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Streaming could become illegal!

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  • 30-06-2011 10:26am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 7,499 ✭✭✭


    A recent bill (S. 978) could make streaming illegal. The bill, titled Commercial Felony Streaming Act"), brings the penalties for illegal streaming in line with the penalties for illegal downloading. While gamers and streamers have had a harmonious relationship with game developers, it may no longer be an option. If it becomes a criminal matter, then LEGALLY, only those with a license from the developer will be free to stream.....All others, could face jail time.

    Excellent article from UltraDavid (the fighting game community's attorney at law :) )

    http://shoryuken.com/2011/06/29/trolling-the-stream-by-ultradavid/
    UltraDavid wrote:
    David “UltraDavid” Graham (for Shoryuken.com) explains why, if bill S.978 passes, you could be jailed for streaming video games, or even uploading them to youtube;

    The United States Senate is in the process of considering bill S.978, a bill “To amend the criminal penalty provision for criminal infringement of a copyright,” or as you might know it, the Anti-Streaming Bill. There’s been some discussion about what it really means and how it would affect stuff we care about, so I’d like to clear everything up. To be blunt, if passed it would pretty significantly reconfigure American copyright law in ways that could honestly really hurt internet culture in general and our video game communities specifically.

    So what does it do? Its stated purpose is to attack the online streaming of copyrighted works, specifically films and live television. It tries to do this by criminalizing some electronically transmitted (read: internet) public performances of copyrighted works.

    Background: the law is split into criminal law and civil law. In (very) short, criminal is for things designated as crimes (like murder and theft), can involve jail time, and is handled by the government, whereas civil law covers everything else, doesn’t involve the risk of jail, and can only be sued over by whatever entity actually got screwed. Copyright law has both criminal and civil law sides, but with a few significant exceptions copyright mostly sticks to civil law in practice. That means that only the copyright owner can sue you for infringement, and the worst thing that can usually happen is that you either get a cease and desist letter and stop what you’re doing or you pay the copyright owner some dough. While that can be really costly (up to $150k per infringement, although that’s very uncommon), you can’t get sent to jail.

    More background: there are four major exclusive rights granted to copyright holders, including the exclusive rights to reproduce a copyrighted work, to distribute it, to modify it, and to perform or display it. Streaming a copyrighted video game audiovisual work can involve all four of those rights, but most obviously it’s a performance of that work transmitted to members of the online public. Infringements of the performance right have only ever been handled by civil law, that is, subject only to getting shut down or to paying the copyright owner some money; there’s never ever been a criminal penalty for an unlicensed performance of a copyrighted work. This bill breaks with all previous copyright history and tradition by criminalizing some unauthorized performances. Here’s the text: http://t.co/eAgrD96.

    According to the bill as it’s currently written, if you engage in “public performances by electronic means” 10 or more times over a 180 day period, and if either the total economic value of those performances exceeds $2500 or the cost of getting the copyright holder’s permission to perform exceeds $5000, then you can potentially get fined and put in jail for 5 years. Jail. FIVE YEARS.

    Just to hit you over the head with this, that means that if you stream a game like Street Fighter 4 or Starcraft 2 (or a movie or a song etc) only 10 or more times in a full half year, and if you make a bit of money doing it, you either need to have a license from Capcom or Blizzard etc or you risk going to jail.

    Amusingly slash horrifyingly enough, it gets worse. The wording of this bill is so vague that “performance” could count for a crap-ton of what we who understand the internet would consider very different things. The offense is defined super broadly: “public performance by electronic means.” That includes live streaming of copyrighted audiovisual works, of course, but it almost certainly also includes recorded YouTube videos of copyrighted audiovisual works, whether they be match vids, game footage/live shot hybrids, movies, TV shows, music, and so on. Going off other legal precedent, it might even cover embedding an infringing YouTube vid and videos of kids lip syncing to music.

