Van insurance

Tombones

I tried to get a quote yesterday on a van and was declined because i dont have a trade. I want to use it for private purposes eg transporting surfboard. This is apparently a new rule that all insurers are adhereing to. Anyone else had this problem and is there anyway around it?

Spear

Moved from N&F. I went with Motors due to the van specific aspect of the question, rather than Banking and Insurance. Apologies if this isn't the best choice.

BronsonTB

Have you tired Insuremyvan.ie....very helpful....

doctorchopper

give mike murphy's a call, thats who i'm with and never been asked if i'm in a trade, the other half has a commercial pajero with them and she doesn't have a trade and no problems, just renewed the policy yesterday.

illegalmidget

you have to have a commerical occupation to insure a commerical vehicle its not a new thing it has been around for years.


I work in the sector myself andi find it hard to belive that they havent done away with this in this day and age considering half the builders etc are unempolyed at the moment seems a bit crazy!

Top Dog

illegalmidget wrote: »

you have to have a commerical occupation to insure a commerical vehicle its not a new thing it has been around for years.

Eh - no you don't.

I know of at least 7 people personally (myself included) that have commercial vehicles insured privately.

OP try insuremyvan.ie and FBD for private policies on a commercial vehicle

DrPhilG

Sorry to drag up an old thread but makes sense rather than start a new one.

How does private van insurance compare to car insurance? I'm getting a second motor for occasional use but I'd rather get a van than a car simply because I can use it for the surfboard and the dogs.

I know I have to tax it privately and it will be pricey, but will insurance cost a bomb? Trying to get online quotes is tough, 123.ie wouldn't give me one so I'm awaiting a callback. Insuremyvan.ie only does commercial insurance.

This is starting to look like more bother than it's worth!

sealgaire

I'm in the same boat. This crowd will get you sorted.

http://www.sheridan.ie/van-insurance-quote.php

DrPhilG

sealgaire wrote: »

I'm in the same boat. This crowd will get you sorted.

http://www.sheridan.ie/van-insurance-quote.php

Can't quote me without a valid registration number. I don't have a van bought yet so don't have a number to enter.

Did you get sorted? Is van insurance in general more expensive than car?

sealgaire

Ah no, its the same, possibly bit cheaper. What kinda van you after? I've a Scudo 2.- JTD. bout 7 yrs NCB €280 TP

DrPhilG

sealgaire wrote: »

Ah no, its the same, possibly bit cheaper. What kinda van you after? I've a Scudo 2.- JTD. bout 7 yrs NCB €280 TP

Caddy/Inca/Partner/Kangoo etc, not fussy. Insurance gets does my nut. Just checked with 123.ie, if I change from a 2004 2.0 petrol Hyundai Coupe worth €6k to a 2001 Peugeot 206 1.5 diesel worth €1000, my insurance only drops from €600 to €550...

sealgaire

Yea, thing is insurance is really calculated on "You", more so than the car you are driving. Unless it is something totally mental!

DrPhilG

Ah, now we're sucking diesel...

Picked a van from an autotrader ad and used the registration number from that. Got quoted €370 TP for a 2001 VW Caddy. Tried a 99 Citroen Berlingo too, still €370.

And according to their front page;

Is only used for carriage of own goods and social, domestic and pleasure purposes and not used for hire or reward

So it does cover private use. I'm assuming that this covers driving to work on occasion? Normally I'd travel with the wife but if I'm working a double shift I'd need to take my own wheels.

TOP MAN SEALGAIRE!

sealgaire

Yea its just like a car policy. The insurance company is Setanta and thsi is what they offer. I don't have a "use" for a commerical either, I just find them handy as F**K in my spare time.

DrPhilG

Just need to track down a cheap van now!

DrPhilG

Another question you might be able to answer, what is the situation with NCT/DOE? Does the van still need DOE every year, or do I NCT it as normal since it will be taxed privately?

Similar question here...

http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080422050558AAulXsj

DOE is only for commercial vehicles, but NCT don't test vans. Where does that leave me? Also, if I buy a van with say 6 months commercial rate tax on it, do I get credit for that against the private tax amount I pay?

