Athlone-Mullingar Rail link

Eiretrains

dowlingm wrote: »

Hopefully eiretrains will see this thread and give us an idea when the pictures were taken - it may have been some time ago.

They were taken in 2003 when the station looked 'ok', however I have been told nowadays that there are trees and shrubs growing between the rails on the line! The route was built to double track main line standards, fairly straight and level with few level crossings.
http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=moate+station

LGiamani

The line is an excellent piece of infrastructure as I've walked it in the last few years. There are a number of bridges that do not cater for double tracking but these can be changed.

Eiretrains

Eiretrains wrote: »

They were taken in 2003 when the station looked 'ok', however I have been told nowadays that there are trees and shrubs growing between the rails on the line! The route was built to double track main line standards, fairly straight and level with few level crossings.
http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=moate+station

Interesting, it appears that the only part of the line that is still being maintained is the level crossing in Athlone, workers were painting it a few days ago.

Hungerford

LGiamani wrote: »

The line is an excellent piece of infrastructure as I've walked it in the last few years. There are a number of bridges that do not cater for double tracking but these can be changed.

The line was built as a double track one [it was singled later] so there should be enough space under the bridges.

flazio

Hungerford wrote: »

The line was built as a double track one [it was singled later] so there should be enough space under the bridges.

True, but there's also a few places where the line goes over a road and the bridge isn't wide enough.
Here is a prime example (although I do see room for expansion.)

corktina

is there any need for it to be double track for two or three trains a day? I(s there any need for a station in Moate for that matter. Its oinly a short link and Mullingar and Athlone are reasonably close to Moate.

flazio

flazio wrote: »

True, but there's also a few places where the line goes over a road and the bridge isn't wide enough.
Here is a prime example (although I do see room for expansion.)

The cost of replacing the deck is tiny in comparison with having to widen an embankment and piers, chances are when the track was singled the original steel bridge deck was recycled as well.

Art(h)ur

The major factor for me would be if the travel time from Galway to Dublin would be shorter via Mullingar than it is now via Portarlington. If yes, then it would make sense to rebuild it (on top of the benefits of freeing up the capacity on the existing line as described by OP). From looking at the map - it should be shorter as now in Clara the track turns south even though its destination (Dublin) is to the west. The Galway trains could be alternating between Mullingar and Portarlington or all of them going via Mullingar with separate Athlone-Portarlington-Dublin services.

But a more urgent issue for me is about the Athlone Midland - why are there derelict buildings lying right by one of the main routes in the country for all tourists to see (especially as the trains slow down right there when approaching the bridge)???? After merely 25 years since its closure, no one took them over as shops, warehouses, restaurants, anything? Or during the boom years, the land could have been sold to a successful property developer so that he could tear them down and build whatever he wishes in a perfect location close to a thriving city, right by the river etc. Sounds unbelievable but yet...

dowlingm

But a more urgent issue for me is about the Athlone Midland - why are there derelict buildings lying right by one of the main routes in the country for all tourists to see (especially as the trains slow down right there when approaching the bridge)????

That's CIE "Property Management" for you I suppose...

As for the discussion about double tracking - why bother? Single track gives you the connection to Mullingar but where are the slots into Maynooth/the northside coming from to run large numbers of trains to justify double? Better to have a high speed single track line which can also accommodate Galway/Mayo GAA express specials and the like rather than creating expectations in Moate and other small towns and village that trains = stations.

Art(h)ur

Art(h)ur wrote: »

But a more urgent issue for me is about the Athlone Midland - why are there derelict buildings lying right by one of the main routes in the country for all tourists to see (especially as the trains slow down right there when approaching the bridge)???? After merely 25 years since its closure, no one took them over as shops, warehouses, restaurants, anything? Or during the boom years, the land could have been sold to a successful property developer so that he could tear them down and build whatever he wishes in a perfect location close to a thriving city, right by the river etc. Sounds unbelievable but yet...

That station is actually some distance form the centre of town and on the wrong side of the river, any development there would be out on its own (a bit like many of the ghost estates).

Any development there would need to be part of a wider area plan to be successful.

flas

coylemj wrote: »

You have to remember that the old MGWR station is closed with no staff so you'd have to recruit new staff and refit most of the station to open it up and I can't see Irish Rail coughing up the cash to do this.

An Athlone-Galway commuter would only be viable if it started by picking up passengers on the Leinster side at the 'new' station, I can't see them stopping the train after barely a mile to pick up a couple of passengers at the MGWR station.

this happens at leixlip?!

Art(h)ur

Deleted User wrote: »

That station is actually some distance form the centre of town and on the wrong side of the river, any development there would be out on its own (a bit like many of the ghost estates).

Any development there would need to be part of a wider area plan to be successful.

That's exactly why I was thinking more of industrial/shopping use - these have no problem with being located on the outskirts. And they could happen even in the downturn.

coylemj

flas wrote: »

this happens at leixlip?!

FFS, you can't compare Athlone to Leixlip which is part of greater Dublin! There's probably more people working in Intel than live on the west side of Athlone.

