mcpa for rushes

butt1

hi everyone,just finished cutting strong rushes,2ft high,cut them bare with a rotary,question is wen do i apply mcpa and can cattle still graze,wen its applied,the land is good quality,any shores that were needed were put in 2 years ago,cattle have poached it,hence lots of rushes, i have more to do,ive a topper was thinking of spraying wen topped,do i just let them rot away or get the rotary at them again after a few weeks???????????.
any theories welcome

Bodacious

butt1 wrote: »

hi everyone,just finished cutting strong rushes,2ft high,cut them bare with a rotary,question is wen do i apply mcpa and can cattle still graze,wen its applied,the land is good quality,any shores that were needed were put in 2 years ago,cattle have poached it,hence lots of rushes, i have more to do,ive a topper was thinking of spraying wen topped,do i just let them rot away or get the rotary at them again after a few weeks???????????.
any theories welcome

What i did and opinons will vary but i was advised even on here to cut then let grow for 4 weeks (til rush comes to a point/tip at the top) then spray and after another three weeks graze and following grazing top the dead rushes again.. gives grass chance to take over. oh and add lime and manure to aid grass growth as rushes are dying.

Worked for me .. best of luck 4 weeks from now you will get a good kill as will be good growth and green rush easier killed

vanderbadger

butt1 wrote: »

hi everyone,just finished cutting strong rushes,2ft high,cut them bare with a rotary,question is wen do i apply mcpa and can cattle still graze,wen its applied,the land is good quality,any shores that were needed were put in 2 years ago,cattle have poached it,hence lots of rushes, i have more to do,ive a topper was thinking of spraying wen topped,do i just let them rot away or get the rotary at them again after a few weeks???????????.
any theories welcome

cut them myself the other day and sprayed them yesterday evening, dont know if it was right or not but will see what happens

reilig

vanderbadger wrote: »

cut them myself the other day and sprayed them yesterday evening, dont know if it was right or not but will see what happens

I'd like to know if it will work? I think that rush spray, as a herbacide, needs to have the rush growing when you spray it. Rushes that you just topped may be stunted and not growing yet. By the time the start to grow, the spray may be long gone off them. Let us know if you achieved a kill.

farmerjohn

think you should wait till bout 2 to 3 weeks after cutting them, thats wat we do anyway,

sea12

farmerjohn wrote: »

think you should wait till bout 2 to 3 weeks after cutting them, thats wat we do anyway,

Thats what I did, Cut them and sprayed off with roundup 3 weeks later. very disappointed with kill rate however. maybe they were stunted a little by the drought like weather over the past few weeks. Some rushes on couldnt top and that was sprayed got a much better kill. So not too sure about cutting and spraying. I will know better in a few weeks once it is reseeded and see if anything comes up.

bbam

Last year we sprayed a few corners that hadn't been topped in 12 months, got a good kill rate, and some areas complete kill happened..
Happy with results and diesel saved....

johngalway

reilig wrote: »

I'd like to know if it will work? I think that rush spray, as a herbacide, needs to have the rush growing when you spray it. Rushes that you just topped may be stunted and not growing yet. By the time the start to grow, the spray may be long gone off them. Let us know if you achieved a kill.

I'd be figuring the same thing as yourself Reilig. "Topped" some of mine with the strimmer a good while back, some are well over 12" high now, fence up, just wondering about the weather to spray, may have just missed my window. Anyway, I would let them grow and spray them then, then re-cut after they had died off.

I sprayed what you would call thick mature stands of rushes late last year with Mortone, got complete kill in almost all areas I sprayed, very happy with that. Cut them a good while after they had died off. Doesn't seem to be any regrowth worthy of note.

vanderbadger

reilig wrote: »

I'd like to know if it will work? I think that rush spray, as a herbacide, needs to have the rush growing when you spray it. Rushes that you just topped may be stunted and not growing yet. By the time the start to grow, the spray may be long gone off them. Let us know if you achieved a kill.

was down there yesterday evening, no re growth yet, the butts look kinda brown, maybe its early days yet though

