Why no far-right candidates?

Nolanger

Anyone have a reasonable explanation why not even one person going for election had far-right views? Surely some people would have voted for these candidates?

gcgirl

you had the CSP is that not far right for you ?

joulter

http://irishelectionliterature.wordpress.com/category/irish-solidarity-party/

that guy ran in cork south central. didn't get very far

Kev_ps3

Because we are a bunch of pussys. The Irish dont have the backbone for the far-right.

RetroBate

Nolanger wrote: »

Anyone have a reasonable explanation why not even one person going for election had far-right views? Surely some people would have voted for these candidates?

Presume you are talking about, anti-immigration candidates.

2011
Ted Neville, Cork South Central, Irish Solidarity Party: Votes 523 = 0.8%

2007
Ted Neville, Cork South Central, Immigration Control Platform: votes 804 = 1.36%

Maybe the above will go some way to explain it.

Blowfish

It depends on your definition of right wing. Economically there weren't really any extreme right candidates.

Socially, there were some as above, but they never get anywhere anyway.

newmug

I thought the answer to that would be obvious! Being far-right is bad! Anyway, it was right-ish policies that got us into this mess in the first place, we dont need any more of that thank you very much!

And to the gossin calling us pussies, say that to the people who voted Gerry Adams and other SF candidates in!

Pauleta

newmug wrote: »

I thought the answer to that would be obvious! Being far-right is bad! Anyway, it was right-ish policies that got us into this mess in the first place, we dont need any more of that thank you very much!

Bailing out banks and a free money for all welfare system are very left wing policies

Blowfish

newmug wrote: »

I thought the answer to that would be obvious! Being far-right is bad! Anyway, it was right-ish policies that got us into this mess in the first place, we dont need any more of that thank you very much!

How so? The policies that nationalised the debt from the banks onto the taxpayers were neither right wing capitalism nor left wing socialism. It was in fact just plain cronyism and/or incompetence.

LeixlipRed

Leo Varadkar?

joulter

Blowfish wrote: »

It depends on your definition of right wing. Economically there weren't really any extreme right candidates.

Socially, there were some as above, but they never get anywhere anyway.

when you say extreme-right economically do you mean anarcho-capitalist or something?

generally when people say far-right they mean anti-immigration, social conservatism and nationalism. it depends on the group but some of them aren't very right wing economically, more centrist or even protectionist in some cases.

the bnp are the best-known example of far-right

newmug

Pauleta wrote: »

Bailing out banks and a free money for all welfare system are very left wing policies

Blowfish wrote: »

How so? The policies that nationalised the debt from the banks onto the taxpayers were neither right wing capitalism nor left wing socialism. It was in fact just plain cronyism and/or incompetence.

Bailing out businesses at the expense of the people is very capitalist. Thats not taking from the fact that it is indeed also just plain cronyism and incompetence.

The welfare system we have is far from left-wing. I would say it sfairly centre. I know in some countries, there is zero dole (right), and in others, there is zero ownership of private property (left).

But what I was referring to was the prioritisation of business before anything else. Thats right wing. I mean in relation to planning, building anywhere and everywhere, allowing inflation to dictate economic policy, lack of properly organised social infrastructure, closing hospitals while people die on trolleys in A+E etc. All these things are right wing. We've been living in a right wing utopia for the last ten years1

Blowfish

joulter wrote: »

when you say extreme-right economically do you mean anarcho-capitalist or something?

In the modern sense, I'd say deregulated free marketeerism.

newmug wrote: »

Bailing out businesses at the expense of the people is very capitalist.

Not in the least. Capitalism dicatates that you take the bad with the good and have zero interference, i.e. the banks fecked up, that's their own fault, so they should be allowed fail.

newmug

Blowfish wrote: »

Capitalism dicatates that you take the bad with the good and have zero interference, i.e. the banks fecked up, that's their own fault, so they should be allowed fail.

