Photography Association

smelltheglove

I have had it up to here with it all, I blame OLD Goat for planting the seed but I am determined now to set up an association, but I have not got a clue, have a couple of pages of a website designed, anyone want to get involved and help out?

I do not know what is required to register an association, I can handle a mission statement, I want to ensure that IF there needs to be fees they will be as low as possible.

If this too awkward? Can we actually arrange these between boardsies? Most of us are here to help each other out and this would just be another level of help, obviously I would not be interested in including a forum, I love boards too much.

SO what we would need to start is someone who can handle registering the association, if that needs to be done and I guess take it from there.

OldGoat

Perhaps a post in Entrepreneruial & Business Managment forum would give some answers or at least pointers to the right questions to ask.
As for going ahead and looking into it, fair play. Hope you can make it work.
I'd like to apply for membership.

smelltheglove

OldGoat wrote: »

Perhaps a post in Entrepreneruial & Business Managment forum would give some answers or at least pointers to the right questions to ask.
As for going ahead and looking into it, fair play. Hope you can make it work.
I'd like to apply for membership.

Arent you the smart and informative one, I will have to award you with honorary membership;)

squareballoon

I'd like to apply for membership too (unless the membership fees are eleventy hundred euro)

Lagnagoushee

Apologies to Groucho Marx....but......."I don’t care to belong to any association that will have me as a member".

Sounds interesting.........

+1 for the idea.

smelltheglove

Well if nobody wants to help I hereby declare myself Queen of things that are associated with my recognised association:p

Paulw

I recognise your association. And if you're really nice to me (and don't charge me), I might just join your association.

squareballoon

all hail queen Rachel!

Borderfox

Me too, but in the spirit of elitist snobbery, can you close off membership now

smelltheglove

Ok so my membership is at

Eas
PaulW
Borderfox
Old Goat
Squareballon
Lagnagoushee
and of course Queen Rachel

OldGoat

smelltheglove wrote: »

Well if nobody wants to help I hereby declare myself Queen of things that are associated with my recognised association:p

I propose Rachael (SmellTheGlove and Queen of all things) as Chairperson of said association. Do I hear a second?

Paulw

OldGoat wrote: »

I propose Rachael (SmellTheGlove and Queen of all things) as Chairperson of said association. Do I hear a second?

Ah sure I've nothing else to say for now, so I'll second that.

Consider the association formed. :rolleyes:

smelltheglove

Haha this could actually be quite fun. The website is almost complete! I will probably have to register the name before I say it online to ensure nobody else registers it, I have even decided the titles I will give to my members.

PCPhoto

I want in ..I want in !!!

Who do I need to blackmail ?...ahem...I mean photo .... I mean erm.... where do I sign ?

smelltheglove

Site is almost ready to go so I will give you all notice as soon as it is live.

PCPhoto

I have 2 ID card printers ...for Membership cards...make it look all professional and stuff !!

EDIT: Hard plastic ID cards....not a piece of paper laminated.

dakar

National Association of Photographers of Ireland has a nice ring to it...

PCPhoto

im wondering why the wink.... that name is taken... naip

Paulw

I have a big question, before I join .... will my L from SISLP carry over to your new association? Will I still be able to put letters after my name?

smelltheglove

Well as I have never been a member of an association although I would like to I do not know how to run that.

Paul if you would like to take hold of that department you would be more than welcome.

PC, how much does it cost for membership cards? I am hoping to be able to do this with no membership fee, maybe if the members could join and place an order for a membership card??? That way the membership is free and they are only paying for their card and if we go ahead with the L as Paul mentioned etc they would pay maybe a nominal fee on entry to cover costs of judges etc.

PCPhoto

costs me about a euro per card (then its just a matter of designing a template and putting pics into template...then print)

smelltheglove

Not bad. I am going to call a few people tomorrow and see what I need to do to register, if I need to do tax returns etc if it is non profit. AT least if I could start it off for free it would be great, then if it cost too much money to run at least I could introduce a nominal yearly fee of up to say €10 or something. I reckon though if it is a free service there shouldnt be any hassle with people just paying via paypal or something for their membership card and postage, say maybe €2.

So would you be into selling one of those printers or helping out by taking over the membership card side?

dakar

PCPhoto wrote: »

im wondering why the wink.... that name is taken... naip

I may have been poking a little fun. NAPI, not NAIP...

