Kids and guns in south Armagh

junder

How many times have we seen images of young children brandishing ak47s in far flung places as Africa and the middle east, how would you feel to see young children brandishing ak47s on the same island as were you live.



"Children have appeared dressed up as republican paramilitaries and brandishing replica guns in a south Armagh community centre which has received hundreds of thousands of pounds in EU funds.
The children, some of primary school age, were photographed at the Ti Chulainn cultural centre in Mullaghbawn.
They were wearing balaclavas, combat jackets and trousers, dark glasses and berets, and brandishing replica weapons including AK47s and Armalites.
A complaint has been made to the Children’s Commissioner Patricia Lewsley. The PSNI will also be asked to investigate.
Despite several telephone calls and written questions submitted by the Belfast Telegraph, no-one from the Ti Chulainn centre would comment on the matter.
The photographs were posted on a social networking website by a Lurgan Sinn Fein member. It is understood they were taken at the centre six months ago. Appalled members of the public who saw the pictures contacted IRA victims’ group Fair and the TUV.
The Children’s Commissioner confirmed that Fair director Willie Frazer yesterday lodged a complaint with her office.
Mr Frazer said: “I was told the office’s legal department will investigate. I was also advised to report the matter to the PSNI.” Mr Frazer said that while the photographs insulted victims of IRA violence, they raised wider issues: “People bereaved or injured by terrorism are insulted by these photographs.
The Ti Chulainn centre has benefited from local and international public funding. The Special EU Programmes Body (SEUPB) has confirmed a previous award of £42,000 and a current award of £264,500 to the centre for “specific tourist-related activity”.
DUP MEP Diane Dodds yesterday held an urgent meeting with the SEUPB. She said: “As a result of our meeting, SEUPB is now developing a code of conduct for all organisations to sign up to in order to secure funding. Not only is there a child protection issue, but there’s also an issue of incitement to terrorism. I wouldn’t be surprised if this matter ends up with police.”
The TUV’s Barrie Halliday said: “We’re constantly being told to forget the past as Northern Ireland has moved into a new era. These disgusting photographs show that to be lies.”
Local UUP MLA Danny Kennedy said: “Those who organised this event and those who hosted it need to seriously question themselves.”


http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/ne...-15121827.html


http://i53.tinypic.com/j6lj4n.jpg


http://i55.tinypic.com/2ep0aab.jpg

http://i51.tinypic.com/207nxh4.jpg


Remind you of anything


http://holyfalafel.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/terrorist-kids.jpg

http://www.manyriversfilms.co.uk/assets/images/services/child_hamas_192.jpg

LordSutch

Thanks for posting that junder, truly appalling that adults can alow children to dress up like that, but I'm sorry to say that many of the posters here would be IRA/ Republican supporters anyway, so don't expect too much shock & disgust. You will probably get about 90% of posters agreeing with the Ti Chulainn stance.

OhNoYouDidn't

LordSutch wrote: »

Thanks for posting that junder, truly appalling that adults can alow children to dress up like that, but I'm sorry to say that many of the posters here would be IRA/ Republican supporters anyway, so don't expect too much shock & disgust. You will probably get about 90% of posters agreeing with the Ti Chulainn stance.

While I would question the taste, it is just kids playing with toy guns when all is said and done. We all did it. What exactly will the cops be expected to do?

When a man with links to terrorism leads the hysteria, you have to laugh... As for linking it to Hams, spare us.

Its a 'troubles museum' they were at by the way. its not as if the locals dug up some guns for the occasion.

Overheal

LordSutch wrote: »

Thanks for posting that junder, truly appalling that adults can alow children to dress up like that, but I'm sorry to say that many of the posters here would be IRA/ Republican supporters anyway, so don't expect too much shock & disgust. You will probably get about 90% of posters agreeing with the Ti Chulainn stance.

I don't think you know what you're talking about there.

LordSutch

With all due respect I have been around long enough on Boards.ie to know.

Maybe you would like to enlighten us with your opinion on the main topic?

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

you'd think so, but clearly you haven't been paying much attention

OhNoYouDidn't

So lets be clear.

6 months ago, at a museaum, what looks like a kid, picked up a replica gun and photos were put on a private page on a social network site.

Now a man with a terrorist past is decrying this as child abuse and asking the cops to intervene. On what charge, no-one knows.