    In essence, a bill intended to limit the unauthorized live streaming of films and TV could result in potential jail time for a lot of people doing very different things. While the bill’s sponsors might not have known how wide-ranging its effect could be at first, they’ve been confronted with that since the text was released and they show no signs of pulling it back.
    What about the monetary limits? Well, they actually aren’t that high. If you don’t think our major streamers, casters, and uploaders make $2500 over a full half a year, you’re crazy. Keep in mind, the wording of the bill is “the total economic value of such public performances to the infringer or to the copyright owner.” Total, meaning revenue from live streaming, plus revenue for replays, plus compensation by a tournament for coming to stream in the first place, and so on. And economic value, as in not net profit but just the amount of revenue coming in.

    Because almost every use of an audiovisual work online can be considered a public performance, this might drastically change how people behave online. No longer is the penalty for uploading infringing videos just getting shut down or having to pay the copyright owner. If the vids become popular, you might go to jail.

    Now, obviously some companies, including video game publishers like Capcom and Blizzard, tend to take a hands-off approach to the constant unauthorized streams and replays our scenes pump out. So why worry? Surely they wouldn’t send us to jail.

    But that’s only in a world where the performance right is merely a civil law provision, where the only ones who can bust infringers are copyright owners. Jamming the performance right into criminal law means that the government gets involved and gets to decide whether to bring charges on its own. Whereas for now video game publishers can (and usually do) let infringing live streams and replays slide, in the future the government might be able to bring criminal charges regardless of whether the copyright holder says to. In practice the government tends not to go after infringers unless notified by copyright holders, but if it wants to it can go after infringers anyway.
    I don’t want to be too alarmist here. It strikes me as very unlikely that the government would take the time and money to put someone in jail for streaming a Marvel vs Capcom 3 tournament. But since this would be a totally new thing, I can’t say for sure; I don’t think anyone can. I also don’t think it’s a great idea to ever play Russian roulette, regardless of whether the gun has a hundred chambers or ten thousand.

    I think the consequences for our relationship with video game copyright holders are obvious. It would no longer be good enough that Capcom takes a hands off approach to us publicly performing their copyrighted works, because the government could still bust us if it wants. I can’t imagine that many people would risk jail time by engaging in publicly viewable, easily findable unauthorized performances like tournament streams or popular YouTube vids. The result might be that the only people streaming or putting up replays are those who have licenses from copyright holders explicitly allowing them to do so.

    And I think that would be a disaster for our culture. It means the gut gets slit right out of our media side, because while having a few big names and groups is great, without voluntary participation by whoever wants to be involved I feel like we’ll lose a huge portion of the vibrant, fast-moving dynamism that I love about our scenes. Maybe we’ll be able to get permission easily, but in my personal experience it’s been anything but easy for video game copyright owners to grant licenses.

    When I was writing this, one of my friends said, “Dude, but like, you’re a lawyer who practices this exact kind of law. Aren’t you like totally stoked that pretty much every streamer and uploader ever is gonna need to pay you to get all licenses and stuff for them from Capcom and Blizzard and Microsoft and all that?” No, that would suck. Would I trade the viability of my community for some dollars? EAD.

    I think a good chunk of what this is about is just the old guard not understanding what’s happening nowadays. Technology like free, instant, and relatively simple mass streaming or uploading by anyone to infinite viewers all over the world is just… really new. And I think the entertainment industry has no idea how to approach that, so instead of taking advantage of it themselves, they’d rather make sure everyone else has a hard time coming in instead.

    Companies like Capcom are starting to understand how streaming or casting tournaments and match footage can be really positive for them, but they don’t know how to do it themselves, so they let us do it instead. But traditional film and television companies, who are the real drivers behind this bill, have even less of a clue. It seems natural to us that if we can watch a show on live TV we should be able to watch it live on our computers too, but that’s barely even on the radar for TV companies. The vacuum left between how we want to watch shows and how the content publishers want to give them to us has been taken up by streamers, and that makes the streamers money and the copyright owners mad.

    Even worse, the people in government are so clueless as to how to approach all this that they’re letting themselves get run over by an old industry attempting to destroy or seriously harm the development of newer technologically literate communities. They have no thought for how copyright owners can benefit from streamers rebroadcasting live TV, usually complete with ads and all, to people who don’t have TV and otherwise wouldn’t be able to see the content or the ads. They don’t consider how video game community streamers, casters, and uploaders are making games more popular and valuable, or how they’re filling vacuums of competition and entertainment that the older entertainment companies are simply incapable of filling themselves. They just have this knee-jerk, 2nd millennium theory of copyright and ownership that reacts very negatively to any loss of control.

