Atheists and The Angelus

Mistress 69

Atheists and The Angelus

Quote Taken from atheist ireland
“In August, on the 60th anniversary of the Angelus on RTE, we had a high profile media campaign on the need to remove the Angelus. We have since entered into correspondence with the new Director General of RTE on this issue.”

Why is there any need to remove the Angelus? What gives the atheist community any right to even try to do so. Who the hell do they think they are? They must be out of their minds(1) if they think they will succeed in that endeavour. Seems to me that they only try to do so on Catholic turf. I mean let’s get real here, when is the last time we saw any atheists trying to enforce their wishes around The Mosque in Clonskeagh? They would do well to remember that this is a Catholic country that welcomes all, and at least try to behave as reasonable people. Hope RTE tells them where to get off....HOORAH!:p


(1) I tried not to use inflammatory words such as mini brains as I did before.

Delirium

RTE news is really falling behind in the stories if it doesn't realise there'll be no need for the angelus after tomorrow :P

MagicMarker

Not this AGAIN!!!

opinion guy

Lol I saw this thread title and reached for my popcorn:D

Mistress 69 wrote: »

this is a Catholic country

Things change

strobe

Thread done lots.

If you are genuinely interested Mistress (heh, now that would be a shock) then those threads above have this covered in detail. Glad to be of assistance.

kylith

Mss. 69, you would be ok with your licence fee being used to record a muslim call to prayer 5 times a day, and whatever other religions wanted to have a daily prayer, I assume.

This is not a Catholic country any longer. In order to be fair RTE should either cater to every religion or none. Frankly I would like my money to go into programming rather than religious nonsense. If you're so worried about missing 6pm I advise that you set your alarm clock.

Zillah

This is a well constructed troll. Genuine but tired issue, clear misunderstanding of the facts, pre-emptive stawmanning of responses, ignorance of secularism, passive-aggressive tone...

Nice.

Doctor DooM

Zillah wrote: »

This is a well constructed troll. Genuine but tired issue, clear misunderstanding of the facts, pre-emptive stawmanning of responses, ignorance of secularism, passive-aggressive tone...

Nice.

I believe someone pointed this out to the OP in their last troll thread, good to see her learning.

opinion guy

Doctor DooM wrote: »

I believe someone pointed this out to the OP in their last troll thread, good to see her learning.

Welcome to Troll Academy OP

pH

SuperInfinity

No I agree with the Angelus staying on. Anything the public want has a right to being on tv.

It's how public television works, if enough people want it, it gets put on. If there were enough muslim people who would like a programme on, they would put that on. It's about demand.

Anyone who wants to take the Angelus off the air is just pretentious.

The Mad Hatter

SuperInfinity wrote: »

No I agree with the Angelus staying on. Anything the public want has a right to being on tv.

It's how public television works, if enough people want it, it gets put on. If there were enough muslim people who would like a programme on, they would put that on. It's about demand.

Anyone who wants to take the Angelus off the air is just pretentious.

...What exactly do you think the word pretentious means?

strobe

SuperInfinity wrote: »

It's how public television works, if enough people want it, it gets put on. If there were enough muslim people who would like a programme on, they would put that on. It's about demand.

It would be interesting to see the viewership figures it get's and what viewership figures it would get if it wasn't on immediately before the RTE flagship news programme. Just in terms of the demand thing like. I'm pretty sure I could get reasonably good viewership for a show with me wearing a funny hat and telling knock knock jokes for 60 seconds if I got RTE to run it the minute immediately preceding The Late Late Show every Friday.

Anyone who wants to take the Angelus off the air is just pretentious.

What are they pretending to be exactly? People that don't want the angelus to be on tv? Are you sure they are only pretending?

bnt

I can't say I'm too bothered personally - what's a minute? - but it's unconstitutional. It's a violation of Article 44 (2) (2°) of the Constitution of the Republic of Ireland, which reads "the State guarantees not to endow any religion". RTÉ air time costs money, so giving the Catholic Church air time for free is an "endowment". It's as simple as that, and it would not be tolerated in e.g. the USA with their activist lawyers, but things like that tend to slide in this little country.

Zillah

SuperInfinity wrote: »

No I agree with the Angelus staying on. Anything the public want has a right to being on tv.

It's how public television works, if enough people want it, it gets put on. If there were enough muslim people who would like a programme on, they would put that on. It's about demand.

Anyone who wants to take the Angelus off the air is just pretentious.

Do you know what secularism is? Do you know why it is important?

