Still happy you voted Fine Gael?

MaybeI

The Fine Gael/Labour coalition Government is to implement in detail the outgoing Government's four-year austerity plan as approved by the EU-IMF, the Sunday Independent can reveal.

In what will amount to the most barefaced breach of election promises ever perpetrated by an incoming Government, the coalition partners' programme for government will cause uproar when it is published today.

While an attempt will be made to dress up the programme as a new plan by a new Government, when it is analysed it will be seen for what it is -- the continuation of the economic policies of Fianna Fail and the Greens, virtually in minute detail, as laid down by the EU-IMF.

If anything, Fine Gael will be seen to have capitulated more as it is handing over responsibility for reform of the public sector to Labour, whose core support is drawn from the public sector.

The programme envisages no more than 22,000 voluntary redundancies in the public sector, a long way short of Fine Gael's election promise to reduce the numbers employed by 30,000.

Fine Gael is expected to defend this U-turn by stating that 2,500 voluntary redundancies have already taken place in the public sector since January 2010.

However, the Fine Gael decision to hand reform of the public sector to Labour will provoke fury among many Fine Gael TDs, and cause uproar among the huge numbers who voted for Fine Gael.

Furthermore, it reduces the Government's chances of re-negotiating the EU-IMF bailout since our public spending excess is seen as a chronic problem in Europe.

The new Government will place heavy emphasis on its intention to renegotiate the bailout plan, as imposed on the outgoing Government, but the possibility of such a renegotiation is at least two, maybe three years away.

The omens are not good in this regard as the incoming Taoiseach, Enda Kenny, has already prepared the ground to pull back from his demand for "haircuts" on senior bank debt, saying other ways must be found to cut the cost of Ireland's bank bailout if losses are not imposed on bondholders.

"There is no way we are going to survive as a country unless we successfully renegotiate the EU-IMF deal," a senior Fine Gael source, familiar with the negotiations to form a Government, told the Sunday Independent yesterday.

.....

MaybeI

"VOTE FOR CHANGE" :pac:

Gummy Panda

I voted Labour

Mark200

Yep, still happy.

Agricola

http://www.perkel.com/politics/lies.htm

COYW

No suprise really. I've said it before and Ill say it again. FG and Labour wont last 3 years in government. The level of dislike towards them will be on a par to that of FF within 12 months.

Manach

Labour "reforming" the public service, its core supporters - yeah right.

phasers

Well, at least FF can't claim the public supported anything they did...

Anyway, I voted for Kodos

biko

From After Hours
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056193469

Gummy Panda

phasers wrote: »

Well, at least FF can't claim the public supported anything they did...

Anyway, I voted for Kodos

Kang offers better reforms

caseyann

Now will Irish shout for a referendum.
Bahahahahahahahaha could smell their lies a mile off :rolleyes:

Monty Burnz

caseyann wrote: »

Now will Irish shout for a referendum.
Bahahahahahahahaha could smell their lies a mile off :rolleyes:

Which lies? FG said before the election that they would have to stick to the budget and spending targets Fianna Failure promised the IMF.

Please explain which lies you 'smelled'.

ilovesleep

I voted to get FF out, so I am very happy with the way I voted. Slightly disappointed that Labour didn't go into opposition though.

questionmark?

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Which lies? FG said before the election that they would have to stick to the budget and spending targets Fianna Failure promised the IMF.

Please explain which lies you 'smelled'.

Your dead right.

Also Enda Kenny said that everybody would have to share the pain.


Still happy I supported FG.

In regards to the public service and FG backing down. I'll think you'll find OP that FG dont have an overall majority and so have to enter coalition and compromises have to be meet.

whoopdedoo

Gummy Panda wrote: »

I voted Labour

us too!!

there better be riots over this nonsense or I'll be sick

caseyann

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Which lies? FG said before the election that they would have to stick to the budget and spending targets Fianna Failure promised the IMF.

Please explain which lies you 'smelled'.

The new Government will place heavy emphasis on its intention to renegotiate the bailout plan, as imposed on the outgoing Government, but the possibility of such a renegotiation is at least two, maybe three years away.

