Syria slaughters again

xflyer

Just to redress the balance for those of who get worked up by such things but only when Israel is involved. I've started this thread. Note this story:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2011/0606/1224298468266.html

Syrian forces kill 90 and cut internet in crackdown

I'm all those who enthusiastically condemm Israel's actions will no doubt join me in condemming Syrian actions? Hmmm......

It is notable too the the Israel story had higher prominence in the Irish Time than the much bigger massacres perpertrated by the Syrian regime on it's own people.

Orizio

Is the Syrian government Jewish? No?

Mods delete this thread.

xflyer

Yes of course it's only wrong when Jews do bad things to Arabs!

Mahatma coat

does the Syrian government claim to be
'The only Democracy in the Region' and then proceed to run an apartheid state???

the Syrian Government will be turfed out on its ass shortly by the people of Syria, then we shal see what fills the void remaining.

wes

Terrible what the Syrian government is doing. Assad needs to go now, and the people there need to be free.

Now seeing as the OP on here would like to invoke the thread on Israel, I think it only fair to point out, that its unlikely we will see the same kind of vigorous defense of the murder of protesters (unless someone decides to troll for the hell of it), as we do when Israel does it. I also doubt that any one who condemns, Assad will be personally attacked for daring to criticize him (again unless someone decides to troll). If your looking for balance, then its only fair that we mention that.

Also, just noticed that the OP, didn't post in the other thread from yesterday.......... Now far be it for me to point out such hypocrisy, but surely the OP is guilty of what he is accusing others of doing, seeing as they did not post in the other thread to condemn Israel........

Biggins

Shocking what they did to the 13 year old last week.

arybvtcw0eolkf

As in the Israeli threads I can't argue politics, and unlike some in those threads I don't pretend to be versed in international law pertaining to war crimes.

On the few occasions I've crossed paths with Syrian soldiers they were a rag-tag bunch of knackers & not as disciplined as the IDF so I'm not surprised at the casualty figures being released - however, I still take those figures with a pinch of salt as I think history will show them to be higher.

So I'll wait for the usual suspect to come and bring the thread around to debating Israeli actions.

Hookah

Wes sums it up.

It's terrible people being shot, but this thread will be short lived due to the lack of Assad supporters.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Biggins wrote: »

Shocking what they did to the 13 year old last week.

What was that?.

I haven't been following things that closely.

RMD

The reason this isn't gaining the same prominence is because it's an internal conflict. The difference with Israel is they're actively fúcking over a whole other country, if there only controversy was oppressing their own public then few people would give a fúck.

My name is URL

The Syrian government are undoubtedly scumbags, but that fact does not absolve Israel of the atrocities it's responsible for. Pretty childish thread tbh (intent wise).. one-upmanship of the worst kind.

xflyer

Yes Wes and it's only fair to point out that only Israeli actions seem to attract thread after thread from the same people with an agenda.

My point is that their actions whether justified or not got more prominence than actions of the Syrian forces at the same time against their own people. Worse indeed.

Israelis killing Syrians is terrible and outrageous apparently. Syrians killing Syrians barely warrants comment.

A nice double standard.

RachaelVO

Biggins wrote: »

Shocking what they did to the 13 year old last week.

What happened? I didn't see anything

Gunsfortoys

Jesus Christ.

Who the hell is justifying these killings? Anyone?

People are kicking up a fuss over Israel because they are illegally occupying an area that is not their own, depriving civilians of any due process while murdering many others.

While the Syrian government are responsible for a lot of atrocities against its own people, it should be up to its own people to overthrow these scumbags.

The way people go on, it is as if Israel is the shining example of how to deal with these people.

xflyer

The usual suspects have arrived Maikkomi. Their humanitarian concern for fate of Arabs only comes to the surface when Jews do the killing.

Biggins

Biggins wrote: »

Shocking what they did to the 13 year old last week.

Johan Huge Roughneck wrote: »

What was that?.

I haven't been following things that closely.

Repulsive images have shocked the world, infuriated the protesters and shaken the foundations of Bashar Assad’s brutal regime in Syria. The mangled body of Hamza al-Khatib, a 13-year-old boy, lay contorted on a plastic sheet. There is a gaping wound on his small skull, the hair matted with blood. A gunshot, piercing the torso, was fired at his kidneys. His neck has been broken and his penis has been severed.

Syrian torturers grabbed him off the street in looking for someone to get hold accountable.
They tortured the hell out of him - then stabbed him, castrated him, then shot him repeatedly.
When the government killers sent the body home, they told the family to keep quiet or else...!

They didn't.

See here for example: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/one-boys-death-stirs-a-wave-of-revulsion-20110606-1fp90.html

WARNING: On other news sites, there are some terrible pictures of the boy and what they did to him.