You're splitting hairs over various shades of right winged-ness. When you take the bad with the good, thats centre, no? Hoisting the banks failure on the people is right wing, giving two fingers to the banks investors for the benefit of the people is left wing. Obviously centre is what should have happened.

HavingCrack

newmug wrote: »

You're splitting hairs over various shades of right winged-ness. When you take the bad with the good, thats centre, no? Hoisting the banks failure on the people is right wing, giving two fingers to the banks investors for the benefit of the people is left wing. Obviously centre is what should have happened.

Proper right wing economic policies would dictate that businesses stand and fall on their own feet. The banks failed so they collapse is capitalism. Supposedly right wing state intervention in the markets to protect the interests of big business a aka the banks is just as bad as left wing nationalisation.

mikemac

joulter wrote: »

generally when people say far-right they mean anti-immigration,

True, but you could also say it's free market and pro big business. And big business would favour immigration for cheap labour

Depends on the definition you give it

HavingCrack

feelingstressed wrote: »

True, but you could also say it's free market and pro big business. And big business would favour immigration for cheap labour

Depends on the definition you give it

Exactly as right wing could refer to the Islamic theocracies in Iran and Saudi Arabia, a Republican government in the United States, the Conservatives in the UK, a military dictatorship such as Pinochets etc etc,,,

RandomName2

Nolanger wrote: »

Anyone have a reasonable explanation why not even one person going for election had far-right views? Surely some people would have voted for these candidates?

OP needs better definition of left-right political division.

panda100

I think we can thank our lucky stars we don't have a party like the BNP over here. I think the people of Ireland are intelligent enough to realise that immigrants were not to blame for our economic collapse, but rather it was the failed policies of FF.

davdvn

for a proper right wing party to come forward we need a left wing commie party to threaten the establishment. up and coming sinn fein should do the trick.

we need a right winged liberal party in my opinion

we have a fair amount of choice on the left side and probably too many center parties

Dionysus

Nolanger wrote: »

Anyone have a reasonable explanation why not even one person going for election had far-right views? Surely some people would have voted for these candidates?

Er, Shane Ross?

Dionysus

Deleted User wrote: »

we need a right winged liberal party in my opinion

Yes, after all the Progressive Democrats were such a cracking success for the Irish economy.

Hopefully Fine Gael will continue on their tradition and privatise all Irish semi-states like the ESB and Bord Gáis now during a recession when they can be sold cheaply. Hopefully, that is, for all Fine Gael's political opponents.

Blowfish

Dionysus wrote: »

Er, Shane Ross?

He's in favour of protecting the depositors of the banks. In a far right free market system, the banks would be allowed collapse with no intervention, meaning all shareholders, bondholders and depositors lose out. This is precisely why we don't have any far right candidates.

sarumite

newmug wrote: »

Bailing out businesses at the expense of the people is very capitalist. Thats not taking from the fact that it is indeed also just plain cronyism and incompetence.

No it is not....a true capitalist would let them fail...allow market forces to determine the course of action.

The welfare system we have is far from left-wing. I would say it sfairly centre. I know in some countries, there is zero dole (right), and in others, there is zero ownership of private property (left).

Thats a pretty crude method to determine that its centre....sorry, not buying it. A person can agree with private property rights and be left...furthermore one can agree with unemployment payments and be right. Your binary approach to things fails in the real world.

But what I was referring to was the prioritisation of business before anything else. Thats right wing. I mean in relation to planning, building anywhere and everywhere, allowing inflation to dictate economic policy, lack of properly organised social infrastructure, closing hospitals while people die on trolleys in A+E etc. All these things are right wing. We've been living in a right wing utopia for the last ten years1

Lawrence1895

LeixlipRed wrote: »

Leo Varadkar?

And Richard Bruton?

Don't know, is a TD who tolerates racist attitudes in his constituency some kind of open minded to those attitudes himself?

.0

sarumite wrote: »

No it is not....a true capitalist would let them fail...allow market forces to determine the course of action.

