Barrow Street chaos

dfdublin

Anyone else notice the chaos on Barrow Street due to the lack of traffic and parking enforcement?

• Taxis camp-out in their cars taking up spaces outside EuroSpar without having to pay for parking.
• More taxis arrive and just stop outside other cars and put on their hazzard-lights as if it makes them invisible and immune from all rules of the road.
• Delivery trucks then also have to double-park.
• Workers on the new Google building double-park all day right up to outside of the Dart Station restricting traffic to a single lane at times.
• Clampers arrive, ignore all the taxis and double-parking outside the Dart station, and target cars who are legally parked except for being outside their time limit!

It is a complete joke. Aside from the chaos and frustration, there is going to be a serious accident - particularly with the crowds regularly exiting the Dart station.

I think the street urgently needs proper road markings and most importantly enforcement.

Anyone else experience this and any ideas on how to get all of the relevant authorities to work together on it?

Thanks

Hermy

Someone should complain!

Grevesey

Hi - I have complained. First to the taxi regulator who fed me a long tale of woe about how they only have 9 enforcement officers across the whole of ireland and that i should talk to the Guards! I then complained yesterday to the local Labour TD, Kevin Humphries who responded immediately (well done Mr H!!) and said he has had a number of complaints about Barrow St and that he will contact me by phone in the next two days to discuss. I agree it is chaos - unofficial taxi rank that takes away parking for customers or the various businesses down there, a road surface and road width that is no longer fit for purpose, litter that is an embarrasement to the city in a touristy area and a clamping regime that at best is extortion and at worse, is abusive........so I am on it!! I am a resident of nearby Charlotte Quay so have watched the street evolve over the last 10 years from an insignificant side street to effectively the Google campus!!! We will see what Mr Humphreys can do and if he is good to his word...bad urban planning in my opinion....how can you add almost 4,500 employees, 3 major office buildings and several new retail outlets and NOT think about upgrading the road - eejits at Dublin Corpo...

delta_bravo

This is not what your TD is for.

Would you not get in touch with the council and your councillors?

Grevesey

Sorry - used wrong terminology - think he is actually a local councillor - but even if he was a TD, that is EXACTLY what TDs are for - to represent and stick up for their constituent's voice and issues........we vote them in to represent us at government level, be that local or central....

CottonMouth

+1 on complaining

I cycle down every morning and I see more incidents there each day than I do on the rest of my 10km trip every month. Taxis at law firms are the worst culprits, delivery vans at Spar too.

Googlers cross roads like lemmings do cliffs, :eek:

Some helpful suggestions

Grevesey

Ha - thanks Cottonmouth:D - will gather together this thread and show to Kevin Humphreys so if anyone else wants to add their dissent, the more the better!

Kevin called me today as promised but we missed each other - we are due to speak again on Monday - will keep you posted.

A lollipop lady may indeed solve the Darwin Award contestents at Google and help them with basic road-crossing skills alright! Heaven knows somebody would be grateful for the employment!!

2qk4u

If you went to Barrow st and needed a Taxi and there were none there and you had to wait I suppose you would complain about that too ?
Where do you expect the Taxis and truck and vans ect to stop ? Its a busy street and all the road markings in the world wont make a difference.

Grevesey

I am campaigning for a recognised, and limited taxi rank there - Dublin is not short of taxis and if you stand still for 10 seconds in this town, one will stop.....I agree we do need some taxis there....but it needs to be controlled...

gurramok

2qk4u wrote: »

If you went to Barrow st and needed a Taxi and there were none there and you had to wait I suppose you would complain about that too ?
Where do you expect the Taxis and truck and vans ect to stop ? Its a busy street and all the road markings in the world wont make a difference.

Where did you spring this gem from? Before Google arrived, Barrow st always had taxis passing down the street, you'd be waiting only a few short minutes before a taxi arrived.

There is not an official tax rank on that street so taxis have no right to be there waiting for a fare all day.

If you were stuck for a taxi(rarely happens on that street pre-Google and post-Google), stroll onto Grand Canal st or Ringsend Rd, no shortage at all. And you can use public transport as well, DART on the street and buses on the above named streets.

Stationary taxis are the problem, they are hindering deliveries for trucks and vans.

Jay D

That would do my head in too. I know the road well and yeah I've seen it grow, from Esat-BT etc and on... Everyone seems to be taking the absolute piss but what's the answer there other than enforced clamping and the like? No room for improvements now.