Tora Bora

I cut a half acre of very strong rushes last September. Left them in the row to rot down, which they have.
Grazed the field in early March followed by a blast of 18;6;12.
Grazed again third week April. Penned the cattle in tight and let them skin the grass. They even topped the rushes. :cool:
Sprayed 2nd of May with MCPA.
They are looking fairly brown today:D
The best part is, the grass has come on a treat in the meantime. I guess the grass suffered little or no set back from the MCPA, because I had it skinned to the bone, and so did not take up any of the chemical.

reilig

Tora Bora wrote: »

I cut a half acre of very strong rushes last September. Left them in the row to rot down, which they have.
Grazed the field in early March followed by a blast of 18;6;12.
Grazed again third week April. Penned the cattle in tight and let them skin the grass. They even topped the rushes. :cool:
Sprayed 2nd of May with MCPA.
They are looking fairly brown today:D
The best part is, the grass has come on a treat in the meantime. I guess the grass suffered little or no set back from the MCPA, because I had it skinned to the bone, and so did not take up any of the chemical.

I find that MCPA doesn't stunt grass in the same way as mortone does.

futurefarmer

Quick question,
Cut some very strong rushes with a mower last weekend they hadnt been cut for 3 years so were pretty wild, just wondering i presume these wont rot away for months so how is best to gather them up ?
Stupid question i know but theirs about 4 acres and i really want to save my back if i can

butt1

futurefarmer wrote: »

Quick question,
Cut some very strong rushes with a mower last weekend they hadnt been cut for 3 years so were pretty wild, just wondering i presume these wont rot away for months so how is best to gather them up ?
Stupid question i know but theirs about 4 acres and i really want to save my back if i can

bale them,bury them in a hole,do not burn or use as bedding,best of luck

jmurf100

Which is the best spray for rushes? Mortone or MCPA? What are the advantages or disadvantages for each?

reilig

jmurf100 wrote: »

Which is the best spray for rushes? Mortone or MCPA? What are the advantages or disadvantages for each?

IMO MCPA is the best - it achieves the fastest kill and stunts the grass least

bbam

futurefarmer wrote: »

Quick question,
Cut some very strong rushes with a mower last weekend they hadnt been cut for 3 years so were pretty wild, just wondering i presume these wont rot away for months so how is best to gather them up ?
Stupid question i know but theirs about 4 acres and i really want to save my back if i can

Leave them be... wasn't there a thread recently where it was quoted that they produced 70% of the P&K that farmyard manure does...
We've been attacking some heavy crops in recent years and never gather them.... let them rot away

reilig

bbam wrote: »

Leave them be... wasn't there a thread recently where it was quoted that they produced 70% of the P&K that farmyard manure does...
We've been attacking some heavy crops in recent years and never gather them.... let them rot away

I think he's suggesting that by gathering them up, you gather a lot of the seed also.

Tora Bora

bbam wrote: »

Leave them be... wasn't there a thread recently where it was quoted that they produced 70% of the P&K that farmyard manure does...
We've been attacking some heavy crops in recent years and never gather them.... let them rot away

Agreed. Downside is, land is under a heavy cover a the rushes die away. You won't get a quick regrowth of grass whilst the rushes decompose.
But if you are not under real pressure for grass, and you can afford to wait a bit, I would take advantage of the fertilizer value. Think of the cost of P&K, to buy in the bag. Then think of the cost of rowing, baling and burying bales of rushes.

Easy decision in my mind.

bbam

reilig wrote: »

I think he's suggesting that by gathering them up, you gather a lot of the seed also.

I read a research article online where it stated that the ground where rushes are strong has 1,000's seeds per sq meter, I think gathering felled rushes will have little effect but to tidy them up and possibly allow grass up faster..

polod

im just woundering if the weather picks up in july , august and i actually might get a chance to spray them ....would it be to late to spray them ? they have not been cut since last year

pakalasa

No I dont think it is too late.

I think one of the most important things is to spray in the right conditions. Spray early on a dry day with no rain forecast for a few days. There will be plenty of time then, for the water to evaporate leaving the MCPA chemical dry on the rushes.
I sprayed mine with the knapsack lasy year. I didnt cut them and this year they were completely dead. I burned (candle lighter) some in the dry weather in May.

