Quality of the College View 2010/2011

monument

Art_Wolf wrote: »

If everything takes so much time, might it not be an idea to scale back from monthly to something more manageable? Get the quality up and then begin reducing the time between publications.

There's a few options:

• Reduce the page count, keep the frequency
• Keep the page count, reduce the frequency
• Keep the page count, improve the processes
• Slash the page count, improve the processes, and increase the frequency

All of those could be done, some are harder than others. But it's more of a menu of options -- you have to look at suits each team and what they think is possible.

Green Hand Guy wrote: »

To be honest, that's a bit of a double-edged sword. I gave up on reading it when it turned into a bitchy pro-USI propaganda leaflet. To me, and I'm sure many others, it seemed to be run by an elitist clique intent on pissing everyone else off and forcing their own agendas, which is completely not what you want.

Controversy is only good if it's properly directed. The SU aren't the enemy, and I'm sure it doesn't help them deal with the University authorities when the student media seems intent on undermining them at every turn. If the College View want to fight for the students, then they should help them rather than constantly try to make them look incompetent.

Imagine if the Union and the College View worked together. I'm sure as a united front they could get far more students involved in both groups and have much greater success lobbying the University.

I'm not saying the SU is perfect, and of course genuine scandals should be reported on, but much of what I've read has been just petty and malicious. The SU were elected by the student body, the CV team was elected by... a small clique of mostly journalism students. It actually disgusts me when they claim to be "the voice of the students." They don't speak for me and little of what they say is in my interest.

Student unions tend to do a very good job at making them self look incompetent and undermining them self... That's for another tread...

It's the student media's main roll to challenge power and expose incompetence -- "power" in this respect includes DCU, the SU, the Government etc, etc.

While I don't think it's healthy for an SU to be viewed as the "enemy", it would be worse for them to be viewed purely "on the same side". I'm not saying the SU and the paper can't work together, at times, but you seem to want a union propaganda paper rather than an independent student paper.

KenHy wrote: »

... what's sent to the printers? couldn't that be uploaded. I'm not in DCU anymore but I would have read a simple pdf if it was made available.

Indeed, as I have mentioned, it should be done a team any year are not bothered to maintain a full blown website. It's the very least which should have been done in the last year or two.

For any pedants out there: Yes, the PDFs sent to the printers are large files, but it takes feck all time to save smaller sized PDFs for on screen reading.

ndx11

Well I have wrote for the CV, im a JR student and I think its crap. The most recent issue one of the worst ever. Alot of it is badly written, with stories just sourced online and facebook.

There was like a 600 word story in the latest issue about how many people had joined a FB page/event concerning UCD's ball. How is that news?

The Editorial on page 2 was laughable, it doesn't actually say the editors name! For somebody who claims to get a buzz seeing their name in print its quite the mistake.

Maybe its because the editor hasn't attended any lectures this semester. I wasn't aware that the same credits awarded for passing modules were also made if you wrote half a newspaper on your own.I thought getting a good degree was the best thing you could take out of DCU.

From the years I have spent involved with the CV I have come to the same view as many people posting on this thread, Its controlled by a small clique of JR students only interested in having held a title position in a publication to put on their Curriculum Vitae.

The College View for your C.V. Boom!

XPS

ndx11 wrote: »

Well I have wrote for the CV, im a JR student and I think its crap. The most recent issue one of the worst ever. Alot of it is badly written, with stories just sourced online and facebook.

There was like a 600 word story in the latest issue about how many people had joined a FB page/event concerning UCD's ball. How is that news?

The Editorial on page 2 was laughable, it doesn't actually say the editors name! For somebody who claims to get a buzz seeing their name in print its quite the mistake.

Maybe its because the editor hasn't attended any lectures this semester. I wasn't aware that the same credits awarded for passing modules were also made if you wrote half a newspaper on your own.I thought getting a good degree was the best thing you could take out of DCU.

From the years I have spent involved with the CV I have come to the same view as many people posting on this thread, Its controlled by a small clique of JR students only interested in having held a title position in a publication to put on their Curriculum Vitae.

The College View for your C.V. Boom!

Oh lol. Pot, kettle. People in glass houses. Other cliches.

Also no paper puts the name of the editor on the editorial. Would agree with some of the online sourcing but its two things; lazy JR students or students who don't have the confidence to source their own quotes.