No, that's what a libertarian ideologue would like to happen, not what an actual capitalist would do.

Manach

The MNC which are the essence of the captialist system seem to be doing fair well in Ireland at the moment.

Benito

Nolanger wrote: »

Anyone have a reasonable explanation why not even one person going for election had far-right views? Surely some people would have voted for these candidates?

Shatter, Varadker, Lenihan B etc? Who you want, an Irish Facist party?

Dionysus

Dionysus wrote: »

Yes, after all the Progressive Democrats were such a cracking success for the Irish economy.

Hopefully Fine Gael will continue on their tradition and privatise all Irish semi-states like the ESB and Bord Gáis now during a recession when they can be sold cheaply. Hopefully, that is, for all Fine Gael's political opponents.

lol the PDs werent right wing...they might have thought they were or people might have thought they were but were certainly were not......!

Nolanger

Benito wrote: »

Who you want, an Irish Facist party?

Maybe change your username?

Benito

Nolanger wrote: »

Maybe change your username?

And who was THAT Benito named after by his Daddy?

Benito

Benito wrote: »

Shatter, Varadker, Lenihan B etc? Who you want, an Irish Facist party?

Right wing economics does not mean fascism!!
people cant separate right wing economics and right wing social policy

Dionysus

panda100 wrote: »

I think we can thank our lucky stars we don't have a party like the BNP over here. I think the people of Ireland are intelligent enough to realise that immigrants were not to blame for our economic collapse, but rather it was the failed policies of FF.

That will come. Britain has decades more experience than Ireland has on this issue. And Ireland, following the British example thanks to the "free market above all else" ideology of Harney/McDowell/McCreevy is well on the way to making the same mistakes.

As for the intelligence of the Irish electorate: 1) They consistently voted in Fianna Fáil under Ahern/McCreevy/Cowen 2) They've just voted in Fine Gael, despite the latter engaging in what has been the most dishonest election campaign in my lifetime.

Dionysus

Deleted User wrote: »

lol the PDs werent right wing...they might have thought they were or people might have thought they were but were certainly were not......!

The PDs were as economically rightwing as anything Thatcher or Reagan have offered. What is it with rightwingers claiming here that the unregulated capitalism and mé féinerism of the Irish political elite was, now that it has failed, not capitalist.

Pulling that one is seriously offensive shít altogether.

CiaranC

Dionysus wrote: »

The PDs were as economically rightwing as anything Thatcher or Reagan have offered. What is it with rightwingers claiming here that the unregulated capitalism and mé féinerism of the Irish political elite was, now that it has failed, not capitalist.

Pulling that one is seriously offensive shít altogether.

Its Orwellian double-think.

dsmythy

Dionysus wrote: »

The PDs were as economically rightwing as anything Thatcher or Reagan have offered. What is it with rightwingers claiming here that the unregulated capitalism and mé féinerism of the Irish political elite was, now that it has failed, not capitalist.

Pulling that one is seriously offensive shít altogether.

If it remained unregulated then bank guarantees wouldn't have happened. They'd be allowed to go bust. The government would have stayed away. They didn't though.

Blowfish

Dionysus wrote: »

What is it with rightwingers claiming here that the unregulated capitalism and mé féinerism of the Irish political elite was, now that it has failed, not capitalist.

Pulling that one is seriously offensive shít altogether.

It's quite simple. The very first line of wiki's definition of free market states:

A free market is a market in which there is no economic intervention and regulation by the state, except to enforce private contracts and the ownership of property.

Guaranteeing private debt and transferring it to the taxpayer goes against the very definition of what a free market actually is.

To reiterate, the banks failing is capatilism. The Irish taxpayer being forced to pay for the banks failure is not capatalism.

pragmatic1

Because it never ends well with far right politics. Bunch of moaners who project their own insecurities onto other groups.