At the very moment the Irish people have performed the basic act of democracy, even pro-Europeans must feel it’s pretty galling to be told by an anonymous Brussels bureaucrat -

that the terms of the EU-IMF bailout “must be applied” whatever the will of Ireland’s people or regardless of any change of government. “It’s an agreement between the EU and the Republic of Ireland, it’s not an agreement between an institution and a particular government.



They will seriously try to renegotiate the bailout.

Total National Debt € 97.159.831.124

Debt per Household € 62,683

Debt per Person € 21,788

But then, what else do the Irish expect? Fine Gael actually helped Brian Cowen’s sinking government to put the Finance Bill to a vote in the Dail, supported some of its provisions and failed to stop the ones it opposed from passing. It is unrealistic in the extreme of Fine Gael to give the impression they will be able to change the terms of the expensive loan the EU and IMF put together.
There is excited talk of Kenny starting the process of renegotiating the previous government’s 85bn-euro (£72bn) EU/IMF loan package. It is something that has echoes of David Cameron’s pledge to renegotiate the repatriation of power from Brussels to Westminster and is likely to have the same outcome.


It is not even take it or leave it. It’s done. Ireland’s only role in this now is to implement the programme agreed with the EU, IMF and European Central Bank. Irish voters are not a party in this process, whatever they have been told,” said the diplomat.

It will become apparent to the Irish people in the weeks and months that despite the campaigning, the voting and the time consuming counting they have changed precisely nothing, they are not a party in this process. It has been nothing more than a very expensive piece of theatre.http://autonomousmind.wordpress.com/2011/02/27/fine-gaels-win-will-change-nothing-in-ireland/

For the figures its on fine gael site.

MaybeI

has the 5 point plan been tore up Enda? :pac:

I voted for Indo's, if I voted Fine Gael for change I would not be happy (my view).

Obviously there are a lot of casual voters who just voted for get rid of FF....

goose2005

It's the Sunday Independent just trolling again. Most of this "leak" is made up. They even forgot to add Michael Noonan to the cabinet.

Monty Burnz

caseyann wrote: »

The new Government will place heavy emphasis on its intention to renegotiate the bailout plan, as imposed on the outgoing Government, but the possibility of such a renegotiation is at least two, maybe three years away.

At the very moment the Irish people have performed the basic act of democracy, even pro-Europeans must feel it’s pretty galling to be told by an anonymous Brussels bureaucrat -

that the terms of the EU-IMF bailout “must be applied” whatever the will of Ireland’s people or regardless of any change of government. “It’s an agreement between the EU and the Republic of Ireland, it’s not an agreement between an institution and a particular government.

At the very moment the Irish people have performed the basic act of democracy, even pro-Europeans must feel it’s pretty galling to be told by an anonymous Brussels bureaucrat -

They will seriously try to renegotiate the bailout.

Total National Debt € 97.159.831.124

Debt per Household € 62,683

Debt per Person € 21,788

Caseyann, I ask you again, what lies did you smell?

And next time, please do not paste an unattributed quote from another source, we are not stupid.

dixiefly

caseyann wrote: »

The new Government will place heavy emphasis on its intention to renegotiate the bailout plan, as imposed on the outgoing Government, but the possibility of such a renegotiation is at least two, maybe three years away.

At the very moment the Irish people have performed the basic act of democracy, even pro-Europeans must feel it’s pretty galling to be told by an anonymous Brussels bureaucrat -

that the terms of the EU-IMF bailout “must be applied” whatever the will of Ireland’s people or regardless of any change of government. “It’s an agreement between the EU and the Republic of Ireland, it’s not an agreement between an institution and a particular government.



They will seriously try to renegotiate the bailout.

Total National Debt € 97.159.831.124

Debt per Household € 62,683

Debt per Person € 21,788

But then, what else do the Irish expect? Fine Gael actually helped Brian Cowen’s sinking government to put the Finance Bill to a vote in the Dail, supported some of its provisions and failed to stop the ones it opposed from passing. It is unrealistic in the extreme of Fine Gael to give the impression they will be able to change the terms of the expensive loan the EU and IMF put together.
There is excited talk of Kenny starting the process of renegotiating the previous government’s 85bn-euro (£72bn) EU/IMF loan package. It is something that has echoes of David Cameron’s pledge to renegotiate the repatriation of power from Brussels to Westminster and is likely to have the same outcome.


