Why do the Irish always run away

th3 s1aught3r

As in emmigrate
I know there is the obvious answer of no jobs. But anytime we have difficulty, people leave in droves. The only ones who stay are the long term unemplyable, those lucky enough to get into the civil service and those who can afford to , ie: the ruling classes.
They keep us in this cycle of doom
Maybe if people stayed here and stood up for themselves instead of legging it we wouldnt be in this mess , or am I totally wrong on this ?

Nolanger

It's the education system here. Everyone is expected to stay in school and then go on to college. After that very few are able to set up their own business or establish a future multinational. They all have to emigrate to find work. Too many imitators and not enough innovators.

Kintarō Hattori

th3 s1aught3r wrote: »

As in emmigrate
I know there is the obvious answer of no jobs. But anytime we have difficulty, people leave in droves. The only ones who stay are the long term unemplyable, those lucky enough to get into the civil service and those who can afford to , ie: the ruling classes.
They keep us in this cycle of doom
Maybe if people stayed here and stood up for themselves instead of legging it we wouldnt be in this mess , or am I totally wrong on this ?

Hmnn I'm not unemployed, I'm not in the civil service and I'm not within the ruling classes.

I am OP working class, have just bought a house and don't plan on going anywhere anytime soon. You're statement is plain silly I'm afraid. When in a recession some people emigrate to you know...... find work and earn a living.

smk89

Good idea, because most protests create jobs.

whoopdedoo

th3 s1aught3r wrote: »

As in emmigrate
I know there is the obvious answer of no jobs. But anytime we have difficulty, people leave in droves. The only ones who stay are the long term unemplyable, those lucky enough to get into the civil service and those who can afford to , ie: the ruling classes.
They keep us in this cycle of doom
Maybe if people stayed here and stood up for themselves instead of legging it we wouldnt be in this mess , or am I totally wrong on this ?

there is an element of reality in your above statement but I've been on the dole over two years now and have had enough. I've saved enough to do tefl and go teaching abroad. I'll be gone by may and to tell the truth the sh1te I've had to swallow from people refusing to stand up for themselves at critical points in the last 2 years will enable me to leave in disgust!!

Gummy Panda

Cause we are big fans of Flock of Seagulls

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA1O48CrmlU

davyjose

Gummy Panda wrote: »

Cause we are big fans of Flock of Seagulls

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA1O48CrmlU

You got a tahnks for the awesome song ... not for the bad joke!

davyjose

th3 s1aught3r wrote: »

As in emmigrate
I know there is the obvious answer of no jobs. But anytime we have difficulty, people leave in droves. The only ones who stay are the long term unemplyable, those lucky enough to get into the civil service and those who can afford to , ie: the ruling classes.
They keep us in this cycle of doom
Maybe if people stayed here and stood up for themselves instead of legging it we wouldnt be in this mess , or am I totally wrong on this ?

Why should people be guilt-tripped into staying?

In the few years this country has been independent, we have been run by a bunch of clowns who, barring one recent purple patch, have run this country with all the guile and intelligence of a retarded dog. They have fcuked this country into the ground too many times, and they, in their mansions, and the bankers and the rest of the good ol' boys, are the only ones who haven't suffered.

Meanwhile we're supposed to stay? For loyalty, is it? Give me a fcuking break!

bonerm

th3 s1aught3r wrote: »

As in emmigrate
I know there is the obvious answer of no jobs. But anytime we have difficulty, people leave in droves. The only ones who stay are the long term unemplyable, those lucky enough to get into the civil service and those who can afford to , ie: the ruling classes.
They keep us in this cycle of doom
Maybe if people stayed here and stood up for themselves instead of legging it we wouldnt be in this mess , or am I totally wrong on this ?

Turn the question around and ask yourself why would anyone want to *stay* here apart from the work. There's many worse places in the world than Ireland (but there's also plenty of better ones). Plus why would you want to stay around and try 'fix' a country that is inherent broken. Apart from maybe agriculture what exactly does this country offer to the world (and don't say IT because there's places elsewhere in the world right now offering better and for cheaper).

If I'd been born in most any developed country in the world other than Ireland I couldn't imagine myself being in any rush to come here to work/live.

The_Kew_Tour

It's funny

You stay and draw dole people will say your lazy

You emigrate, now you dont stand up for yourself.

This is a great country, me bollocks.

