CCC and Luttreslestown

Number_5

Hi folks,

With the recent announcment that CCC and Luttreslestown will strategically work together when allocating spots I am looking to get more information on this. I understand that Luttrelstown school will serve the greater "luttrelstown area" while CCC will serve Castleknock - hence enforcing a stricter catchment area going forward. Does anybody have some info on how they would define these regions? For example, some would say that CCC itself is in the luttlestown area. So if a child was to live in Burnell Park, Bramley Ave for example would they automatically be assigned to Luttrelstown? The reason I ask is that I am currently living abroad but will most likely be moving home in the next year so that my son can start school in Ireland. We quite like the idea of living in that area but just want to make sure we understand the situation re schools. We do not want to send him to the Castleknock private school.

Also, does anybody have any feedback on these two schools (CCC and Luttreslestown) in terms of reputation - quality of teachers, sports facilities, culture etc. I believe that 75% of education is at home but school is important also.

Thanks,
Cathal

Justask

Hello Number 5.
Unfortualty the days of you choosing a school in this area are gone... its more of a case of what you can find and waiting to see if you are accepted.
CCC is a very very big school and places are very limited. unless your son has a sibling in the school or attends the feeder school i think you will have great trouble getting him into that school.

As for luttrelstown, they are in prefabs at the moment and places are very limted also. I am aware that the places have been filled.

There are other schools in the area.
This is a problem in this area and has been for a long time with secondary school

I hope you can find a place for you son in the area.

Diddler1977

Both of these schools have a good reputation. Luttrelstown has not been in existance for very long.

Castleknock has in the past few years produced some students who achieved very high LC results.

Number_5

thanks for feedback folks. i suppose i should have mentioned that he still has to go through primary school! We'll be sending him to either Patricks or Brigids in Castleknock starting next year. I know it might sound like early planning but in the background we will be buying a house and want to sure we as many bases covered as possible. Our aim is to live close to quality schools (primary and secondary) such that he will benefit from friendship continuity right through from 5 to 18.

Justask

Number_5 wrote: »

thanks for feedback folks. i suppose i should have mentioned that he still has to go through primary school! We'll be sending him to either Patricks or Brigids in Castleknock starting next year. I know it might sound like early planning but in the background we will be buying a house and want to sure we as many bases covered as possible. Our aim is to live close to quality schools (primary and secondary) such that he will benefit from friendship continuity right through from 5 to 18.

Sorry i totally misunderstood you I thought he was going into secondary school next year...:) Fair play to you for planing ahead.

I would strongly recommend Castleknock educate together, This is from my experiance a fantastic school.

Lutrellstown is a grea:)t school it at the moment only has first and second year. The teachers are fab, Headmistres great very very firm but I think you have to be with kids that age.
They are soon going to be building a new school for them that will be ready in a couple of years. But IMO its more to do with the teachers and student then the building
Wishing you the best of luck with you move

Diddler1977

Number_5 wrote: »

thanks for feedback folks. i suppose i should have mentioned that he still has to go through primary school! We'll be sending him to either Patricks or Brigids in Castleknock starting next year. I know it might sound like early planning but in the background we will be buying a house and want to sure we as many bases covered as possible. Our aim is to live close to quality schools (primary and secondary) such that he will benefit from friendship continuity right through from 5 to 18.

Whoa that's forward planning!

Have you considered Dublin 7 schools or Schools in Dublin City Centre?

Why so opposed to Castleknock College?

Number_5

cheers again

I forgot about educate together in castleknock - it wasn't built long when i left the country.

I dont have anything in particular against the Castleknock College. We both want him to go to a public school - rightly or wrongly i think it gives a kid a better perspective on all parts of society and as a result a better balance. But does private offer a better education? - i dont think so - i think we all now plenty of people of public/private schools who have done both great and terrible. As I said below I think 75% of it gets back to how much the parent puts in and the example set. Again, nothing against people who have gone to or are going to private schools - just a personal preference.

We have thought about where to live and have considered a number of areas (including dublin 7 as you say, clontarf/howth, and even across the liffey ). But we grew up in D15 and part of the motivation in coming home is to spend time with the relatively elderly grandparents. And within that I was lucky enough not to have a long commute when i was going to school and would be great if my son could have the same - hence the focus on schools in the castleknock/carpenterstown area.