BronsonTB

DOE every year. I have mine insured commerically as I drive it for work & pleasure & Taxed private. I get mine DOE'd every year.

02 vw caddy.

sealgaire

Oh I don't know, I've mine taxed commercial

vetstu

DrPhilG wrote: »

DOE is only for commercial vehicles, but NCT don't test vans. Where does that leave me? Also, if I buy a van with say 6 months commercial rate tax on it, do I get credit for that against the private tax amount I pay?

Yeah, still needs DOE every year. Its just like an extra €100 tax. :-)
Just leave it for the 6 months till it needs renewed, chances of being done for driving it privately are very slim. Haven't heard of anyone being stopped for it.



;)But I'm not telling you to do it because we aren't allowed promote illegal activity on boards.

DrPhilG

vetstu wrote: »

Yeah, still needs DOE every year. Its just like an extra €100 tax. :-)
Just leave it for the 6 months till it needs renewed, chances of being done for driving it privately are very slim. Haven't heard of anyone being stopped for it.

Going to see a 00 Peugeot Partner this evening, went through the DOE/CVT today so it has a full year. Is it €100 for a van that size? Tried to check the costs of the CVT and couldn't get a straight answer.

My other query now is whether I have to tax it from scratch, or if I get any credit for the commercial tax on it at the minute.

sealgaire

DrPhilG wrote: »

Going to see a 00 Peugeot Partner this evening, went through the DOE/CVT today so it has a full year. Is it €100 for a van that size? Tried to check the costs of the CVT and couldn't get a straight answer.

My other query now is whether I have to tax it from scratch, or if I get any credit for the commercial tax on it at the minute.

what is CVT?

Why are you worrying about taxing it if it already has tax????? Don't pay any heed to that private vs commercial tax talk.

DrPhilG

sealgaire wrote: »

what is CVT?

Why are you worrying about taxing it if it already has tax????? Don't pay any heed to that private vs commercial tax talk.

Commercial Vehicle Test, apparently it's the new name for the DOE test.

I'm taxing it privately because it's the law. Call me old fashioned...

sealgaire

Well that's a new one. It's up to you I suppose if you want to tax somethign that already has tax. . . . .. . Your money . .. ..

DrPhilG

sealgaire wrote: »

Well that's a new one. It's up to you I suppose if you want to tax somethign that already has tax. . . . .. . Your money . .. ..

It already has tax, but not valid tax so it might as well not have any.

By brother in law reckons his neighbour was done for using a van on commercial tax for private use, and his brother was warned for using a van from the farm to pick up a bag of chips in town!

BronsonTB

Insure it Commercially (Allows S&P use also)
Tax it privately (Allows S&P & commerical use)
Test it for the DOE/CVT every year

(And yes if you TAX commercially but use JUST to collect shopping then you are open to be done for it)

NCT has nothing to do with vans no matter how they are taxed.
CVT/DOE Will test any van no matter how it is taxed or insured.

Good luck buying Van & Drive it as often as you want, when you want, where you want....!

Eire-Dearg

Same boat here, I'm currently refurbishing the father's van. He used to be in a trade and I'm not in one at all, but people keep telling me I won't be able to drive it at all because it's a commerical van???

What's the story, it's all very confusing...

DrPhilG

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

Same boat here, I'm currently refurbishing the father's van. He used to be in a trade and I'm not in one at all, but people keep telling me I won't be able to drive it at all because it's a commerical van???

What's the story, it's all very confusing...

Well bought the Peugeot last night, and after talking to the CVT people in Mayo or somewhere, the Tax Office in Letterkenny and a few insurance companies, here's a summary, much the same as Bronson said previously.

Tax - If using privately it must be insured at the same rate as cars. In other words my 1.9 Peugeot Partner will cost me about €580 a year.

Insurance - I was with 123.ie in the car, but they won't insure a van for private use so I'm going to have to cancel with them. Sheridans, from Sealgaire's earlier post quoted me €370 though, and that's including privatre use. So not all companies will give me van insurance for private use.

