Has Eastern European immigration since 2004 been good for Ireland?

nickobrien1985

Well has it?

My name is URL

What's your own opinion?

Personally I think it has had little effect overall.. people leave as well as arrive from our shores.

Though how we deal with immigration on the whole can be quite wasteful.

Wolfe Tone

I think its great, love the polish and Romanian lads, loads of them love Ireland too and dont want to leave.

jimmycrackcorm

East European chicks have made Irish women finally try to compete.

Unpossible

nickobrien1985 wrote: »

Well has it?

Yes, they are contributing to society and through taxes & spending they are contributing economically. Most seem to be quite decent folk, every group has some bad eggs, but I think almost all that came here came to work and have a decent life.

charlemont

Yes, they settle here well..I live in a street thats like the U.N. and we all get along...

Bottle_of_Smoke

Yeah great bunch of lads and cute ladies.

I remember just before they could legally move here there was this big fear going around that we were about to be invaded by a third world nation. Then about 6 weeks later everyone loved the Poles/Lithos!

The Orb

No it hasn't. The resultant population explosion seriously fuelled the ridiculous property bubble. The Govt of the time stated that they expected 40,000 eastern europeans to come to Ireland, 400,000 came. It was too many, too fast. The resultant strain on state resources has been too much. They are decent people but the Irish state was not ready for such a population explosion and the inherent strains on pubic resources. Structurally the state wasn't ready. We should have followed the rest of Europe (except UK and Sweden) and restricted the numbers who could come for the first few years. This was done when the Romanians and Bulgarians joined the EU,in itself an acknowledgment that we got it wrong in 2004. No country could handle a 10% increase in population in such a short time.

Son Of A Vidic

My name is URL wrote: »

What's your own opinion?

Indeed, OP starts a thread without giving their own opinion/views. I always love that. Whether it's been good or bad is impossible to measure, becasue all our experiences would be subjective.

tigger123

The Orb wrote: »

. The Govt of the time stated that they expected 40,000 eastern europeans to come to Ireland, 400,000 came. It was too many, too fast.

What's your source for this number? Not picking a fight, just asking. Is the data collected on the number of EU nationals entering the State? I know for a fact that no exit checks are conducted in this country, ie, the monitoring of people leaving.

Degsy

I'm of two minds on this one.
A girl i know from Lithuania works in tesco's for 200 quid a week..fair enough,she's working.

But..the average monthly wage in Lithuania is something like 300 per month for somebody working 40 hours a week.

If she loses her job,will she go home?There's nothing there for her and the dole here pays more than double what she'd get at home in full enemployment of which there is very little

A lot of these guys and gals are genuinley nice people,hardworking etc but if they should happen to be come unemployed,we might just be stuck with them..further stretching our resources and all the rest that goes with it.

RichieC

I echo the Great bunch of lads sentiment.

RichieC

Degsy wrote: »

I'm of two minds on this one.
A girl i know from Lithuania works in tesco's for 200 quid a week..fair enough,she's working.

But..the average monthly wage in Lithuania is something like 300 per month for somebody working 40 hours a week.

If she loses her job,will she go home?There's nothing there for her and the dole here pays more than double what she'd get at home in full enemployment of which there is very little

A lot of these guys and gals are genuinley nice people,hardworking etc but if they should happen to be come unemployed,we might just be stuck with them..further stretching our resources and all the rest that goes with it.

:rolleyes:

what ifs..

WesternNight

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

East European chicks have made Irish women finally try to compete.

Compete for what?

fontanalis

The Orb wrote: »

No it hasn't. The resultant population explosion seriously fuelled the ridiculous property bubble. The Govt of the time stated that they expected 40,000 eastern europeans to come to Ireland, 400,000 came. It was too many, too fast. The resultant strain on state resources has been too much. They are decent people but the Irish state was not ready for such a population explosion and the inherent strains on pubic resources. Structurally the state wasn't ready. We should have followed the rest of Europe (except UK and Sweden) and restricted the numbers who could come for the first few years. This was done when the Romanians and Bulgarians joined the EU,in itself an acknowledgment that we got it wrong in 2004. No country could handle a 10% increase in population in such a short time.

Sure, it's the Easter Europeans fault dodgy apartments were thrown up everywhere.

Tallaght Saint

In terms of women, yes it has.