And Junder tries to link it to Hamas.

You couldn't make it up etc.

junder

http://i51.tinypic.com/qsl3f6.jpg

http://i51.tinypic.com/15f2a1k.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/2guabyp.jpg

Who said anything about hamas, saying there us a link implies a connection, sT no point did I mention I only showed how these pictures of kids with ak47s pictured in south Armagh looked like photos of child soldiers from the middle east and africa, which even you would have to admit they do. Posted a few more 'innocent' photos

OhNoYouDidn't

junder wrote: »

http://i51.tinypic.com/qsl3f6.jpg

http://i51.tinypic.com/15f2a1k.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/2guabyp.jpg

Who said anything about hamas, saying there us a link implies a connection, sT no point did I mention I only showed how these pictures of kids with ak47s pictured in south Armagh looked like photos of child soldiers from the middle east and africa, which even you would have to admit they do. Posted a few more 'innocent' photos

These photos were lifted off a private facebook page, yeah? So the line that this is rubbing it in to the victims is to say the least, moot.

Will I dig out Young Citizen Volunteers photos? Or is it only wrong when Republican kids are involved?

Its such a non story I don't even know where to begin

junder

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

These photos were lifted off a private facebook page, yeah? So the line that this is rubbing it in to the victims is to say the least, moot.

Will I dig out Young Citizen Volunteers photos? Or is it only wrong when Republican kids are involved?

Its such a non story I don't even know where to begin

For such a non story you seem to have an awful lot to say about it

ghostdancer

funny, i thought Unionists loved playing dress-up for cultural events celebrating their murderous past?

Denerick

ghostdancer wrote: »

funny, i thought Unionists loved playing dress-up for cultural events celebrating their murderous past?

I make the following prediction:

This thread will last for over a 100 pages.

Incessant whataboutery will take place.

The 1918 general election will be invoked by one party, debated by the other, and ignored by the other.

We've had this debate before.

Spudmonkey

ghostdancer wrote: »

funny, i thought Unionists loved playing dress-up for cultural events celebrating their murderous past?

Its pretty poor taste, regardless of which side they are on.

CokaColumbo

When an article is relying on an interview with the UVF apologist and generally soft-headed Willie Frazer, I hesitate to call it news worthy. This is a non-issue which has been turned into "news" by injecting unionist emotionalism and exaggeration.

The original poster is being theatrical by comparing kids dressing up and posing with fake guns for fun with kids in the middle east who are photographed with real assault rifles and who will grow up to use them for real against the 'Zionist infidel.'

Poor taste, yes. Big deal, no.


(The link to the Belfast Telegraph site doesn't work by the way).

karma_

CokaColumbo wrote: »

When an article is relying on an interview with the UVF apologist and generally soft-headed Willie Frazer, I hesitate to call it news worthy. This is a non-issue which has been turned into "news" by injecting unionist emotionalism and exaggeration.

The original poster is being theatrical by comparing kids dressing up and posing with fake guns for fun with kids in the middle east who are photographed with real assault rifles and who will grow up to use them for real against the 'Zionist infidel.'

Poor taste, yes. Big deal, no.


(The link to the Belfast Telegraph site doesn't work by the way).

Willie Frazer, one of the biggest jokes to emerge from NI.

KeithAFC

I have to say, the uniform of the IRA sucks in comparison to the UVF uniform.

FTA69

Putting a balaclava and replica gun in the hands of a small child is ridiculous. Furthermore it's disrespectful to those who actually gave their lives for Irish freedom and participated in the wider Republican struggle. It's sh*t taste of the highest order and whoever was facilitating that in a community centre would need a kick up the hole.

There are much better ways to commemorate those who died.

KeithAFC

FTA69 wrote: »

Putting a balaclava and replica gun in the hands of a small child is ridiculous. Furthermore it's disrespectful to those who actually gave their lives for Irish freedom and participated in the wider Republican struggle. It's sh*t taste of the highest order and whoever was facilitating that in a community centre would need a kick up the hole.

There are much better ways to commemorate those who died.

Did they tell them the IRA killed innocent people?

testicle

junder wrote: »

How many times have we seen images of young children brandishing ak47s in far flung places as Africa and the middle east, how would you feel to see young children brandishing ak47s on the same island as were you live.