EDIT: Typo

Galvasean

bnt wrote: »

I can't say I'm too bothered personally - what's a minute? - but it's unconstitutional. It's a violation of Article 44 (2) (2°) of the Constitution of the Republic of Ireland, which reads "the State guarantees not to endow any religion". RTÉ air time costs money, so giving the Catholic Church air time for free is an "endowment". It's as simple as that, and it would not be tolerated in e.g. the USA with their activist lawyers, but things like that tend to slide in this little country.

I agree with you 100%. I don't really mind it. In fact in my house the ringing bells are like an alarm indicating that the news is imminent!
But like you said, it is not technically constitutional.

SuperInfinity

strobe wrote: »

What are they pretending to be exactly? People that don't want the angelus to be on tv? Are you sure they are only pretending?

Pretentious about their purely atheistic stance. A mature and truly enlightened person does not persecute people based on their beliefs.

What about Keith Barry's shows? Some people believe in him, should RTE say that no, we won't allow that, because it's a supernatural thing? No, because if people watch it then it should be allowed on.

It doesn't matter if you believe in it or not. Your opinion on it doesn't matter, just like your opinion on whether Home and Away should be on doesn't matter.

Otherwise you are no better than the people who want/wanted to ban overly violent movies, ban all sex, etc. You're in the same boat with them. You're on a sort of "crusade" for atheism like the christians used to go on their crusades before. It is just a waste of time and hurting the rights of others based on what they believe.

I don't believe in the Angelus but want it on. Who are you to say that based on what someone believes they should or shouldn't be allowed to have something?

liamw

SuperInfinity wrote: »

Otherwise you are no better than the people who want/wanted to ban overly violent movies, ban all sex, etc. You're in the same boat with them. You're on a sort of "crusade" for atheism like the christians used to go on their crusades before. It is just a waste of time and hurting the rights of others.

You must be a troll...

bnt wrote:

It's a violation of Article 44 (2) (2°) of the Constitution of the Republic of Ireland, which reads "the State guarantees not to endow any religion".

Galvasean

SuperInfinity wrote: »

Pretentious about their purely atheistic stance. A mature and truly enlightened person does not persecute people based on their beliefs.

Wanting to take away one group's preferential treatment and treat everyone equally is not persecution...

SuperInfinity

Galvasean wrote: »

I agree with you 100%. I don't really mind it. In fact in my house the ringing bells are like an alarm indicating that the news is imminent!
But like you said, it is not technically constitutional.

But RTE isn't endorsing it by putting it on. They're not saying: "This is the Angelus, let us all now pray to the Lord our God".

liamw

SuperInfinity wrote: »

But RTE isn't endorsing it by putting it on. They're not saying: "This is the Angelus, let us all now pray to the Lord our God".

They are endorsing one religion over another.

Galvasean

SuperInfinity wrote: »

But RTE isn't endorsing it by putting it on. They're not saying: "This is the Angelus, let us all now pray to the Lord our God".

The Angelus says just that... It's a call to prayer for Catholics!

SuperInfinity

Galvasean wrote: »

Wanting to take away one group's preferential treatment and treat everyone equally is not persecution...

There is no "preferential treatment", except in so much as there's "preferential treatment" every time a programme comes on that not everyone enjoys equally.

If there is a football match on, is this preferential treatment to football supporters? If Friends is on, is this preferential treatment to people who like that show? No.... preferential treatment does not occur in this context. Indeed, preferential or discriminatory treatment would only occur if many people want to watch a programme, but were not allowed to do so because of their beliefs or the type of programme it was.

SuperInfinity

liamw wrote: »

They are endorsing one religion over another.

Not really, they put it on as a public service. They would put muslim's call to prayer on if there was a big enough demand for it.

dvpower

SuperInfinity wrote: »

What about Keith Barry's shows? Some people believe in him, should RTE say that no, we won't allow that, because it's a supernatural thing? No, because if people watch it then it should be allowed on.

Whenever I hear Keith Barry being interviewed, he is at pains to point out that what he does isn't supernatural.
So if people still believe that its a supernatural thing, I think its fair to point out the truth (that they are idiots)

Galvasean

Either I'm being trolled or I'm being debated by an idiot. I don't fancy either. All of this has been covered in previous threads that have been linked to already.
I'm out. Enjoy the weekend.

bnt

The language in the Constitution is not "endorse", it's "endow":

endow (ɪnˈdaʊ) — vb
1. to provide with or bequeath a source of permanent income
2. ( usually foll by with ) to provide (with qualities, characteristics, etc)
3. obsolete to provide with a dower

[C14: from Old French endouer, from en- 1 + douer , from Latin dōtāre, from dōs dowry]

"endow." Collins English Dictionary - Complete & Unabridged 10th Edition. HarperCollins Publishers. 20 May. 2011. <Dictionary.com http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/endow>.

