Emigration over-hyped?

nickobrien1985

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0312/1224291980040.html?via=mr


I believe emigration is over-hyped.
Its not like the 80s where all leaving were Irish.
60,000 on average leave per annum, 40,000 are foreign nationals.
Irish people have always done their year in Oz, NZ or Canada.
We're just not getting the foreigners coming to our country anymore.

Only 3,000 more Irish went to oz in 2009 than in 2006.

alan85

It's true to say emigration isn't what it was. I'd say it's more than a 1000 a week if figures are to be believed. 1000 is net. But if you look at immigration for '09 it was 30k(quoted from Independent on breakdown of sexes coming in). So 60k + 30k is 90k out. 30k is probably a conservative figure as I'd imagine more came here in '09 than '10. So I think it's probably more like 1500 out if I'm right. Maybe somebody else has better figures.

I suppose main problem is that a lot of those emigrants want to come back. Say sick family... Welfare implications... No jobs here... Air fares home as some are so far away. It's not nice.

Denerick

Most of the emigrants are young graduates like myself and foreign nationals returning home. I really wish we'd stop this miniature violin stuff. Most of the people I know who have emigrated are having a wonderful time. (Barbecues in February cannot be a bad thing - and on a beach at 30 degrees) I'm thinking of packing in my job to join them. I work for low wages and am bouncing along week to week in little old Ireland, earnestly but boringly tucking money away.

Who's the real mug here?

Tefral

As a QS, most of the people i know my age that were in construction that graduated the same year as me arent working in Ireland anymore... All in OZ,Canada, or England.

A friend of mine who is a construction manager who is now in oz said to me : "man you should definitely come over, youd fall out of bed into a job here"

Permabear

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Red Hand

Permabear wrote: »

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How did you start out, Permabear? Like, did you have a degree and money to get you started? How did you get a visa?

(Don't have to answer such personal questions by the way...I'm merely curious. Have been thinking about moving somewhere else for a bit myself.)

Bog

He said migration is now a fact of life for different generations, including retirees living in the south of Spain and young people who form relationships with people from different countries.

“There has been a huge growth in so-called love miles, people following their girlfriend or boyfriend and living in their country,” he said.

He said emigration should not be treated as an “unmitigated disaster” but effort should be put in to encouraging educated people to return with skills later.

This is true. Emigration is no longer the tearful hanky-waving at the portside, only to expect an annual christmas card for the next twenty years. The world has shrunk and people are intermingling, creating lives, families and futures which are not solely based on the possibility of finding a job somewhere. From my own experience, the decision to emigrate had nothing to do with the economy but rather the chance to develop a relationship. The world has changed since the fifities and even the eighties.

Permabear

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Byron85

Permabear wrote: »

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Interestingly enough, i'm going to be chancing my arm with that at the end of this year when it re-opens. I'm also going to be throwing around post grad applications all over the place (hopefully), mainly to the U.S and England. It's going to be an interesting year or so.

Valmont

Denerick wrote: »

Most of the emigrants are young graduates like myself and foreign nationals returning home. I really wish we'd stop this miniature violin stuff. Most of the people I know who have emigrated are having a wonderful time.

Pah. The very fact that many of us would have liked to carry on living with our familiies and friends isn't exactly extinguished by the fact that we might be having fun in our new adopted homes. I'm only in the UK and having a great time (I've actually migrated off the minimum wage for the first time in my life!) but I do resent the fact very much that I can't really go home to visit my family very often, not to mention the dog I left behind in their stead.

Simply, if I could have stayed in Ireland and found a relatively decent graduate-type job, and attended a decent university for an Msc, I would have.

Mozart1986

Valmont wrote: »

Pah. The very fact that many of us would have liked to carry on living with our familiies and friends isn't exactly extinguished by the fact that we might be having fun in our new adopted homes. I'm only in the UK and having a great time (I've actually migrated off the minimum wage for the first time in my life!) but I do resent the fact very much that I can't really go home to visit my family very often, not to mention the dog I left behind in their stead.

Simply, if I could have stayed in Ireland and found a relatively decent graduate-type job, and attended a decent university for an Msc, I would have.

Yes, thats true and I'm genuinely sorry to hear that, but the levels of emigration are not the same as the 80s and we now have so many channels of communication so people are not completely dislodged from their relationships at home.

Graduates would have done the year abroad regardless, they always did, some never came back but for a holiday. A person with a family who is forced to emigrate is a terrible thing, but the numbers don't stack up for it to be used as a political football the way it is by RTE.