Does anyone know if the seeds are killed aswell when you spray?

butt1

well ive cut the rushes,baled them,put them in a hole on the land waited 3 weeks for regrowth,sprayed 5 acres with 5 litres of mcpa and 600 litres of water,in the evening,after a dry day,waited 3 weeks,no dead rushes,did it again,waited another two weeks,no dead rushes,the new rushes have seeds on them,so i dont no what to do at this stage,weather is brutal,i cant get 2 dry days together to do anything,ive 50 acres to do

Grecco

MCPA will only work on the soft rush.By soft rush these are the ones you`d see growing in the after-grass of a meadow. It sounds to me like the place is badly infested, MCPA is a waste of money in this case. My advice is to cut them for now as in don't let them go to seed. Then tackle one field or roughly 5 acres at a time. Do a complete kill off with Roundup Bio active, wait for at least 5 weeks or until the roots of the rushers are roting away. then rotovate and reseed.
And then don't be too surprised if you see the rush appearing again as the seed can live in the soil for 50 years!
But its just a matter of keeping them in check after that, (you could then use the MCPA). Plus you need to ensure that the drainage is in order, this is a big help, and avoid poaching the land if possible.

polod

pakalasa wrote: »

No I dont think it is too late.

I think one of the most important things is to spray in the right conditions. Spray early on a dry day with no rain forecast for a few days. There will be plenty of time then, for the water to evaporate leaving the MCPA chemical dry on the rushes.
I sprayed mine with the knapsack lasy year. I didnt cut them and this year they were completely dead. I burned (candle lighter) some in the dry weather in May.

Does anyone know if the seeds are killed aswell when you spray?

cheers pakalasa .......lets just hope we can get 2 or 3 days with out rain now if thats not to much to ask

pakalasa

I did them at a rate of 0.5 Lt MCPA per 15Lt Water in the knapsack and I gave them a good drenching. A lot of back breaking work to do them so a right pain if it rains soon after ....worth watching the forecast alright. Use a small bit of wasking up liquid - it's supposed to help it stick to the rushes.

polod

pakalasa wrote: »

I did them at a rate of 0.5 Lt MCPA per 15Lt Water in the knapsack and I gave them a good drenching. A lot of back breaking work to do them so a right pain if it rains soon after ....worth watching the forecast alright. Use a small bit of wasking up liquid - it's supposed to help it stick to the rushes.

jaysus how many acres did ya do with the knapsack? ...thats some hard work alright.........not to mention boring yeah i heard that to about the fairy liquid.......but the teagasc man told me there is no need for it :rolleyes: also i heard to if u mix it with diesel its suppose to help 2

reilig

I licked 10 acres of hilly land with the quad on saturday - beats the knapsack any day

polod

reilig wrote: »

I licked 10 acres of hilly land with the quad on saturday - beats the knapsack any day

how do you find the licker ? ive heard its not as good as spraying them ?

reilig

polod wrote: »

how do you find the licker ? ive heard its not as good as spraying them ?

Its definitely not as good as spraying, but it works well enough. 20 litres of gallop for €60 will do 100 acres of land. If you were to buy MCPA to cover all that you'd be out a fortune. If I do them every year with the licker, it should keep them under control.

johngalway

I've no experience of lickers either, but I'd imagine if the rushes were cut, then licked from two different directions then it'd be pretty effective.

Posted same time Reilig

I would have thought the gallup would have killed off the rushes? Hmm, food for thought...

pakalasa

...I didn't do acres with the knapsack, only spot sprayed here and there.:D
I do them every year, just to keep on top of them.

polod

pakalasa wrote: »

...I didn't do acres with the knapsack, only spot sprayed here and there.:D
I do them every year, just to keep on top of them.

ahaha ah yeah who'd need a sprayer if you get a contracter in with a knapsack on his back

polod

reilig wrote: »

Its definitely not as good as spraying, but it works well enough. 20 litres of gallop for €60 will do 100 acres of land. If you were to buy MCPA to cover all that you'd be out a fortune. If I do them every year with the licker, it should keep them under control.

i bought mcpa (argitox i think is the name of it ) in the ferurary 40euro for a 10 litre drum

reilig

polod wrote: »

i bought mcpa (argitox i think is the name of it ) in the ferurary 40euro for a 10 litre drum

But how many acres will a 10 litre drum do?