Obviously a lot can change in the years ahead as luttrelstown build their permanent headquarters. And to be honest we usually aren't the best at planning ahead but just want to make sure we are in the right area before taking the plunge with a house. Again, I appreciate the feedback! v helpful

daymobrew

Number_5 wrote: »

I forgot about educate together in castleknock - it wasn't built long when i left the country.

CETNS has a long waiting list. Download a pre-enrolment form and send it off immediately. Use an Irish address so that they can reply to you with your waiting list number. You can update that address when you move to Ireland.

I pre-enrolled my son right after he was born (late 2007) and he was #30 on the list for the year he will start! (Sept 2012)


** Rants about education choice to follow **
Disclaimer: I am/was involved with the campaign to establish an Educate Together school in Carpenterstown. We are still accepting pre-enrolment forms.

Diddler1977 wrote: »

Whoa that's forward planning!

Not really. If you want a Catholic school then you probably don't have to worry but if you want something different you quickly see that your options are very limited (and in demand).

Justask wrote: »

They are soon going to be building a new school for them that will be ready in a couple of years. But IMO its more to do with the teachers and student then the building

Unfortunately very typical of the (outgoing) Government to be playing catchup - the demand for secondary school places doesn't just happen overnight - the kids will have been in primary school for the preceding 8 years!
It is bad planning that Luttrellstown Community College, in temp premises at the entrance to Connolly Hospital, will not have a permanent school until 2 or even 3 years after it was established.

Justask

daymobrew wrote: »

CETNS has a long waiting list. Download a pre-enrolment form and send it off immediately. Use an Irish address so that they can reply to you with your waiting list number. You can update that address when you move to Ireland.

I pre-enrolled my son right after he was born (late 2007) and he was #30 on the list for the year he will start! (Sept 2012)


** Rants about education choice to follow **
Disclaimer: I am/was involved with the campaign to establish an Educate Together school in Carpenterstown. We are still accepting pre-enrolment forms.

Not really. If you want a Catholic school then you probably don't have to worry but if you want something different you quickly see that your options are very limited (and in demand).

Unfortunately very typical of the (outgoing) Government to be playing catchup - the demand for secondary school places doesn't just happen overnight - the kids will have been in primary school for the preceding 8 years!
It is bad planning that Luttrellstown Community College, in temp premises at the entrance to Connolly Hospital, will not have a permanent school until 2 or even 3 years after it was established.

I agree with you that its a shame that the kids dont have permanent buildings from the start, but they do get there in the end
My eldest was one of the first in Castlenock Educate together in a class room in the Boys school for the deaf in cabra and now look at what they have...its a fantastic school IMO.
The kids dont seem to be put out that much either in Luttrellstown, They will get there new school in time and they know this. Its a great school

BostonB

You'll have to excuse the rant but this is a pet peeve of mine.

Personally I think its bad idea to have to commute to school if you can avoid it. Theres all that time wasted commuting. Also you won't connected to the community around the school and most likely separated from your classmates outside of school hours. I also think there a lot to be gained from the stability and continuity of keeping some friends from primary into secondary. From a practical point of view, its much handier to share school tasks, pickups, drops, sick kids, with neighbours or family close by. Which is impossible if all the kids are scattered all over. Never mind if siblings and cousins are separated.

Bearing that in mind, many of the schools primary and secondary, keep changing their catchment. So its almost impossible to plan any of this. Being catholic, isn't much help, as most catholic schools do not give preference for this, and indeed if theres a quota of non catholic spaces, you may indeed be excluded from a catholic school for being a catholic, as spaces are limited. You may even be in the catchment area one year and out of it the next as they change the boundary. It doesn't seem to matter if you've lived in the area 30yrs or 3 weeks. Most seem to just go on the proximity in the catchment. Educate Together being an exception. AFAIK.

So bearing all that in mind, you have to run with the enrollment policy decided in the year of application. So AFAIK you just have to get an address, as close to the school in the catchment. The catchment may exclude the houses across the road from the school, but include houses a mile away. So be aware of that.

Its a bit of lottery in effect. Which considering the impact it has on the kids and their families, its a shambles.

daymobrew

BostonB wrote: »

Most seem to just go on the proximity in the catchment. Educate Together being an exception. AFAIK.