    This is not law yet. Quick recap if you don’t know how a bill is passed here: one house of Congress (either the House of Representatives or the Senate) has to pass a bill, then the other house has to pass it, then the President has to sign it. Each house has committees, or sub-groups that specialize in certain areas, that have to agree on bills before the rest of the house decides whether to actually pass it. All that’s happened so far with this bill is that it’s been agreed to by its committee.

    But the good money is on it being passed. It enjoys bipartisan support; it was cosponsored by two Democrats and a Republican. Its goals were identified and proposed by the Obama administration. And if anyone in government is on the fence, it has the weight of very significant traditional entertainment industry lobbying behind it.

    Tl;dr: This is not a good look. I don’t know how to yell loud enough to the government that this is a huge mistake, but man, I really feel like we have to try. [Editor's Note: Head over to Demand Progress to make your voice heard in just one click, you lazy bum]


    My question or concern is: does it apply only to those streaming from America, or could it affect people worldwide streaming American content (or worse, anything at all!)?

    🤪



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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,169 ✭✭✭Sagat06


    Dont america run the internet? and the world?

    Could the developers not write it into their user agreement a sort of permission slip to stream? I dont imagine Capcom, Arc or Namco would want to stop the exposure they get from the streams.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,239 ✭✭✭UberPrinny_Baal


    From Ultradavid's previous articles I know that Capcom already had full writes to pull permisions (like with E.Ryu and Oni leak) or outright sue people publishing footage of any of their games to youtube.

    They just choose not to because exposure like that leads to more interest which leads to more sales.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,499 ✭✭✭Sabre0001


    From Ultradavid's previous articles I know that Capcom already had full writes to pull permisions (like with E.Ryu and Oni leak) or outright sue people publishing footage of any of their games to youtube.

    They just choose not to because exposure like that leads to more interest which leads to more sales.

    I think the issue, from the article, is that it was a civil law matter before whereas if the bill gets passed it becomes criminal law. i.e. Police and Government step in...It was previously up to copyright owner (i.e. Capcom) to step in and show they were unhappy.

    🤪



  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    Just to hit you over the head with this, that means that if you stream a game like Street Fighter 4 or Starcraft 2 (or a movie or a song etc) only 10 or more times in a full half year, and if you make a bit of money doing it, you either need to have a license from Capcom or Blizzard etc or you risk going to jail.


    Phew, good thing I don't make a penny.


    And don't live in America.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,169 ✭✭✭Sagat06


    I'd imagine this will just stop me watching thinks like footy or boxin, well hopefully it wont come in before the David Haye fight at the weekend anyway lol


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  • Registered Users Posts: 18,703 ✭✭✭✭K.O.Kiki


    If this means no Evo stream... then FVCK AMERICA.


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    Sagat06 wrote: »
    I'd imagine this will just stop me watching thinks like footy or boxin, well hopefully it wont come in before the David Haye fight at the weekend anyway lol

    It's an American law. AFAIR alot of streaming websites have already moved to Eastern European countries anyway.

    Not that I condone this type of behaviour Sagat :P
    K.O.Kiki wrote: »
    If this means no Evo stream... then FVCK AMERICA.

    I would say Evo will likely get an official licence from Capcom anyway. It's the smaller streams which will be buggered, and people like me, as no doubt youtube will no longer be able to tolerate video game footage.


  • Registered Users Posts: 684 ✭✭✭Ken B


    Sagat06 wrote: »
    I'd imagine this will just stop me watching thinks like footy or boxin, well hopefully it wont come in before the David Haye fight at the weekend anyway lol
    That's what the pub is for......:D

    And please, refer to it as the Wladimr Klitschko fight, thanks.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,239 ✭✭✭UberPrinny_Baal


    If this passes, I think this will probably affect us as much as any other US centric law - Not at all personally (Unless youtube self regulate), but definitely affect the stuff we consume (Team Spooky steams, Excellent Adventures).

    In Ireland this stuff isn't really enforced by law to my knowledge, but we do have special interest media groups who bully useless companies like Eircom (God I hate Eircom) into agreeing to give slower service or suspended service for customers who break certain rules.

