Unhappy Catholics

georgieporgy

Some catholic posters have been banned from christianity forum for ignoring Mod warnings . Seems they were talking about something that's not allowed.
It's good to see that the mods were not sleeping on the job and I certainly applaud them for that.
I just thought I'd mention it here to spread the happiness.

It isn't my intention to criticise the mod actions. But I was just wondering if regular posters on this forum think it's probably not a bad idea to muzzle catholics if you had the chance.

Mena

Oh now this can't end well...

Ickle Magoo

I think boards has clear protocols and if posters can't or won't follow them - and think the rules that everyone else manages to work with shouldn't apply to them - then they deserve everything they get. Stupid is stupid, regardless of faith, race, demographic, whatever else....

Zombrex

I found it some what funny that the default stance when this started happening was that they cried "intolerance!"

This unfortunately seems to be the default stance of far too many Catholics in Ireland, do what we say or want or we will cry you are being intolerance and anti-Catholic.

Reminds me of the nonsense of Israel where any criticism of Israel was met with cries of being anti-semitism.

georgieporgy

Can one talk about anything they like on this forum? I notice there is certainly a lot more leniency when tossing around insults and people are expected to have a thicker skin. Nothing wrong with that. It allows for a better exchange of opinions if people don't get upset about different views too easily.

antiskeptic

georgieporgy wrote: »

Some catholic posters have been banned from christianity forum for ignoring Mod warnings . Seems they were talking about something that's not allowed.

Seems they were ignoring mod warnings today and in similar circumstances recently

It's good to see that the mods were not sleeping on the job and I certainly applaud them for that. I just thought I'd mention it here to spread the happiness.

Although I don't at all like Roman Catholicism, I feel it is best dismantled by revealing itself as fully as possible. In that regard, I regret the banning. I'm sure Donatello's heard of ID cloaking though.

liamw

georgieporgy wrote: »

It isn't my intention to criticise the mod actions. But I was just wondering if regular posters on this forum think it's probably not a bad idea to muzzle catholics if you had the chance.

I don't think anybody is 'muzzling' catholics... This whole catholic mod thing is frankly silly. Fanny is right, a moderator has a specific job and it's nothing to do with denomination, race or whatever else.

robindch

georgieporgy wrote: »

But I was just wondering if regular posters on this forum think it's probably not a bad idea to muzzle catholics if you had the chance.

Not at all, at least on this forum. For a variety of reasons.

Firstly, this forum is strongly in favour of the kind of free speech that's compatible with the forum charter - which is basically almost anything save personal invective or mindless soap boxing.

Secondly, many christians, at the behest of their preachers, sincerely believe that they are being "persecuted". We have no wish to encourage this manic delusion.

Thirdly, I think the best antidote to religion is a reliable and wide-ranging knowledge of religion and religious thinking. The more religious posters who can help to provide these, the better.

Finally, debating is what this forum is all about and it would be a far lesser place than it is if we were to ban opinions we disagreed with or blocked religious posters from chatting with rational people.

robindch

Btw, discussion of the moderation of other forums is done in the feedback forum. This thread is fine once the topic is solely the "muzzling of catholics".

robindch

georgieporgy wrote: »

Can one talk about anything they like on this forum? I notice there is certainly a lot more leniency when tossing around insults and people are expected to have a thicker skin.

In simple terms, you can say what you like about ideas, but - the violent or egregiously ignorant religious aside - you are not allowed to insult people.

Please read up on the forum charter. It's quite short and is not difficult to read or remember.

georgieporgy

antiskeptic wrote: »

Seems they were ignoring mod warnings today and in similar circumstances recently


Although I don't at all like Roman Catholicism, I feel it is best dismantled by revealing itself as fully as possible. In that regard, I regret the banning. I'm sure Donatello's heard of ID cloaking though.

It wouldn't be nice for me to come to this forum and start criticising mod decions on another forum so I don't want to go down that road. That's not the intention of this thread.
Having said that, i'm in agreement with your second paragraph. A frank and open discussion is ideal.

Donatello

Definitely. I've been banned from the Christian forum, but I can speak freely here, for now at least.

I think the main thesis of the Catholic rebels is that there needs to be a Catholic moderator so as to provide a healthy balance. Only a Catholic moderator can possess a Catholic sensibility to ensure fair play.

In these times of plurality, tolerance, and diversity, it is ironic that there is not a Catholic moderator on the Christian forum. It only adds to the impression that the Catholic members have, that boards.ie isn't a friendly place for Catholics.

I think the only way to resolve this is to appoint a Catholic moderator from among the faithful regulars.

