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Cohabitating couples & Tax

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  • 27-04-2011 8:41pm
    #1
    tinee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1 ✭


    Hi all,

    Can anyone advise me on cohabitating couples and tax rights? basically im trying to figure out how to save some money..?
    Tagged:


«13

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    #2
    poppylady
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31 ✭poppylady


    Wish I could - I'm part of a cohabiting couple and my tax credits etc are classed as a single person. Tried to get more info off revenue but I think I must have been interrupting her tea break as the woman I spoke to wasn't very helpful.


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    #3
    barneystinson
    Registered Users Posts: 4,683 ✭✭✭barneystinson


    poppylady wrote: »
    Wish I could - I'm part of a cohabiting couple and my tax credits etc are classed as a single person. Tried to get more info off revenue but I think I must have been interrupting her tea break as the woman I spoke to wasn't very helpful.

    There's not really anything for her to tell you... unless you're married, you're single for tax purposes, simple as. (And don't get me wrong, I'm in the same boat myself :mad: )

    Inherently unfair considering that for social welfare purposes you will be treated the same as a married couple, but there you have it. Possibly contrary to European law, but until someone takes a case it'll probably stay as it is.


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    #4
    KevMacI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6 ✭KevMacI


    barneystinson wrote: »
    There's not really anything for her to tell you... unless you're married, you're single for tax purposes, simple as. (And don't get me wrong, I'm in the same boat myself :mad: )

    Inherently unfair considering that for social welfare purposes you will be treated the same as a married couple, but there you have it. Possibly contrary to European law, but until someone takes a case it'll probably stay as it is.


    Revenue have it all stiched up in their favour basically. For example if you are a single parent then you can claim a single parent tax credit as long as the child stays at least one night with you in the year. As soon as revenue hear you are living with someone else, then you lose that credit but are still taxed as a single person, not as a couple.


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    #5
    barneystinson
    Registered Users Posts: 4,683 ✭✭✭barneystinson


    KevMacI wrote: »
    Revenue have it all stiched up in their favour basically. For example if you are a single parent then you can claim a single parent tax credit as long as the child stays at least one night with you in the year. As soon as revenue hear you are living with someone else, then you lose that credit but are still taxed as a single person, not as a couple.

    I think it's important to distinguish between Revenue (the organisation responsible for enforcing tax legislation and collecting taxes) and The State. Revenue don't make the rules, they just apply them. It's the Oireachtas or more specifically the minister(s) for finance who you should be complaining about really...


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    #6
    poppylady
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31 ✭poppylady


    KevMacI wrote: »
    Revenue have it all stiched up in their favour basically. For example if you are a single parent then you can claim a single parent tax credit as long as the child stays at least one night with you in the year. As soon as revenue hear you are living with someone else, then you lose that credit but are still taxed as a single person, not as a couple.

    So if you are cohabiting and have children who gets the tax credits for the children?


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    #7
    KevMacI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6 ✭KevMacI


    poppylady wrote: »
    So if you are cohabiting and have children who gets the tax credits for the children?


    http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/leaflets/it9.html
    here is a link that explains the credit pretty clearly I think. Both the parents are entitled to claim the credit as long as the child stays with either of them during the year , but the credit is lost to whichever of the parents decides to cohabit with a new partner. If both parents find new partners then the credit is lost completely, which seems unfair if both are still contributing to the upkeep of the child.


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    #8
    nompere
    Registered Users Posts: 1,677 ✭✭✭nompere


    KevMacI wrote: »
    If both parents find new partners then the credit is lost completely, which seems unfair if both are still contributing to the upkeep of the child.

    In 2011:

    A single person has a credit of €1,650.

    A married couple has a credit of €3,300. Whether they have children or not makes no difference.

    A single person with a child has a credit of €3,300.

    Two single persons living together between them have credits of €3,300. Whether they have children or not makes no difference.

    The pattern here is that a one-person household has one credit of €1,650 and a multi-person household has (in effect) two credits of €1,650.

    I don't see anything unfair in this.

    It's a different dicussion about the unfairness of allowing the married couple to transfer allowances and bands between each other when an unmarried couple may not.


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    #9
    mytaxreturn
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭mytaxreturn


    Im an accountant and do a lot of returns for married couples..
    If your not married and have kids and one partner on low income your are losing at least €2500 a year in tax (assuming your paying tax)
    This is even higher if the partner pays tax at the higher rate...
    So there is a financial benefit to getting married !


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    #10
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,537 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    There is only a saving in being married if one couple is stay at home.


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    #11
    mytaxreturn
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭mytaxreturn


    Untrue tombo...
    Both can be working and if one is one less than €23800 its worth transferring their cut off point to avoid tax at 41%
    There is also the carers credit when one spouse is on an income below €7000.