ET does not have a catchment area - up until recently there hasn't been enough of them to have one.

BostonB wrote: »

The catchment may exclude the houses across the road from the school, but include houses a mile away. So be aware of that.

This sounds like a reference to St Mochta's and the nearby estates in Clonsilla. This occurs because parish boundaries govern the catchment area and St Mochta's happens to be on the parish edge.

BostonB

That's why I excluded ET. ET does it based on when you put your child on the list, and ignores everything else (AFAIK). The only problem with that is you have no guarantee that if you get one child in, that you'll get their siblings in. If that's a problem in reality I don't know. I'm just pointing out the disadvantage. I expect the children from ET will be scattered to secondary schools all over. As there's no obvious feeder secondary to it. AFAIK. If thats something of interest.

The catchment being lopsided is a problem for St Patrick's and St Mochtas, CCC and LCC. (and perhaps others) That my opinion anyway. Personally I'm not mad on the idea of a child not being in the same school as those on the next street, instead the child will be dragged to play dates, or hang out with his mates at the far end of the parish, instead of his local area.

I commuted to school out of my own area. So its something I'm keen to avoid for my own kids.

Is there any infomation on academtic results of the schools?

daymobrew

BostonB wrote: »

That's why I excluded ET. ET does it based on when you put your child on the list, and ignores everything else (AFAIK). The only problem with that is you have no guarantee that if you get one child in, that you'll get their siblings in. If that's a problem in reality I don't know. I'm just pointing out the disadvantage. I expect the children from ET will be scattered to secondary schools all over. As there's no obvious feeder secondary to it. AFAIK. If thats something of interest.

Correct, ET is first come first served.

I believe that CETNS feeds into CCC. I don't know how this will be impacted by the new enrollment policy.

BTW, CCC has an announcement on their site about the new enrollment policy.

BostonB

The few ET pupils I know are going to LCC not CCC. Thats most likely because they are outside the catchment for CCC. I don't know if they've been told or that only the LCC accepted the application and CCC refused it.

I never thought to ask and the CCC/LCC catchment has only just changed so I wouldn't have thought to ask previously. One will have to commute through the CCC catchment to get to LCC. So that makes no sense to me.

Ultimately they built too many houses, with not enough schools to cater for them. So the decision of zoning even more land for housing to get the LCC built, IMO is daft beyond comprehension. The reason its not in the center of the parish/catchment, is they didn't make any provision for schools when they approved all these vast estates. Its not even in the center of the new zone for housing.

Morag

ET are pushing to get a secondardy school built in the area.

oblivious

Sharrow wrote: »

ET are pushing to get a secondardy school built in the area.

Lucan i believe

BostonB

Will the new LCC even be built this year. I suspect not.

daymobrew

BostonB wrote: »

Will the new LCC even be built this year. I suspect not.

I doubt it too.
A pre-election leaflet from Brian Lenihan said:

The process of appointing a design team for the new Luttrellstown Community College will commence shortly.

That's the design team, not the builders!

Earlier in the leaflet he referenced the plans for the Porterstown Link road (linking Diswellstown Road and Porterstown Road via the roundabout):

FCC has already completed the drawings and specifications required for the new Porterstown link road, linking the Diswellstown Road to the Porterstown Road Clonsilla. This new roadway will improve access for children attending St Mochta's NS, Scoil Colm (sic) and the proposed Luttrellstown Community College. This road will facilitate the rapid construction of the new secondary school.

The road will be blocked at the Porterstown level crossing so St Mochta's students will still have to go over the bridge. Scoil Choilm students can walk or be driven via the link road.

I am not clear how the road will facilitate rapid construction of LCC - Scoil Choilm managed to be built quickly using the crappy Luttrellstown Road.

BostonB

You'd assume a bigger wider road would facilitate heavy trucks better. IMO though it would be offset by the big increase in traffic that this link road will most likely attract.

Justask

Sharrow wrote: »

ET are pushing to get a secondardy school built in the area.

And have been since my eldest was 9 and now is 18

the plan as i am aware its to be in Lucan

Justask

BostonB wrote: »

Will the new LCC even be built this year. I suspect not.

No its wont be
It will be 2 years or over.