Edit: poking fun at those other organisations that is. I think this is a good idea. Fair play STG

PCPhoto

are they still in operation ??? ... I think they set up around March ...but have not heard anything since then.

smelltheglove

PCPhoto wrote: »

are they still in operation ??? ... I think they set up around March ...but have not heard anything since then.

Check out their site, http://www.naip.ie/ scroll down to the red print.

smelltheglove

Also is anyone handy enough at doing some sort of logo, lets make this a real boardsie association and all get involved somehow eh:D

PCPhoto

smelltheglove wrote: »

Check out their site, http://www.naip.ie/ scroll down to the red print.

the part where they say they are active ? or the part where they say every member must show proof of insurance to work in a hotel ?

smelltheglove

I was ipressed by the part where they say both part time and full time photogs should have insurance and their contact with hotels was to discourage weekend warriors..... sure arent the part timers the ones the haters like to call weekend warriors....

CabanSail

Can I join and thereby make this an International Association?

smelltheglove

Anyone got a nice landscape pic that would like to offer for the home page? Maybe a pic of photography equipment or of someone lining up a shot or something?

Block G Raptor

Id Love to Join. I'm Founder/CEO of the ITB Photographic Society (ITBPhotoSoc)so any assistance i can offer I'm glad to help

pearljamfan

can i join up too!

smelltheglove

Thanks for the offer Block.

3 things I still need, any help appreciated from anyone:

A shot for the home page

An application form

To find out if this needs to be declared to the tax man...

kensutz

Ooh I want in!

squareballoon

I'd be rubbish for a landscape picture I'm afraid. I would think that unless the company is charging a membership fee and is running for profit it is unlikely to be liable for tax. You may have to register the name though to get an .ie address.

landsleaving

How will you decide who can join? Other than boards posters? Will there be some sort of test or vetting of people to see if they can actually use a camera with some level of proficiency?

If not, I'd like to join

Kbeg3

I'd definitely join

smelltheglove

I was thinking of just having seperate ametuer and professional divisions, to apply for professional status you would need to be insured I suppose. I am not 100% on exactly how it will work, I have the site almost finished and I reckon when I am ready to show it off I can add the link here and you guys can just let me know if you think anything needs to be changed before going live.

pearljamfan

this is something i did a while ago, prob a bit boring tho (its a keyring on my sunroof) maybe you could feature different peoples photos on it every month or something instead of sticking to one??

heres some application forms that could be copied possibly..
http://home.the-aop.org/Join_the_AOP

CabanSail

How about IIPA as a name?

International Independent Photographers Association.

oshead

smelltheglove wrote: »

I was thinking of just having seperate ametuer and professional divisions, to apply for professional status you would need to be insured I suppose. I am not 100% on exactly how it will work, I have the site almost finished and I reckon when I am ready to show it off I can add the link here and you guys can just let me know if you think anything needs to be changed before going live.

This is just like the book/movie Animal farm. Before you know it, you'll be holding AGM's and visiting the hotels demanding that your members who are "rank amateurs" should not be allowed to photograph weddings due to them not holding an insurance certificate.

OldGoat

Us rank amateurs appricate our seperation from the money grubbing souless corporate 'togs who have whored themselves for pieces of copper coin and have lost touch with the pure love and artistry of the artform that is artistic photography in their lust for filthy lucre*. :cool:


*Yes, I'm STILL waiting to make that first sale

oshead

OldGoat wrote: »

Us rank amateurs appricate our seperation from the money grubbing souless corporate 'togs who have whored themselves for pieces of copper coin and have lost touch with the pure love and artistry of the artform that is artistic photography in their lust for filthy lucre*. :cool:


*Yes, I'm STILL waiting to make that first sale

That's a difficult read above the rumble of hunger pains coming from my stomach....

oshead

Btw, if you're eager to make a sale, it's simple really.:) Just identify the lowest common denominator, Ie... one step up from the gutter and channel all your efforts into producing something for them. Then build from there.

smelltheglove

oshead wrote: »

This is just like the book/movie Animal farm. Before you know it, you'll be holding AGM's and visiting the hotels demanding that your members who are "rank amateurs" should not be allowed to photograph weddings due to them not holding an insurance certificate.