The pagans get their own mods, the atheists get their own mods, the Christians get their own moderators, but Catholics don't get their own moderator. In a time when the Catholic Church is under attack, a Catholic moderator can ensure that Catholics have the same rights as everyone else.

georgieporgy

robindch wrote: »

In simple terms, you can say what you like about ideas, but - the violent or egregiously ignorant religious aside - you are not allowed to insult people.

Please read up on the forum charter. It's quite short and is not difficult to read or remember.

agreed. I was a bit fluid with my post. it's the ridiculing of each other's ideas i was referring to and not personal insults.

antiskeptic

Donatello wrote: »

I think the main thesis of the Catholic rebels..

Don't you mean Catholic Protestants?

liamw

Donatello wrote: »

I think the main thesis of the Catholic rebels is that there needs to be a Catholic moderator so as to provide a healthy balance. Only a Catholic moderator can possess a Catholic sensibility to ensure fair play.

Why can only a Catholic moderator ensure fair play? I would argue that an atheist could moderate the Christian forum. I don't see what difference it makes.

What particular skills does a catholic moderator possess that a non-catholic mod wouldn't?

hinault

Donatello wrote: »

Definitely. I've been banned from the Christian forum, but I can speak freely here, for now at least.

I think the main thesis of the Catholic rebels is that there needs to be a Catholic moderator so as to provide a healthy balance. Only a Catholic moderator can possess a Catholic sensibility to ensure fair play.

In these times of plurality, tolerance, and diversity, it is ironic that there is not a Catholic moderator on the Christian forum. It only adds to the impression that the Catholic members have, that boards.ie isn't a friendly place for Catholics.

I think the only way to resolve this is to appoint a Catholic moderator from among the faithful regulars.

The pagans get their own mods, the atheists get their own mods, the Christians get their own moderators, but Catholics don't get their own moderator. In a time when the Catholic Church is under attack, a Catholic moderator can ensure that Catholics have the same rights as everyone else.

I've tried to engage with the moderators over there on the Christian forum and I've got to say it's proving fruitless.

Banning posters. Closing threads. It all smacks of heavy handedness on the part of the people who moderate that part of the Forum.
When asked if they'd contact the site owner about accessing the Forum Request thread they refuse to commit.

I only know of 2 posters who've been banned for 7 days.
As an act of solidarity, I won't be posting over there until the bans are lifted.

robindch

Final warning folks - no discussion of how other forums here on boards are moderated. Posters who ignore this will have their posts edited or deleted or be banned themselves for ignoring repeated mod requests.

You are free to discuss the muzzling of catholics, intra-religious intolerance, the narcissism of minor difference and so on.

dvpower

hinault wrote: »

I only know of 2 posters who've been banned for 7 days.
As an act of solidarity, I won't be posting over there until the bans are lifted.

I'm sure the refugees will be treated well here while the insurrection over yonder is put down.:)

georgieporgy

dvpower wrote: »

I'm sure the refugees will be treated well here while the insurrection over yonder is put down.:)

this is like going to the pub for a drink after church:)

Donatello

I have to be careful what I say here.

I think the point is, only a faithful* Catholic can truly see, by knowing the nuances and all the aspects of the issue, when Catholics are being treated unfairly.

A Catholic will not carry any anti-Catholicism, whereas the 'best' of Protestants are, by definition, protesting against the Catholic Church and will therefore have their own stance.

By having a selection of people, like in the PSNI, you can have a better prospect of ensuring fairness for everyone.

It is the case that the Catholic Church is despised in many quarters, both on boards.ie and in Irish society. Some of the anger is justified, but it usually spills over into anti-Catholic bigotry.

* One who accepts and lives all the teachings of the Church.

ShooterSF

Donatello wrote: »

A Catholic will not carry any anti-Catholicism,

By anti-catholicism do you include the actions of the representatives of the church or do you only mean the church's official teachings? If the former I haven't met in person a single catholic that statement stands true for, while if you mean the latter, well actually that's the same. Haven't met one (though I know they're out there).

Zombrex

Donatello wrote: »

I think the point is, only a faithful* Catholic can truly see, by knowing the nuances and all the aspects of the issue, when Catholics are being treated unfairly.

If a Catholic was put in such a position (not just Boards.ie but any position of moderation) and ended up not agreeing with you would you not simply dismiss them as being not "faithful" enough for your liking.

You don't seem to want a Catholic, you seem to want someone exactly like you.

Delirium

Wicknight wrote: »

You don't seem to want a Catholic, you seem to want someone exactly like you.

MagicMarker

Wicknight wrote: »

You don't seem to want a Catholic, you seem to want someone exactly like you.

*shudder*

liamw

Donatello wrote: »

* One who accepts and lives all the teachings of the Church.

Scary thought

MrPudding

Just been over the wall. Hilarious. It is a shame Fanny is not a catholic, if he was he might be up for a sainthood for putting up with all the bollox be has to.