InTheTrees

Mahatma coat wrote: »

does the Syrian government claim to be
'The only Democracy in the Region' and then proceed to run an apartheid state???

no.

so what?

wes

xflyer wrote: »

Yes Wes and it's only fair to point out that only Israeli actions seem to attract thread after thread from the same people with an agenda.

I fundamentally disagree, many different posters start those threads. So for you presume some kind of agenda is rather ridiculous.

xflyer wrote: »

My point is that their actions whether justified or not got more prominence than actions of the Syrian forces at the same time against their own people. Worse indeed.

I am sorry, but no one stopped you starting this thread, but you have decided to make this thread about Israel (in the very first post), and not about the people who were killed. Personally, I find that rather messed up. You don't seem to think that starting a thread on the basis that Assad murdered people was valid enough, but you decided to make it all about Israel instead.

xflyer wrote: »

Israelis killing Syrians is terrible and outrageous apparently. Syrians killing Syrians barely warrants comment.

A nice double standard.

Considering you didn't post in the other thread, I would say you are yourself guilty of the same double standard you accuse others of.

Also, the fact that you posted this thread to make a point about Israel, show very clearly you don't think the murder of protesters on its own merited a thread. Again, that is messed up.

What Assad is doing completely wrong, and I see no reason to invoke Israel at all, like you did, to condemn the odious Human Being for his horrible crimes. So personally, I done with this part of the conversation, as I find it rather messed up.

ISDW

xflyer wrote: »

The usual suspects have arrived Maikkomi. Their humanitarian concern for fate of Arabs only comes to the surface when Jews do the killing.

Can I just point out though, that its not only Jews who are in the IDF, so it could be arabs firing any shots that kill people.

Pauleta

The whole Syria thing just isnt as sexy as Palestine or Tibet.

InTheTrees

wes wrote: »

I am sorry, but no one stopped you starting this thread, but you have decided to make this thread about Israel, and not about the people who were killed.

??

This thread was started as a response to the ubiquitous anti-israel "slaughter" thread.

There's irony that's being drawn attention to.

Biggins

Pauleta wrote: »

The whole Syria thing just isnt as sexy as Palestine or Tibet.

It isn't funny either!

Mike 1972

To an extent the OP has a valid point even if it does reek of whatabouttery

wes

InTheTrees wrote: »

??

This thread was started as a response to the ubiquitous anti-israel "slaughter" thread.

There's irony that's being drawn attention to.

Considering that the poster who started the thread didn't post in the other thread, I would say they are just as hypocritical as the people there complaining about.

Personally, i find the death of Syrian protesters, being used for this kind of goal scoring to be messed up. Sorry, but there deaths should not be used for this kind of nonsense.

Einhard

xflyer wrote: »

The usual suspects have arrived Maikkomi. Their humanitarian concern for fate of Arabs only comes to the surface when Jews do the killing.

That's just not true.

InTheTrees

wes wrote: »

Also, the fact that you posted this thread to make a point about Israel, show very clearly you don't think the murder of protesters on its own merited a thread. Again, that is messed up.

Huh?

Its shows nothing except the childish double standard.

You can try and spin it any way you want.

My name is URL

Mike 1972 wrote: »

To an extent the OP has a valid point even if it does reek of whatabouttery

I recall at least two threads right here in AH recently about the situation in Syria.. others for Libya and Egypt during its uprising, and everyone who posted in them condemned the violence that was happening. The way the OP is worded makes it seem like the only thing people ever show disagreement with is Israel related stuff, and that's simply untrue. If anything you could turn it on its head and say that the only acts of violence and murder which people are prepared to support are those carried out by Israel.

Minstrel27

xflyer wrote: »

I'm all those who enthusiastically condemm Israel's actions will no doubt join me in condemming Syrian actions? Hmmm......

It is notable too the the Israel story had higher prominence in the Irish Time than the much bigger massacres perpertrated by the Syrian regime on it's own people.

This is one of the most pathetic attempts at **** stirring that I have seen in a while.

Biggins

I don't know about anyone else - and I don't get in to the Israel/Palestine who's right/wrong debate - I'm just repulsed at the senseless killings that is happing to innocent people on ALL sides.
End of story.

wes

InTheTrees wrote: »

Its shows nothing except the childish double standard.

No, its shows that some people on this thread don't give a crap about dead Syrian protesters, unless they can invoke Israel some how. Especially as a lot of the same posters either didn't post in the other thread (showing them to be hypocrites themselves), or were defending Israel murdering protesters in the other thread.

InTheTrees wrote: »

You can try and spin it any way you want.

Just pointing out the hypocrisy of others and nothing more. I will say again, using the deaths of Syrian protesters as some sort of goal scoring exercise is messed up, and that is clearly the whole point of the thread, from the first post. If people really cared about the deaths, Israel would not have been invoked in the first post.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Einhard wrote: »

That's just not true.