Wait for the real mortgage crisis though, when all of the young couples in negative equity and behind not only on capital payments, but on the interest, start to board up the windows and tip on.

djpbarry

Valmont wrote: »

Simply, if I could have stayed in Ireland and found a relatively decent graduate-type job, and attended a decent university for an Msc, I would have.

Chances are though, if you want to get ahead in a specific field, you're going to have to leave Ireland at some point, regardless of the prevailing economic circumstances. It's just too small an economy to accommodate every budding career.

ei.sdraob

djpbarry wrote: »

Chances are though, if you want to get ahead in a specific field, you're going to have to leave Ireland at some point, regardless of the prevailing economic circumstances. It's just too small an economy to accommodate every budding career.

We are part of the worlds largest economic zone with freedom of movement

Now if only more people bothered to learn another european language,
or if the schools stopped wasting time on compulsory Irish and Religion...

nickobrien1985

ei.sdraob wrote: »

We are part of the worlds largest economic zone with freedom of movement

Now if only more people bothered to learn another european language,
or if the schools stopped wasting time on compulsory Irish and Religion...

On the ball with that compulsory Irish and Religion point

pragmatic1

Really. Out of my group of about 15 friends, only five are left in the country.

Kivaro

Permabear wrote: »

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I concur.
The opportunities are tremendous over here for those who really want it. The States is a huge country with diverse opportunities. Just because the employment rate is 8.9% nationwide, does not mean that it's that rate everywhere (e.g. 4.9% where I live).

Jeremiah 16:1 wrote:

How did you start out, Permabear? Like, did you have a degree and money to get you started? How did you get a visa?

Just to highlight my experiences: like Permabear, I 'won' a lottery visa (which was very easy), and earned my degree over here. Working hard and showing initiative now allows me to take as many vacation as I want and live a very high standard of living. One of the biggest mistakes in my life was moving back to Ireland during the Celtic Tiger years .... I found the country to be a miserable place with false notions about itself (but that's just my opinion). Returning back to the States a few years later gave me back my freedoms ............ e.g. Freedom not to worry about the weather, freedom not to worry about scumbags, freedom of not seeing my tax money wasted on an over-generous welfare system, freedom of having a great quality of life without paying through the nose for it etc.

It's early March and I'm in flip-flops and shorts, so maybe that has something to do with my outlook.

cavedave

pragmatic1

Really. Out of my group of about 15 friends, only five are left in the country.

One third of young people leaving a country in a 3 year period is huge.

alan85

I'd say it's more than a 1000 a week if figures are to be believed

A thousand a week is huge. There are about 60,000 Irish people of any age. so what 1000 a week amounts to is nearly every 18 year old emigrating each year. Of course it is spread over more than one years worth of people. But over a few years a level of emigration that is roughly equal to the number of leaving cert students each year is a big deal

Anonymous1987

If you read the IT article you would see that CSO figures indicate 27,700 Irish people emigrated in the year end to April 2010 working out at about 533 per week.

nickobrien1985

cavedave wrote: »

One third of young people leaving a country in a 3 year period is huge.



A thousand a week is huge. There are about 60,000 Irish people of any age. so what 1000 a week amounts to is nearly every 18 year old emigrating each year. Of course it is spread over more than one years worth of people. But over a few years a level of emigration that is roughly equal to the number of leaving cert students each year is a big deal

Emm, the figure is 20,000 Irish, 40,000 foreign.
Plus, we all know a lot, and I mean a lot of Irish friends who went to Oz, Nz, UK, Dubai, wherever during the good times.

cavedave

nickobrien1985

Emm, the figure is 20,000 Irish, 40,000 foreign.
Plus, we all know a lot, and I mean a lot of Irish friends who went to Oz, Nz, UK, Dubai, wherever during the good times.

The foreigners who came here in general worked paid taxes and contributed to Irish society. I reject the idea that them leaving is an entirely neutral and not a bad thing.

Irish people have always left. Ireland is not big enough to have all the industries and facilities needed to occupy everyone born here.

The issue being discussed is whether this wave of extra emigration is overhyped? I don't think so. My friends and family members who have left break down roughly evenly in the people who wanted to see the world and could have gotten good jobs here and those that had no prospect of good jobs here. Most of those builders I know who have emigrated are not coming back. There won't be much building here for 15-20 years at which point they will be in their forties married and with kids in school.