MrP

Benny_Cake

"Accepts and lives all the teachings of the church"? That's not this Catholic so.

I would think that an atheist could do a very good job moderating the Christianity forum, and likewise, a Christian could do a good job in moderating on A&A. It is a role that is simply involved with enforcing a charter.

Donatello wrote: »

I have to be careful what I say here.

I think the point is, only a faithful* Catholic can truly see, by knowing the nuances and all the aspects of the issue, when Catholics are being treated unfairly.

A Catholic will not carry any anti-Catholicism, whereas the 'best' of Protestants are, by definition, protesting against the Catholic Church and will therefore have their own stance.

By having a selection of people, like in the PSNI, you can have a better prospect of ensuring fairness for everyone.

It is the case that the Catholic Church is despised in many quarters, both on boards.ie and in Irish society. Some of the anger is justified, but it usually spills over into anti-Catholic bigotry.

* One who accepts and lives all the teachings of the Church.

strobe

What an interesting thread. It's like a re-enactment of the Marian Exiles or the Puritans fleeing to the secular new world to escape oppression inflicted upon them by their fellow Christians, only with Catholics the ones fleeing and played out online this time. I'm not sure whether to laugh or cry.

I wonder how long it will be before our Catholic refugees start to bemoan the very secularism that has provided their safe haven as a great evil of modern times? Any thoughts Donatello?

Dades

Thread VERY close to the bone regarding discussion of over yonder.

Zillah

Dades wrote: »

Thread VERY close to the bone regarding discussion of over yonder.

Why does this rule exist, anyway?

AhSureTisGrand

I think the rebels hold the same view as that nice man who decided only Catholics were capable of voting

ShooterSF

Zillah wrote: »

Why does this rule exist, anyway?

I assume it's if youre not in feedback don't discuss moderating decisions. (Hope discussing discussing mod decisions is ok)

Fair play for no one posting in here looking for an agnostic's subforum

(Purposely not commenting on modding) I do wonder about mods mental states when they take the job seeing the crap they have to put up with (that includes our 2 resident mods).

housetypeb

What would catholics need a forum for?
Catholics are not supposed to interpret the bible for themselves,the magisterium of the catholic church does all that for them.
If they need an opinion on anything the church will give it to them!
I guess thats why they refer to them as a flock.

georgieporgy

housetypeb wrote: »

What would catholics need a forum for?
Catholics are not supposed to interpret the bible for themselves,the magisterium of the catholic church does all that for them.
If they need an opinion on anything the church will give it to them!
I guess thats why they refer to them as a flock.

Well, for starters they could answer questions like that.

georgieporgy

ShooterSF wrote: »

I assume it's if youre not in feedback don't discuss moderating decisions. (Hope discussing discussing mod decisions is ok)

Fair play for no one posting in here looking for an agnostic's subforum

(Purposely not commenting on modding) I do wonder about mods mental states when they take the job seeing the crap they have to put up with (that includes our 2 resident mods).

the agnostics don't know if they want one or not:D

bnt

ShooterSF wrote: »

Fair play for no one posting in here looking for an agnostic's subforum

(shudders) It's already bad enough here with folks not knowing what "agnostic" means - treating it like some nice happy fence-sitting "I don't know" medium between theism and atheism ...

The only suggestion I'd have for the mods here would be: merge this thread into "The Funny Side of Religion".

Dades

Zillah wrote: »

Why does this rule exist, anyway?

Before it existed this forum seemed to be the first port of call to those aggrieved about how they were treated in the other forum. It got a bit tired after a while.

AhSureTisGrand

On a side note, my opinion of Catholicism has worsened dramatically since joining Boards. It's frightening to see what it's like when somebody actually follows through with it instead of going à la carte

robindch

Donatello wrote: »

It's interesting that for all their talk of tolerance, diversity, and pluralism, there's none more intolerant than liberals in power, who very quickly implement their own, nefarious, totalitarian regime. This must be resisted with the utmost force by all those of good will.

Donatello wrote: »

[...] I can speak freely here, for now at least. [...] In these times of plurality, tolerance, and diversity, it is ironic that there is not [...]

This evening, can we take it that you're less in favor of resisting "with the utmost force" the liberalism, tolerance, diversity and pluralism you condemned two days ago?

housetypeb

georgieporgy wrote: »

Well, for starters they could answer questions like that.

Could they? wouldn't they have to check with a priest that they have the correct answer and that it agrees with the teachings of the the church.

strobe

AhSureTisGrand wrote: »

On a side note, my opinion of Catholicism has worsened dramatically since joining Boards. It's frightening to see what it's like when somebody actually follows through with it instead of going à la carte

Hmmm I dunno. I'm kinda strangely impressed by the unity and revolutionary tendencies being shown here amongst them. I guess I haven't left my anarchistic Trotskyite leanings as far behind as I thought.