Listen, I'll call a spade a spade here.

He's talking about Wes and Dfpl..(whatever that damned username is) and and their tiresome anti-Israeli agenda.

At this stage its a royal pain in the hole, they'll bend over backwards to put an anti-Israeli slant on any thread and rarely shows up in After Hours unless there's a thread on Israel or the Palestinian people.

I find it flabergasting that Wolfe Tone has been banned from talking politics in After Hours and these guys alone get to pull this stunt time after time after time.

Mahatma Coat is just a funny dude, he has an equal hatred of everyone and I love reading it.. Honestly he makes me smile.

Now - Biggin, thanks for that.

I won't go looking for the graphic stuff.

But I think its amazing/disgusting that the west/europe can bomb the sh*t out of Libya and not lift a hand to protect the other oppressed people of other north african and middle eastern states.

brimal

wes wrote: »

Terrible what the Syrian government is doing. Assad needs to go now, and the people there need to be free.

This is the only sentence you have contributed to this thread on Syria.

Everything else in your posts is to address this 'us against them' keyboard battle you are having.

I'm pretty disappointed wes, you seemed to be on the ball and be able to have a decent debate on what's happening in conflicts, but even you can't help but get dragged into this tit-for-tat crap.

To everyone else, can we keep to the topic?

Has anyone got any decent sources from Syria seeing as they have put the country on lockdown? Cheers

Biggins

wes wrote: »

...as a lot of the same posters either didn't post in the other thread (showing them to be hypocrites themselves)...

It has to be said that a lot of folk (I suspect) don't stray much into those threads deliberately as they sometime if not all the time, turn into the usual who's right/wrong, tit for tat, snipping and bitter bickering arguments.

Some - like me - maybe tend to stay out of such threads for peace of mind sake.
NOT for only wanting to come across as hypocritical. I hope others can understand that too.

wes

Johan Huge Roughneck wrote: »

Listen, I'll call a spade a spade here.

He's talking about Wes and Dfpl..(whatever that damned username is) and and their tiresome anti-Israeli agenda.

Ah, the old bizarre vendetta you have against me. I have no idea, how I pissed you off so much, and I could care less. Why you insist on making things so personal is beyond me, and I personally get a great laugh out of it.

Johan Huge Roughneck wrote: »

At this stage its a royal pain in the hole, they'll bend over backwards to put an anti-Israeli slant on any thread and rarely shows up in After Hours unless there's a thread on Israel or the Palestinian people.

Oh please, I post on plenty of stuff on here. Yesterday, you made the claim I posted on nothing but this topic, and after I corrected you, you didn't concede you were wrong. Now, you have modified is slight today, but considering that you like make things personal, its only make sense that I would end up posting on the topic more, as people like yourself, can't actually help but attack other posters.

Johan Huge Roughneck wrote: »

I find it flabergasting that Wolfe Tone has been banned from talking politics in After Hours and these guys alone get to pull this stunt time after time after time.

I find it doubly funny coming from someone who also posted in these threads all the time as well. Hypocritical much?

Gunsfortoys

Johan Huge Roughneck wrote: »

I find it flabergasting that Wolfe Tone has been banned from talking politics in After Hours
.

That is a bloody disgrace. Stinks of Bias.

InTheTrees

Johan Huge Roughneck wrote: »

But I think its amazing/disgusting that the west/europe can bomb the sh*t out of Libya and not lift a hand to protect the other oppressed people of other north african and middle eastern states.

Because its about our interests rather than any humanitarian goodness.

If Syria was a major oil producer I'm sure we'd be helping them.

wes

Biggins wrote: »

NOT for only wanting to come across as hypocritical. I hope others can understand that too.

I was mostly referring to the OP, who didn't post in the other thread. I would say they are guilty of what they are accusing others of, and also that they made this thread, to comment on Israel threads, as opposed to condemning Assad, which is doubly hypocritical imho, and again messed up.

wes

brimal wrote: »

This is the only sentence you have contributed to this thread on Syria.

I contributed more than you have so far.

brimal wrote: »

I'm pretty disappointed wes, you seemed to be on the ball and be able to have a decent debate on what's happening in conflicts, but even you can't help but get dragged into this tit-for-tat crap.

I am rather disappointed in you, as you first post on this thread, and you don't offer a word of condemnation against Syria, but you would rather talk about other posters, but then to be fair, that was the whole point of the thread since the first post.

brimal wrote: »

To everyone else, can we keep to the topic?