Duckworth_Luas

WesternNight wrote: »

Compete for what?

Me. They both lost.

yrwhu8jxtni06a

Tbh,they are welcome to come and work,but i think the government took their eye off the ball in reforming welfare system during the "celtic tiger"with those who refuse to work or who was on dole for years,there where approximately 104,800 unemployed during the "boom years" who could had got some form of work which was plenty available at time in shops and services and not just the building sites.

source here- http://www.cso.ie/newsevents/pr_qnhsq3_06.htm

ilovesleep

Degsy wrote: »

I'm of two minds on this one.
A girl i know from Lithuania works in tesco's for 200 quid a week..fair enough,she's working.

But..the average monthly wage in Lithuania is something like 300 per month for somebody working 40 hours a week.

the cost of living with be lower in eastern europe would it not?

I was watching a documentry about poland a few weeks ago and it looks like a beautiful country. I have my eye on a few local eastern european fellas but unfortunately they dont want to up and leave sticks and bring me with them.

Amhran Nua

The Orb wrote: »

The resultant population explosion seriously fuelled the ridiculous property bubble.

No, it didn't. The property bubble was fuelled by the banks. In any transaction where 90% to 110% of the payment is supplied by a third party, that third party decides the price. That third party was the banks. In 2006 at the peak of the bubble, 40% of purchasers were "investors", and I use that term loosely, topped up by natural demand fuelled by easy credit terms. There were very few immigrants buying Irish property.

Personally I think we need a thorough analysis of the effects of immigration in Ireland, even handed and conducted by a disinterested internationally recognised group, if only for the purposes of clarification.

gsxr1

WesternNight wrote: »

Compete for what?

Maybe it will make them compete to fit into a slim dress and stop filling their fat white Irish bird faces with Denny rashers and family size bags of HunkyDorys.

Those polish gals are well fit compared to our home feed girls:D

Amhran Nua

Lindsey Mysterious Diesel wrote: »

there where approximately 104,800 unemployed during the "boom years"

About half that were long term unemployed, and that includes those on disability. This is around the 1% to 2% mark. The rest was just seasonal churn.

Ostrom

The Orb wrote: »

No it hasn't. The resultant population explosion seriously fuelled the ridiculous property bubble. The Govt of the time stated that they expected 40,000 eastern europeans to come to Ireland, 400,000 came. It was too many, too fast.

They didn't drive up housing demand, no more than they availed of cheap credit and voted in our incompetent government. But they did absord a deficit in service employment thanks to our false prosperity. Those properties were not produced for, nor purchased by immigrants.

The Orb wrote: »

The resultant strain on state resources has been too much. They are decent people but the Irish state was not ready for such a population explosion and the inherent strains on pubic resources. Structurally the state wasn't ready.

What strain exactly? It should take you two minutes to head to CSO's database direct to check out our employment levels for the past twenty years. You should then compare these against employment figures for incoming migrants (you can select eastern european origin only). From this you can observe the proportions employed by years end.

There really is no excuse for this any more

opo

tigger123 wrote: »

What's your source for this number? Not picking a fight, just asking. Is the data collected on the number of EU nationals entering the State? I know for a fact that no exit checks are conducted in this country, ie, the monitoring of people leaving.

Regardless of the exact numbers - they inflated the balloon coming and threw a few pins in by leaving.

As an employer of EE workers - I would not like to see the back of them from an employer and human perspective.

doolox

The influx of people from outside has been bad for the ordinary worker in that the process has happened too suddenly.
Those availing of social services etc find themselves at the brunt of having to compete with foreign newcomers for a limited range of services which the government has not increased.

Scarce jobs are taken by the foreigners while our own have to emigrate to Canada and Australia to find work.

Those with Ireland-specific qualifications such as teachers ( Irish language ) and solicitors ( Law is specific to Ireland ) are immune to this competition but all other sectors are prey to this influx.

It will take decades for the average Irish worker to catch up with and overtake the foreigners in the job seeking stakes.

Killer Pigeon

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

I think its great, love the polish and Romanian lads, loads of them love Ireland too and dont want to leave.

I know, the Irish dole is great isn't it!

fontanalis

opo wrote: »

Regardless of the exact numbers - they inflated the balloon coming and threw a few pins in by leaving.

As an employer of EE workers - I would not like to see the back of them from an employer and human perspective.