Solidarity, my Catholic comrades! :pac:

ShooterSF

strobe wrote: »

Hmmm I dunno. I'm kinda strangely impressed by the unity and revolutionary tendencies being shown here amongst them. I guess I haven't left my anarchistic Trotskyite leanings as far behind as I thought.

Solidarity, my Catholic comrades! :pac:

You do portray some rather spoon like characteristics sometimes across the wall

Donatello

robindch wrote: »

This evening, can we take it that you're less in favor of resisting "with the utmost force" the liberalism, tolerance, diversity and pluralism you condemned two days ago?

I'm being sarcastic. The talk of pluralism and diversity is hollow, because it doesn't actually tolerate Catholicism but leads to totalitarianism.

strobe wrote: »

Hmmm I dunno. I'm kinda strangely impressed by the unity and revolutionary tendencies being shown here amongst them. I guess I haven't left my anarchistic Trotskyite leanings as far behind as I thought.

Solidarity, my Catholic comrades! :pac:

They do say that the blood of the martyrs is the seed of the Church.

Vivo Cristo Rey!

Sarky

Why muzzle the religious? They love that whole thrown-to-the-lions thing, it did wonders for early Christianity. On the whole I think very religious people provide as strong a case against religion as any amount of logic/science/skepticism/whatever.

robindch

Donatello wrote: »

The talk of pluralism and diversity is hollow, because it doesn't actually tolerate Catholicism but leads to totalitarianism.

You should try to move beyond Alive-level cliches.

I've already explained in this thread twice that so long as you (and every other poster) sticks to the very simple forum rules, you can post here for as long as you like and your views and the reasoning behind them are welcome, whether we agree with them or not. I don't recall similar tolerance on any religious forum I've recently seen, and never on any one run by people who claim to be catholic.

And given that, two days ago, you threatened the use of "utmost force" against the same liberal principles that you now use to express your religious views, well, I'm afraid that's hypocrisy. Though again, you're welcome to display it.

Zombrex

Donatello wrote: »

The talk of pluralism and diversity is hollow, because it doesn't actually tolerate Catholicism but leads to totalitarianism.

What, like Catholics demanding they have their own way all the time?

Bottle_of_Smoke

PDn's a great guy. One of the tops mods and posters on the site.

Still. I'd say if you were Catholic enough to post about it online you'd be pretty suspicious of mods who's religion was created with a fundamental emphasis in undermining yours

housetypeb

This could turn into a very funny thread with the right stimulus,for a start,i wonder if some posters are actually too holy and pious for the other forum or is that just the beer talking.

strobe

ShooterSF wrote: »

You do portray some rather spoon like characteristics sometimes across the wall

Spoon like?

Heh, sorry you lost me I'm afraid man. Is that a reference to me being malleable or a comparison to Lysander Spooner? (Or my much lauded ability to handle soup?)

ShooterSF

strobe wrote: »

Spoon like?

Heh, sorry you lost me I'm afraid man. Is that a reference to me being malleable or a comparison to Lysander Spooner? (Or my much lauded ability to handle soup?)

I laughed hard!

Erm I was more referring to the spoon's famous ability to stir rather than to scoop

sponsoredwalk

Donatello wrote: »

A Catholic will not carry any anti-Catholicism,

Just like a good American wont carry any anti-Americanism, or a good
Scotsman would never out-do a sex maniac from outside Scotland.

Donatello wrote: »

The talk of pluralism and diversity is hollow, because it doesn't actually tolerate Catholicism but leads to totalitarianism.

I really hope you continue to post here, you do a wonderful job
informing the reader what kind of human action is considered
totalitarian - diversity, pluralism, even a hint @ equality with women -
& what is considered a tolerant, or "good will", position:

Donatello wrote: »

They do say that the blood of the martyrs is the seed of the Church.

Donatello wrote: »

It's interesting that for all their talk of tolerance, diversity, and pluralism, there's none more intolerant than liberals in power, who very quickly implement their own, nefarious, totalitarian regime.

This must be resisted with the utmost force by all those of good will.

Donatello wrote: »

It's funny but history always repeats itself. If you look at the feminist ideology today, there is nothing new. They want priestesses, sexual immorality, and abortion. It's just a rehash of what came before.

Show me a woman who wants women priests, and I'll show you a woman who wants to abort her own child, or takes issue with the sexual moral teaching of the Church. Show me a man who wants women priests, and I'll show you a man who has a problem with the sexual moral teachings of the Church.

Donatello wrote: »

A Catholic will not carry any anti-Catholicism,

by a religious person who takes their faith a little more seriously.
Please, do go on...