The OP invoked Israel in the very first post, so I was being on topic.

brimal wrote: »

Has anyone got any decent sources from Syria seeing as they have put the country on lockdown? Cheers

http://english.aljazeera.net/

Biggins

wes wrote: »

I was mostly referring to the OP, who didn't post in the other thread. I would say they are guilty of what they are accusing others of, and also that they made this thread, to comment on Israel threads, as opposed to condemning Assad, which is doubly hypocritical imho, and again messed up.

I'm not sure of the full picture myself of who's involved, what sides they are on and who said what, etc.
...And I don't want to get involved in that mess.

Most of the rest of us here though are just saddened daily to hear of the continuous actions of stupid people still doing stupid things (and I'm NOT talking about anyone in threads - heads of state more like and their agents) and being allowed to do so while the world (for whatever more stupid reason) stands quietly by.

There's hypocrisy worldwide and innocent people are paying the price of others (too) quiet stance, looking on.

Dudess

xflyer wrote: »

Yes of course it's only wrong when Jews do bad things to Arabs!

I just hate murder, no matter who does it. And I think anti semitism and islamophobia are contemptible. But the bias in favour of Palestine that people who lick the arse off the Israeli state talk about is pretty much in their heads, and THEY are actually the biased ones.

Wonder if Flutt will be along to this thread to complain about it pushing an agenda...?

Son Of A Vidic

I think most rationale people would equally condemn the Syrian government for murdering civilians, as they would condemn the Israeli government. There is a key difference here however. The Israelis peddle the delusionary myth that they are somehow the flagship of democracy in the region. Yet their brutal record exposes this blatant lie.

Einhard

Johan Huge Roughneck wrote: »

I find it flabergasting that Wolfe Tone has been banned from talking politics in After Hours and these guys alone get to pull this stunt time after time after time.

Why is that? I rarely agree with him on anything, but that's a bit strange.

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

I think most rationale people would equally condemn the Syrian government for murdering civilians, as they would condemn the Israeli government. There is a key difference here however. The Israelis peddle the delusionary myth that they are somehow the flagship of democracy in the region. Yet their brutal record exposes this blatant lie.

Not going to get into a debate on Israel's actions (I'm doing that in another thread!), but being a democracy and acting in a brutal manner are not necessarily mutually exclusive. Israel is a beacon of democracy in the region because her citizens can vote for their leaders in free and fair elections. One cannot do that in Syria. The matter of Israel's policies is another thing, but regardless of what one thinks of them, they don't make the Israeli state any less democratic.

Nodin

xflyer wrote: »

Yes of course it's only wrong when Jews do bad things to Arabs!

...makes you wonder why theres a thread about the Syrian situation in the politics forum.

FlutterinBantam

Einhard wrote: »

Why is that? I rarely agree with him on anything, but that's a bit strange.



/QUOTE]


Bit strange:eek:

Guy has been flogging a SF agenda barefaced and in- your -face for the past few months.

Get a grip man, look around you and see what the agenda is.

jeesh:rolleyes:


Well done to the Mods for that.

Einhard

Bit strange:eek:

Guy has been flogging a SF agenda barefaced and in- your -face for the past few months.

Get a grip man, look around you and see what the agenda is.

jeesh:rolleyes:


Well done to the Mods for that.

So? It's a discussion site. Shouldn't he be free to discuss SF all he wants, and we free to disagree or otherwise? I could change one word in your post, and apply it to how others might see you or I:

Guy has been flogging an Israeli agenda barefaced and in- your -face for the past few months.

Wouldn't be how I'd see it of course, but others might, and might seek to have me banned from discussing politics in AH. The point I'm making is, if WT is banned from making his points, what's stop anyone else being banned for making arguments that go against the consensus?

FlutterinBantam

Einhard wrote: »

So? It's a discussion site. Shouldn't he be free to discuss SF all he wants, and we free to disagree or otherwise? I could change one word in your post, and apply it to how others might see you or I:

Guy has been flogging an Israeli agenda barefaced and in- your -face for the past few months.

Wouldn't be how I'd see it of course, but others might, and might seek to have me banned from discussing politics in AH. The point I'm making is, if WT is banned from making his points, what's stop anyone else being banned for making arguments that go against the consensus?

Maybe you might like to search how many pro Israeli threads I have started ?

I'll give you a hint.... you won't find many.

On the contrary.....................;) wake up pal:eek:

Nodin

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

...............

Get a grip man, look around you and see what the agenda is.

..........

You don't have anything to say about this thread? .......

FlutterinBantam

Nodin wrote: »

You don't have anything to say about this thread? .......

What's your point mate.?

Nodin

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

What's your point mate.?

So you've nothing to say about this thread?

dlofnep

Why is there intervention in Libya, but none in Syria? Pure and utter scum. Syria merits intervention if any state needs it.

FlutterinBantam

Nodin wrote: »

So you've nothing to say about this thread?

I'm responding to a post as quoted, I have little interest in this thread M'kay?