Put it this way: if the Church paid tax, they could be taxed on the "benefit in kind" that they accrue through all that free air time. I may not be a lawyer, but you don't need to be to understand a bit of the Constitution. And I'm not even Irish, either.

Squarewave

As a bell-ringing enthusiast and an atheist, I'm torn on this issue.

Zillah

SuperInfinity wrote: »

There is no "preferential treatment", except in so much as there's "preferential treatment" every time a programme comes on that not everyone enjoys equally.

If there is a football match on, is this preferential treatment to football supporters? If Friends is on, is this preferential treatment to people who like that show? No.... preferential treatment does not occur in this context. Indeed, preferential or discriminatory treatment would only occur if many people want to watch a programme, but were not allowed to do so because of their beliefs or the type of programme it was.

Your brain is completely defective.

Dades

Mistress 69 wrote: »

Quote Taken from atheist ireland

Let's get one thing straight - the Boards A&A forum IS NOT aligned with Atheist Ireland.

Yes, there we share common members and some of us share certain ideals but we don't have to answer for every initiative or campaign they engage in.

I, like other atheists on this thread, don't give a rat's ass about the angelus.

That is all.

DeVore

Showing Soccer IS preferential treatment for Soccer fans. Personally I hate it as a stupid waste of tax payers money.

Where your analogy breaks down is that such preferential treatment is not forbidden by our constitution.

DeV.

opinion guy

DeVore wrote: »

Showing Soccer IS preferential treatment for Soccer fans. Personally I hate it as a stupid waste of tax payers money.

Where your analogy breaks down is that such preferential treatment is not forbidden by our constitution.

DeV.

whilst I have no love of soccer - it is at least a commercially viable exercise from advertising revenues etc.

strobe

SuperInfinity wrote: »

and truly enlightened person

Dishonest Buddhists and Wylo? Do dishonest Buddhists and Wylo want no more angelus? News to me. Quotes? References? Anything?

does not persecute people based on their beliefs.

Could you quote the posts of the persecution by the Buddhists, man? I never seen them do it, ye know? I'd like to show it to them for future reference. If you got something on Ekhart Tolle throw that in to the mix too please. He is getting fairly upity.

What about Keith Barry's shows? Some people believe in him, should RTE say that no, we won't allow that, because it's a supernatural thing? No, because if people watch it then it should be allowed on.

If people want to watch Kieth Barry let them loose. Let them at it. Let them form a wall of support and dance around singing "we will not be moved".

... What has this to do with anything again? Just so we are clear. Remember your 'point' was to do with demand. Care to draw a line?

It doesn't matter if you believe in it or not. Your opinion on it doesn't matter, just like your opinion on whether Home and Away should be on doesn't matter.

If I believe what or not? We are talking about demand, remember? What I believe has no relevance.

Otherwise you are no better than the people who want/wanted to ban overly violent movies, ban all sex, etc. You're in the same boat with them. You're on a sort of "crusade" for atheism like the christians used to go on their crusades before. It is just a waste of time and hurting the rights of others based on what they believe.

I really tried, I really fukking did, but no, you lost me. Why am I no better than people that don't like Natural Born Killers?

I don't believe in the Angelus but want it on. Who are you to say that based on what someone believes they should or shouldn't be allowed to have something?

Could you rephrase that please? I'm not trying to be insulting but that just doesn't form any question I could answer. It makes no sense in English, really.

Thanks.

MungBean

I just dont watch RTE any more. Solved the problem for me.

Bloody Nipples

I have more issues with the All-Ireland Talent show than with the Angelus.

SuperInfinity

Don't worry strobe you didn't insult me at all. In fact I read your post with mild amusement.

Tar.Aldarion

it's not even funny like the god channel, it's gotta go.

MagicMarker

Strobe, now be nice! Don't you know SuperInfinity has a degree in electrical engineering? He's know what he's talking about!

Nodin

Mistress 69 wrote: »

.......... I mean let’s get real here, when is the last time we saw any atheists trying to enforce their wishes around The Mosque in Clonskeagh? ........

It's secularists and RTE, to be precise.

They don't broadcast the Muslim call to prayer on RTE.

