Obama's Official Long Form Birth Cert Released

liah

Here it is.

Wonder what the birthers will come up with now. Reckon they'll still call fake?

kev9100

It makes sense as it will show everyone just how crazy and stupid the nut-job wing of the GOP is. Still, the idea that ANYONE thought he wasn't eligible to be President is very depressing.

oscarBravo

Almost certainly. The PDF is an interesting one - it's composed of several bitmap layers, rather than being a single scanned bitmap.

It could be an artifact of being stored in a format like DjVu and re-assembled for the purpose, but it's inevitable that it will be considered a forgery instead.

Dave!

45% of registered Republicans don't (or did not) believe that Obama is eligible to be President... incredible. Do the Republicans just have a disproportionate number of idiots? Racists? Rednecks? Are they just stubborn/bad losers?

I think Bill Maher said that "not all Republicans are racist, but if you are racist, you're more than likely a Republican." I reckon there's a bit of truthiness to that.

It'll be interesting to see where the Donald's campaign goes from here. Obviously they've been talking about nothing but this for weeks, and it's made him quite popular. Will he start talking about the issues now, or just start picking holes in the released cert? He'll almost certainly claim this as a victory, that's for sure.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

Dave! wrote: »

I think Bill Maher said that "not all Republicans are racist, but if you are racist, you're more than likely a Republican." I reckon there's a bit of truthiness to that.

"
Truthiness is a "truth" that a person claims to know intuitively "from the gut" without regard to evidence, logic, intellectual examination, or facts
"

you know, I think you're right about that.

Dave!

You think there's probably an even distribution of racists between registered Republicans and Democrats? 50/50? Just based on your observations of the kind of issues that preoccupy the Republican party. Gut reaction, yeah.

20Cent

Trump is really shameless.
Declaring it as a victory and also throwing in a bit of doubt just in case "I hope it checks out". He really is an idiot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6hsm81VXKY&feature=player_embedded

Einhard

20Cent wrote: »

Trump is really shameless.
Declaring it as a victory and also throwing in a bit of doubt just in case "I hope it checks out". He really is an idiot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6hsm81VXKY&feature=player_embedded

One thing he's not, is an idiot. He knows exactly what he's doing. He's thrown the cat amongst the pigeons in the GOP race, and even if he doesn't get the nomination (which he won't), he'll still have massively boosted his profile, which, no doubt, he'll be perfectly able to transfer into more money for himself. Despicable yes; idiotic, not in the least.

Madd Finn

Einhard wrote: »

One thing he's not, is an idiot. He knows exactly what he's doing.

True. He's worse than that. He's not an idiot. He just thinks everybody in his constituency is.

Denerick

THis was never about his birth certificate, anyone who ever believed that needs his head checked. This was utterly and entirely about race. Obama has an unusual heritage, from a completely cosmopolitan background (spent some of his childhood in Indonesia, has a Kenyan father, and an ultra liberal mother) Not to mention his race. What annoys rednecks even more than his skin colour is the fact that he is half white. Miscegnation is still an issue for these bigots.

Its a national shame and disgrace that Obama even had to go to such lengths to prove what was already obvious.

If ever there was a sign that America is in both material and intellectual decline this was it.

hmmm

Until Obama produces the document that proves he is white, he'll always be attacked by the birthers.

I think today sets up a huge strategic victory for Obama - he has lured a large wing of the Republican party into supporting a crazy conspiracy story which he has disproved. That wing now has only one other place to go after this and that is to push even further into whacko conspiracy (e.g. suggesting it is a fake).

Paul's budget is about to make the Tea Party wing unelectable. Trump and his fans are about to make the racist side of the party front and center leading into a presidential election. Obama and the Democrats can simply keep stoking both these groups and drive the independents into their camp.

ArtSmart

20Cent wrote: »

Trump is really shameless.
Declaring it as a victory and also throwing in a bit of doubt just in case "I hope it checks out". He really is an idiot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6hsm81VXKY&feature=player_embedded

he's an unpleasant individual, but no fool.

Obama made a mistake issuing the cert. the nutters can claim they brought the pres to their will and still claim it's fake - bec it was never about the truth of the matter, just the political currency they could derive from it.

Chuck Stone

Oh dear - he had to finally admit he was born an American - the shame of it.

oscarBravo

hmmm wrote: »

I think today sets up a huge strategic victory for Obama - he has lured a large wing of the Republican party into supporting a crazy conspiracy story which he has disproved. That wing now has only one other place to go after this and that is to push even further into whacko conspiracy (e.g. suggesting it is a fake).

I was just about to reply to the first sentence, when I read the second. If you've ever seen the Conspiracy Theories forum on here, you'll realise that disproving a crazy conspiracy is impossible. Pushing even further into wackiness is SOP for conspiracy theorists.

But yeah, maybe it's a good strategic move to drive them to transports of ever greater craziness. Time will tell.