L1011

coylemj wrote: »

FFS, you can't compare Athlone to Leixlip which is part of greater Dublin! There's probably more people working in Intel than live on the west side of Athlone.

They even intended to build a *third* station for Intel due to its volume of staff; but as Intel started to build towards the existing station the plan got dropped.

kildarecommuter

Some interesting comments here but not a chance of Irish Rail doing anything with line and I doubt much political will either.

LXFlyer

Art(h)ur wrote: »

The major factor for me would be if the travel time from Galway to Dublin would be shorter via Mullingar than it is now via Portarlington. If yes, then it would make sense to rebuild it (on top of the benefits of freeing up the capacity on the existing line as described by OP). From looking at the map - it should be shorter as now in Clara the track turns south even though its destination (Dublin) is to the west. The Galway trains could be alternating between Mullingar and Portarlington or all of them going via Mullingar with separate Athlone-Portarlington-Dublin services.

But a more urgent issue for me is about the Athlone Midland - why are there derelict buildings lying right by one of the main routes in the country for all tourists to see (especially as the trains slow down right there when approaching the bridge)???? After merely 25 years since its closure, no one took them over as shops, warehouses, restaurants, anything? Or during the boom years, the land could have been sold to a successful property developer so that he could tear them down and build whatever he wishes in a perfect location close to a thriving city, right by the river etc. Sounds unbelievable but yet...

Appearances can be deceptive as you have also to remember the difference in line speeds, particularly between Portarlington and Heuston.

Athlone-Heuston is typically 1 hour 30-35 minutes.

Mullingar-Connolly is typically 1 hour 10 minutes, while Athlone-Mullingar would take roughly 40 minutes giving a journey time of 1 hour 50 minutes.

So no it would not be faster.

mgmt

lxflyer wrote: »

Appearances can be deceptive as you have also to remember the difference in line speeds, particularly between Portarlington and Heuston.

Athlone-Heuston is typically 1 hour 30-35 minutes.

Mullingar-Connolly is typically 1 hour 10 minutes, while Athlone-Mullingar would take roughly 40 minutes giving a journey time of 1 hour 50 minutes.

So no it would not be faster.

Connolly is better than Hueston. Is Docklands better than Hueston?

LXFlyer

You're still looking at a faster journey time to O'Connell Street via Portarlington by about 10-15 minutes.

L1011

Would Athlone to Mullingar really take 40mins? If the line was rebuilt I'd presume it'd be capable of higher speeds than that.

veryangryman

lxflyer wrote: »

You're still looking at a faster journey time to O'Connell Street via Portarlington by about 10-15 minutes.

And more people would take the train from Galway/Athlone.

Most people who want to go to Dublin have zero interest in the area around Heuston. Connolly is downtown :cool:

dowlingm

MYOB wrote: »

Would Athlone to Mullingar really take 40mins? If the line was rebuilt I'd presume it'd be capable of higher speeds than that.

In the IE network statement Mullingar-Athlone is listed as 28 miles. If the line could be relaid to 70-75mph line speed with only enough speed restrictions to keep end-to-end average speed to 60mph, that's 28 minutes. But that's a higher spec than they relaid WRC to so 40mins is probably pretty realistic.

Anyone got a dusty old 1960s timetable so we can tell what it was back in the day?

Incidentally, the same network statement still lists Tralee-Fenit and Waterford-New Ross mileage...

patrickbrophy18

veryangryman wrote: »

And more people would take the train from Galway/Athlone.

Most people who want to go to Dublin have zero interest in the area around Heuston. Connolly is downtown :cool:

Totally agree. While many might classify Heuston as being in the "city center", it isn't really quite there. When people (both nationally and internationally) think of the city center, they think of the main thoroughfares and shopping streets. For example, O'Connell Street and Grafton Street are at the very heart of Dublin City. Heuston Station as a "city center" terminus is treated much the same as many of Ryan Air termini in that it's in the vicinity but not quite at the actual place itself.

Any-who, back on topic. I will admit that a lot of former railway infrastructure has gone to the dogs. The former Broadstone Station is an excellent example of an asset that was badly mistreated as it is strategically located in such a way where a large number of Maynooth services could terminate. This alone would ease the huge strain which currently builds up in Connolly Station. Having seen the map of the former Broadstone Station, it looks like a reasonably straight forward project to relay the track between it and Broombridge Station. I know that the former track bed on this section has become overgrown with weeds and grass and in some cases, mini rivers. However, a lot of this could be cleaned up in a matter of weeks with the correct machinery. Hereafter, relay the tracks.

If every second or third train to and from Maynooth departed and terminated at Broadstone Station, the newly available slots from Connolly would enable use of The Phoenix Park Tunnel for potential passenger services from the likes of Galway, Cork and Waterford. In a similar vain, extra commuter services to Athlone could begin their journey at Connolly station and operate via the Athlone-Mullingar Rail Link where the stretch along the Kildare route becomes over-crowded. Given that the Kildare route is shared by services coming from Westport, Galway, Cork and Waterford, it must suffer from some congestion. As such, the Athlone-Mullingar Rail Link could be upgraded for this very use. However, Broadstone Station would play a very important role in making use of The Phoenix Park Tunnel and The Athlone-Mullingar Rail Link possible. A lot of extra potentially future Galway services could start their journey in Connolly as a result of reinstating these key parts of infrastructure.