"Children have appeared dressed up as republican paramilitaries and brandishing replica guns in a south Armagh community centre which has received hundreds of thousands of pounds in EU funds.
The children, some of primary school age, were photographed at the Ti Chulainn cultural centre in Mullaghbawn.
They were wearing balaclavas, combat jackets and trousers, dark glasses and berets, and brandishing replica weapons including AK47s and Armalites.
A complaint has been made to the Children’s Commissioner Patricia Lewsley. The PSNI will also be asked to investigate.
Despite several telephone calls and written questions submitted by the Belfast Telegraph, no-one from the Ti Chulainn centre would comment on the matter.
The photographs were posted on a social networking website by a Lurgan Sinn Fein member. It is understood they were taken at the centre six months ago. Appalled members of the public who saw the pictures contacted IRA victims’ group Fair and the TUV.
The Children’s Commissioner confirmed that Fair director Willie Frazer yesterday lodged a complaint with her office.
Mr Frazer said: “I was told the office’s legal department will investigate. I was also advised to report the matter to the PSNI.” Mr Frazer said that while the photographs insulted victims of IRA violence, they raised wider issues: “People bereaved or injured by terrorism are insulted by these photographs.
The Ti Chulainn centre has benefited from local and international public funding. The Special EU Programmes Body (SEUPB) has confirmed a previous award of £42,000 and a current award of £264,500 to the centre for “specific tourist-related activity”.
DUP MEP Diane Dodds yesterday held an urgent meeting with the SEUPB. She said: “As a result of our meeting, SEUPB is now developing a code of conduct for all organisations to sign up to in order to secure funding. Not only is there a child protection issue, but there’s also an issue of incitement to terrorism. I wouldn’t be surprised if this matter ends up with police.”
The TUV’s Barrie Halliday said: “We’re constantly being told to forget the past as Northern Ireland has moved into a new era. These disgusting photographs show that to be lies.”
Local UUP MLA Danny Kennedy said: “Those who organised this event and those who hosted it need to seriously question themselves.”


http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/ne...-15121827.html


http://i53.tinypic.com/j6lj4n.jpg


http://i55.tinypic.com/2ep0aab.jpg

http://i51.tinypic.com/207nxh4.jpg


Remind you of anything


http://holyfalafel.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/terrorist-kids.jpg

http://www.manyriversfilms.co.uk/assets/images/services/child_hamas_192.jpg

You missed this bit - "Children have appeared dressed up as republican paramilitaries and brandishing replica guns in a south Armagh community centre"

southsiderosie

The pictures are distasteful, and the adults involved clearly have no sense.

From the community workers I talked to in Republican areas of Belfast, there seems to be a great deal of concern about young people today being unduly starry-eyed about the misadventures of the Provos. These kids hear from older family members about the protests, community resistance, and transformative prison experiences of their elders, and then they look at their own lives which seem to pale in comparison. It's a sad commentary on the state of NI today that so many young people, particularly in disadvantaged communities see that time period as something exciting and maybe even fun, rather than a horror show, and any museum exhibit that lets these kids play 'Provo dress-up' only feeds into that.

mike65

Its indicative of a mentality that needs expunging.

Dyr

If those are primary school kids waving those weapons around they must have been kept back a fair few years

Iwasfrozen

testicle wrote: »

You missed this bit - "Children have appeared dressed up as republican paramilitaries and brandishing replica guns in a south Armagh community centre"

For Christ sake. For course they're replica. A child isn't going to be able to hold a real AK-47!

Here you have children being brainwashed into thinking it's acceptable to dress like a paramilitary and all you and your ilk are interested in is whether the guns are real or not.

Un-fúcking-believeable.

OhNoYouDidn't

KeithAFC wrote: »

Did they tell them the IRA killed innocent people?

The British Army killed many times more innocent people. Where is your condemnation of kids playing soldiers? Or products like this?



As for Willie Frazer, what about the innocent victims of murder he is a suspect in and was arrested over? Who represents them?

Iwasfrozen

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

The British Army killed many times more innocent people. Where is your condemnation of kids playing soldiers? Or products like this?

As for Willie Frazer, what about the innocent victims of murder he is a suspect in and was arrested over? Who represents them?

Comparing owning an action man to dressing up as a paramilitary is stupid. I'm sorry, but it is. And I hope for your sake I don't have to explain why.