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    #12
    Kungfu
    Closed Accounts Posts: 113 ✭✭Kungfu


    I and my partner are cohabitating. We have one child and another on the way. My partner is not working. She is a stay at home mother. Apart from my income the only other income is the child benefit my partner is receieving for our child. Is my partner still entitled to her tax credit? If so, can this tax credit be transferred to me, so that I can claim the same tax credit as a married worker?


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    #13
    relax carry on
    Registered Users Posts: 4,074 ✭✭✭relax carry on


    Kungfu wrote: »
    I and my partner are cohabitating. We have one child and another on the way. My partner is not working. She is a stay at home mother. Apart from my income the only other income is the child benefit my partner is receieving for our child. Is my partner still entitled to her tax credit? If so, can this tax credit be transferred to me, so that I can claim the same tax credit as a married worker?

    Unfortunately no. Transfering credits or rate bands between couples can only happen under joint assessment which can only be applied if the couple is married or in a civil partnership.

    http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/leaflets/it2.html


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    #14
    mytaxreturn
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭mytaxreturn


    Civil partnership cheapest option !
    To be married in the eyes of Revenue you need to fill in the assessable spouse form
    Then go claim the credits, adjust the cut off points and claim carers credit if you have kids and one spouse in on income below 7,000 per annum.....

    Could be a saving of at least €2,500 in your pocket....


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    #15
    Itchianus
    Registered Users Posts: 230 ✭✭Itchianus


    mytaxreturn wrote: »
    Civil partnership cheapest option !
    To be married in the eyes of Revenue you need to fill in the assessable spouse form
    Then go claim the credits, adjust the cut off points and claim carers credit if you have kids and one spouse in on income below 7,000 per annum.....

    Could be a saving of at least €2,500 in your pocket....

    What are you on about, civil partnership only applies to same sex couples...


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    #16
    digzy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭digzy


    Itchianus wrote: »
    What are you on about, civil partnership only applies to same sex couples...

    Are you trying to pick fights again?:rolleyes:

    it's fairly obvious the poster refers to having a wedding in a registry office as opposed to the big day out in the church and hotel, with all the accompanying costs.


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    #17
    Itchianus
    Registered Users Posts: 230 ✭✭Itchianus


    digzy wrote: »

    Are you trying to pick fights again?:rolleyes:

    it's fairly obvious the poster refers to having a wedding in a registry office as opposed to the big day out in the church and hotel, with all the accompanying costs.

    Hardly picking a fight, and a bit rich coming from the self styled king of the put-down on the dentistry forum :rolleyes:

    And it's not obvious that he's talking about anything other than the thing he specifically said, which was Civil Partnership.


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    #18
    mytaxreturn
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭mytaxreturn


    Apologies - its a civil marriage I meant.


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    #19
    lennyloulou
    Registered Users Posts: 344 ✭✭lennyloulou


    Help! i really dont understand this.
    I work full time and so does my husband. We married June 2011.
    We never looked into being taxed as a married couple- never contacted Revenue. Both of us do the same hours approx- hubbie 2 less than me a week -As far as i know we are still classed as single people- He moved into my house in 2009.
    What can I claim???? Rent? Tax relief? Mortgage is in my name still. Any advice would be appreciated


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    #20
    mytaxreturn
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭mytaxreturn


    Hi
    Well it all depends on your income..
    If you both earn more than €16,500 but less than €32,800 then there is no difference in being taxed as a married couple..
    Its all about using up your tax credits - you can swap them around to suit your income and go back 4 years to have your tax reviewed..


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    #21
    Kungfu
    Closed Accounts Posts: 113 ✭✭Kungfu


    Itchianus wrote: »
    What are you on about, civil partnership only applies to same sex couples...
    Yeah...What you talkin' about, Willis?

    This country is still under the thumb of the Catholic Church.And we all know what they got up to. So a man and woman who decide to spend their lives together are expected to comply with some biased idea of how they should live. Or be denied certain rights. But a same sex couple is free to live as they wish? If gay maarriage is to be permitted in future, then is it not fair to allow heterosexual couples to be recognised as civil partners with all of the rights that civil partnership allows? Or is it a case that fairness and equality are only to be allowed as a luxury for certain groups of people?


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    #22
    2ndcoming
    Registered Users Posts: 3,570 ✭✭✭2ndcoming


    Heterosexual couples are and have always been free to have a civil marriage i.e. one in a registry office. The only difference between a civil partnership and civil marriage is the omission of the word marriage in same sex partnerships. Religion has nothing to do with it tbh.

    The reason from a tax point of view is the difficulty in linking a couple on the system as co-habiting and granting the equivalent of married credits, then breaking them up 3 months later and joining them again when they kiss and make up the following month.