Ali Babba

The simple answer this time is there is no longer a future here in Ireland thanks to Brian Lenihan selling us out to bail the banks. This mess has put us back to the dark ages thanks mainly to his decision to make the taxpayer foot the bill. Effectively he's sealed our fate and instead of working our way out we'll only end up borrowing more and more money and be total enslaved to the IMF. The only future for any Irish person now is to move to another country.

KerranJast

Ali Babba wrote: »

The simple answer this time is there is no longer a future here in Ireland thanks to Brian Lenihan selling us out to bail the banks. This mess has put us back to the dark ages thanks mainly to his decision to make the taxpayer foot the bill. Effectively he's sealed our fate and instead of working our way out we'll only end up borrowing more and more money and be total enslaved to the IMF. The only future for any Irish person now is to move to another country.

Complete and utter rubbish. Theres a load of people still employed here. The tech and pharma industry are crying out for graduates. Will we see a spike in those courses in the CAO? More likely another bumper year for "Arts".
The vast majority of those made redundant are in construction or related areas. Shorttermism from a huge majority of those people in part contributed to the current live register list.

hinault

There's the argument that the innovators emigrate while the rest stay here and stew in the economic depression.

It's a rather simplistic argument in my opinion because it doesn't take account of the fact that many people who may wish to emigrate cannot do so.

whydoibother?

What do people mean by "stay and stand up for yourself". Nobody is entitled to demand that somebody else give them a job. It's economic forces. The Government can't just create jobs tomorrow if someone gets angry enough about it. They may have helped cause the mess but that doesn't mean they have the power to fix it.

th3 s1aught3r

davyjose wrote: »

Meanwhile we're supposed to stay? For loyalty, is it? Give me a fcuking break!

Just dont complain about a country if you wont stand up for it :rolleyes:

hinault

KerranJast wrote: »

Complete and utter rubbish. Theres a load of people still employed here. The tech and pharma industry are crying out for graduates. Will we see a spike in those courses in the CAO? More likely another bumper year for "Arts".
The vast majority of those made redundant are in construction or related areas. Shorttermism from a huge majority of those people in part contributed to the current live register list.

I must remember to pass on your advice to the solicitors and accountants who I know that cannot find a job.:rolleyes:

whoopdedoo

KerranJast wrote: »

Complete and utter rubbish. Theres a load of people still employed here. The tech and pharma industry are crying out for graduates. Will we see a spike in those courses in the CAO? More likely another bumper year for "Arts".
The vast majority of those made redundant are in construction or related areas. Shorttermism from a huge majority of those people in part contributed to the current live register list.

bollox!!

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

KerranJast wrote: »

Complete and utter rubbish. Theres a load of people still employed here. The tech and pharma industry are crying out for graduates. Will we see a spike in those courses in the CAO? More likely another bumper year for "Arts".
The vast majority of those made redundant are in construction or related areas. Shorttermism from a huge majority of those people in part contributed to the current live register list.

Define, please, a 'bumper year for "arts". If it's an industry with jobs how come Ireland is not a nation of artists?

th3 s1aught3r wrote: »

Just dont complain about a country if you wont stand up for it :rolleyes:

Since when is "emigrating" an synoynm for "running away"? Perhaps people just want a better life or feel more suited to a different environment?

davyjose

th3 s1aught3r wrote: »

Just dont complain about a country if you wont stand up for it :rolleyes:

If you need to qualify your counter argument with a rolleyes, good luck to you. you're actually not making any sense, and the assumptions you make are ridiculous.

I'm in ireland, I work, and I pay taxes. But I have no issues with anyone leaving. The future is bleak for a lot of intelligent, educated, hard working people. Why? because the people we trusted to run this county, crashed it. Stand up for what? the rich people who have been protected by Nama? Or my fellow citizens who have no choice but to leave?

So fcuk off with your glib half-thought out twitteresque statements, to be frank with ya!!!

De Dannan

Kintarō Hattori wrote: »

When in a recession some people emigrate to you know...... find work and earn a living.

Not on the scale the Irish have being doing for DECADES
Are we really that bad at managing ourselves here
You should think things over m'kay ....

LambsEye

Apart from the fact that historically, it's in our culture to emigrate, Economists and the like who study social factors determine that a country and an economy usually has what is called "push" or "pull" factors.