    I'm on NTL, and they actually fought this stuff in court, so anyone who is also a customer should probably be fine (for now).

    I obviously can't speak for the Northie lads though, I have no idea what the deal is in the UK.


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    If this passes, I think this will probably affect us as much as any other US centric law - Not at all personally (Unless youtube self regulate), but definitely affect the stuff we consume (Team Spooky steams, Excellent Adventures).

    It will affect me and us all right, youtube operate under US law.

    What this might see is a shift to using services in another country.

    This won't help content providers in America, but to be honest I cannot see that law existing in that form for too long without workarounds being found.

    Also, I am shocked google is not fighting this- the only reason yt is still up and running is because the DMCA is the prevalent law and take down notices work. What happens if virtually every piece of footage there could lead to an enforced legal prosecution?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,239 ✭✭✭UberPrinny_Baal


    What happens if virtually every piece of footage there could lead to an enforced legal prosecution?

    This is the thing that makes me wonder.

    If there is, lets say, a potentially infinite amount of footage online, all of which is CRIMINALLY illegal; what government department is going to have the time to check and take legal action against all of this with finite time and resources?


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,070 ✭✭✭Placebo


    Back in my day there were no streams or youtube, we had to make to do with torrents and avi files on mediashare.com

    WELCOME BACK TO THE REAL WORLD SUCKA's

    the law makes sense tbh. From a legality perspective, cant get into nitty gritty specifics for just games/a game


  • Registered Users Posts: 217 ✭✭Neeknak


    Will anyone other than the copyright holder be able to pursue legal action? For example, if Capcom don't give a **** about tournament streams will everything be alright or will the FBI stick their oar in in the name of the law?


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    This is the thing that makes me wonder.

    If there is, lets say, a potentially infinite amount of footage online, all of which is CRIMINALLY illegal; what government department is going to have the time to check and take legal action against all of this with finite time and resources?

    Big business doesn't work like that. Google will simply no longer tolerate the presence of video game footage because the potential for prosecution is there and they cannot risk that.
    Placebo wrote: »
    Back in my day there were no streams or youtube, we had to make to do with torrents and avi files on mediashare.com

    WELCOME BACK TO THE REAL WORLD SUCKA's

    the law makes sense tbh. From a legality perspective, cant get into nitty gritty specifics for just games/a game

    I don't agree (and I usually do with you on matter of actual business here :D ), as Ultradavid said it's a very pre web 2.0 way of trying to put smoke back in the bottle. A forward thinking way of dealing with this (effectively unstoppable) new world of media would be to skew it in their favour by giving high quality advertised streaming, not trying to criminalise it, which as I pointed out will be simply inneffectual for most of the world. I'd like to see them try to criminalise watching streams :D
    Neeknak wrote: »
    Will anyone other than the copyright holder be able to pursue legal action? For example, if Capcom don't give a **** about tournament streams will everything be alright or will the FBI stick their oar in in the name of the law?

    Yes, that's the entire point. The American govt. can now stick their nose in, even though Capcom/ Netherrealm etc. are actually happy to have this happening.


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    Placebo wrote: »
    Back in my day there were no streams or youtube, we had to make to do with torrents and avi files on mediashare.com

    WELCOME BACK TO THE REAL WORLD SUCKA's

    the law makes sense tbh. From a legality perspective, cant get into nitty gritty specifics for just games/a game

    One other thing Farzipan- The games industry is now a bigger money industry than Hollywood. We should stop thinking of it as "just games".


  • Registered Users Posts: 217 ✭✭Neeknak


    I hope the developers start giving away licenses to stream inside every game box.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,070 ✭✭✭Placebo


    One other thing Farzipan- The games industry is now a bigger money industry than Hollywood. We should stop thinking of it as "just games".

    that is a fair point. Do people watch other games being streamed? Is there huge COD tournaments?


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,499 ✭✭✭Sabre0001


    Neeknak wrote: »
    I hope the developers start giving away licenses to stream inside every game box.

    Only if you pre-order at GameStop...All other licenses must be downloaded two months later as DLC (which was already on the disc!)
    Placebo wrote: »
    that is a fair point. Do people watch other games being streamed? Is there huge COD tournaments?

