Cutting out processed meat

DoubleBogey

My diet is quite good in some respects and bad in others. I make all my meals from raw ingredients, whether it be burgers and chips or a vindaloo. So I know exactly what is going into my meals. At least I thought I did until I realized the meats I use are mostly processed. I also eat lunch meats, processed, every single day. I'm trying to cut this out to complete the picture, but rather than go without I would prefer to find a healthy alternative. But how can you tell if the meat is processed and where do you go, what do you ask for when shopping for unprocessed meat. Take chicken breasts for example, I have no idea where to buy one that has not been injected with saline gunk.

Well if you're very health conscious I'd cut out lunch meats completely if I were you. I know you said you didn't want to cut anything out, but I really wouldn't eat that stuff.

Irish chicken isn't bulked up with anything I'd class as particularly worrying AFAIK, but a general rule is that you get what you pay for. If there's 500g of chicken and they're asking you for the price of 400g chicken, it's probably only 400g chicken + 100g water. (completely abstract example btw)

Best quality stuff will be at a trusted butcher's, where you can see what you're getting and you can talk to the butcher about it. There'll always be a few wafflers here and there but on the whole it's a better deal than getting a pre-packed meat.

careca11

out of interest ,
what is your recipe for your Vindaloo,
I'd love to try it

DoubleBogey

true-or-false wrote: »

Well if you're very health conscious I'd cut out lunch meats completely if I were you. I know you said you didn't want to cut anything out, but I really wouldn't eat that stuff.

Irish chicken isn't bulked up with anything I'd class as particularly worrying AFAIK, but a general rule is that you get what you pay for. If there's 500g of chicken and they're asking you for the price of 400g chicken, it's probably only 400g chicken + 100g water. (completely abstract example btw)

Best quality stuff will be at a trusted butcher's, where you can see what you're getting and you can talk to the butcher about it. There'll always be a few wafflers here and there but on the whole it's a better deal than getting a pre-packed meat.

Most definitely I want to cut out lunch meats, but replace it with a healthy non processed version. But everything seems to be processed to give it a better shelf life. Maybe what I'm looking for is organic meat? I just have no idea what to look out for.

Chicken breasts are not harmless. It's not just salt and water, they put chemicals in it too.

DoubleBogey

careca11 wrote: »

out of interest ,
what is your recipe for your Vindaloo,
I'd love to try it

I get my recipes straight from recipe books :-). For something quick and easy that u can make on a weekday try Jamie oliver's ministry of food. You can make batches of the paste and freeze them. I also have a hard core curry book, but you need a spate afternoon to make it!

d'Oracle

DoubleBogey wrote: »

It's not just salt and water, they put chemicals in it too.

What ones?

Also, I am usually skeptical about these things when applied to Ireland.
Its usually some British or American mass food stuff that we, with our utterly awesome food quality, don't really get.

DoubleBogey

d'Oracle wrote: »

What ones?

Also, I am usually skeptical about these things when applied to Ireland.
Its usually some British or American mass food stuff that we, with our utterly awesome food quality, don't really get.

Apparenly there are nitrates in the solution which can cause cancer. Just did a quick google and you can get nitrate free meats, but alas nothing Irish showing up.

Anyone know if organic meat is nitrate free? What I really want is just a cut of meat, untampered with. Frozen is fine but no injections of any kind, not even water and salt.

Red Cortina

DoubleBogey wrote: »

My diet is quite good in some respects and bad in others. I make all my meals from raw ingredients, whether it be burgers and chips or a vindaloo. So I know exactly what is going into my meals. At least I thought I did until I realized the meats I use are mostly processed. I also eat lunch meats, processed, every single day. I'm trying to cut this out to complete the picture, but rather than go without I would prefer to find a healthy alternative. But how can you tell if the meat is processed and where do you go, what do you ask for when shopping for unprocessed meat. Take chicken breasts for example, I have no idea where to buy one that has not been injected with saline gunk.