Twenty10

Imagine how it is for the people who live in the houses at the end. They must be driven mad by it. Also a creche has just opened on the road so no doubt that'll add to the traffic chaos.

Grevesey

Indeed - the new creche also means that we all should be watching out for kids running about, potentially into the road from behind parked cars etc - it is indeed a serious accident waiting to happen. The more support we get for some serious review of Barrow St the better. Something can be done, it just takes will and some creative thinking. You are right that this should have been thought about years ago but there is always a solution for these things, it's just a question of thinking big!!

neris

Twenty10 wrote: »

Imagine how it is for the people who live in the houses at the end. They must be driven mad by it. Also a creche has just opened on the road so no doubt that'll add to the traffic chaos.

Barrow Street is the bizzarest street in the city. The taxis are usually waiting for Google staff and usually see staff coming and going with suit cases. Was there last Friday night about 1130pm and the que of taxis looked was that Carlsberg ad a few years back. The Euro spar is a disaster with the loading bay out side it and the entrance to the Google carpark plus a disabled space being constantly used by vans and people running into the shop. Ive attached pics of some of the dire parking that goes on down there i especially love the one from last sunday of the car in the disabled space without a blue badge and the the clamper truck aprked on front of it. The creche wont add to the chaos as most children are walked to it and at the most can only hold 50 children and the vast majority of the children are under 4 and cant just run out of the building alone.

Grevesey

Thanks for those photos Neris. I have also pics of taxis waiting int he laoding bay and the long line of Taxis bulding up. The evidence gathering continues!:)

neris

Grevesey wrote: »

Thanks for those photos Neris. I have also pics of taxis waiting int he laoding bay and the long line of Taxis bulding up. The evidence gathering continues!:)

i think i have more on another pc but im sure i,ll have pleanty more over the next while. Theres a thread in motors for obnoxious parking and barrow street is a goldmine for those kinda pix. I think it was also suggested to city council about a barrier on the kerb outside the creche.

Grevesey

Great news Neris. A fellow crusader!

gurramok

At the top end of Barrow st just before Bolands Mills, there was(not sure if its still on) Irish dancing classes for kids on a Sunday. A nightmare with mothers in their 4x4's waiting for their darlings to emerge from class.

Also some of those taxi's hang around near the Pembroke Sq apts waiting for clubbers from the Gasworks pub, sort of acts like an overflow taxi rank when parking outside the pub is full, only saw that once though.

Just to add, South Lotts Road is like Barrow st with taxis on Wednesday and Friday nights due to Shelbourne Park.

Grevesey

Gurramok - yes there is now a full blown kids theatre/dance school there on Saturdays so there is alot of pickng up/dropping off of future X-Factor contestents....another reason to add to the long list of reasons why the street needs some review. There are taxis everywhere around here - they do stop on Sth Lotts Rd too, mainly to use that Spar and coffee shop I think. It is ridiculous - deregulation gone bonkers in the taxi industry. In many ways, there is an argument to not need a taxi rank in Barrow St at all given the plethora of availability around and about but in order to appease everyone, I am guessing it will be an inevitability.....but controlled and limited. There might also be an argument to say that if Google want a taxi rank for their staff, then they should contribute to the costs of either setting that up or policing it and the rest of the road - they are not short of a bob or two and we all know they are here for multi-million $$ savings in Corporation Tax so their corporate responisbility should extend to the surrounding environment and impact on local residents where they choose to set up camp....this will be something I will float with Mr Humphreys.

neris

And wait for the future when Bolands is developed, gona be great craic altogether. I see that over the other side of the canal on the street that goes under the train bridge (dont know its name) theyve blocked it off so 2 cul de sacs now. Might be worth a look at with the bridge on barrow street becuase the narrowness of that is one of the major problems with ppl exiting the station.

gurramok

I'd agree there should be a taxi rank there outside Google(perhaps paid by G themselves) going up to just before the Eurospar but until that is established the council should enforce the rules as its infringing on local residents who find it quite difficult to find parking at times.
If a rank was there, at least taxi's queuing outside that rank can be penalised.

And yeh, there are a few pubs at that Sth Lotts junction with Grand Canal st near the Spar, like a paradise for taxi's to pick up fares

Grevesey

We can only be thankful that the chances of Bolands Mill being developed is about as far away as the chances of me being made Pope by Christmas! I have lived here for 15 years and the Bolands Mill building has been in planning dispute for all that time. It is a protected building because of it's connection with the Irish Rebellion but it has been mired in planning disputes for decades. Fortunately this should mean we don't have further constuction worries in the area for a while!