My main aim for it is not to be lobbying for rights for professional photographers or holding agms or competitions aka qualifications but to actually present photography as a welcoming and enjoyable industry.

I mean if an influx of photographers is reducing your workflow you need to adapt by offering better quality at a reaosnable price not by trying to shove those photographers out. If your work is appreciated well enough and you can move with the times then really you should not have too much of an issue in staying in the industry.

oshead

Up to this point in the thread, there's been so much populous crap it's a little hard to believe. There.... I said it.... :cool:

They obviously have a mandate from their members and the industry best interests at heart. So collectively, they've agreed to try and set some standards and best practices. A lot of them have been photographers for a great many years and are entitled to try what they believe is correct and protect their industry and income.

Weather you agree with it or not. That's not the issue. As you know, every Tom, Dick and Harry these days with a DSLR is a wedding photographer. That whats wrong with the industry. The influx of blow-ins are blowing the industry apart. Brides can spend 2-3 grand on a wedding dress yet, won't spend more than a few hundred euro on a life time of memories. Whose fault do you think that is?

With the aid of advancing technology, The Tom, Dick and Harry's of this world have taken the value out of wedding photography. Anyone can try it and declare that they are a pro. All you need is a 1000D and a kit lens. What about formal qualification's or peer recognition, insurance, evidence of a proper business structure, tax clearance certs or evens proper professional gear.

If you want to setup up an association that has the best interests of the industry at it's heart then you should make all those things your priority. Aim to start on the right footing and continue along that path. Otherwise you'll set up a Quasi-Professional Association with an Amateur Ethos.

Promac

Love the idea - will happily pay for a nice plastic card with a picture that says I belong somewhere!

superflyninja

ooohhh if there is a rank amateur section would be of interest!!! However being such a rank amateur ive no idea what the benefits of such an association would be?

smelltheglove

oshead wrote: »

Up to this point in the thread, there's been so much populous crap it's a little hard to believe. There.... I said it.... :cool:

They obviously have a mandate from their members and the industry best interests at heart. So collectively, they've agreed to try and set some standards and best practices. A lot of them have been photographers for a great many years and are entitled to try what they believe is correct and protect their industry and income.

And everyone is entitled to their opinion, you think the idea of an open association for people who love photography and are genuinely welcomed is 'populas crap' whereas I think an association trying to drive newcomers out of the industry is pathetic, with all due respect the number of years someone is in an industry has no relevance really, sure someone could claim to be a photographer for 20 years and still produce crap.

The industry does need a bit of protecting alright, it needs protecting from the reputation it has of being uninviting and unwelcoming.

Adrian.Sadlier

Oh this is a REAL Irish association - a split before the formation

landsleaving

As one of the rank amateurs this is a bit of a strange one for me. I like the idea of the industry being more open if it is as uninviting as it's described - obviously I have no idea if it is either way, but the work of pros does need protection. If you have an association with clearly defined 'pro' and 'amateur' sections, do you only allow the pros to take on paid work?

I think there's plenty you could do, but it needs clearer definition. If the pro photographers have to be working two years to be described as such, what about fresh graduates of photography courses who have strong portfolios? Aren't you putting a massive barrier in front of them? You'd almost need a separate section for them if you still want to maintain that time limit, since they're hardly just a random punter with a DSLR.

What i'd do, and this is just me with no experience of running anything, except running away from an angry dog once, is feature very, very prominently a well-written outline of why it makes sense to go with a pro. Allow the amateurs to upload a portfolio and take work, but remind people the risk of results being less than satisfactory. Then after an amateur has a reasonable level of experience (time x jobs x portfolio) move them into the pro category. Maybe give photography graduates a fast track of sorts, from a category of their own.

If you can allow amateurs to offer their services at a reduced rate, but with the proviso that they must use some of their work for portfolio building (people who don't want their image featured in a portfolio would have to go pro) and must charge a rate that doesn't undercut the pros by so much that no one would pay the extra, then with a bit of publicity you could definitely have a working organisation, which can offer certain standards without alienating the average person. Oh and amateurs would have to provide a standardised size of portfolio before being allowed join, I think that would weed out anyone who might harm the association's reputation.

Anyways, just my uneducated opinion on the matter!