If you read any of the college papers you will find that they cover stories in other universities, it's student news (general).

monument

ndx11 wrote: »

... with stories just sourced online and facebook.

There was like a 600 word story in the latest issue about how many people had joined a FB page/event concerning UCD's ball. How is that news?

That internet thing... sure it'll never catch on. The internet is a valid source.

Did not see it but I'm guessing the UCD ball coverage and the facebook page was related to it being cancelled? That seems like news to me.

ndx11 wrote: »

The Editorial on page 2 was laughable, it doesn't actually say the editors name! For somebody who claims to get a buzz seeing their name in print its quite the mistake.

Are you just trolling? Editorials don't usually have names attached to them.

ndx11 wrote: »

...I thought getting a good degree was the best thing you could take out of DCU.

You thought wrong, getting experience is far more valued in the trade.

ndx11 wrote: »

....Its controlled by a small clique of JR students ...

That should be avoided, but at the same time it won't work as a democracy.

smorgasbord

For the most part, I felt that The College View did a good job given their limited resources. There were definitely issues with proofreading - spelling/grammar mistakes from students pursuing Journalism/Communications is kind of laughable and need to be stamped out if The College View and other campus publications - Campus Magazine was the worst for these mistakes - want to gain more credibility and respect.

I did find that it was very hard to break into, especially for students outside of JR. I e-mailed Flux on three different occasions this year about writing different pieces and received only one response, telling me that they had my name and they would get back to me, which they never did. The same names popped up in the bylines every single week and I think that next year's editorial team need to be more inclusive and pick from a wider pool of writers.

Choc123

smorgasbord wrote: »

I did find that it was very hard to break into, especially for students outside of JR. I e-mailed Flux on three different occasions this year about writing different pieces and received only one response, telling me that they had my name and they would get back to me, which they never did. The same names popped up in the bylines every single week and I think that next year's editorial team need to be more inclusive and pick from a wider pool of writers.

That is somewhat a mistake on your part I'm afraid. Pitching stories is useful but even in the journalism industry, editors don't like to get emails proposing stories. They want well written, accurate and preferably exclusive articles.
As a freelance journalist, I don't pitch stories to editors. I go out and find stories, write them up and send them in. That way you can impress, get published and get a phone call to do more. The whole pitching ideas is fine but it shouldn't be seen as the way to getting published. Having said that, I only write news, arts probably differs. Show a bit of initiative and it's only a matter of time when the CV includes your work.

Monument is spot on in relation to the SU/CV partnership suggestion. That goes against the key principles of what a paper should be - independent and objective. Although papers like the UCD Observer are technically SU papers, they have a certain level of independence. The CV has to keep the SU and the College to account. It hasn't done that for a couple of years but once upon a time it did:

The article on former president Ferdinand von Prondzynski's plans to sell the helix which resulted in him telling a national newspaper that quotes attributed to him by the particular journalist were "completely inaccurate". He later issued a full apology to the paper. How many CV stories do you remember that made it into a national newspaper?

The front page story about how the Estates Office were letting the air out of tyres of bicycles tied "illegally" to poles on campus. This resulted in a member of staff being investigated for his actions.

The story about former student and DCU GAA SU election candidate Conor Mortimer. The CV revealed how his campaign was being funded directly from the GAA Academy.

The article on the major row between a professor and the former SU President etc etc etc..

These are just some of the original and in many ways investigative stories that the paper has published in the past. There are so many stories on and off campus but they need to be found. That takes a level of ambition that I hope the new news editors will show.

I think everybody needs to give the new editorial team a chance. As the editor wrote in her editorial, it is an opportunity for a clean sheet.

smorgasbord

Choc123 wrote: »

That is somewhat a mistake on your part I'm afraid. Pitching stories is useful but even in the journalism industry, editors don't like to get emails proposing stories. They want well written, accurate and preferably exclusive articles.
As a freelance journalist, I don't pitch stories to editors. I go out and find stories, write them up and send them in. That way you can impress, get published and get a phone call to do more. The whole pitching ideas is fine but it shouldn't be seen as the way to getting published. Having said that, I only write news, arts probably differs. Show a bit of initiative and it's only a matter of time when the CV includes your work.

Sorry, if I wasn't clear - I wasn't actually pitching stories, I was just trying to put my name forward so they would give me either stories or albums/films to review, which is the way one gets into The College View. Like I said, they never got back to me, despite my e-mailing three times and despite saying they would.