It is not even take it or leave it. It’s done. Ireland’s only role in this now is to implement the programme agreed with the EU, IMF and European Central Bank. Irish voters are not a party in this process, whatever they have been told,” said the diplomat.

It will become apparent to the Irish people in the weeks and months that despite the campaigning, the voting and the time consuming counting they have changed precisely nothing, they are not a party in this process. It has been nothing more than a very expensive piece of theatre.http://autonomousmind.wordpress.com/2011/02/27/fine-gaels-win-will-change-nothing-in-ireland/

For the figures its on fine gael site.

Are you deluded or something?

Were you not aware that this has been a country ruled by coalition governments for the last 25 or so years? It was always likely that the election would result in a coalition government and that compromises would be on the cards. It was never denied. In fact I know people that were planning to vote FG but decided to vote Labour at the end because they preferred a coalition. Myself, I voted FG in the hope that they would get a majority but realised that there was a v strong chance of a coalition.

The programme for government reflects the coalition and 2 partners being involved.

As Gerry Stenbridge said on the radio this morning, we should give them a chance instead of writing them off at this early stage.

caseyann

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Caseyann, I ask you again, what lies did you smell?

And next time, please do not paste an unattributed quote from another source, we are not stupid.

The renegotiation bull,which didnt take them long to start showing yellow on.:P

And i didnt try pass it as my own what ever i was looking for more of the tripe they spun to get the dumb to vote for.

dixiefly

MaybeI wrote: »

has the 5 point plan been tore up Enda? :pac:

I voted for Indo's, if I voted Fine Gael for change I would not be happy (my view).

Obviously there are a lot of casual voters who just voted for get rid of FF....

I voted FG and I am not unhappy so far. I will give them time.

Monty Burnz

caseyann wrote: »

The renegotiation bull,which didnt take them long to start showing yellow on.:P

And i didnt try pass it as my own what ever i was looking for more of the tripe they spun to get the dumb to vote for.

I'm sorry, but your post is phenomenally stupid. You are saying that - EVEN BEFORE A GOVERNMENT IS FORMED - the government is not going to try renegotiate the bailout terms?

MaybeI

Monty, did you vote Fine Gael to keep FF's policies? Out of interest.....

caseyann

Monty Burnz wrote: »

I'm sorry, but your post is phenomenally stupid. You are saying that - EVEN BEFORE A GOVERNMENT IS FORMED - the government is not going to try renegotiate the bailout terms?

I don't believe them for one minute and neither should anyone else.

Bar some tinkering around the edges nothing will change. Ireland’s voters will still be paying higher taxes and experiencing huge cuts in spending on public services. They voted for change but will not see any, because when all is said and done the government of Ireland is cannot be found in the Dail, it resides in Brussels. No one was able to vote for or against it.

Those making the decisions for Ireland have not appeared on any ballot paper. Ireland is not mistress in her own house. The democratic process engaged in by 70% of those eligible to vote is meaningless, a charade, an illusion. How can Ireland’s government be on a collision course with the EU, when the EU is Ireland’s government? It is already making this clear:

Agree so much with this taken from
http://autonomousmind.wordpress.com/2011/02/27/fine-gaels-win-will-change-nothing-in-ireland/

so Monty doesnt accuse me of trying to pass off as my own.


But neither the two European leaders nor the European Central Bank or EU will permit any substantial changes, despite the huge popular Irish revolt against the bailout.
Chancellor Merkel will tell Mr Kenny that if he wants to reduce the high, punitive 5.8 per cent interest rate charged on EU loans then Ireland will have to give up its low corporate tax rates - a measure regarded as vital to Ireland's recovery and one of the few economic policies it has not yet handed over to Brussels or Frankfurt.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/ireland/8349497/Irelands-new-government-on-a-collision-course-with-EU.html

simonj

As I said in an earlier posting about Labour going into coalition with FG it is no surprise to me that FG should continue FF policies, they and FF being two cheeks of the same arse.