"Push" factors are:

Unemployment
Bad social infrastructure: Welfare, benefits, health care, etc.
Disillusionment with institutions like government
Poorly developed social amenities and culture
Education: Poor literacy rates, no graduate work, expensive education,
Disproportionate opportunities, i.e. A huge rich/poor divide

"Pull factors" are pretty much the opposite of this.

Look at Ireland, this country ticks every single "push," factor, as well as the fact that as a people, we don't have the best mindset towards a lot of things.

I left Ireland 2 years ago to live in America and never ceased to hear about how stupid Americans are and how my friends could NEVER see themselves living in America and yet these are the ones who are either a. Unemployed or b. Getting mammy to pay for their Masters so they don't have to face the real world yet.

Unfortunately I had to return home in recent months and feel a genuine depression at the fact. The MINUTE I can (hopefully in a few months,) I'm up out this b*tch, never to return.

ALSO, you need to consider that some people want to explore, see the world and experience new cultures. Many, many people find that they are better suited to a certain way of life in a different country.

Captain_Generic

I had always planned to emigrate, college put it off for 5 years but now i've got no excuse not to. I don't consider it running away either, I just want to travel as much as is humanly possible in my lifetime

Nolanger

hinault wrote: »

I must remember to pass on your advice to the solicitors and accountants who I know that cannot find a job.:rolleyes:

F**k them. Leeches of the highest order living of the earnings and ambitions of others. No sympathy for these law/finance professionals who are only in it for the acclaim and money. Most of those fools have little passion for their work. It's just a well-paid job to them.

Glenster

Only scum emigrate, we're better off without them.

We got rid of millions of the filthy spongers in the 80's and we developed a Celtic Tiger economy.

Hopefully once all the dirty bricklayers and carpenters are gone we can get back to business around 2014.

KerranJast

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Define, please, a 'bumper year for "arts". If it's an industry with jobs how come Ireland is not a nation of artists?

There was a huge diversion of LC students last year into Arts courses and a drop off in Architecture, accountancy, law etc instead of a load of applications for careers which are dying for graduates like technology and science.

dizzywizlw

De Dannan wrote: »

Not on the scale the Irish have being doing for DECADES
Are we really that bad at managing ourselves here
You should think things over m'kay ....

Ireland is a kip, people leave because they believe they can have the opportunity for a better life elsewhere. For much of my generation (I entered college at the start of this recession) the Celtic Tiger was overblown. My family and my friends didn't 'party' and now have pay for it, they worked for what they got to see it taken away because small groups of affluent people brought the country to its knees.

I'm not going to stay because what 'Ireland' is now is not worth saving and my generation didn't make it that way. We're young, we get to bail and leave the Tiger parents to sort out their own mess.

Emigrate or die

Glenster

Nolanger wrote: »

F**k them. Leeches of the highest order living of the earnings and ambitions of others. No sympathy for these law/finance professionals who are only in it for the acclaim and money. Most of those fools have little passion for their work. It's just a well-paid job to them.

The righteousness of the unemployable........

LambsEye

Also, if there are no jobs, no opportunities and a government that sucks enormous goat dick why in the world would people stay?

I for one, have no interest in staying in this country for some misty eyed, ideological reason or for some skewed sense of national pride.

I'm going to where I can make money, make a life and have some semblance of faith in whatever government under which I chose to live.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Nolanger wrote: »

F**k them. Leeches of the highest order living of the earnings and ambitions of others. No sympathy for these law/finance professionals who are only in it for the acclaim and money. Most of those fools have little passion for their work. It's just a well-paid job to them.

Isn't that what work is to a lot of people? Apart from the well-paid bit.

Glenster wrote: »

Only scum emigrate, we're better off without them.

We got rid of millions of the filthy spongers in the 80's and we developed a Celtic Tiger economy.

Hopefully once all the dirty bricklayers and carpenters are gone we can get back to business around 2014.

Trolling...? In case not...

Are you defining "scum" as someone who wants to make a life for themselves and goes to somewhere that it#s more likely? Would you still call people scum who leave their hometown and move to a bigger city but stay in the same country?

Are you defining "sponger" as someone who moves away and ceases to be a burden on the state rather than staying and drawing the doel for months on end?

I think you misunderstand the words "scum" and "ambitious".

LambsEye

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Trolling...? In case not...