Testing - Regardless of what a van is used for, it will still be classed as a commercial vehicle. Even if it's only ever used privately, it is still a commercial vehicle. Therefore you will always have to do the DOE/CVT test, not the NCT. This is annual, not bi-annual.

hucklebuck

Advice from a professional:

The reason it is difficult getting van insurance as a non tradesman is the old question what are you using the van for, some of you have suggested using brokers but in the event of a claim it's down to the insurance company if they want to pay or not as your broker could be operating outside their "third party agreement" with the insurance company.

A way around this would be to buy a van with seats, then you can insure it as a car, get quotes before you buy.

Just be aware in the event of a claim on a commercial vehicle policy it will be settled ex vat so if you are not vat registered you could lose 13% - 21% of the value of the van.

fuerte1976

doctorchopper wrote: »

give mike murphy's a call, thats who i'm with and never been asked if i'm in a trade, the other half has a commercial pajero with them and she doesn't have a trade and no problems, just renewed the policy yesterday.

I echo this.

DrPhilG

hucklebuck wrote: »

The reason it is difficult getting van insurance as a non tradesman is the old question what are you using the van for, some of you have suggested using brokers but in the event of a claim it's down to the insurance company if they want to pay or not as your broker could be operating outside their "third party agreement" with the insurance company.

So you don't think the insurance offered by Sheridans that I was quoted would cover private use? Even though it states this on the front page of the quote?

DrPhilG

From http://sheridan.ie/van-insurance-quote.php

Your Commercial Vehicle
Is only used for carriage of own goods and social, domestic and pleasure purposes and not used for hire or reward

Is normally kept at your home address

Is right hand drive, is not imported, not modified, converted or adapted in any way

Is not a vehicle with fixed seats in the rear other than purpose built crew cab vehicles

Is registered in your or your company name in the Republic of Ireland and the name of the main driver is declared

Eire-Dearg

At the end of the day though you can drive a commerical vehicle privately, despite what I've been told?

DrPhilG

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

At the end of the day though you can drive a commerical vehicle privately, despite what I've been told?

As long as it's taxed privately, I think so.

Certainly hope so, otherwise does anyone fancy buying a '00 Peugeot Partner???

Eire-Dearg

DrPhilG wrote: »

As long as it's taxed privately, I think so.

Certainly hope so, otherwise does anyone fancy buying a '00 Peugeot Partner???

Would that cost roughly the same as a car or be hell of a lot more?

DrPhilG

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

Would that cost roughly the same as a car or be hell of a lot more?

Got a quote of €370 third party for the van. My name only, add the wife on and it doubles! She wouldn't be caught dead driving it anyway though.

I'm 32, 2 years no claims bonus. Currently insured on a 04 Hyundai Coupe at €830 fully comp.

Anybody know if I need to cancel my private car insurance before I take out a commercial insurance on the van?

Eire-Dearg

DrPhilG wrote: »

Got a quote of €370 third party for the van. My name only, add the wife on and it doubles! She wouldn't be caught dead driving it anyway though.

I'm 32, 2 years no claims bonus. Currently insured on a 04 Hyundai Coupe at €830 fully comp.

Anybody know if I need to cancel my private car insurance before I take out a commercial insurance on the van?

God only knows what I mine would be, I'm still on the provisional

What about tax?

BronsonTB

DrPhilG wrote: »

Anybody know if I need to cancel my private car insurance before I take out a commercial insurance on the van?

If 2 completely different policies then you dont' but if your using your NCB to insure the Van then yes you do as it's all just one policy as the NCB is being transffered from the car to the van.

hucklebuck

DrPhilG wrote: »

So you don't think the insurance offered by Sheridans that I was quoted would cover private use? Even though it states this on the front page of the quote?

It may not, it depends on the agreement they have with their insurance company. If they don't have an occupation on what they sent you they may not have asked for it. If they have mis-sold the policy and can't get the insurance company to cover their mistake, you could claim under the brokers Professional Indemnity policy but this would be subject to a lower limit than proper insurance would give.

Occupation is vital for a commercial vehicle quote as they have a whole heap of occupations they won't cover.

The problem with a lot of brokers they have a lot of competition and will do anything to get/ hold on to business.

All I am saying is be sure to read the policy before you buy, if you could not be bothered you deserve to lose your balls if you have a claim.