With 20 seats and little in the way of policy or moral difference, it could be quite possible for FG to do a deal with FF, a reciprocal Tallaght accord if you will.

Even if I could have voted (despite taking an active role in my community and paying taxes seafarers are disenfranchised) I doubt my #1 would have gone to FG, but as with dixiefly, I wish them well, and we will just have to wait and see what happens.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

MaybeI

i think the casual voters thought they were voting for change imho.

Liam Byrne

A bit less happy but the main aim was achieved - getting the most corrupt and incompetent shower out.

Had an inkling that the damage FF did was too huge, and I also posted a while back about how it seemed we were all being manipulated.

simonj

Well, according to what economists tell us, yes, had the greens and FF enforced banking legislation and taken advice that the housing bubble was not going to go on forever.
We are bailing out speculators and gamblers who were enabled by corruption, cronyism and gombeen politics, sadly - that looks set to continue.

Avé! Duci novo, similis duci seneci!

Monty Burnz

MaybeI wrote: »

Monty, did you vote Fine Gael to keep FF's policies? Out of interest.....

I didn't vote for FG.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Monty Burnz

MaybeI wrote: »

i think the casual voters thought they were voting for change imho.

They got change. The corrupt morons who helped the Irish people walk themselves into disaster are out of government. We are still stuck with the stupid electorate who gave them power in the first place.

Monty Burnz

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

I think you are expecting too much subtlety and understanding from some posters there...:(

yoshytoshy

Sweet jesus ,brian cowen is still taoiseach.

How could anyone criticise fine gael yet

Joey the lips

The sunday independent..... Yeah right the paper that said Gerry Adams would flunk flat out.....

I would like to wait and get my information from real sources Tony...

Monty Burnz

yoshytoshy wrote: »

Sweet jesus ,brian cowen is still taoiseach.

How could anyone criticise fine gael yet

Fine Gael & Labour - remember that the Irish electorate voted for a cocktail, and that's what they are getting.

Pete_Cavan

The Fine Gael/Labour coalition Government is to implement in detail the outgoing Government's four-year austerity plan as approved by the EU-IMF, the Sunday Independent can reveal.

In what will amount to the most barefaced breach of election promises ever perpetrated by an incoming Government, the coalition partners' programme for government will cause uproar when it is published today.

More propaganda from this FF-apologist rag. How anyone can still buy the Indo is beyond me, the level of bias is sickening. In a few months time they will be telling us how Brian Lenihan had almost sorted out the banking system only for Noonan and FG to come along and ruin all of Lennys hard work!

Of course it doesnt matter to the Indo that the incoming Government did not make any election promises, yet it still talks of "the most barefaced breach of election promises ever perpetrated" - the irony of a pro-FF paper saying this is beyond funny. Two parties ran separate election campaigns based on different policies. The people of this country decided we did not want one party or the other, we wanted a combination of both and therefore the programme for government will be made up of compromises between the two parties policies.

I am still happy I voted for FG, however I am disappointed more people didnt do likewise because now we are beginning to see the watered-down, meet half way and achieve nothing policies this ill-conceived coalition will give us.

ilovesleep

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

WHAT?
Are people out there believing that a new government would continue to roll with the good times of the Septic Tiger? That tiger has stopped meowing and is very much dead.

Monty Burnz

ilovesleep wrote: »

WHAT?
Are people out there believing that a new government would continue to roll with the good times of the Septic Tiger? That tiger has stopped meowing and is very much dead.

Yeah, that's exactly what Permabear is saying. There are some bizarre posts on this thread, I have to say. Do they still teach reading comprehension in Irish schools?

zootroid

I didn't vote, but would have voted FG

They haven't even taken office, and people are giving out about them. Ridiculous.