I guess that processed luncheon meats aren’t exactly the worst food in the world to eat but I see where you are coming from.

There are a couple of rules of thumb that I try to abide by when I am choosing what to eat. One of them would be to try and eat real food made in a traditional manner. Another one would be that you are what you have eaten has eaten.

So I try to limit the amount of pork/ham/bacon in my diet as I figure that pigs are kept in piggeries (when did you last see a pig roaming around in a field??) which are not their natural environments and are probably fed stuff that they are meant to eat.

I try and limit the amount of chicken in my diet too. Did you ever see that documentary that Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall did about chickens? It seems that even though when chicken is sold and labelled ‘free range’, the chances of it having left the barn in which it is housed to wander around the tiny area outside are limited. Whatever about buying the chicken labelled free-range in the supermarket, I would be wary about buying cheapo chicken from butchers who don’t seem to have any label on it at all.

I try and eat lamb and beef as I figure that the chances of lamb/cattle having seen a bit of grass/silage/hay in Ireland is pretty high. (As per El_D’s recommendations and also the recommendations of the health blogger Kurt Harris here: http://www.archevore.com/get-started/ )

So to answer your question about what to eat and where to go for meat-could you eat some canned fish for lunch maybe? Or cook some fish at home and bring it with you? Again you want to buy fish which is wild, not farmed or organic. And if you were watching Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall’s Fish Fight documentary you would also try and avoid eating salmon, tuna and cod which are over-fished at the minute cause everyone wants to eat those types. Or else you could do a chilli with minced beef or some beef or lamb stew. I love slow braised shoulder of lamb. What about some egg muffins? There is a recipe knocking around here for those.

El_Dangeroso

DoubleBogey wrote: »

Apparenly there are nitrates in the solution which can cause cancer. Just did a quick google and you can get nitrate free meats, but alas nothing Irish showing up.

Anyone know if organic meat is nitrate free? What I really want is just a cut of meat, untampered with. Frozen is fine but no injections of any kind, not even water and salt.

It's not the nitrates, there's tonnes more nitrates in veg than there is in bacon. Nitrate doesn't convert to nitrite and then carcinogenic nitrosamines in the gut, that was a hypothesis that turned out to be wrong when tested in humans.

Save your money on that expensive nitrate-free bacon.

There still is quite a strong link between processed meat and gastric cancer though, I don't know why but I'd suspect there must be something about the curing process that causes it. Back when we didn't have refrigeration the rates of gastric cancers were really high compared to today because pretty much all meat had to be cured or pickled.

The trouble with a lot of the studies on this is that they don't differentiate between crappy hotdogs and artisan-cured prosciutto. People who tend to eat a lot of processed meat tend to have rather crappy diets in general and even with statistical manipulation, these factors are hard to tease apart.

Bottom line, don't eat bacon for all your meat needs (3-4 times a week is fine), buy GOOD quality bacon. Avoid packet cooked meats, and above all don't stress too much, that's bad for your health too!

woggie

El_Dangeroso wrote: »

It's not the nitrates, there's tonnes more nitrates in veg than there is in bacon. Nitrate doesn't convert to nitrite and then carcinogenic nitrosamines in the gut, that was a hypothesis that turned out to be wrong when tested in humans.

There was a tv program on the other week claimed that the nitrates put into ham caused cancer of the bowel, it was claiming pretty high statisics also ... is this wrong then, or did I completely miss the point?

slowburner

El_Dangeroso wrote: »

It's not the nitrates, there's tonnes more nitrates in veg than there is in bacon. Nitrate doesn't convert to nitrite and then carcinogenic nitrosamines in the gut, that was a hypothesis that turned out to be wrong when tested in humans.

Save your money on that expensive nitrate-free bacon.

There still is quite a strong link between processed meat and gastric cancer though, I don't know why but I'd suspect there must be something about the curing process that causes it. Back when we didn't have refrigeration the rates of gastric cancers were really high compared to today because pretty much all meat had to be cured or pickled.