I wouldn't even bother, such is the extent of the troll.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

th3 s1aught3r wrote: »

As in emmigrate
I know there is the obvious answer of no jobs. But anytime we have difficulty, people leave in droves. The only ones who stay are the long term unemplyable, those lucky enough to get into the civil service and those who can afford to , ie: the ruling classes.
They keep us in this cycle of doom
Maybe if people stayed here and stood up for themselves instead of legging it we wouldnt be in this mess , or am I totally wrong on this ?

This post is full of shít to be quite honest...

Glenster

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

I think you misunderstand the words "scum" and "ambitious".

I saw a programme about emigration on TV a week or two ago and every person they interviewed who was emigrating was a dirty, knackery, tracksuit-wearing, skobariffic, scumbag. No one with an ounce of ambition. They all wanted bar work or a construction job, none of them were willing to re-skill (or even skill). No loss.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

KerranJast wrote: »

There was a huge diversion of LC students last year into Arts courses and a drop off in Architecture, accountancy, law etc instead of a load of applications for careers which are dying for graduates like technology and science.

But were there jobs at the end of them?

twinQuins

Glenster wrote: »

The righteousness of the unemployable........

Glenster wrote: »

Only scum emigrate, we're better off without them.

We got rid of millions of the filthy spongers in the 80's and we developed a Celtic Tiger economy.

Hopefully once all the dirty bricklayers and carpenters are gone we can get back to business around 2014.

Unemployed, are we?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

LambsEye wrote: »

I wouldn't even bother, such is the extent of the troll.

I like to give the benefit of the doubt...

Glenster

twinQuins wrote: »

Unemployed, are we?

Developed a sarcasm-proof helmet have we?

Yakult

Why not emmigrate?

If you live in rural Ireland their are no oppertunities what so ever.
Even in cities its too limited now.
Much easier to go abroad and find work than move to the dull cities like Cork, limerick, dublin where you will struggle to find work, nevermind over priced accomadation etc.

th3 s1aught3r wrote: »

Maybe if people stayed here and stood up for themselves instead of legging it we wouldnt be in this mess , or am I totally wrong on this ?

What do you expect them to do? Stay unemployed and drive themselves into depression?

Unless you have some magic formula that whisks away unemployment and creates thousands of jobs?

Nolanger

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Isn't that what work is to a lot of people? Apart from the well-paid bit.

Yes but most people's jobs are beneficial to the country. Lawyers and accountants are just passionless wan*ers feeding off the system without contributing much. No sympathy for anyone out of work in these areas.

twinQuins

Glenster wrote: »

Developed a sarcasm-proof helmet have we?

Haven't realised that tone isn't conveyed well in text, have we?

Glenster wrote: »

I saw a programme about emigration on TV a week or two ago and every person they interviewed who was emigrating was a dirty, knackery, tracksuit-wearing, skobariffic, scumbag. No one with an ounce of ambition. They all wanted bar work or a construction job, none of them were willing to re-skill (or even skill). No loss.

Looks pretty sincere to me.

hinault

Nolanger wrote: »

F**k them. Leeches of the highest order living of the earnings and ambitions of others. No sympathy for these law/finance professionals who are only in it for the acclaim and money. Most of those fools have little passion for their work. It's just a well-paid job to them.

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Before generalising you should try to engage your brain, Langer.

People across all backgrounds have lost their jobs including many architects, accountants, solicitors, engineers and quantity surveyors as well brickies, labourers, sales people etc.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Nolanger wrote: »

Yes but most people's jobs are beneficial to the country. Lawyers and accountants are just passionless wan*ers feeding off the system without contributing much. No sympathy for anyone out of work in these areas.

A bit cynical. These people do provide a service to the state lawyers can help prosecute and put away dangerous criminals, accountants can help make sure that the tax take is brought in. I'll assume you're not saying that everyone in these two industries is corrupt, or something?

saywhatyousee

LambsEye wrote: »

"Push" factors are:

Unemployment
Bad social infrastructure: Welfare, benefits, health care, etc.
Disillusionment with institutions like government
Poorly developed social amenities and culture
Education: Poor literacy rates, no graduate work, expensive education,
Disproportionate opportunities, i.e. A huge rich/poor divide

.

.

i am trying to figure out or you serious or is that a joke.
in every one of the points you listed america is worse
break your leg in america without health insurance and see what happens
try to do a masters degree in america and see how much it costs???
the rich poor divide in america is much worse than ireland
before i go on i want to make sure that is a serious comment???cant be

hinault

Glenster wrote: »

Only scum emigrate, we're better off without them.