How about giving them a chance? Say, for example, 2 years? (Which wouldn't even take them half way through their term of office)

femur61

22,000 reduncies in PS is OK, better than nothing and reduce debt by 2015 OK. I would prefered in FG won in reality they received more than twice as many votes as Labour so they got a higher mandate from the people. Labour in cahrge of PS reform can't see that working. Labour = Unions = inept PS.

MaybeI

Another interesting article here;

Sunday March 06 2011
WAGS in Leinster House were at their cynical worst on Friday. "The deal has been stitched up for days," volunteered one senator.

"Big Phil Hogan, Pat Rabbitte, Michael Noonan and Brendan Howlin have been playing bridge for three nights in a row to relieve the boredom," responded an Independent TD.

Of course the negotiators felt compelled to paint a fraught atmosphere at the ultra-smooth Fine Gael/ Labour talks. Word kept leaking about the "difficulties". The tangible harmony inside the Sycamore Room in Government Buildings could cause unease among party foot soldiers. The faithful, watching from the sidelines, expected skin and hair to be flying by now as the two teams traded long treasured principles.

....

Source: http://www.independent.ie/national-news/elections/

[MOD]Please respect people's copyright. Post part of the article and a link, not the whole thing unattributed.[/MOD]

Pete_Cavan

MaybeI wrote: »

Another interesting article here;

Great, more "try to drag everyone else down to our level" articles from the Indo. If you are going to keep posting these articles you really should rename the thread the "FF sympathiser thread".

caseyann

zootroid wrote: »

I didn't vote, but would have voted FG

They haven't even taken office, and people are giving out about them. Ridiculous.

How about giving them a chance? Say, for example, 2 years? (Which wouldn't even take them half way through their term of office)

How about not giving them a chance and backing them up against a wall and breathing down their necks.Instead of sitting back like the majority of the country did already twiddling their thumbs until the country got to here.
Give them no room to breathe,no space no benefit of the doubt,they have to earn that and they havent so therefore i wont be trusting them till they prove it.If they do prove it.

yoshytoshy

caseyann wrote: »

How about not giving them a chance and backing them up against a wall and breathing down their necks.Instead of sitting back like the majority of the country did already twiddling their thumbs until the country got to here.

The country hasn't twiddle it's thumbs in recent years ,fianna fail has. The majority of us were working hard ,paying taxes.

Iwasfrozen

yoshytoshy wrote: »

The country hasn't twiddle it's thumbs in recent years ,fianna fail has. The majority of us were working hard ,paying taxes.

Hey Fianna Fail weren't sitting around twiddling their thumbs either. It's no easy job turning europes economic success story into a basketcase you know.

caseyann

yoshytoshy wrote: »

The country hasn't twiddle it's thumbs in recent years ,fianna fail has. The majority of us were working hard ,paying taxes.

The voters who had to have seen it coming and voted them back in again i am talking about and sat back on their lollies continuing to make excuses and bury heads in the sand.Did you vote them back in on previous election? Then yes its your fault.If you didnt then no not your fault.
The writing was on the wall and i,one of the people who wouldnt understand all the banking and economic details could see it coming the minute the euro came in as did alot of my family and friends.

johngalway

Yes, I'm happy.

• Anyone thinking FG had a magic wand was an idiot.
• It was highly unlikely FG would get an overall majority so compromises would be made in a coalition.
• FF/PD/Green/Ind had wrecked the country leaving a long hard road to be traveled.

Only those people not operating in reality thought otherwise. (ie the shinners :P ).

xoxyx

whoopdedoo wrote: »

there better be riots over this nonsense or I'll be sick

<Shocking front page news incites mixed emotions from the general public.>

Honestly, what did you think was going to happen??

gandalf

What did you expect, it is a coalition of course there were going to be compromises, on the whole I am happy they have sorted it out this weekend and we will have a working government who actually have a mandate in place from Wednesday onwards.

FG told us before this election we were in for real pain and after seeing Pat Rabbittes face the other day after the negotiators were briefed by the Dept of Finance it is obvious that they did not get the full picture from the outgoing gangsters. I expect what they will have to do is going to be far more severe than they are hoping to get away with. The only reservation I would have is Labour being in charge of PS reform.