But I have to say that the public transport to LCC is very good. There are 2 buses that run from St patricks and The Clonsilla Inn

BostonB

I don't have the problem yet. But the whole idea of moving beside schools for me would be so the kids would not have to commute to somewhere else.

selsun

The proper LCC will open in August 2013. They can't start works without the Porterstown Link Road being completed. More details on LCC website: http://www.luttrellstowncc.ie/news/52.html

daymobrew

selsun wrote: »

The proper LCC will open in August 2013. They can't start works without the Porterstown Link Road being completed. More details on LCC website: http://www.luttrellstowncc.ie/news/52.html

It's a pity that there isn't a link to the Design Team Procedures. I had a quick look on the DoE site but could not find them.

I would love to see the site design too.

I wonder if the school will make use of renewable energy sources e.g. solar water heating? The adjacent Scoil Choilm, with its large south facing roofs, doesn't - a really silly oversight.

selsun

daymobrew wrote: »

It's a pity that there isn't a link to the Design Team Procedures. I had a quick look on the DoE site but could not find them.

I would love to see the site design too.

I wonder if the school will make use of renewable energy sources e.g. solar water heating? The adjacent Scoil Choilm, with its large south facing roofs, doesn't - a really silly oversight.

Give them a buzz or contact via http://www.luttrellstowncc.ie/contact-us.html

LoonyLovegood

I know several people who have had problems in CCC. I attended there myself, but left after transition year, just couldn't hack it in there any more.. My sister's in third year and loves it, but my parents are refusing to send my brother there after my own problems with it. He's going to start in LCC in September, and is looking forward to it.

It really does depend on the child in primary school. Both my brother and I were bullied extensively, and CCC did very little to stop it.

It is a good school exam result wise, but there has to be a balance between exams and students happiness, and I think they fall short a bit there. But, it is my own opinion.

daymobrew

selsun wrote: »

Give them a buzz or contact via http://www.luttrellstowncc.ie/contact-us.html

I emailed them and got a strange reply that was intended for a member of staff. I will wait a few days before emailing again.

gutenberg

CTYIgirl wrote: »

I know several people who have had problems in CCC. I attended there myself, but left after transition year, just couldn't hack it in there any more.. My sister's in third year and loves it, but my parents are refusing to send my brother there after my own problems with it. He's going to start in LCC in September, and is looking forward to it.

It really does depend on the child in primary school. Both my brother and I were bullied extensively, and CCC did very little to stop it.

It is a good school exam result wise, but there has to be a balance between exams and students happiness, and I think they fall short a bit there. But, it is my own opinion.

I'm curious as to your experiences at CCC (if you don't mind expanding!). I attended as well for five years (through to LC), and far from it being overly academic (which is the implication I'm getting from your post?), I found at times that it wasn't academic enough?! So I'm just curious really

LoonyLovegood

gutenberg wrote: »

I'm curious as to your experiences at CCC (if you don't mind expanding!). I attended as well for five years (through to LC), and far from it being overly academic (which is the implication I'm getting from your post?), I found at times that it wasn't academic enough?! So I'm just curious really

No, you're grand!

It wasn't overly academic (despite getting amazing results, which surprises me), but they concentrate on either academics or sport, and that seems to be it.

I went to the main feeder school for it, and out of the 105 in my primary school, about 90 went there, which was probably a reason I didn't like it. I just found that there were no supports for students with a problem other than academic.

gutenberg

CTYIgirl wrote: »

No, you're grand!

It wasn't overly academic (despite getting amazing results, which surprises me), but they concentrate on either academics or sport, and that seems to be it.

I went to the main feeder school for it, and out of the 105 in my primary school, about 90 went there, which was probably a reason I didn't like it. I just found that there were no supports for students with a problem other than academic.

I can completely understand where you're coming from with regards feeling suffocated around the same people- by the time I was finishing up, I couldn't wait to get away from some people, and deliberately chose to attend a university that not a large number from the school move on to (i.e. not NUIM )

I suppose if you were a couple of years after me (I left in 2006?), then perhaps the academic element of the school has developed more. When I was coming up through the school, the emphasis was very much on sports & non-curricular things. I felt that as a fairly strong student academically, they just assumed I'd be ok left to my own devices, and would motivate myself etc., which of course just doesn't work. Thankfully I had some great teachers later on in LC who were very encouraging. And yes they have produced some great results at both JC & LC, but up until a couple of years ago they weren't great at really promoting that I don't think, and encouraging people to do well especially at JC. For instance, as a fellow CTYI-er (;) ) I was amazed when I heard of friends at other schools who were given prizes for getting into CTYI, and whose schools had prizes for individual subjects, essay-writing competitions etc. CCC didn't have that, and I think still doesn't.