Or the inflation led to them coming, as for throwing pins leaving that's nonsense.

c montgomery

No it has not been good for the country. It is estimated that over 100,000 of the people on the dole are immigrants and than over 40%of the welfare budget goes to non nationals.
This is not good for Ireland, unless you enjoy paying extra tax that is!

WesternNight

gsxr1 wrote: »

Maybe it will make them compete to fit into a slim dress and stop filling their fat white Irish bird faces with Denny rashers and family size bags of HunkyDorys.

Those polish gals are well fit compared to our home feed girls:D

And then we can compete for lovely Irish guys like yourself, perhaps? Superb.

Amhran Nua

c montgomery wrote: »

No it has not been good for the country. It is estimated that over 100,000 of the people on the dole are immigrants and than over 40%of the welfare budget goes to non nationals.

Have you got a source for this or are you just pulling numbers out of the netherlands.

Unpossible

WesternNight wrote: »

Compete for what?

To win, the volleyball games had previously been "just for fun".

huzzah for this being moved to ah

LighterGuy

to be perfectly blunt... :

it was a stupid idea.
All it was doing was allowing non-eu people to come over here, work but send the money back to their native country.


On the flipside it was great for the polish etc. You cant blame them.

Ostrom

LighterGuy wrote: »

to be perfectly blunt... :

it was a stupid idea.
All it was doing was allowing non-eu people to come over here, work but send the money back to their native country.


On the flipside it was great for the polish etc. You cant blame them.

Really? According to this report it was actively pursued as policy by the DETA.

Although I'm sure it was obviously stupid at the time.

JerryHandbag

gsxr1 wrote: »

Maybe it will make them compete to fit into a slim dress and stop filling their fat white Irish bird faces with Denny rashers and family size bags of HunkyDorys.

Those polish gals are well fit compared to our home feed girls:D

Ah yes, but do they know how to "have the craic"?

Unpossible

LighterGuy wrote: »

to be perfectly blunt... :

it was a stupid idea.
All it was doing was allowing non-eu people to come over here, work but send the money back to their native country.


On the flipside it was great for the polish etc. You cant blame them.

They are from the EU and as far as I'm concerned EU citizens should be able to move to whatever EU state they want, which is mostly how it works.

Father Damo

Tallaght Saint wrote: »

In terms of women, yes it has.

Sorry, but wehat? Im not denying some of them are attractive but I worked in places which were under 50% Irish and can tell you if you put 100 randomly picked Irish girls and 100 EE in a room, there would be no contest as to how many lookers would be Irish. Seriously, yes some EE are knock outs, but theres a chronic amount of munters there too. Give me a more attractive hard drinking Irish girl with a better personality over some mid level Polish girl who thinks I drink too much any day of the week tbh.

partyndbs

dont care the birds are hot tho

tigger123

doolox wrote: »

The influx of people from outside has been bad for the ordinary worker in that the process has happened too suddenly.
Those availing of social services etc find themselves at the brunt of having to compete with foreign newcomers for a limited range of services which the government has not increased.

Scarce jobs are taken by the foreigners while our own have to emigrate to Canada and Australia to find work.

Those with Ireland-specific qualifications such as teachers ( Irish language ) and solicitors ( Law is specific to Ireland ) are immune to this competition but all other sectors are prey to this influx.

It will take decades for the average Irish worker to catch up with and overtake the foreigners in the job seeking stakes.

DEY TOOK OUR JERB!

hairy sailor

tigger123 wrote: »

DEY TOOK OUR JERB!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-ED_ltKwD1o

K-9

The Orb wrote: »

No it hasn't. The resultant population explosion seriously fuelled the ridiculous property bubble. The Govt of the time stated that they expected 40,000 eastern europeans to come to Ireland, 400,000 came. It was too many, too fast. The resultant strain on state resources has been too much. They are decent people but the Irish state was not ready for such a population explosion and the inherent strains on pubic resources. Structurally the state wasn't ready. We should have followed the rest of Europe (except UK and Sweden) and restricted the numbers who could come for the first few years. This was done when the Romanians and Bulgarians joined the EU,in itself an acknowledgment that we got it wrong in 2004. No country could handle a 10% increase in population in such a short time.

It probably didn't help in that it resulted in a bigger rental market but house prices here had been rising dramatically since about 1996, with much smaller immigration levels.