Choc123

smorgasbord wrote: »

Sorry, if I wasn't clear - I wasn't actually pitching stories, I was just trying to put my name forward so they would give me either stories or albums/films to review, which is the way one gets into The College View. Like I said, they never got back to me, despite my e-mailing three times and despite saying they would.

Don't believe that this is "the way to get into the College View" - It might be the conventional way but as a former editor, if you wrote me a story without pitching it and it was decent I would keep in touch with you about writing more. Pick an album and write a review and bang her in!

smorgasbord

Choc123 wrote: »

Don't believe that this is "the way to get into the College View" - It might be the conventional way but as a former editor, if you wrote me a story without pitching it and it was decent I would keep in touch with you about writing more. Pick an album and write a review and bang her in!

Well, if this isn't the way to get into The College View, then it needs to be made clearer to students how to do it. At the Journalism Society, we were told to e-mail one of the editors expressing your interest in writing and they would then delegate pieces. And I followed this protocol.
In my initial e-mail, I had actually attached a 250 word sample review of a film that was being released, but was still told that they had my name and would get in touch with me, which they never did. This could just apply to the arts section, but that was my experience with The College View.

Green Hand Guy

Choc123 wrote: »

The CV has to keep the SU and the College to account. It hasn't done that for a couple of years but once upon a time it did:

The article on former president Ferdinand von Prondzynski's plans to sell the helix which resulted in him telling a national newspaper that quotes attributed to him by the particular journalist were "completely inaccurate". He later issued a full apology to the paper. How many CV stories do you remember that made it into a national newspaper?

The front page story about how the Estates Office were letting the air out of tyres of bicycles tied "illegally" to poles on campus. This resulted in a member of staff being investigated for his actions.

The story about former student and DCU GAA SU election candidate Conor Mortimer. The CV revealed how his campaign was being funded directly from the GAA Academy.

The article on the major row between a professor and the former SU President etc etc etc..

Well, that's exactly it! Holding the SU and the College to account on meaningful things like those above is exactly what the CV should do. What I've found though is that some time around two years ago it all turned a bit tabloid, and became more about manufacturing fake controversies to further the agendas of some of the CV team than reporting on real controversies that would matter to the students. At times they seemed to just bash the Union and SPC for the fun of it. I'd be delighted if they returned to the standard of ~3 years ago.

Choc123

smorgasbord wrote: »

Well, if this isn't the way to get into The College View, then it needs to be made clearer to students how to do it. At the Journalism Society, we were told to e-mail one of the editors expressing your interest in writing and they would then delegate pieces. And I followed this protocol.
In my initial e-mail, I had actually attached a 250 word sample review of a film that was being released, but was still told that they had my name and would get in touch with me, which they never did. This could just apply to the arts section, but that was my experience with The College View.

That's a shame but don't let it put you off writing again - it's a new arts team next year.

smorgasbord

Choc123 wrote: »

That's a shame but don't let it put you off writing again - it's a new arts team next year.

Oh, I definitely won't! New year, new beginning!

Also, I don't want to discredit this year's arts team in any way, shape or form. Flux was consistently well-produced and well-written and I just hope that I can be involved with it next year!

thusspakeblixa

ndx11 wrote: »

The Editorial on page 2 was laughable, it doesn't actually say the editors name! For somebody who claims to get a buzz seeing their name in print its quite the mistake.

Maybe its because the editor hasn't attended any lectures this semester. I wasn't aware that the same credits awarded for passing modules were also made if you wrote half a newspaper on your own.I thought getting a good degree was the best thing you could take out of DCU.

From the years I have spent involved with the CV I have come to the same view as many people posting on this thread, Its controlled by a small clique of JR students only interested in having held a title position in a publication to put on their Curriculum Vitae.

The College View for your C.V. Boom!

Do you read newspapers? Most Irish newspaper don't carry the editor's byline in the editorial. The College View has never done it either. It seems you have some personal grievance with the current editor, so please take that to her and don't post it on a public forum. Your point about the 'good degree being the best thing to take from DCU' is also slightly misplaced. A good degree is important, but I have found that most employers value the quality and breadth of your writing more (along with your experience). Hence- most journalists don't come straight from recognised Journalism degrees.