    In entering into a marriage or civil partnership you are bound by a contract and can only become legally separated or legally divorced.


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    #23
    kevmal
    Registered Users Posts: 1 ✭kevmal


    why can i not claim tax credits for my partner, we have lived together for 18 years, have a 16 year old daughter and a morgage, my partner suffers from Crohns disease and is unable to work, i myself work a low pay job but just get by.
    I was on social welfare 4yrs ago and had much the same income from them and also had winter fuel allowence, free school bus for our daughter, school clothing allowence, and more, medical card etc, Why would anyone bother working when all this is stacked against you.


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    #24
    Tombo2001
    Registered Users Posts: 6,537 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    kevmal wrote: »
    why can i not claim tax credits for my partner, we have lived together for 18 years, have a 16 year old daughter and a morgage, my partner suffers from Crohns disease and is unable to work, i myself work a low pay job but just get by.
    I was on social welfare 4yrs ago and had much the same income from them and also had winter fuel allowence, free school bus for our daughter, school clothing allowence, and more, medical card etc, Why would anyone bother working when all this is stacked against you.

    Cause you are not married?

    I agree on your latter point - state supports do mean that at certain salary point, particularly if you are an unmarried woman with children, you are simply better off not working......


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    #25
    tiredblondie
    Registered Users Posts: 706 ✭✭✭tiredblondie


    It does seem an unfair rule to be honest - when my partner had his hours cut, i was means tested and told that once he's credits were used up, my salary would come into play - but....i wasn't entitled to his tax credits as we aren't married!
    Sounds like a rule to suit themselves!


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    #26
    relax carry on
    Registered Users Posts: 4,074 ✭✭✭relax carry on


    tiredblondie wrote: »
    It does seem an unfair rule to be honest - when my partner had his hours cut, i was means tested and told that once he's credits were used up, my salary would come into play - but....i wasn't entitled to his tax credits as we aren't married!
    Sounds like a rule to suit themselves!

    To suit who? Revenue do not make the law, only administer and enforce the system. If you wish to alter something with the taxation system, start with badgering the hell out of your local political representatives. If the system changes, Revenue will administer and enforce the changes.


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    #27
    tiredblondie
    Registered Users Posts: 706 ✭✭✭tiredblondie


    relax carry on wrote: »
    To suit who? Revenue do not make the law, only administer and enforce the system. If you wish to alter something with the taxation system, start with badgering the hell out of your local political representatives. If the system changes, Revenue will administer and enforce the changes.

    To suit whoever makes the rules that's who!

    My point is, I'm not entitled to his credits if he were out of work as we're not married but I'm expected (which of course I would!) to support him as we cohabit


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    #28
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,261 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    tiredblondie wrote: »
    It does seem an unfair rule to be honest - when my partner had his hours cut, i was means tested and told that once he's credits were used up, my salary would come into play - but....i wasn't entitled to his tax credits as we aren't married!
    Sounds like a rule to suit themselves!
    No, in this case it's a rule to suit you. If you want to be treated as married, you can marry. If you want to be treated as unmarried, you can not marry. You're in control here.

    Is there some obstacle which prevents you from marrying, to secure the treatment that you want?


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    #29
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,823 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    tiredblondie wrote: »
    To suit whoever makes the rules that's who!

    My point is, I'm not entitled to his credits if he were out of work as we're not married but I'm expected (which of course I would!) to support him as we cohabit

    Im in a very similar situation.

    It's totally unfair.

    But it is our TDs that we should be complaining to . Ir maybe some EU body.


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    #30
    tiredblondie
    Registered Users Posts: 706 ✭✭✭tiredblondie


    Peregrinus wrote: »
    No, in this case it's a rule to suit you. If you want to be treated as married, you can marry. If you want to be treated as unmarried, you can not marry. You're in control here.

    Is there some obstacle which prevents you from marrying, to secure the treatment that you want?

    OK......


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    #31
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,261 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    tiredblondie wrote: »
    OK......
    Leaving aside whatever religious signficance you do or don't invest in the relationship (which is no business of the state's, obviously), marriage is essentially a mechanism by which a couple seeks and obtains societal recognition of their relationship. And if couples choose not to marry, the signal they are sending is that they don't want societal, official, administrative recognition of their relationship. And I don't think they can them complain that their relationship is not being recognised.

    It's a different matter if a couple wishes to marry but is not free to do so, which is why the denial of same-sex marriage was an injustice. But if a couple has made a choice which results in their relationship not being recognised, I don't see why they should be complaining about that to the Revenue, or to TDs, or even to the EU. They should be asking themselves whether they have might the optimal choice, given the outcomes they want.


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