KeithAFC

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

The British Army killed many times more innocent people. Where is your condemnation of kids playing soldiers? Or products like this?



As for Willie Frazer, what about the innocent victims of murder he is a suspect in and was arrested over? Who represents them?

We aren't talking about the British army. We are talking about kids being brainwashed by republicans to wear republican IRA uniforms.

KeithAFC

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Comparing owning an action man to dressing up as a paramilitary is stupid. I'm sorry, but it is. And I hope for your sake I don't have to explain why.

Indeed it is. I find it truly amazing how anyone can actually try to defend it. And the IRA killed more catholics than the British army did.

charlemont

Fair play to these children, its their history and they are entitled to show it respect..

karma_

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

The British Army killed many times more innocent people. Where is your condemnation of kids playing soldiers? Or products like this?



As for Willie Frazer, what about the innocent victims of murder he is a suspect in and was arrested over? Who represents them?

Here now, don;t be dragging Action Man into this, Action Man rocked.

danbohan

KeithAFC wrote: »

Indeed it is. I find it truly amazing how anyone can actually try to defend it. And the IRA killed more catholics than the British army did.

this is from the guy that was hero worshiping the uvf uniform 1 hour ago , need we say more

R P McMurphy

karma_ wrote: »

Here now, don;t be dragging Action Man into this, Action Man rocked.

Was action man always a British soldier or was this a limited edition or something?

charlemont

If ye feel like that about it, why dont ye have a problem with video games where its always a white American or British soldier killing dark skinned characters.

Maybe someone should make a Captain Robert Nairac Torture Doll, or an IRA video game,

OhNoYouDidn't

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Comparing owning an action man to dressing up as a paramilitary is stupid. I'm sorry, but it is. And I hope for your sake I don't have to explain why.

Not if you are from South Armagh its not.

Kids playing with guns is either right or wrong. Yet again, we have the unionist heirarchy of victimhood. How DARE Republicans, in private, respect their military tradition. Only we are allowed do that, in PUBLIC, with marches and dressing kids up in YCV trappings.

KeithAFC

danbohan wrote: »

this is from the guy that was hero worshiping the uvf uniform 1 hour ago , need we say more

As a passive joke to just how silly it is to allow those kids to put those uniforms on. I would not like to see young loyalist kids wearing the UVF uniform. I'd like to think we have more dignity and we know our identity to not have to do that.

OhNoYouDidn't

KeithAFC wrote: »

We aren't talking about the British army. We are talking about kids being brainwashed by republicans to wear republican IRA uniforms.

And the difference is?

Yet again, one rule for you, one rule for them.

karma_

R P McMurphy wrote: »

Was action man always a British soldier or was this a limited edition or something?

Just the British version of Gi Joe I believe. However he was very popular toy in the 80's and most kids had at least one.

Denerick

southsiderosie wrote: »

The pictures are distasteful, and the adults involved clearly have no sense.

From the community workers I talked to in Republican areas of Belfast, there seems to be a great deal of concern about young people today being unduly starry-eyed about the misadventures of the Provos. These kids hear from older family members about the protests, community resistance, and transformative prison experiences of their elders, and then they look at their own lives which seem to pale in comparison. It's a sad commentary on the state of NI today that so many young people, particularly in disadvantaged communities see that time period as something exciting and maybe even fun, rather than a horror show, and any museum exhibit that lets these kids play 'Provo dress-up' only feeds into that.

Amen brotha'. Nationalism is a silly secular religion anyway; all this obsession with struggle, uniform, and the epic strivings of entire peoples.... seriously, its quite camp and stupid. And worse again it attracts only the most naive and violent prone youngsters into its fold. Not a good indicator of what we can expect over the next 20 years.

KeithAFC

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

And the difference is?

Yet again, one rule for you, one rule for them.

Check the thread title. Kids and guns in South Armagh.

OhNoYouDidn't

karma_ wrote: »

Just the British version of Gi Joe I believe. However he was very popular toy in the 80's and most kids had at least one.

And guess what, no-one felt the need to start internet threads about it and most of us at least didn't grow up as psychopaths. Like these kids won't.

OhNoYouDidn't

KeithAFC wrote: »

Check the thread title. Kids and guns in South Armagh.

Kids and TOY guns in South Armagh.

Iwasfrozen

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Not if you are from South Armagh its not.