How many years have you 'ben involved' with the CV? I've been involved since 2009, and I can say with some validity that it is not a clique. If you want to level those accusations, I suggest you look elsewhere on campus. As a former editor, I take exception to your last point too. The only reason I took the job of editor was because I thought I could make the newspaper better. Having worked for the paper since first year, I care about it. Obviously, I failed but it was never about my CV. Indeed, I could have made a lot more money freelancing or getting a part-time job. So, for most of the people I have known in the paper, seeing our bylines in it was not a motivating factor for getting involved with the CV.

Out of interest, what did you write? I should know most people who wrote for the newspaper this year, I'd be interested to hear your experience.

JemimaPD

The College View is not so bad.

The only issues I see with it is -

1) There are no details for a closing date for articles for the next edition or when the final issue is being printed.

2) The website for College View is completely out of date by over 1 year.



I know the Archery club within DCU wanted to put something in the Campus Mag and CV about winning the Intervarsity Competition for the third year in a row but couldn't get it done due to the closing date for the last edition of each mag already lapsed.

Grudaire

I also looked for the name in the editorial, and I can see why people looked. The editorial was a bit... grandeous, and it was very unclear who was writing it. I may have missed the "This is the new CV editorial team" article, and it seemed a bit odd for an outgoing article. (Not that I'd have a clue who was or is editor :pac: )

The College View is far better than Campus, and it has a lot of stuff going for it. Sure it gets bashed for some stuff undeservingly, but it is infuriating to see the small things being done wrong. If it thinks it can hold people to account whilst doing so much wrong and having so many mistakes itself then the CV is kidding itself

Nanaki

Cliste wrote: »

The article on sexism is laughable,

She didn't bother to actually look up any facts. Sure the price of Car insurance is no longer allowed to be based on sex, but it's quite clear that although young females lose out, they stand to gain when it comes to the rest of the changes that the very same ruling brings in:
- Women are more likely to claim Income Protection
- Women live longer so Pensions cost more

Either she chose the ignore 3/4 of the ruling, or she didn't have a clue what she was talking about. Either wayit's pretty Daily Mail (Pathetic) reporting.

Who wrote that?

ipadzz

I personally am quite impartial to the CV. I think there is a place for it but there are negatives about it. I'm not going to go into either opinion to be honest. I wrote for it once or twice, since I was in JR, but i'm not a committee member or in any way related to the paper anymore.

The one thing I will mention is that for a module at the end of JR3, we had to do a focus group with a bunch of students about college media and how they use it. The overwhelming response to the paper was that people were full of complaints about it. We questioned about 30 students, making sure it was from a wide range of faculties.

However, when we asked towards the end of the interviews why don't people get involved to make the changes themselves they responded "I have no time". This attitude fuels one - the idea every faculty has about humanities being a school of lazy, elitists, and two - the fact people have everything to complain about but expect others to change how they feel for them.

If people in other faculties have so much criticism to write and say about the paper, why don't you get off your backside and change it then? Chances are the others in your faculty feel the same. Just because you have classes 9-5 everyday and we don't does not mean that we spend the rest of our days picking our noses and lying around. We also brought up the idea that there was not enough pieces relevant to them in the paper (pieces about technology, nursing, science news, teaching, postgrad). Yet when we asked whether they would be happy to write pieces for it, again "not enough time"..."no interest in writing".

You cannot expect a bunch of humanities students to know all about what you want and need. Yes, we can do a good job of finding out the right information but if there is a need for something, we need to be pointed towards it by people in the know! Ask an astronaut to bake a cake. Chances are the astronaut has baked before but isn't really confident about making an entire cake. He/she will try it out but it could be a bit lackluster. But give him/her a few helpful tips before they start and the results will be miles better and the helper will be happy. Do you understand what I'm getting at here?

All the comments here will help next year's team but if you really feel passionate about change make it know and better yet, make it yourself next year! I'm not a supporter of the paper, i actually have a lot of negative things to say about it but that would be directed at the staff more so the content so don't take this as a pro-paper comment. I'm just putting out there what results I got from research I did. College media never claims to be humanities-focused and all the college publications strive to meet the needs and wishes of the entire student body. DCU FM actually have quite a few non-humanities students presenting and working with them.

Grudaire

Nanaki wrote: »

Who wrote that?

It was definitly a girl, I can't say who did and there were no old issues around DCU... Sorry!