1 litre of gallop wil do 3 to 5 acres with the licker on medium rushes.

polod

johngalway wrote: »

I've no experience of lickers either, but I'd imagine if the rushes were cut, then licked from two different directions then it'd be pretty effective.

Posted same time Reilig

I would have thought the gallup would have killed off the rushes? Hmm, food for thought...

id imagine the licking would be easier on the grass.......and ya could prob lick them with round-up to

polod

reilig wrote: »

But how many acres will a 10 litre drum do?

1 litre of gallop wil do 3 to 5 acres with the licker on medium rushes.

6 acres........some odds aint there ......... how much is gallop ?

reilig

polod wrote: »

6 acres........some odds aint there ......... how much is gallop ?

20 litres for €60

polod

have 15 acres of low land to spray ......think im going to chance it today

reilig

polod wrote: »

have 15 acres of low land to spray ......think im going to chance it today

You might as well if its dry enough. The weather looks to be dry for the next few days anyway.

johngalway

polod wrote: »

id imagine the licking would be easier on the grass.......and ya could prob lick them with round-up to

Yes, that's whatI would have thought too. I sprayed thick, established stands of rushes with Mortone and got a very good kill on the rushes that were there, close to 100%.

Now I see the odd green stem popping up here and there again. Spraying these would be a waste for me, there fore I'll be out with a bucket of round up and a paint roller, same concept before the sniggering starts

butt1

I SPRAYED 40 ACRES YESTERDAY EVENING,5 LITRES OF MCPA PLUS 300 LITRES WATER,IN 4 ACRE SECTIONS,THEY WOULD WANT TO DIE,AS I SPRAYED SOME OF THE SAME SECTIONS BEFORE,3 LITRES OF MCPA AND 300LITRES OF WATER,GOT NO KILL,FINGERS CROSSED,THE REGROWTH OF RUSHES ARE ABOUT 12 TO 14 INCHES,JESUS IF I COULD GET GRASS TO GROW AS QUICK AS RUSHES,IDE BE LOADED

polod

butt1 wrote: »

I SPRAYED 40 ACRES YESTERDAY EVENING,5 LITRES OF MCPA PLUS 300 LITRES WATER,IN 4 ACRE SECTIONS,THEY WOULD WANT TO DIE,AS I SPRAYED SOME OF THE SAME SECTIONS BEFORE,3 LITRES OF MCPA AND 300LITRES OF WATER,GOT NO KILL,FINGERS CROSSED,THE REGROWTH OF RUSHES ARE ABOUT 12 TO 14 INCHES,JESUS IF I COULD GET GRASS TO GROW AS QUICK AS RUSHES,IDE BE LOADED

i sprayed a bit yesterday too i used 10 litres of mcpa in 300 litres of water to 6 acres .........this is my first time ever to spray them ...hope its not a waste of money because they got one good shower of rain

MJH72

Heard of a rush killer called Buggy. I spoke to some people who used it. Completely killed the rush. Can only be used by a licker. Roco in mountbellew stock it. And you can hire a licker for fifty euro per day. I have a lot of rushes which are very heavy so I am going to spray with MCPA first.

vanderbadger

MJH72 wrote: »

Heard of a rush killer called Buggy. I spoke to some people who used it. Completely killed the rush. Can only be used by a licker. Roco in mountbellew stock it. And you can hire a licker for fifty euro per day. I have a lot of rushes which are very heavy so I am going to spray with MCPA first.

its probably same as round up or gallup so you cant spray it unless you want to burn off everything, just guessing now, have never actually come across it

restive

How long do i have to wait before grazing after mcpa application?

towzer2010

I checked the label on a drum and it says

"Livestock must be kept out of treated areas until poisonous weeds such as ragwort have died and become unpalatable"

If you dont have ragwort or poisonous weeds then I'd say its up to you since it doesnt say to keep animals away.

I usually leave it for about a month but I spray after grazing and there would be no grass anyway.