The property mania and insatiable greed had already set in and immigrants became another section of victims.

opo

fontanalis wrote: »

Or the inflation led to them coming, as for throwing pins leaving that's nonsense.

How so?

There is not a single industry in Ireland unaffected by reduced demand.

I am not trying to say they did anything deliberate - I am saying that their individual contributions - naturally evaporate the minute they step on a plane home.

Mena

c montgomery wrote: »

No it has not been good for the country. It is estimated that over 100,000 of the people on the dole are immigrants and than over 40%of the welfare budget goes to non nationals.
This is not good for Ireland, unless you enjoy paying extra tax that is!

8 billion on non-nationals eh? Riiiiight.

Joeyjoejoe83

Mostly nice people,except in the gyms where they take over everything. However, I look at it that they worked here and instead of pumping money back into the Irish economy, it was sent home.

As such, I say no, as their arrival has led to money being bled from our economy for years, with no sign of stopping....

OPENROAD

doolox wrote: »

The influx of people from outside has been bad for the ordinary worker in that the process has happened too suddenly.
Those availing of social services etc find themselves at the brunt of having to compete with foreign newcomers for a limited range of services which the government has not increased.

Scarce jobs are taken by the foreigners while our own have to emigrate to Canada and Australia to find work.

Those with Ireland-specific qualifications such as teachers ( Irish language ) and solicitors ( Law is specific to Ireland ) are immune to this competition but all other sectors are prey to this influx.

It will take decades for the average Irish worker to catch up with and overtake the foreigners in the job seeking stakes.

Taking jobs from locals

opo

Joeyjoejoe83 wrote: »

Mostly nice people,except in the gyms where they take over everything. However, I look at it that they worked here and instead of pumping money back into the Irish economy, it was sent home.

You can't send your rent and food bill home.

OPENROAD

Joeyjoejoe83 wrote: »

Mostly nice people,except in the gyms where they take over everything. However, I look at it that they worked here and instead of pumping money back into the Irish economy, it was sent home.

As such, I say no, as their arrival has led to money being bled from our economy for years, with no sign of stopping....

Some money would be sent home, just like the Irish send money back to Ireland when working abroad.

stoneill

I for one welcome our Eastern European Women overlords. (Overladies?)

Kintarō Hattori

It's been great. It's fantastic to walk down the street and see so many interesting faces, to hear the various languages spoken on our streets, to see the various shops and restaurants around town. Within my own work enviorment we've employed many eastern european workers and they are great, hard working, friendly and sociable.

Personally it's been great for me. I'm engaged to a fantastic Polish lady and we've just bought a house together. I've been to the country 15 times at this point. I've experienced a new culture, language, food, viewpoint and so on.

Long may it last.


(Edit- I should add to those who say their money flows out of the country, my own lady sends none of it home.)

megafan

doolox wrote: »

The influx of people from outside has been bad for the ordinary worker in that the process has happened too suddenly.
Those availing of social services etc find themselves at the brunt of having to compete with foreign newcomers for a limited range of services which the government has not increased.

Scarce jobs are taken by the foreigners while our own have to emigrate to Canada and Australia to find work.

Those with Ireland-specific qualifications such as teachers ( Irish language ) and solicitors ( Law is specific to Ireland ) are immune to this competition but all other sectors are prey to this influx.

It will take decades for the average Irish worker to catch up with and overtake the foreigners in the job seeking stakes.

Your right DOOLOX Like the banking system there's been no regulation and it'll be some time before we realise the full effects of immigration it's less than 8years since the real migration started & from what I hear from eastern european work mates little has improved in their own homeland (wages much the same since they joined the EC but prices increasing fast to our levels) we here will have to shrink to eastern european levels re wages etc! Do the Math's a broke country of about four million against.. I dunno 40 millionish Poles or so.. add the rest of eastern europe Checks, Slovac's Litlhiuinan's Romainian's etc... who's going to meet who re living standards?.... It'll be all downhill folks!....:eek:

snubbleste

UK PM has just admitted that allowing unrestricted migration from the 10 accession states in 2004 was a mistake.

How long before our government says the same?

Fudge You

Tallaght Saint wrote: »

In terms of women, yes it has.

You do realise that Eastern European Men are on average better looking than Irish men.*



*Source - I fancy all of them.