Dannyboy83

nickobrien1985 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0312/1224291980040.html?via=mr

Only 3,000 more Irish went to oz in 2009 than in 2006.

More than 11,000 Irish people went Down Under on working holidays last year.

That represents an increase of 30% on figures for the previous year.


Read more: http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/number-going-down-under-to-work-rises-30-in-a-year-497078.html#ixzz1GUqLZrpY

djpbarry

ei.sdraob wrote: »

We are part of the worlds largest economic zone with freedom of movement

Yes, but Ireland in and of itself is a relatively small economy - doesn't matter how good things are there at any point in time, people will still be emigrating to see more of the world, get better jobs, etc.

dan_d

I'm all for people travelling, and I know there have been a lot of people going on working holidays......but I suppose what's different now is there are a number of families going...kids and all..because they have to.
There's no doubt that emigration will always be there in this country - but the current circumstance of "having" to go as opposed to "wanting" to go is a problem. Especially since it's actually been built into Government economic policy - which is very wrong.

nickobrien1985

dan_d wrote: »

I'm all for people travelling, and I know there have been a lot of people going on working holidays......but I suppose what's different now is there are a number of families going...kids and all..because they have to.
There's no doubt that emigration will always be there in this country - but the current circumstance of "having" to go as opposed to "wanting" to go is a problem. Especially since it's actually been built into Government economic policy - which is very wrong.

Evidence please

djpbarry

dan_d wrote: »

I'm all for people travelling, and I know there have been a lot of people going on working holidays......but I suppose what's different now is there are a number of families going...kids and all..because they have to.

I would be very surprised if that were the case.

wow sierra

The high levels of youth unemployment today is a real tragedy but yes I think the emigration story is being overhyped. Lots of the young people who are going would have gone anyway even back in 2005/06. Many are leaving jobs to go. On the other hand I am sure there are very many of them who hate having to go. But even for them - the emigration experiecne isnt as bad as it was in any other generation - with internet and skype etc for keeping in touch.
If they can have a good standard of living abroad then its not such a tragedy.
One of the Television reports that really appealed to me was the one showing the girls working holding the Stop-Go signs for the builders in OZ. Being paid to watch guys work, as they said themselves:).If I was twenty years younger I would be very tempted.

It sure beats working harder for a lot less pay to pay my mortgage, petrol costs etc and being constantly being made to feel guilty for still having a job.

PatrickD32

I dont think so, about 30/35 of my friends are now wither in Germany, Canada, NZ or OZ.

In sayign that i plan to

Rabble Rabble

Emigration is not what is was, psychologically, because

1) Most of Europe is less than 2-3 hours away. Flying is cheap.
2) The internet.
3) Mobile phones.

A few weeks ago a letter to the Irish Times from the patriarch of a Mayo family discussed how his family was reliving past emigration, as their daughter had left for the UK. But she probably would have left for Dublin during the boom.

The time taken from Mayo to Dublin is longer than the time from London, or Bristol. Knock, Shannon, Cork and Dublin have frequent flights to England, and other European destinations. She'll be back next week, in other words.

Most of those builders I know who have emigrated are not coming back. There won't be much building here for 15-20 years at which point they will be in their forties married and with kids in school.

Plenty of Irish people who marry Irish people come back specifically when they have children, as they prefer Irish schools.

Rabble Rabble

There is a massive schizophrenia in the liberal Irish attitude to immigration and emigration. Emigration is seen as an absolute evil, immigration as a moral good. But every emigrant is an immigrant, and every immigrant an emigrant.

In any case I think Ireland's emigration is going to be more or less like Australias from now on, people leave when young, some - but not most - stay. Most come home.

Byron85

Rabble Rabble wrote: »

There is a massive schizophrenia in the liberal Irish attitude to immigration and emigration. Emigration is seen as an absolute evil, immigration as a moral good. But every emigrant is an immigrant, and every immigrant an emigrant.

In any case I think Ireland's emigration is going to be more or less like Australias from now on, people leave when young, some - but not most - stay. Most come home.

Have a read of this:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2010/1012/1224280878033.html

I'm in the same university as that person and in that article, she epitomises the "Celtic Tiger Cub" generation; expectations of everything and an imagination worth nothing. She's going to be finishing university with a law degree but that's "worthless" in her eyes and she'll be "forced to emigrate". People have left the country in years gone by with far less to their names and to be honest, i'm just glad to be getting a third level education. Simply put, those that had what they wanted, expect more of the same.