Grevesey

P.s Neris I fear the idea of a permanent barrier under the bridge like the parallel street is unlikely - Barrow St in fairness is an important rat-run through to Shelbourne Rd so would be difficult to justify.

neris

Maybe off topic a bit but am I the only one who gets a bad smell around the bolands site at times and also near the mason hayes offices?

Grevesey

Haven't noticed myself but sometimes when the wind and weather is conspiring, the stink from the mudflats on Sandymount Strand can sit over Ringsend when the pall is not blown off by winds.....more often in the summer, less so in the winter. Could that be it?

easygoing39

1.the public wanted more taxis,there are now more taxis and yet people complain??
2.why should google pay for a rank on barrow st,its the corpo's responability to provide ranks?
3.There are 15,000 taxis in dublin,more than in new york city,why are you trying to stop taxi drivers from looking for fares on barrow st,theyre only trying to provide for their familys?
4.do you want to go back to 2005,when you had to stand at a rank for 10 minutes to get a taxi,now we have the pick of taxis on every rank that is always full in this city??

Grevesey

Easygoing : If you read the thread you will see that I am not proposing banning taxis from Barrow Street - I am looking for a taxi rank which limits and controls the taxi build up on Barrow St so that it leaves parking and a decent run through the street without the blight of double parked cabs, cabs in delivery bays (meaning delivery vans double park as a necessity), cabs taking up customer parking for the Eurospar, cabs doing U-turns in the street as well as improving the road and the preventing the traffic chaos that is up there at peak times. I have nothing against taxis - I use them almost every day.....but the fact that the deregulation of taxis has resulted in too many cabs in Dublin all fighting for the same business id evidently not being addressed by either the Regulator (who seems to be an impotent and toothless dog) or the Dublin Corpo (I have witnessed physical and verbal fights in the middle of the road btw competing cabs for my business - very intimidating for a lone female passenger and frankly, ridiculous). This is about safety and keeping an important thoroughfare clear for traffic. I am not on a vendetta against all taxis in Dublin. So I think you might be in the minority here!

neris

If they put in a rank it wouldnt stop Taxis still que close by and wait to be called onto the rank. Look at the Oconnell st rank where they que around the middle of the street or theres a rank up at Nortshide sc and when its full the taxis wait across the street and wait for their mates to call em when spaces come free. A rank would probably cause more trouble between drivers then anything. Fights over customers, full time drivers only, no blacks etc. Its not up to Google to provide a rank if the taxi drivers think theres business on the street its up to the council

monument

Grevesey wrote: »

P.s Neris I fear the idea of a permanent barrier under the bridge like the parallel street is unlikely - Barrow St in fairness is an important rat-run through to Shelbourne Rd so would be difficult to justify.

Err... What? How can there be an "important rat-run"? A rat run by it's nature is a unattractive thing.

A bit more traffic calming and traffic reduction sounds exactly what is need on the street.

Grevesey

Neris - you might be right here - will discuss once I (finally) connect with Kevin Humphreys. We seem to be missing each other at the mo.

Raytown Rocks

The place is a nightmare, plain and simple.
Taxis all over the road, double parked, they trying u-turns when the get a fare. Its shamblollic to say the least.

chrisp2281

I work on Grand Canal Quay which is the next street over.
They have now closed the through road from Clanwilliam Terrace to Grand canal Quay which means everyone driving to Grand Canal Quay also uses Barrow street now. Another brilliant decisions by DCC

Grevesey

Hi all

I have just had a very interesing conversation with Kevin Humphreys, the local Labour TD and it looks like good news :

• He has been campaigning (both in his capacity as TD and also as a member of Dublin Council) for Barrow St to be upgraded and seems to already be actively talking to the disparate authorities with a vested interest in this. To summarise his points :

• Barrow St falls under the remit of Dublin Docklands Authority. The DDA has a Development Fund that has been set aside for just this sort of thing and there is currently moves to release considerable money from this Dev Fund to upgrade the road surface in B St, set up better pedestrian footpaths under the bridge and along the length of the street. Whilst these funds are available, it is taking some time to release them but Kevin thinks in the next couple of months, this will be forthcoming.

• Mr Humphreys and Dublin Council are already in talks with Google to fund a raised walkway between the two Google buildings to ensure that the staff cross over above the road, in a covered walkway. Google have agreed this in principle and to fund all/part of it.

• The Gasworks developer, Liam Carroll is bust and the whole complex is now in the hands of NAMA. This means that whilst there had originally been plans by Liam Carroll to fund a taxi rank, along with Google, that money is unlikely to be available now.