    Yup - MLG for CoD...Other games = World Cyber Games, DreamHack, MLG, ESL, ESWC, etc, etc, etc. So many places running quality streams for games at this stage - ranges from fighting games to first person shooters to strategy and beyond. Loads of pro (and less than pro) gamers running Starcraft 2 streams of them just playing matches on ladder.

    🤪



  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    Placebo wrote: »
    that is a fair point. Do people watch other games being streamed? Is there huge COD tournaments?

    CoD has a HUGE community on youtube at least, and certainly Starcraft is massive.

    Thinking about it, something could happen like legit companies like Machinima get the license, and then people like me leave stuff in their drop box...


  • Registered Users Posts: 217 ✭✭Neeknak


    Starcraft streams get 100,000 viewers at a time compared with normally sub-10,000 viewers that fighting streams get.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,239 ✭✭✭UberPrinny_Baal


    Starcraft is a national sport of Korea.

    Not joking.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    uh starcraft2 tournament streams can get huge viewers alright, but.. generally if it's just a pro player streaming (usually on justin.tv) the numbers are quite small. There's 2-3 guys who can pull in over 10k viewers every time they stream, there's a few others who can average a few thousand.. most people though under 1k.. usually well under, 1-300 people.

    --edit

    also, league of legends kicked the **** out of every other game at the recent dreamhack in terms of viewer counts. like.... kicked the living ****ing **** out of them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭WasterEx


    "Unauthorised copying, reverse engineering, transmission, public performance, rental, pay for play, or circumvention of copy protection is strictly prohibited"

    Read that on the back of ssfiv case.
    I never knew it was there until now either.

    I thought when you bought a game it becomes your property. You should be allowed to do whatever with your own property.


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    WasterEx wrote: »
    "Unauthorised copying, reverse engineering, transmission, public performance, rental, pay for play, or circumvention of copy protection is strictly prohibited"

    Read that on the back of ssfiv case.
    I never knew it was there until now either.

    I thought when you bought a game it becomes your property. You should be allowed to do whatever with your own property.

    I stand to be corrected but I believe you're buying a license to use the software for personal use- much like buying a CD (not technically legal to play at a party or in a pub without a license, as it happens) or a DVD (ditto).

    I once worked in a job where a location was fined for having a little radio playing behind a desk in a public place.


  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭aeonfusion


    i've seen many a stream of l4d2 tournaments knocking around, lots of games get streamed.

    i really hope this doesnt effect it too much, i love watching steams, i also hope that this doesnt effect this communities ability to stream their matches, was really nice to watch matches from inferno and the evo qualifier, gives me a really good idea of where i stand and helps me learn new things


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,868 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    I'm sure I will find a way around it. It might mean eventually we won't get the international exposure we have been for the last couple months though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 488 ✭✭the 1st hardter


    If this passes it will be the end of e-sports in America. Already some professional starcraft players saying they will move if this goes through since it is their source of income (just look up a player called destiny who makes 4 grand + a month sueing some kids parents cause he kept dosing him)

    I don't see game developers wanting this..... But how has it gotten this far if they did not want it???


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,239 ✭✭✭UberPrinny_Baal


    I don't see game developers wanting this..... But how has it gotten this far if they did not want it???

    Uhh.. because this is being spearheaded by the TV and Movie industry's special interest groups, who are a lot more powerful and influential than game devs?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,966 ✭✭✭ayjayirl


    Uhh.. because this is being spearheaded by the TV and Movie industry's special interest groups, who are a lot more powerful and influential than game devs?

    This will mean the death of YT over time and emergence of a much more fractured distribution of providers that are connected through social mediums like FB - The problem is that it will extend to them as well.

    TBH this is a joke and a feeble attempt to stop copyright distribution. They tried with money and now they are scaring with Jail terms. FFS embrace the tech and evolve the business model. Some people just seem deluded to think that because they made money with one technology, that they should be allowed to keep that position rather than a disruptive technology dictating the change.


    Land of the free.....*ahem*.... as if.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,237 ✭✭✭Owwmykneecap


    The sky is not falling. nothing will change.


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