Nolanger

What's to blame is this 'education for all' that was introduced here during the Celtic Tiger. People now expect a job from their useless degree. Looking for opportunities abroad instead of creating ones here for themselves. There are enough jellyfish in Australia already without sending our spineless Irish out there!

Wolfe Tone

Its terrible when people are forced to leave their home country out of economic necessity.

Fo Real

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

Its terrible when people are forced to leave their home country out of economic necessity.

Ok fair point. But we have already established that a significant proportion of our young people are emigrating for the sake of fun and adventure. In 2006 at the height if the Celtic Tiger, 15,300 Irish people emigrated. Surely this can't be attributed to "economic neccessity". I'd encourage recent graduates to travel and broaden their worldview. Anything to escape this gombeen-ridden backwater. (However, change is in the air. Nice to see Enda cut TD's wages and scrap the ministerial mercs).

BTW, an Arts degree will always be useless, even in the midst of an economic boom. So don't go blaming "the recession" as a scapegoat for poor decision making at college.

FTA69

People are emigrating because there is a profound lack of opportunity for young people in Ireland and therefore a massive youth unemployment rate. The fact the destination of choice is now sunny Australia as opposed to London or New York doesn't change the fact that people are leaving for the same reasons they always did - lack of jobs.

Similarly I don't understand the "sure they're having a laugh out in Oz" line either, people had fun and adventure back in the 1980s and 1990s as well, for the simple fact that it was better craic to be employed in a booming, cosmopolitan city like London than scratching your arse in a sh*thole like Cork. I fail to see how a young man leaving to work in construction in London in 1986 is remembered as a social tragedy while someone leaving to work in construction in Sydney nowadays is seen as an entirely different thing. Also, the full scale of emigration remains to be seen, I train with one fella in his mid-30s who has moved to Australia to work and send home money to his wife and two small children, I'm sure there'll be others in the same boat soon enough.

Is emigration a tragedy? For those involved it means new opportunities and a better standard of living, for the state itself I can't see how young people pouring out of the country is a sign of a healthy state of affairs.

pragmatic1

Nolanger wrote: »

What's to blame is this 'education for all' that was introduced here during the Celtic Tiger. People now expect a job from their useless degree. Looking for opportunities abroad instead of creating ones here for themselves. There are enough jellyfish in Australia already without sending our spineless Irish out there!

Yeah education is a negative thing. People should just stay at home a be farmers.

dan_d

nickobrien1985 wrote: »

Evidence please

My only evidence is the hundreds of stories that I've heard, and also knowing a LOT of people who have either left with their families, or where one parent is living abroad and sending money home to their family, seeing them only every few months. These aren't just direct friends btw, these are families and friends of friends, and of my OH's and my own families co-workers. In other words, they spread across quite a large demographic. I could tell all the stories here, but we haven't got all day.

What's right about that??

I'm all for travelling.I've travelled (with and without my parents) from a very early age, and given that I was born in the early 80's, when most people didn't have the money to fly anywhere, that's saying something. (and no, we're not hugely wealthy). But there is a drastic difference between your average early 20-something year old going off to find themselves in Australia and Asia for a year, and on the other hand, going because to find themselves - and because it's the only way they'll get a job. There's a huge difference between that early 20-something, and those who are older, who've always been employed, suddenly finding themselves with nothing and no options other than to leave. And there's a gaping hole of a difference between that 20-something and 2 people with a young family finding they have to leave to keep a roof over their children's heads, or worse, that one parent has to leave in order to do it.

I'm not playing a small violin here. And possibly, to some extent, emigration has been over-hyped. But it doesn't change the fact that firstly, a large number of our young people are leaving for good. Yes, they left during the Celtic Tiger years - but the majority came back. Now they aren't. That's the difference. It also doesn't change the fact that a portion of the population who would have always worked here, had kids here and considered themselves to be permanently here are also having to leave, whether they want to or not.The choice is no longer there for many people.....and when you find yourself in a position where you have no other option, it's easy to find you resent everything that got you into that position.

So yeah - it's really easy to say "ah sure, it's great in other countries, sunshine, beaches, blah, blah, blah". It is. But it loses a lot of it's shine when you HAVE to go and stay there, as opposed to wanting to go for a year to travel, and then come home at the end. That suits a lot of people, but equally there are many more who'd like to be able to live in their home country, and now find they can't. And what it all boils down to is that they are leaving because there are no jobs. It doesn't change that fact.