We got rid of millions of the filthy spongers in the 80's and we developed a Celtic Tiger economy.

Hopefully once all the dirty bricklayers and carpenters are gone we can get back to business around 2014.

There is an argument which suggests that those with drive and ambition constitute the majority of those who emigrate.

Instead of sitting here and waiting for 2014, they get up and do something between now and then.

Just saying.............

LambsEye

Nolanger wrote: »

Yes but most people's jobs are beneficial to the country. Lawyers and accountants are just passionless wan*ers feeding off the system without contributing much. No sympathy for anyone out of work in these areas.

I really don't know where you're getting this opinion. I've worked in several offices and I couldn't do have the crap the accountants do. I'm absolutely w*ank with numbers and tax returns and all that nonsense.

As for lawyers, I've also found I've relied on them a HUGE deal, especially when dealing with my visa applications for America. There is no way I could have waded through the red tape and bureaucracy and political jargon without my lawyer.

Why the venom?

mickydoomsux

Glenster wrote: »

They all wanted bar work or a construction job, none of them were willing to re-skill (or even skill). No loss.

I don't agree with the rest of your post but i do agree to some extent with this statement.

I know a lot of ex-labourers, tradesmen and hospitality industry types who won't take jobs doing anything but what they did during the boom. Fair enough with the whole job statisfaction thing but don't complain that you're stuck on the dole because you won't take any job that doesn't involve hanging off the side of scaffolding or working in a hotel bar.

It's not boomtime anymore. Construction is dead. Hotels that weren't needed are closing down. Money is money. Take whatever work you can if you don't want to be on the dole, there's no picking and choosing anymore.

Krusader

Glenster wrote: »

I saw a programme about emigration on TV a week or two ago and every person they interviewed who was emigrating was a dirty, knackery, tracksuit-wearing, skobariffic, scumbag. No one with an ounce of ambition. They all wanted bar work or a construction job, none of them were willing to re-skill (or even skill). No loss.

When are you heading so

LambsEye

saywhatyousee wrote: »

i am trying to figure out or you serious or is that a joke.
in every one of the points you listed america is worse
break your leg in america without health insurance and see what happens
try to do a masters degree in america and see how much it costs???
the rich poor divide in america is much worse than ireland
before i go on i want to make sure that is a serious comment???cant be

I never once said in my post that America didn't have those same problems. I'm hugely aware that the country is flawed in many of their systems. I merely pointed out to the OP that these are the reasons people leave Ireland. The difference between America and Ireland is that there are loads of opportunities there that don't exist here.

And isn't opportunity and employment the biggest factor in people emigrating?

Also, I was merely relating my experience. I wasn't suggesting people who emigrate purely want to go to America.

No jobs, coupled with all those factors above make Ireland a bigger "Push" economy than America, Canada, Australia etc.

Nolanger

You don't need to emigrate to set up the next Facebook?

whoopdedoo

Glenster wrote: »

I saw a programme about emigration on TV a week or two ago and every person they interviewed who was emigrating was a dirty, knackery, tracksuit-wearing, skobariffic, scumbag. No one with an ounce of ambition. They all wanted bar work or a construction job, none of them were willing to re-skill (or even skill). No loss.

I seen a similar show recently and I saw grown men reduced to tears in Dublin airport!! the bubble fanned by the government/big business/press/auctioneers has brought this country to it's knees and pushed so many people to the point of hysteria/suicide/emigration it's not even funny!!

Zamboni

th3 s1aught3r wrote: »

As in emmigrate
I know there is the obvious answer of no jobs. But anytime we have difficulty, people leave in droves. The only ones who stay are the long term unemplyable, those lucky enough to get into the civil service and those who can afford to , ie: the ruling classes.
They keep us in this cycle of doom
Maybe if people stayed here and stood up for themselves instead of legging it we wouldnt be in this mess , or am I totally wrong on this ?

Humans migrate to places with better resources.
This is just an island in the North Atlantic.
If there are better resources elsewhere why not go?

Nolanger

They're all wimps crying at airports. Heading abroad to work in a bar yet they won't do that work here. What's needed now is a bunch of lads who want to do something new e.g. set up an Irish whaling industry.