Excuse the Hormones

Truley

I've had a couple of encounters recently that have got me thinking. In the recent past I've had a couple of run in's with a woman who I would describe as being a very temperamental person. Not just angry, but extremely over-emotional, almost hysterical in the way she behaves. I've seen her go bezerk and flay into people over the smallest things, resorting to swearing and namecalling completely unprovoked. The kind of person that will should at waitresses and cashiers. This is a regular occurance with her.

Now personally I would have zero tolerance for bad manners or melodramatics, and will automatically dismiss someone like this as a rude b*tch. However I'm shocked by the number of people in my social circle that know this woman and have tolerated her, referring to her as 'hormonal' as if it's not only an explaination but an excuse. I've heard this on at least half a dozen occasions. I should point out that this lady has children, but the youngest is one. I'm sure PND could be an issue, but does it excuse behaviour like this?

I've never had children, but I do mensturate and experience the mood swings that come with it. I have never experienced it to the extent that I've completely lost myself. And I've certainly never used it as an excuse for losing my temper or treating people badly. I'm not denying that others have though, but it's hard to know when there's a genuine issue or just a cop out for being mean. I hear my friends use it all the time, 'I'm a right cow this time of month etc'

I guess my question is, do you think mensturating, pregnant or post pregnancy women should be given leeway because of hormones or PMS? Or like me do you lean towards the idea that it's just a convienient excuse.

Maple

I think that if a person regularly has that extreme a reaction to the monthly ebb and flow of female hormones then they ought to go do something about it. Yes, we all have our ups and downs and we can all snap and shout and bawl but such regular extreme reactions are inexcusable imho. It's not fair to regularly inflict hardship on other people just because you're having your period.

In relation to pregnancy/post pregnancy hormones, I have seen friends/sisters who are completely sane and rational women lose the complete run of themselves so I think the lines are less clearly defined here. I don't hold with women who treat their pregnancy as an illness or an excuse for constant illmannered behaviour but I do think that pregnancy hormones are very much stronger than a dose of PMT so there has to be definite leeway here. Again I'm basing this on my own personal experience, one memorable conversation with my best mate will forever stay in my mind, she couldn't get her husband on the phone, because fixated on this and 6 repeated unanswered phonecalls later was convinced he was having an affair, she'd completely forgotten his dental appt.

metrovelvet

Well even within pmt there are gradations from mild pmt to full blown pre menstrual psychosis and when you are dealing with pregnancy, pre pre or post natal the level of hormones in terms not only of quantity but of cocktail too, is on a whole other level. And that is for normal pregnancy, when you add depression to it either post or pre natal, then yeah, it is a kind of insanity and if you are a witness to it its hard to see through it for the pain that it is and just think they are 'nuts' but there is real pain there.

Accountability - that is a whole argument that will never be solved.

I asked this on the psych board a long time ago in terms of illness, whether mental illness or addictions, or even alzheimers, how do you know when its the iillness or when its just someone being a jerk? If I had the answer I think id have most of my problems solved thats for sure.

Morag

Could be stress on top of a range of factors including pms, it's rarely one thing.

Wibbs

And sometimes the illness can make them a dick too. I'm quite sure some fake it or use their hormones as an excuse, but just as many don't IME. My take on it is if it's the odd time, then game ball. We can all be loopers at times.

If it's a constant thing, the default setting? I don't really care if it's a condition or mental illness or hormones or whatever. I may understand and sympathise with the person, but I won't want to be around them. Life is too short. I'm cold that way though.

Dravokivich

if she's always like that, i would suspect that it's her own attitude.

but if you only see her occasionally and on the receiving end of it...

my mother can get like that from time to time when dealing with people in a shop / resturant that she doesn't know. so seeing that perspective, this woman you referenced may have an issue with being easily frustrated, more so then hormonal. as i've noticed with my mother.

Morag

It could be sudden onset of menapuse with in a year of giving birth, that does shocking things to the hormaone levels. Seriously I will be telling my dr to shoot me up with hormoanes from pregant horse piss* if that happens to me.


*(honest it's what HRT is made from)

Eviledna

maple wrote: »

I think that if a person regularly has that extreme a reaction to the monthly ebb and flow of female hormones then they ought to go do something about it.

I really agree, but have you every tried to seek professional help for hormone related issues in Ireland? The place is hardly awash with specialists, and if you live outside Dublin you can forget it. The average GP will throw either the pill (can make it worse) or anti-depressants (can be unnecessary) at you and if you ask for a referral they usually ask...to where? "Sure it will sort itself out, you're young..."

I've been a guinea pig for GPs casual attitude wrt the pill before, took 6 years of mood swings, migraines and horrendous pain before I found the IFPA, who immediately suggested intolerance of estrogen, and I've been grand since.