Biggins

nickobrien1985 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0312/1224291980040.html?via=mr


I believe emigration is over-hyped.
Its not like the 80s where all leaving were Irish.
60,000 on average leave per annum, 40,000 are foreign nationals.
Irish people have always done their year in Oz, NZ or Canada.
We're just not getting the foreigners coming to our country anymore.

Only 3,000 more Irish went to oz in 2009 than in 2006.

I haven't read all the previous posts. I will just add this thought.

I was in Galway recently for a few days on business (as recored on my twitter and commented on at the time).
I stopped off in the city centre for a meal and pint at dinner time.
(Pub near the Citylink bus station)
When I got there and was waiting for meal, I got talking to two students from the college up the road.
Both were heading off after finishing their studies. They stated that nine out of ten of their class were doing the same within two months.
The girl serving the customers was busy training in another young girl - because she told me she was also heading off to Australia too, getting out.

A person that I was meeting turned up eventually and we chatted a bit. In the course of conversation she told me that she too was heading off soon.
For the whole time I spent in Galway, all I heard (and I asked discreetly many a time to see) was that "I am/we are leaving" from 95% on average of the youth there.
Now to be fair, I asked those NOT only going to third level colleges but to all youths.
It was the same story all around. Very sad to hear. Depressing.

Permabear

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sandmanporto

for the life of me i dont know why anybody would go to england!

Biggins

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

I, myself, don't know if thats a solution or not but maybe its a new big thread topic in itself.
As regards the original question about emigration, I don't think its over-hyped. Its sadly just the way things are at present.

Valmont

sandmanporto wrote: »

for the life of me i dont know why anybody would go to england!

Hmmm, let me see.

In Ireland I earned a good degree yet was stacking shelves in Woodies and still living with my parents 10 months after graduation.

In England, I've enrolled in a top 10 UK University which is costing me around 3000 euro less than it would in Dublin, I found a job during my first week here, although it was serving vodkas and cleaning puke until 3am on weekends, so I quit, found another job within four weeks with a legal agency who are now paying me seven pounds an hour and letting me pick my own hours.

This would not, cannot, and will not happen in Ireland for a long time. The UK is an excellent choice for anyone wallowing in the graduate slump that is Ireland.

Don't waste any time- leave as soon as you can.

kalihar

My husband is the other side of the world working away from me and our two chidren. We will be joining him in the summer but that means I'll be leaving my family and friends. My children miss him so much, so do I.

Skype is great but it doesn't come close to an actual physical presence, being able to hug my husband or see him play with our kids. My two year old thinks daddy is in the computer!

So no I don't think it is over hyped. I think it's quite painful.

delonglad

I don't think it is over-hyped I think it is misinterpreted.

I myself am an emigrant but I am not an unfortunate one, I landed a good job (along with over 100 Irish grads here at the minute) that I could never have got in Ireland without a few years experience. I'm only living an hour and a half away in The Netherlands but at times I have to say it is quite hard. Not being able to have your girlfriend beside you, not being able to go for a pint with the father or have a gossip with the mother, a session with the brothers or the lads. Some things that you take for granted and technology like skype or a mobile phone can't replace.

Now i'm only a short distance away and can get home once every couple of months if i'm not too busy in work but it pains me to think of the people forced to leave for far further shores leaving loved ones, sometimes wives/husband and children to make a few pound to send back to pay for the damage caused by the septic tiger. Sure there is skype and modern technology but thats whats wrong with the world today most of it lacks emotion.

On the other hand there are throngs of young people going to Oz and Canada for a year, its not for work or to further their career it is to party and have the craic. Its in a way the fashionable thing to do. Most of them have soft parents who fund such a trip.

As a previous poster mentioned about Europe being a wonderful opportunity for people, they hit the nail on the head. It is an open source to the people of Ireland but to some they think yuk them people speak a strange language. Why choose Oz or Canada when there are jobs only a short flight away??

So over-hyped no, there are alot of very sad and painful cases, the misinterpretation comes when you don't fizel out the thousands going on a year long holiday who claim to be forced to emigrate and its all societies fault when they have been on the scratcher during the boom times. Lets hope Enda sorts the country out somewhat and when I have the experience I need I can return.

munchkin_utd

delonglad wrote: »

<snip>As a previous poster mentioned about Europe being a wonderful opportunity for people, they hit the nail on the head. It is an open source to the people of Ireland but to some they think yuk them people speak a strange language. Why choose Oz or Canada when there are jobs only a short flight away??