The trouble with a lot of the studies on this is that they don't differentiate between crappy hotdogs and artisan-cured prosciutto. People who tend to eat a lot of processed meat tend to have rather crappy diets in general and even with statistical manipulation, these factors are hard to tease apart.

Bottom line, don't eat bacon for all your meat needs (3-4 times a week is fine), buy GOOD quality bacon. Avoid packet cooked meats, and above all don't stress too much, that's bad for your health too!

I agree with El-D.
A traditionally cured bacon shouldn't have sodium nitrite in it - God knows what sort of a chemical cocktail is in some of these products!
I think sodium nitrite is used to turn pork meat the red hue expected in bacon - correct me if I'm wrong.
Isn't there something too, about frying bacon fat at high temperatures which releases toxins of some kind or other?

Here's a link to a (vested interest) site which might be of general interest.

DoubleBogey

Ok well I'm still more inclined to believe any sort of preservative bar freezing is bad for you. I don't know what the shelf life is for unpreserved meat, maybe it's ridiculously low and that's the problem. But I also can't believe there is no market out there for untampered meats. Obviously it would have to come from a local source but I don't see how that is a problem in Ireland. A pig could be slaughtered in donegal and it's chops could be on the shelf in Dublin the next day. But as was already pointed out, you still need to worry about what the pig was fed!

Adelie

DoubleBogey wrote: »

Ok well I'm still more inclined to believe any sort of preservative bar freezing is bad for you. I don't know what the shelf life is for unpreserved meat, maybe it's ridiculously low and that's the problem. But I also can't believe there is no market out there for untampered meats. Obviously it would have to come from a local source but I don't see how that is a problem in Ireland. A pig could be slaughtered in donegal and it's chops could be on the shelf in Dublin the next day. But as was already pointed out, you still need to worry about what the pig was fed!

Well you can buy meat without preservatives but the whole point of cured meats like bacon/ham is that they are preserved! Pork chops shouldn't have any additives.

as for what they are fed - Irish beef and lamb are very high quality, choose those over chicken/pork if you want to ensure they had a good diet. Otherwise find an artisan farmer who rears chickens and pork on a natural outdoors diet

edit: just to be clear, I don't think there's anything wrong with eating Irish chicken/pork, and buying Irish chicken/pork is definitely better buying imported stuff, but I do think that Irish beef/lamb are better

jam_mac_jam

This makes me very sad, I eat sliced ham like Shaws or Superquinn premium, also the proscuttio or parma from Lidl, and had no idea that they were this bad for you. I have been eating lots more since I have gone low carb, damn it.

slowburner

jam_mac_jam wrote: »

This makes me very sad, I eat sliced ham like Shaws or Superquinn premium, also the proscuttio or parma from Lidl, and had no idea that they were this bad for you. I have been eating lots more since I have gone low carb, damn it.

Apart from all that - that's too much salt in your diet :eek:

jam_mac_jam

slowburner wrote: »

Apart from all that - that's too much salt in your diet :eek:

Is it really? When I didnt say how much I eat or how often, and the fact I eat no other foods which contain salt. I said lots more than I used to but when you take away the fact I no longer eat bread, cereal, processed foods etc, its not a lot of salt at all.:eek: So shocking that people would eat a few slices of ham a week. shocking.

slowburner

Just something to be wary of. That's all.
I like ham, and rashers, and bacon, and prosciutto, and salami, and chorizo - too

onimpulse

I know someone who works in this industry and rang them up after seeing that prog & asked a few questions. Basically he said...

A basic rule of thumb is you get what you pay for. The more expensive it is the less nitrates and brine (they put in it to increase the weight and make it last longer).

He also said that Irish meat is in a different league to some of the imported stuff & he literally wouldn't eat imported meat from one specific country - ever!

He buys fresh Irish turkeys, chickens, fresh meat etc and cooks it himself on a Sunday & it's in the fridge for the kids lunch for the week or the first part of it anyway.... I've started to do the same. No more sliced meat for me - fresh and Irish or it doesn't get bought.