to lack of funds and returning to college I will not be travelling to New Zealand, although I did make the Lions tour there in 05.
Will this be the year that the All Blacks finally man up?

Judgement Day

I can't see where manning up comes into it as the ABs have a second to none record against all comers with a 75% win rate. The only country to nearly (!) man up to New Zealand is South Africa. England have managed 6 wins; Wales 3; Ireland & Scotland 0 and even the Lions (the combined might of the British Isles) have only managed 6 wins. Not bad for chokers.

thomond2006

Judgement Day wrote: »

I can't see where manning up comes into it as the ABs have a second to none record against all comers with a 75% win rate. The only country to nearly (!) man up to New Zealand is South Africa. England have managed 6 wins; Wales 3; Ireland & Scotland 0 and even the Lions (the combined might of the British Isles) have only managed 6 wins. Not bad for chokers.

That will mean nothing to kiwis if the All Blacks lose one match which knocks them out.

jolley123

Judgement Day wrote: »

I can't see where manning up comes into it

Basically by manning up, he's referring to the trend of NZ choking come WC.

Stev_o

JustinDee wrote: »

Aussie union needs a 'Sloe, Tri Nations or RWC win badly. Even that bananas hybrid game Ned Flanders and Mark Ella are popping up in support of, is not enough.
State of the game in Australia is a worry.

Rumour has it Robbie Deans and Ricky Stuart share tactics on how to win games.

JustinDee

Judgement Day wrote: »

I can't see where manning up comes into it as the ABs have a second to none record against all comers with a 75% win rate. The only country to nearly (!) man up to New Zealand is South Africa. England have managed 6 wins; Wales 3; Ireland & Scotland 0 and even the Lions (the combined might of the British Isles) have only managed 6 wins. Not bad for chokers.

As you already know, in a RWC context, they have only one RWC win. Same as England and less than Australia and South Africa.

Pressure on them to win at home is massive. One of the two reasons that Steve Hansen constantly moans in the press about opponents, laws of the game and referees.

jank

Great to be at this game yesterday. The locals in the crowd looked very glum but recogonised they were beaten by a better side. Some very hard hits in the game something ireland may need to do to stop the dangerous Australian running game. It will be interesting what SA will do now next week. TBH I think NZ will walk the world cup as there is no side capable of beating them even on an off day.

JustinDee

jank wrote: »

TBH I think NZ will walk the world cup as there is no side capable of beating them even on an off day.

There never is . . .

Gracelessly Tom

jank wrote: »

TBH I think NZ will walk the world cup as there is no side capable of beating them even on an off day.

This is just simply not true. They have been beaten in the last year for example, and not necessarily on off days. France, when they click, are pretty much an unstoppable force and have proven in the past that the almighty All Blacks can, and have, been beaten in RWC's, even without having off days. South Africa at full strength are an awesome force as well and well capable of beating NZ. While Australia are also capable of beating them, after yesterday's result (even without many first choice players) it's a little more difficult to give credence to that possibility.

To say that NZ are unbeatable even when playing poorly is utter rubbish IMO.

crazyderk

[QUOTE=. TBH I think NZ will walk the world cup as there is no side capable of beating them even on an off day.[/QUOTE]

Is it my imagination or do Nz tend to start at full speed in previous WC's? getting scores of over 100 when its not needed, i.e playing Canada or something. Then when they are out of their pool, they're knackered also suffering from 1 or 2 injuries and then bam they're beaten by the likes of Australia of SA

Legion2008

No, it's more that they're undercooked .... they don't get a decent challenge during the pool stages and therefore are not fully at the pace of the game in the knockout stages.

Last time round Scotland didn't bother trying against them with the result being that when they came up against the french they were a bit below par. I've seen articles suggesting that the french are contemplating not putting out a serious side in the pool stages this time round