Ludo

I think this pretty much sums it up...

http://yfrog.com/h7hswwsj

hmmm

This comment was oddly enough posted on the Foxnews website. I don't agree with the "Trump is a Democrat" line, but the rest is an interesting prediction

You republicans are a joke! You don't get it do you? Donald Trump is a liberal democrat.
He strongly supports abortion rights. He gives money to democrats. And he made a fool
out of the entire republican party already.

He knew those birth records were out there. That's why all he talked about so far was this
birther nonsense. Every republican did exactly what he wanted them to do. They all turned
into birthers. He's totally discredited FOX News and Rush Limbaugh already. And he's
poised to do it all over again with this nonsense about Obama's well documented scholastic
records.

No doubt by the end of the week every republican, FOX News, and Rush Limbaugh will be
wondering how an African-American could have gone to Harvard. And you can bet that every
republican will be demanding to see Obama's transcripts. And they will cry when they see his
records because they will show what kind of grades Obama received to get him to graduate
near the top of his class completely discrediting the entire republican party, FOX News, and
Rush Limbaugh all over again.

By the time the election gets here, the entire republican party is going to be seen as a racist
organization. And the best part is... Donald Trump isn't even going to run.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2011/04/27/obamas-birth-certificate-donald-trump-implications-2012-presidential-campaign/#ixzz1KoAb9UIz

20Cent

Its started already! there seems to be layers on the published cert so it must be fake!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQAqvtXenKg

metrovelvet

He's not America's first black president anyway. HEs America's first HALF black president.

DoesNotCompute

So Obama was born in Hawaii, so what? Isn't that part of United States territory? I'm no citizenship lawyer but I'd say that Obama is a "natural born" citizen of the United States.

All this conspiracy talk about his birthplace is clearly from people who don't want a non-white-oilman as President.

And isn't his birth certificate a matter of public record (i.e. anyone can apply for a copy of it)? If you believe that this PDF is fake, can't you just apply to get a copy of his birth cert??

Temaz

Surpirse, surprise...Alex Jones claims it's a fake.

http://www.infowars.com/video-proof-obama-birth-certificate-a-fraud/

metrovelvet

DoesNotCompute wrote: »

So Obama was born in Hawaii, so what? Isn't that part of United States territory? I'm no citizenship lawyer but I'd say that Obama is a "natural born" citizen of the United States.

All this conspiracy talk about his birthplace is clearly from people who don't want a non-white-oilman as President.

And isn't his birth certificate a matter of public record (i.e. anyone can apply for a copy of it)? If you believe that this PDF is fake, can't you just apply to get a copy of his birth cert??

The only people who can obtain a copy of his birthcert are him, his kids, his parents, and his wife. Im sure the government can get a court order to obtain one if they have to.

As a US citizen, I can't even get a license without my birthcert, so I would expect that he would have been vetted for all of this.

amacachi

Well in all fairness, if someone actually believes that Obama wasn't born in the US I don't see why something that I could've put together and signed by someone in a state with a Democrat government in place would convince them otherwise.

metrovelvet

Are you saying that what is posted on the whitehouse site is easily put together by anyone?

Einhard

It's interesting to see the difference of opinion amongst the American commentators on how this will play out for Obama, vz the Birthers, and Trump. I think it will help entirely discredit the movement amongst the rational majority in America, and damage both the Tea Party and the GOP in the process. It will also drive the more fringe element (and in certain parts of America, the fringe is decidedly mainstream) to ever more hysterical and dubious lengths to discredit Obama. I never believed this was about race first and foremost. However, the turn now to discredit Obama's academic achievments does have a distinctly racial undertone. I think (hope) Obama will play a similar game here. Ignore the nonsense being spouted, until those spouting it and denigrating his education, reach a crescendo of hate-filled, paranoid fury, and then deflate them, and the wider Tea Party movement, by releasing the transcripts.

The other view, is that Obama has handed the GOP a victory by releasing the records. They are now free of trying to balance their rational sides (the belief that Obama is American) with their political sides (the need to appeal in some way to the grassroots). It removes an issue which may well have damaged the GOP amongst independents, and even moderate Republicans. There is something in this, as was seen by the Republican leadership's rush to accept the validity of the document.

However, I don't think the GOP will have emerged entirely unscathed from all of this. And I think the Tea Party will definitely be damaged by it. it makes their members look hysterical and paranoid, and now that their claims have been refuted, utterly foolish. It's been a sordid chapter in American political history, and I don't think that either the mainstream GOP, or the Tea Party, can walk away from it without damage.


PS: Perhaps the greatest irony in all of this, is that John McCain was actually born in Panama!!

amacachi

metrovelvet wrote: »

Are you saying that what is posted on the whitehouse site is easily put together by anyone?

Anyone familiar with what a Hawaii Birth Cert from the time looks like, yes.
I'm also not sure why it looks like it's one page on the right of a bounded book or pamphlet but some of the details look a bit too crisp to be from a scan.