Kids playing with guns is either right or wrong. Yet again, we have the unionist heirarchy of victimhood. How DARE Republicans, in private, respect their military tradition. Only we are allowed do that, in PUBLIC, with marches and dressing kids up in YCV trappings.

Yes it is, for everyone.

There's nothing wrong with nationalists expressing their culture but dressing their kids in IRA uniforms is a kin to a German dressing their kid up as a Strom trooper. Respect of military tradition, especially a military tradition composed of killing, torturing, and mutilating innocent people has no place in modern Ireland. North or south.

Having said that there's nothing wrong with kids playing with toy guns and Action Men, hell I did it myself.

danbohan

KeithAFC wrote: »

As a passive joke to just how silly it is to allow those kids to put those uniforms on. I would not like to see young loyalist kids wearing the UVF uniform. I'd like to think we have more dignity and we know our identity to not have to do that.

I'd like to think we have more dignity and we know our identity to not have to do that.

great news , does that mean you wont be wearing those silly orange ribbons and trying to march through nationalists areas playing anti catholic music , seen that you now are so in tune with your identity , anybody that remembers trimble and paisleys little jig up the garvaghy road will know that orange /loyalist/unionist and dignity are strange bedfellows

karma_

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

And guess what, no-one felt the need to start internet threads about it and most of us at least didn't grow up as psychopaths. Like these kids won't.

Here, I'm just defending my old pal AM!

KeithAFC

danbohan wrote: »

I'd like to think we have more dignity and we know our identity to not have to do that.

great news , does that mean you wont be wearing those silly orange ribbons and trying to march through nationalists areas playing anti catholic music , seen that you now are so in tune with your identity , anybody that remembers trimble and paisleys little jig up the garvaghy road will know that orange /loyalist/unionist and dignity are strange bedfellows

What nationalist areas? Don't say ardoyne. Already been debunked.

KeithAFC

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

And guess what, no-one felt the need to start internet threads about it and most of us at least didn't grow up as psychopaths. Like these kids won't.

How do you know that? They have basically been told about the IRA in glorified terms. That is dangerous.

OhNoYouDidn't

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Yes it is, for everyone.

There's nothing wrong with nationalists expressing their culture but dressing their kids in IRA uniforms is a kin to a German dressing their kid up as a Strom trooper. Respect of military tradition, especially a military tradition composed of killing, torturing, and mutilating innocent people has no place in modern Ireland. North or south.

Having said that there's nothing wrong with kids playing with toy guns and Action Men, hell I did it myself.

We are sailing very close to Godwin...

As for the bold, ALL military traditions have that ffs.

People dress their kids in daft things all the time, and to repeat, I think the whole incident is stupid. However, I must have missed the thread were people condemned loyalists parading with kids in uniform, or the now completely perverse and pervasive poppy cult were condemned.

The actual issue here is a suspected murderer of innocent people trying to get the cops involved because a few kids were playing with replica guns at a museum and put on old 'Ra type uniforms. Its really not that big a deal.

What is the actual issue here? The replica guns, the clothes or the fact that Republicans still commerate their past?

karma_

KeithAFC wrote: »

What nationalist areas? Don't say ardoyne. Already been debunked.

Let's start with Dunloy, have fun debunking.

sanbrafyffe

wish that willie frazer would just pxxx off.he is his own worst enemy.unfortunately SOUTH ARMAGH was the deadliest brigade of all the paramilatries in the trouble years.its very hard to stop their kids from acting in this behaviour.ah it might fizzle in time hopefully.if willie wasnt there they might not be as bad cause he an arxx hoxx.

dlofnep

I suppose they could dress up as worse..

OhNoYouDidn't

KeithAFC wrote: »

How do you know that? They have basically been told about the IRA in glorified terms. That is dangerous.

But of course you personally glorifying the loyalists and British army on here isn't?

Yet again, themmuns are wrong and have to change.

Spare us.

wilson10

LordSutch wrote: »

Thanks for posting that junder, truly appalling that adults can alow children to dress up like that, but I'm sorry to say that many of the posters here would be IRA/ Republican supporters anyway, so don't expect too much shock & disgust. You will probably get about 90% of posters agreeing with the Ti Chulainn stance.

How right you were.

We will never move on in this country, we'll always have these throwbacks to stoneage man, and the very photos we're talking about are the proof, yet another generation being indoctrinated.