• The taxi rank will be built AFTER the road surfacing is done (which makes sense) and the risk of taxis ignoring the rank and queing to get onto the rank is recognised. In response to this problem across the City, the Taxi Regulator has been taken to task by The Council and new rules and penanties for illegal queuing to get onto a rank are due to be enacted.

• The Dublin Corp have also recognised that the Taxi Regulator has failed in its remit to control cabs in Dublin. It is under review for a total restructure. There is also the added issue that when deregulation came in, the Taxi Regulator experienced a massive windfall of money as a result of more license fees - this massive amount of money was meant to be spent on upgrading the regulator, hiring more staff, more patrols and penalty issuance etc etc. Instead, the regulator chose to deposit this money in a bank account and that is where it has stayed!!! So Dublin Corp are going to force the Regulator to release that money and spend it on regulation!!

• Re plans for the Boland Flour Mills building : this is really interesting! There is a planning application in place from the owner of the Mill, a Mr Kelly, to develop the pretty old building into a boutique hotel, with small apartments behind it, destroy the newer, high rise concrete building behind it and put in a small Museum. However, since that developer is also now in NAMA, that application is on hold indefinately and it is unlikely to be developed in the next 2-3 years if not longer. Interestingly, although everybody, including historians, think that the building has a connection with the Irish Rebellion, that is wrong, The building that WAS connected does not exist any more and was on the site where The Treasury Building (and home of NAMA) is now on the corner of Mackin St. So there is no protection order on the Bolands Building as I thought.

So, it looks like all the issues are being addressed but by disparate authorities and bodies. Kevin seems to be doing a great job and co-ordinating all of t his and he says that he wants to see Barrow St upgraded to a point where it reflects the success of the road and the landmark nature of Barrow St - and I believe him.

We will all keep an eye on how this all works out but it will take time....we'll see!

Cheers all.

2qk4u

The Taxi problem on the street will remain, a lot of the Taxis there are waiting for people, they have been pre booked. A Taxi rank will not help this problem as a booked Taxi does not use the rank.

monument

What exactly does upgrade mean in this context?

A nice big plaza or at least a few pedestrian tables, would be great. This is an example of a pedestrian table on Capal Street:

Grevesey

Monument : I am not sure - Kevin spoke about better footpaths and widened footpaths under the Dart bridge, resurfacing the entire road and re-designating parking areas, delivery bays, the rank etc etc. Once agreement has been found amongst all the relevant bodies, I am sure we will have access to the plans and how that might impact things....

neris

Got these two about 1230 today just the usual Barrow Street obstacle course. Mini parked across the double yellow lines out side googles service entrance and bread delivery van double parked. Also the regular U turner.

(and yes that is bird crap on my windscreen)

Did the local labour guy give any idea of a time line when the road would be done up? Going to really be a nightmare then but at least dcc had the cop on (i hope) to do a rank after the road is resurfaced but wouldnt surpise me to find a new rank on whats there already, resurfacing guys to come in, dig up rank and then have another rank

Grevesey

Thanks Neris - and we will find the bird that crapped on your window and have it publically plucked and stuffed!!

I expect that time will be long here - nothing that involves getting lots of different agencies together is quick although it seems that talks have been going on for some time and so I privately expect something to emerge in the next 6 mths....but don't hold me to that. I will keep a close eye on things and occasionally prod Kevin Humphreys for updates and post here on this thread.

pabloh999

neris wrote: »

Got these two about 1230 today just the usual Barrow Street obstacle course. Mini parked across the double yellow lines out side googles service entrance and bread delivery van double parked. Also the regular U turner

Your bitching about someone doing a 'u turn'? Seriously, you got nothing better to worry about?

Grevesey

I am not sure that last post really warrants a reply...

Marcusm

Just to be clear about something, the whole Gasworks development is not in anyway controlled by NAMA, none of it is. The former gasometer (Alliance building) is controlled by Ulster Bank which has invested money to keep up standards. The remaining residential buildings are in the control of the management companies controlled by residents. There is no need for ill founded speculation or rumour mongering about tha development.

CyCaboose

good to see there are plans for Barrow St, I walk through it every day to/from work and it is just a horrible street considering the amount of traffic through it (pedestrian and vehicle).

the taxi's are a joke, there's too many, and they can be flat out dangerous. Just yesterday I was walking down Barrow Street, and a taxi reversed in front of me at full speed, I figured he was just doing a U-turn, but no, he continued to reverse at full speed onto the footpath and in between the 2 older Google offices - to park his car in that little no driving area. he nearly knocked me over in the process, he wasn't even looking out for pedestrians.