It's true this woman should seek help, but it is really really hard to find the right help to do with hormones. You'd swear it was an art not a science!

Neyite

I worked with someone who was an absolute terror with her 'pms'. I put the inverted commas in as she was almost always like this - anything would set her off, a stupid question on the phone, a look off a colleague, an innocent request to do stuff, a remark made at tea break. So I concluded after bearing the brunt of it for 18 months that she just had anger issues.

One day she tore into me for some remark I had made 2 weeks prior to it. The dogs in the street could see that it was a generic remark, but she chose to take it personally. half an hour later, she apologised to me saying it was PMS. I felt it was a cop out for her terrible behaviour. She was careful never to go off on one of the bosses, only colleagues.

In my opinion, if you are unable to be rational then that extends to everyone around you, if you are selective on who bears the brunt of your ire then its a cop out. She would not see a doctor, nor take any thing for it, which also compounded my suspicions she was just a rotten person hiding behind a convenient excuse when her behaviour went too far. Its like a batterer blaming work stress when they gives their partner a black eye - why not lash out at the boss? The answer is that the batterer knows better.

I have worked with women who suffered severly with endometriosis, each month would excuiciating for them, I know women who faint with the pain and anemia yet their overall treatment of others did not change during their cycle. I have yet to meet someone whose personality utterly changes (im not taking general narkiness, most of us get that, but a jekyll/hyde type) for that week alone prior to their period, and are lovely and calm the rest of the month.

Maple

Eviledna wrote: »

I really agree, but have you every tried to seek professional help for hormone related issues in Ireland?

Yes, I have.

And like you it was a pain in the arse and a long slog before I got "sorted". But at no time did I think it acceptable behaviour to pull the head off some poor innocent because of my hormonal issue.

I'm probably coming across as some sort of martyr here and that's not my intention, but it does my head in that some women blame hormones and PMT as an excuse to act badly which then makes it so hard for women who have genuine issues to be taken seriously.

Eviledna

That's cool Maple, so you know what it's like! :cool:

And I couldn't agree more with this:

it does my head in that some women blame hormones and PMT as an excuse to act badly which then makes it so hard for women who have genuine issues to be taken seriously.

It takes alot to hold it in. To be honest I'd doubt I would have ever got away with aiming it at co-workers, but I'm not the kind of person to try. I work with my OH too, so the consquences of such behaviour would have been dire!:eek:

I don't think this issue is solely hormone-related. The older I get the more I bump into people who just don't hold anything in, regardless of consequences for those around them. It's the ultimate type of selfishness - my issues exceed yours no matter who you are. I've seen it from people, male and female, of all ages. I think these people either weren't raised with compassion or empathy, or just aren't capable of it. Holding them to it only seems to make them worse as they then assimilate you (the confronter) to be part of their problem.

Truley

Good points guys. I'm certainly not disagreeing that hormones can have a huge effect on a person's personality, and would sympathise with anyone who experiences problems. I wouldn't be anymore likely to tolerate it though, for example I would sympathise if my boyfriend had problems with depression/ alcoholism/ rage etc but I would not sit back and allow him to abuse me either. I've noticed however that it's quite acceptable to dismiss women as 'hormonal' and I've also encountered many women who actually seem to enjoy playing up to the 'hysterical woman' stereotype.

Eve_Dublin

There´s a direct correlation between my mood and my period and there´s no doubt that I´m not myself and I´ve been known to bite a few heads off round that time or blow some small drama out of proportion but generally I´m not too bad. I don´t like the person I am round this time and I really find it very hard to control my temper sometimes so I generally give people who I know might push my buttons or get on my nerves around that time a wide berth. It´s my problem, not theirs and I accept that. I definitely don´t use it as an excuse but it is an explanation, one that I don´t expect anyone to accept. It´s as irrational to me as it is to them. I act first then I feel like a diickheead after. I generally just feel very down in the dumps and overly sensitive to comments that weren´t intended to hurt me and that´s when I react but this feeling is usually heightened when I´m in a bad space in my head generally and I´m usually okay and I think most people would describe me as a reasonably calm person otherwise.

As I´ve said, the steps I´ve taken are avoiding certain people, taking Evening Primrose Oil, writing down my thoughts and taking a deep breath and counting to ten and walking out of the room if I feel the temper coming on. I have no time for women who use that as an excuse and it was a bitter lesson I learnt about 5 years ago is that some people just don´t care about being considered kind and are completely the centre of their own universe. Not everyone is as nice as you try to be or want them to be. It´s not important to them. I don´´t understand why but I accept that...as long as they keep well away from me.