Benito

Deleted User wrote: »

Right wing economics does not mean fascism!!
people cant separate right wing economics and right wing social policy

You're offline so I'll be short. Right wing economic agendas in our, Irish experience amount to .... no alternative. You don't need jack-boots to destroy our health system. We pay nearly as much for ours as the Swedes pay for theirs, with their bigger and older population. It has been going on for decades. THERE IS NO ALTERNATIVE. Would be if we had a functioning Democracy. Maybe, just maybe, this is the start...........maybe

Lawrence1895

pragmatic1 wrote: »

Because it never ends well with far right politics. Bunch of moaners who project their own insecurities onto other groups.

As long as the group, which supports those moaners is pretty small, let them moan and don't give them the attention they are crying for

.0

Blowfish wrote: »

To reiterate, the banks failing is capatilism. The Irish taxpayer being forced to pay for the banks failure is not capatalism as I would like it.

Fixed.

Benito

Dionysus wrote: »

The PDs were as economically rightwing as anything Thatcher or Reagan have offered. What is it with rightwingers claiming here that the unregulated capitalism and mé féinerism of the Irish political elite was, now that it has failed, not capitalist.

Pulling that one is seriously offensive shít altogether.

You are angrier than me, for now. It is not the rules of Capitalism (yeah rules!) It is the class of ****e who (whom?) has ruled us since 1922. The profits on land and speculation have had the opportunity to shoot up to the billions and when they fall, get bailed out.

We always emigrate, me in the 90's. The political map always remained the same at home. FF, FG and Labour. Previously there were others. All had to be 'nationalist'. My fifth transfer went to Mary Lou....
First time ever giving a vote to SF. Not proud and mine is variable.

What and who next and when? Looking forward to the locals.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

belacqua_

LeixlipRed wrote: »

Leo Varadkar?

Lucinda Creighton? And the rest of them ...

sarumite

.0 wrote: »

No, that's what a libertarian ideologue would like to happen, not what an actual capitalist would do.

A libertarian takes a capitalist approach to business....so yes, thats true. Though a libertarianism is political position, capitalism is not.

damonjewel

Why no far right candidates? because the Irish never supported any Far right agenda. so its a poor ticket if you want to get elected.

The question here is why there was never support for the far right in Ireland?

I define far right as being National front style politics.

There's probably loads of good well explained reasons, in my opinion I would say that Irish people never had a 'colonial mentality' unlike our european counterparts, there is no massive ethnic diveristy and no ghetto-isation of different ethnic groups to the degree that can be found in other parts of Europe, there is no over threatening hysteria whipped up by the Irish media, Populism and not idealism is used by the major parties, Far right politics usually pick a fight with something in society that goes against the so called national sensibilties and norms e.g. Judaism, Communism, Islam, Atheism, Homosexuality, immigrants, other races, but possibly in ireland a natural scapegoat cant be found. Our sense of National identity is not under threat.

Also lets give ourselves some credit here, I think most Irish people I know, no matter how strange their outlook and opinions are, would never dream of supporting fascism.

irishh_bob

HavingCrack wrote: »

Exactly as right wing could refer to the Islamic theocracies in Iran and Saudi Arabia, a Republican government in the United States, the Conservatives in the UK, a military dictatorship such as Pinochets etc etc,,,

in the eyes of the far left in ireland , islamists in pallestine , iraq or afghanistan are kindred spirits :rolleyes:

Sand

Sinn Fein tend to suck up the usual nationalist/socialist votes that "right wing" parties in other countries receive. It doesnt leave a lot of space for a genuine racist/xenophobic party to emerge, which I suppose is the one saving grace of Sinn Fein.

KIERAN1

Sand wrote: »

Sinn Fein tend to suck up the usual nationalist/socialist votes that "right wing" parties in other countries receive.

Far Right/ no way thank god.. Racist foolish people don't need them in this country.

irishh_bob

Dionysus wrote: »

Er, Shane Ross?

idiotic post