Best advice I can give is get a van/ jeep with seats(they must stay in) & windows and you can insure it as a private car and have no hassle.

hucklebuck

DrPhilG & Eire, just to clarify.

Eire inspite of what I have been told I can shoot someone, but if I get caught

I never said you can't use your van for sd&p, all cv policies give sd&p what i said was if you don't use a van for work your insurance could be invalid ie if you work in an office why do you need a van, are you carrying petrol, explosives, working near airfields etc. Take it from me you could be grand but if you have a serious claim they will have the microscope out looking at your proposal form, they might be force to pay third party liability claim but they can recover the payout from you.

If you have doubts ring them for a quote and tell them your occupation, you should also check if they can "mirror" your no claims bonus, if they can you can used the mirrored bonus on your van and keep your car no claims bonus(which will be valid for 2 years).

Some companies may not accept a car bonus on a van or vice versa so check that too when you ring. Last thing you want is a 20% increase in your quote because they can't do it.

Eire-Dearg

Cheers.

The Sheridan link above seems to include my occupation, but I sure wouldn't be using the van purposely for my occupation but I would use the van to come to and from. The van would basically be what other people use a car for: getting around wherever I want to go.

hucklebuck

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

Cheers.

The Sheridan link above seems to include my occupation, but I sure wouldn't be using the van purposely for my occupation but I would use the van to come to and from. The van would basically be what other people use a car for: getting around wherever I want to go.

That won't matter as your occupation is your occupation, you can tell them you won't use it for work but then that raises the question what do you use the van for, catch 22 I am afraid.

DrPhilG

hucklebuck wrote: »

Occupation is vital for a commercial vehicle quote as they have a whole heap of occupations they won't cover.

There is a list of excluded occupations but I'm not on it.

Sent an email to Sheridan but no reply yet.

fleetman

Just to clarify a couple of things

Insuring a van for private use is not as straight forward as a tradesman insuring a van. But in most cases it is not an issue as previously mentioned the occupation is what will decide whether you will get a quote or not. With regard to the use of the vehicle an example it is no problem for an office worker to get a quote for a van as long as the van is only used for carraige of your own goods.

Using your car bonus - if you do your shopping arround you will get a broker that can mirror your no claims bonus on the car and allow it on the cv quote. In fact you may even get a further discount for having the car.

Vat - You will only be deduced vat if you claimed the vat on the vehicle in the first place - guessing the posters here are not vat registered therefore this is not an issue.

Putting seats in van/jeep - i would not recommend doing this just for insurance purposes - it brings its own complications.

Taxing the vehicle - how the vehicle is taxed is irrelevant to insurers.

The only surprising thing is the cost to add your wife does she have full or prov.

DrPhilG

The wife just passed her test last month, that's what brought this about. Going to get her a car, and I'll keep a van for a second motor but only need it if we're working different shifts.

Do I need to wait for the new log book to arrive before I can tax it? Turns out there was no tax on the van.

fleetman

Unless there is a big difference in your age and your wifes i am very surprised there is a charge to add her to the policy.

With regard to the taxing of vehicle sorry i dont know for sure but would assume you need the logbook prior to taxing.

Good luck with the van

DrPhilG

fleetman wrote: »

Unless there is a big difference in your age and your wifes i am very surprised there is a charge to add her to the policy.

With regard to the taxing of vehicle sorry i dont know for sure but would assume you need the logbook prior to taxing.

Good luck with the van

I'm 32, she's 29.

Not an issue though, her car will be the main one we both use, the van will likely only be used once or twice a week.

dunnariogh

thinking of getting a van for a milk round,and keeping my car,will insurance for the van mirror my ncb for the car or is it something seperate,never had a van before?

Top Dog

dunnariogh wrote: »

thinking of getting a van for a milk round,and keeping my car,will insurance for the van mirror my ncb for the car or is it something seperate,never had a van before?

Totally down to the individual discretion of the insurance company. Mine mirrored my NCB, others don't.

rocky112

Hey Tombones...I have Direct Line insurance for van and its really offers lowest quotes...Hope this will really help you!!!...

DrPhilG

I got my insurance through Sheridans in the end, they mirrored the NCB.

dunnariogh

thanks,where are sheridans based?