Losty Dublin

veryangryman wrote: »

And more people would take the train from Galway/Athlone.

Most people who want to go to Dublin have zero interest in the area around Heuston. Connolly is downtown :cool:

Do they really, though?

Going via the old route you have three towns of any size (Moate, Mullingar and Maynooth) of which one is already served by commuter trains and two are on the main roads to Galway. You connect to the Sligo train and that's it.

Going via the current route, the train connects Clara and Tullamore with Athlone; it also gives the west connections with trains for Cork, Limerick, Tralee and Waterford trains, not to mention Kildare, Newbridge and Portarlington.

Aside from the faster services via the current route, it allows more services to serve Dublin by offering more trains to come and go into Dublin. As long ago as the mid 60's, Connolly was close to capacity and with space limited, Heuston was the only show in town as regards offering space. Heuston also gets people to the Zoo (One of the busiest tourist attractions), St James Hospital, the courts and the south city while it also was quicker for much of the then heavy freight traffic to access the west, including Guinness whose brewery was adjacent to the station. Okay, Connolly is closer to Henry Street and O'Connell Street but Heuston is not the trek many people make it out to be.

L1011

Putting any % of Maynooth line services in Broadstone would kill passenger numbers due to the huge number of people who are switching on to the DART.

You'd also need to move Bus Eireann and Dublin Bus somewhere else, or build a new station right at the station throat which is even further out from the city than Broadstone itself.

LXFlyer

veryangryman wrote: »

And more people would take the train from Galway/Athlone.

Most people who want to go to Dublin have zero interest in the area around Heuston. Connolly is downtown :cool:

I think that you misread my post.

It would still be faster to go via Heuston to O'Connell Bridge than via Connolly by about 10-15 minutes factoring in walking/bus/tram transfers.

MYOB wrote: »

Would Athlone to Mullingar really take 40mins? If the line was rebuilt I'd presume it'd be capable of higher speeds than that.

dowlingm wrote: »

In the IE network statement Mullingar-Athlone is listed as 28 miles. If the line could be relaid to 70-75mph line speed with only enough speed restrictions to keep end-to-end average speed to 60mph, that's 28 minutes. But that's a higher spec than they relaid WRC to so 40mins is probably pretty realistic.

Anyone got a dusty old 1960s timetable so we can tell what it was back in the day?

Incidentally, the same network statement still lists Tralee-Fenit and Waterford-New Ross mileage...

Well I based my estimate on similar distances on the Westport line:

Athlone-Moate is 10 miles (appx) - much the same as Claremorris/Ballyhaunis which takes 12 minutes.

Moate-Mullingar is 18 miles (appx) - much the same as Roscommon/Athlone which takes 23 minutes - that factors in the bridge too which would apply if the Midland station were being used for Athlone/Mullingar/Dublin services.

Allow 3 minutes for a station stop at Moate that gives you 38 minutes.

dennis124wwr

lxflyer wrote: »

I think that you misread my post.

It would still be faster to go via Heuston to O'Connell Bridge than via Connolly by about 10-15 minutes factoring in walking/bus/tram transfers.





Well I based my estimate on similar distances on the Westport line:

Athlone-Moate is 10 miles (appx) - much the same as Claremorris/Ballyhaunis which takes 12 minutes.

Moate-Mullingar is 18 miles (appx) - much the same as Roscommon/Athlone which takes 23 minutes - that factors in the bridge too which would apply if the Midland station were being used for Athlone/Mullingar/Dublin services.

Allow 3 minutes for a station stop at Moate that gives you 38 minutes.

The line is 44.7km

dennis124wwr

lxflyer wrote: »

I think that you misread my post.

It would still be faster to go via Heuston to O'Connell Bridge than via Connolly by about 10-15 minutes factoring in walking/bus/tram transfers.





Well I based my estimate on similar distances on the Westport line:

Athlone-Moate is 10 miles (appx) - much the same as Claremorris/Ballyhaunis which takes 12 minutes.

Moate-Mullingar is 18 miles (appx) - much the same as Roscommon/Athlone which takes 23 minutes - that factors in the bridge too which would apply if the Midland station were being used for Athlone/Mullingar/Dublin services.

Allow 3 minutes for a station stop at Moate that gives you 38 minutes.

The line is 44.7km

LXFlyer

dennis124wwr wrote: »

The line is 44.7km

And your point is - bringing up a post from over two years ago???

eejoynt

The poster has a very recent history of one liners, of which the following is typical

'What is a passing loop'.



Engagement is a waste of time

galwaycyclist

lxflyer wrote: »

And your point is - bringing up a post from over two years ago???

Yes I thought I might mention - as far as I know - Mullingar Athlone has now been co-opted for a section of the Galway to Dublin cycleway.