It is wierd.

The german job office has 755,000 open job positions http://jobboerse.arbeitsagentur.de/vamJB/startseite.html?m=1&aa=1
Munich and some other metropolitan areas have barely 5% unemployment.

And people goto Australia or new zealand instead of looking for something closer?

Now, the lingo is a factor that cant be ignored.
But for anyone with skills and experience theres definitely a lot of opportunities closer to home than a €2000, 30hour+ flight to the far side of the world!!

amacachi

munchkin_utd wrote: »

It is wierd.

The german job office has 755,000 open job positions http://jobboerse.arbeitsagentur.de/vamJB/startseite.html?m=1&aa=1
Munich and some other metropolitan areas have barely 5% unemployment.

And people goto Australia or new zealand instead of looking for something closer?

Now, the lingo is a factor that cant be ignored.
But for anyone with skills and experience theres definitely a lot of opportunities closer to home than a €2000, 30hour+ flight to the far side of the world!!

I also found it surprising how when I was recently in Germany the only low-paid workers who didn't seem fluent in the language weren't European looking. I would have thought there'd be loads of Irish over to fill the vacancies, instead it's people with a bigger language barrier than we have.

Nolanger

There was a problem in Germany back in the '90s with the Irish getting kicked out of camp sites and being refused work. Munich was supposed to be full of our emigrants sleeping rough and homeless.

munchkin_utd

Nolanger wrote: »

There was a problem in Germany back in the '90s with the Irish getting kicked out of camp sites and being refused work. Munich was supposed to be full of our emigrants sleeping rough and homeless.

It was full of drunk students having the craic during the summers.
Some were booted out of the campsite for being too drunk and having too much craic!

The non students working in BMW, Allianz and Siemens and other major firms were certainly not homeless and destitute.

gurramok

My boss(obviosuly in well paid job) is emigrating with his family to Canada as the end of the month. Money is the motivation, rather than a 'change of scenery'.

A Polish woman in my office recently left with her Polish husband and child to go back to Poland. I think this is expected as most Poles are only here temporary with a minority settling in. Another Polish person in my office did leave in '09 after having saved up for a 70k apt in his native Polish town.

For myself, nearly emigrated to Holland in '00 due to lack of opportunity at the time of the early Celtic Tiger(yes, it wasn't all plain sailing then) but as i'm in my 30's with a job(for now), i'm staying with no intention of leaving even if I lose my job,

On the graduate front, there really is a mixed message as what's going on, the obvious emigrants are those with construction, business(maybe) and public sector(education/nursing) qualifications emigrating but outside of these areas is it really that hard to find a job? Are the recently qualified really emigrating outside of these areas? I do not know any recent graduates in real life but on threads on boards, some seem to find a job no problem(thank zod for MNC's ) and some don't.

Pepe LeFrits

One of my sisters moved to the UK with her family 18 months ago for work. She’s in her mid thirties and has two little boys. It’s taken much of the last 18 months for her to learn to accept being forced to uproot, at pretty much the least appropriate time in her life to do so. Skype and all is great for keeping in touch, but it doesn’t cure severe the homesickness, stress or trauma that comes with having your plans for your family turned upside down.

My other sister is emigrating next month too, but thankfully this comes as a relief for her and her family. Her husband had been on the verge of being let go for months and now that he has been, they finally can make some plans.

It’s harsh on my ma though, her 2 grandsons in the UK and 2 granddaughters further afield. My brother also emigrated years ago (personal reasons, though he's unemployed now and couldn't come home even if he wanted) and I’ll probably be off too once my current contract expires next month.

… so I don’t really consider the current emigration situation to be overhyped. This is all very anecdotal of course, but even so, 4 for 4 isn't really a positive indication.

nickobrien1985

Do some folk genuinely consider moving to the UK to be emigrating??

I can actually get to Oxford St in London quicker from my home in Clare via Shannon, than I can get from my gaff to Belfield via Bus Eireann.

There's probably more cultural differences for South Dubliners moving to Donegal or Wexford town than moving to London

cavedave

nickobrien1985

I believe emigration is over-hyped.

Is the question of over hyped about the numbers or the emotional distress or the fiscal distress to the governments tax inputs? The argument seems to be bouncing around between the three.

nickobrien1985 Do some folk genuinely consider moving to the UK to be emigrating??

For the governments tax income. That is used to pay for the nurses, teachers, pensions and much else yes moving to London really is emigrating.