One other thing that annoys me about Barrow Street though, and some of you may not agree as you possibly work for Google, (not trying to put you all in the same category), but the amount of Google employees who literally just loiter outside their office on the footpath in a huge group frustrates me so much. Ok I get you work for Google but its a public footpath not a campus, give some room for other pedestrians. Worst of all is they never move out of the way, they've forced me to walk around them onto the road. And it happens nearly everyday - I really wish Google would tell their employees to loiter somewhere else instead of forming big groups on the footpath. :mad:

crushproof

CyCaboose wrote: »

One other thing that annoys me about Barrow Street though, and some of you may not agree as you possibly work for Google, (not trying to put you all in the same category), but the amount of Google employees who literally just loiter outside their office on the footpath in a huge group frustrates me so much. Ok I get you work for Google but its a public footpath not a campus, give some room for other pedestrians. Worst of all is they never move out of the way, they've forced me to walk around them onto the road. And it happens nearly everyday - I really wish Google would tell their employees to loiter somewhere else instead of forming big groups on the footpath. :mad:

Lucky you wernt there the day the Street Cam drove by.... Google Street View Barrow Street

I've always wondered how ridiulous it is that this street in the hear of "Silicon Dublin" is one of the worst streets around, patched up cement, tarmac and ramps surrounded by high 21st century glass offices. Seriously needs to be sorted out soon, the walkway across for Google is a good idea and should be done ASAP.
And the whole taxi rank issue is something that needs to be sorted out city wide, O'Connell Street rank is crazy as well.

CyCaboose

crushproof wrote: »

Lucky you wernt there the day the Street Cam drove by.... Google Street View Barrow Street

I've always wondered how ridiulous it is that this street in the hear of "Silicon Dublin" is one of the worst streets around, patched up cement, tarmac and ramps surrounded by high 21st century glass offices. Seriously needs to be sorted out soon, the walkway across for Google is a good idea and should be done ASAP.
And the whole taxi rank issue is something that needs to be sorted out city wide, O'Connell Street rank is crazy as well.

yup, came across that street-view yesterday made me laugh... nuts though. Agree the street is pretty pathetic considering such huge offices are around there, and what is essentially now becoming the European Googleplex (the 3 Google offices (4? I see a Google sign on the wall inside the building opposite Eurospar... on the floor above the DTT office) on Barrow St, then also the other Google office around the corner in Grand Canal Plaza... i'm half expecting them to rename Barrow Street to Google Street :pac:

But yeh, a lot of people come over to visit these offices from other countries - the street outside it could do with some serious improvement, its an embarrassment

jollygood

CyCaboose wrote: »

One other thing that annoys me about Barrow Street though, and some of you may not agree as you possibly work for Google, (not trying to put you all in the same category), but the amount of Google employees who literally just loiter outside their office on the footpath in a huge group frustrates me so much. Ok I get you work for Google but its a public footpath not a campus, give some room for other pedestrians. Worst of all is they never move out of the way, they've forced me to walk around them onto the road. And it happens nearly everyday - I really wish Google would tell their employees to loiter somewhere else instead of forming big groups on the footpath. :mad:

Hear hear. The amount of googleheads congregating in gangs, blowing smoke in my face, forcing me onto the road off the pavement twice a day when I try to leave and return home, it is so annoying and seriously bad banners. Their HR dept should have a word.

neris

Apparently the bolands mill site is now in nama if rte.ie is to belived from sunday. Valued at 50million now think it was 200 or 400 million a few years ago. Signs of life in it this evening. A security guard and some vans

oceanclub

dfdublin wrote: »

Anyone else notice the chaos on Barrow Street due to the lack of traffic and parking enforcement?

I was going to make a complaint about this - has slipped my mind. But it's ridiculously - have been nearly knocking down twice by taxis trying to madly double-park.

P.

neris

Barrow street is after getting worse since the previous post. The google works are seriously causing chaos with contractors vans double parked, illegally park and just dumped at any convenient spot. Drove down half an hour ago and the clampers are having a field day but the chaos & obstacle course are still mad.

schemingbohemia

Have you reported this to the Garda?

neris

rang gardai and have made compalints over time to council and clampers. clampers seem to be the only ones who give monkies but theres cash in it for them

TheBandicoot

Maybe we should just pedestrianise the whole area from the junction with Gordon St to the junction with Grand Canal St.