As regards the academic/sport binary, I believe they're pretty good for debating: I was a debater :P

LoonyLovegood

gutenberg wrote: »

I can completely understand where you're coming from with regards feeling suffocated around the same people- by the time I was finishing up, I couldn't wait to get away from some people, and deliberately chose to attend a university that not a large number from the school move on to (i.e. not NUIM )

I suppose if you were a couple of years after me (I left in 2006?), then perhaps the academic element of the school has developed more. When I was coming up through the school, the emphasis was very much on sports & non-curricular things. I felt that as a fairly strong student academically, they just assumed I'd be ok left to my own devices, and would motivate myself etc., which of course just doesn't work. Thankfully I had some great teachers later on in LC who were very encouraging. And yes they have produced some great results at both JC & LC, but up until a couple of years ago they weren't great at really promoting that I don't think, and encouraging people to do well especially at JC. For instance, as a fellow CTYI-er (;) ) I was amazed when I heard of friends at other schools who were given prizes for getting into CTYI, and whose schools had prizes for individual subjects, essay-writing competitions etc. CCC didn't have that, and I think still doesn't.

As regards the academic/sport binary, I believe they're pretty good for debating: I was a debater :P

Debating is probably second to none. Someone won in Oxford last year.

I started in 2006, and took part in a creative writing course that year, run by the now-principal. I think the main reason that I left was not being pushed. If I was passing, teachers didn't care.

One teacher in particular, who I had for French and Religion, would give us the answers for the tests and have us learn them off!

gutenberg

CTYIgirl wrote: »

Debating is probably second to none. Someone won in Oxford last year.

I started in 2006, and took part in a creative writing course that year, run by the now-principal. I think the main reason that I left was not being pushed. If I was passing, teachers didn't care.

One teacher in particular, who I had for French and Religion, would give us the answers for the tests and have us learn them off!

That's pretty shocking to be fair. But I suppose the general problem with any school such as CCC is that they really do cater for a wide range of abilities, and in situations like that teachers are often forced to 'aim at the middle' or just below, to ensure that the majority are keeping up. Which means that the good students are left to fend for themselves a lot.

I wonder looking back now whether they would ever consider introducing streaming. When I started there it was one of their flagship policies, promoting cooperation across the academic divide so to speak. But it has be shown to produce very good results for the top set (though not so much for those lower down, hence its controversial nature). In a school as large & diverse as CCC though I wonder if it is something they will consider eventually, if they want to maintain their good results.

I'm glad you're happy where you are now, and got out of there sane I do have fond memories of the place, specifically of certain teachers who were very supportive: I suppose it is just luck whether you come across a teacher who really gets behind you. I was lucky enough to have a few.

And funny you should mention Oxford- I'm studying at the Other Place now, Cambridge From CCC to Cambridge, it is possible!

daymobrew

gutenberg wrote: »

I wonder looking back now whether they would ever consider introducing streaming.

They don't have streaming?!?
I went to Coolmine in mid 80s and they had streaming. I don't think that I would have done as well as I did without streaming. Even with it, there were classes where I would have been at the lower end so that might have hindered those at the top end of those subjects.

gutenberg

daymobrew wrote: »

They don't have streaming?!?
I went to Coolmine in mid 80s and they had streaming. I don't think that I would have done as well as I did without streaming. Even with it, there were classes where I would have been at the lower end so that might have hindered those at the top end of those subjects.

The last time I checked, CCC still don't stream, they really love their mixed ability classes. The one subject they do stream for is maths, but that's only from second year onwards when everyone is divided between Higher and Ordinary. For all other subjects the classes are mixed: obviously you do have Higher & Ordinary classes for subjects such as Irish & English, but within an Honours class you could have a wide range of abilities, there was no 'top set'.

Once you get to LC there's a certain amount of self-selection going on, as people tend to choose subjects they are better at, so the ability range may not be as stark.

exador

CCC still don't stream