PeakOutput

apparently that is not the long form cert and it is the same one that was released before

Black Swan

2008 Democratic Primary: Hillary Clinton (and the Clinton Democratic Political Machine) wanted to win the Democratic primary. Obama and H Clinton were running neck-and-neck in a very close race. Former US president Bill Clinton was pushing with all his vast resources for his wife Hillary to win. They brought up the birther argument then, and did everything humanly possible to disqualify Obama for president and failed.

Why did they really draw attention to the birther argument? They had vetted Obama in every possible way, knew that Obama had been born in Hawaii, but used it as a campaign stunt in a very close race to sway naive and uninformed voters (as well as to fire-up voters that did not want a Black American president in office).

2008 Presidential Race: The Republicans wanted to retain the US presidency, and elect John McCain. They not only had the vast legal and political resources as one of the nation's two largest parties, but also could call upon sitting president GW Bush and his Republican controlled Executive branch of US government, including the US Justice Department and FBI, for help to investigate Obama's citizenship in order to disqualify him.

They obviously confirmed Obama's birth in Hawaii, or they would have waited until a couple weeks before the November 2008 election to disqualify Obama, which would have wiped out any chance on short notice for the Democrats to win the presidency (and hurt many Democrats running against Republicans for other offices). Why did the McCain, and especially the Sarah Palin camp raise the birther issue? For the same reason that Democrat H Clinton used it: as a political mud slinging ploy to sway naive and uninformed voters (as well as to fire-up those voters who didn't want a Black American president).

All of this occurred before Obama gained the power of the US presidency, so to now claim that he is using this power to manufacture a fake birth certificate takes an extraordinary leap of faith in a conspiracy theory.

Then why did Obama wait until now to release (or re-release) the so called "long forum" of his birth certificate from the White House? Political sensationalist Sarah Palin could not resurrect the birther issue from her 2008 campaign, given that it failed then. It took a highly visible telley celebrity and corporate business leader Donald Trump to bring it back from the dead. "Donald Trump questions..." and all of a sudden it's news again.

Obama didn't need the so-called "long forum" to win in 2008, with his massive popular vote and comfortable Electoral College leads. But now the race could get closer after his huge mistakes forcing through the unpopular Obamacare, adding greatly to the historic federal deficit, and still stuck in two meaningless wars that cost US taxpayers billions per month.

Plus, to reveal the so-called "long forum" now, along with the recent Obama Presidential Address, makes all the Republicans that were using the birther issue to appear a bit ridiculous and petty, when the nation has been confronted with serious Great Recession financial problems, including high unemployment, runaway federal deficit, and two incredibly wasteful wars.

What next are the grand leaders of the world's number one super power to demand? Obama's college and university transcripts? What the craic!

metrovelvet

Here is my question. My son is US born as I am also, but he is inelgible to run for president because not only do you have to be natural born but both your parents have to be US citizens too [natural born or naturalised.] Conflict of allegiance and all that. So aside from the birthcert, because Obama's father was not a citizen his son is not eligable.

[I sincerely hope that is where the similarities between my son and Obama begin and end, though I wouldnt mind a couple of ivy league degrees for him.:)]

MagicMarker

metrovelvet wrote: »

Here is my question. My son is US born as I am also, but he is inelgible to run for president because not only do you have to be natural born but both your parents have to be US citizens too [natural born or naturalised.] Conflict of allegiance and all that. So aside from the birthcert, because Obama's father was not a citizen his son is not eligable.

Incorrect.

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/thepresidentandcabinet/a/presrequire.htm

Only native-born U.S. citizens (or those born abroad, but only to parents who were both citizens of the U.S.) may be president of the United States

Honestly, do you think American missed the part that his father was from Kenya before he was made president?

metrovelvet

MagicMarker wrote: »

Incorrect.

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/thepresidentandcabinet/a/presrequire.htm



Honestly, do you think American missed the part that his father was from Kenya before he was made president?

http://www.scribd.com/doc/17485112/The-Conclusive-Definition-of-Natural-Born-Citizen

"The Conclusive Definition Of "Natural-Born Citizen"

Natural-born citizens of the United States are those who are citizens of the United States from birth without having to perform any act to acquire or perfect their American citizenship. These are those whose parents are citizens of the United States at the time of their birth. "

They knew his father was from kenya but may not have been aware he was not a citizen.

Natural born is not the same as native born. Read again. Natural born means born in the US with both parents being US citizens,plus 14 consecutive years of residency.

In your link first is says 'native born' and then in the last paragraph it says 'natural born'. If you google it there have been plenty of cases around this before Obama.

Its interesting.

MagicMarker

The Fourteenth Amendment states...

All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

This seems pretty clear cut to me, the parent's citizenship only comes in to question if Obama was born outside the USA.

Arguing over the differences between being native-born or natural-born is just a question of semantics.