Nodin

DeVore wrote: »

Showing Soccer IS preferential treatment for Soccer fans. Personally I hate it as a stupid waste of tax payers money.

Where your analogy breaks down is that such preferential treatment is not forbidden by our constitution.

DeV.

There was a study a few years ago that compared sport popularity vs coverage. Turns out that 'middle class' sports receive disproportionate coverage, due to the fact that advertising sales particularily lucrative given the audience. Hence RTE a while back devoting a few saturdays to mens field hockey (with more people playing than standing round the fence watching...)

Zombrex

Mistress 69 wrote: »

Atheists and The Angelus

Quote Taken from atheist ireland
“In August, on the 60th anniversary of the Angelus on RTE, we had a high profile media campaign on the need to remove the Angelus. We have since entered into correspondence with the new Director General of RTE on this issue.”

Why is there any need to remove the Angelus? What gives the atheist community any right to even try to do so. Who the hell do they think they are? They must be out of their minds(1) if they think they will succeed in that endeavour. Seems to me that they only try to do so on Catholic turf. I mean let’s get real here, when is the last time we saw any atheists trying to enforce their wishes around The Mosque in Clonskeagh? They would do well to remember that this is a Catholic country that welcomes all, and at least try to behave as reasonable people. Hope RTE tells them where to get off....HOORAH!:p

The Angelus was originally only supposed to be broadcast for a few weeks. It was kept for political reasons and continues to be shown for political reasons. The RCC influence in the social and political life of Ireland has decreased dramatically in the last few years, we are now by and large a secular state and as such there seems little reason to keep going with this given it was never supposed to be a permanent fixture on radio/tv in the first place.

Unless anyone has a particular strong argument to keep it, but if they do I have yet to hear it.

The argument that we are a "Catholic country" is rather irrelevant, as there is nothing about being a Catholic country that says you broadcast the Angelus, even in the 50s at the hight of Catholic power in Ireland the original arrangement was to broadcast it for a few weeks due to some thing the Pope was doing I can't remember exactly what.

smokingman

The Angelus - "Child rapin', Come join the Fun!"

SuperInfinity

smokingman wrote: »

The Angelus - "Child rapin', Come join the Fun!"

You are a disgrace to atheists everywhere and to children who were abused.

You watch your mouth and don't talk about raping children like that. Sarcastically, in jest, that is still a rotten thing to say and also has NOTHING to do with the angelus.

mikhail

SuperInfinity wrote: »

You are a disgrace to atheists everywhere and to children who were abused.

You watch your mouth and don't talk about raping children like that. Sarcastically, in jest, that is still a rotten thing to say and also has NOTHING to do with the angelus.

If what he said was objectionable to you, report it to the mod. Your other courses of action if you find what someone writes on an internet forum to be objectionable include putting him on your ignore list, and following through with the threat you made yesterday to feck off for good if you didn't receive an apology. Are you new to the internet? It's not like the real world here: people can and will write things which upset you. If you can't handle that without throwing a strop every time, do us a favour and go read a book.

condra

Guys the OP didn't bother coming back. We been trolled.

Damn those pesky Christians, with their .. eh..

...pathetic, cowardly hit-and-run trolling.

The Mad Hatter

condra wrote: »

Guys the OP didn't bother coming back. We been trolled.

Damn those pesky Christians, with their .. eh..

...pathetic, cowardly hit-and-run trolling.

She's been raptured.

*Sees this joke getting really old, really fast...*

Mistress 69

pH wrote: »

GREAT PICTURE....... DID YOU CUT AND PASTE BY YOURSELF OR DID YOURE MUMMY HELP YOU !

condra

wow. obvious troll really is.. obvious.

Any chance we could get Mistress 69 thrown to some lions?

Dades

smokingman wrote: »

The Angelus - "Child rapin', Come join the Fun!"

Unfunny. Tread carefully.

SuperInfinity wrote: »

You watch your mouth and don't talk about raping children like that. Sarcastically, in jest, that is still a rotten thing to say and also has NOTHING to do with the angelus.

The sentiment may be right but leave the modding to the mods. It may not be immediate but it will happen if it needs to. Good.

Mistress 69

strobe wrote: »

Thread done lots.

If you are genuinely interested Mistress (heh, now that would be a shock) then those threads above have this covered in detail. Glad to be of assistance.

Assist yourself and bet you do .... just because my issue was covered in detail previously does not mean the right conclusion was reached.

Dades

Thread closed. OP has obviously no intention of engaging on a reasonable level.

Fair thee be warned.