Will Gerry Adams Lose Seats For SF

imme

Gerry Adams got a tough time in the media over his economic understanding in a recent RTE radio interview.
How many seats will Gerry's understanding or lack of understanding of economic matters as some see it.

Adams was thought to have done very badly in the second party 'leaders' debate prior to the last GE.

After that election SF actually ended up with less TD's than they went in to the election with.

So, will Gerry Adams be a reason why SF gain more seats, or a reason why they lose seats or remain as they are.

ArtSmart

doherty de man, but Gerry will do no harm - he'll do very well in louth.

johngalway

Every time he opens his mouth I smile They should have him on TV & Radio way more often

tim_holsters

The protest vote probably doesn't care.

They should though.

I'm talking about the country itself not just Louth.

ArtSmart

johngalway wrote: »

Every time he opens his mouth I smile They should have him on TV & Radio way more often

who? de doherty or de Gerry?

c montgomery

Its sickens me to think that my some of my tax money will be going towards Gerry Adams salary when he becomes a TD.
What has he got to gain by running in the election other than a nice salary?
I wont say what i think about him here but ill just say that the methods he has employed over the last number of decades to achieve his goals are nothing short of deplorable.

ArtSmart

c montgomery wrote: »

Its sickens me to think that my some of my tax money will be going towards Gerry Adams salary when he becomes a TD.
What has he got to gain by running in the election other than a nice salary?
I wont say what i think about him here but ill just say that the methods he has employed over the last number of decades to achieve his goals are nothing short of deplorable.

well, i'm sure he hopes to get some free office/petrol money stuff as well.

it's not all about salary you know.

puffdragon

Gerry Adams is seen by many to be tainted with the history of violence in Northern Ireland and recently his obvious messy divorce from British politics hasn't changed anyone's notion that there is a deep republican heart beating there.

Still you cant help thinking that the quality of the opposition will help him and with the wave of affection for Pearse Doherty to ride on I can see him doing ok.

He wont lose any seats for SF but a softer candidate maybe would have been better at this time .

tim_holsters

c montgomery wrote: »

Its sickens me to think that my some of my tax money will be going towards Gerry Adams salary when he becomes a TD.
What has he got to gain by running in the election other than a nice salary?
I wont say what i think about him here but ill just say that the methods he has employed over the last number of decades to achieve his goals are nothing short of deplorable.

In fairness you could be talking about any TD or indeed any aspiring TD there, not just GD.

puffdragon

c montgomery wrote: »

Its sickens me to think that my some of my tax money will be going towards Gerry Adams salary when he becomes a TD.
What has he got to gain by running in the election other than a nice salary?
I wont say what i think about him here but ill just say that the methods he has employed over the last number of decades to achieve his goals are nothing short of deplorable.

Sure you could say this of many Fianna Fail politicians now too and to be honest it would fit !

c montgomery

tim_holsters wrote: »

In fairness you could be talking about any TD or indeed any aspiring TD there, not just GD.

puffdragon wrote: »

Sure you could say this of many Fianna Fail politicians now too and to be honest it would fit !

No you couldnt!

How many current TD's have used terror and violence to further their agenda?

Gingy

Unfortunately for Sinn Féin, people in the Free State don't connect with Gerry, and they won't be a serious force until someone like Pearse Doherty is leader, and the leadership that is associated with the troubles steps aside.

I don't know if he'll lose many seats for Sinn Féin, but I doubt they will break 10.

imme

Gingy wrote: »

Unfortunately for Sinn Féin, people in the Free State don't connect with Gerry, and they won't be a serious force until someone like Pearse Doherty is leader, and the leadership that is associated with the troubles steps aside.

I don't know if he'll lose many seats for Sinn Féin, but I doubt they will break 10.

where's that?

Gerry has lived his life in NI. I don't think he has much of an understanding of life in the republic. I'm sure his supporters and he himself would say different.

Like every good socialist he does of course have a second home, a summer gaff in Donegal. So maybe he does know the price of a pint of milk in the 'Free State'.

Irish Slaves for Europe

c montgomery wrote: »

What has he got to gain by running in the election other than a nice salary?

SF TDs only take the average industrial wage (which is about 30k I think), the rest of the money for being a TD is donated to SF.

Fr Tod Umptious

Irish Slaves for Europe wrote: »

SF TDs only take the average industrial wage (which is about 30k I think), the rest of the money for being a TD is donated to SF.

Any chance of a source for that info ?

I know the likes of Joe Higgins only takes the average industrial wage but I have not heard it about SF

ANXIOUS

c montgomery wrote: »

No you couldnt!

How many current TD's have used terror and violence to further their agenda?

Eh Martin Ferris...

testicle

imme wrote: »

where's that?

Here

Irish Slaves for Europe

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Any chance of a source for that info ?

I know the likes of Joe Higgins only takes the average industrial wage but I have not heard it about SF

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/td-could-get-euro25000-before-poll-2438326.html

"A TD's salary is ?92,672, which means that if Mr Doherty serves until the General Election is held at the end of February or early March, he will receive ?23,168. As a senator, he was previously paid ?65,621 a year.
However, Sinn Fein says all its TDs only receive the average industrial wage, around ?29,000, and the rest is given to the party.
If a general election is held at the end of February or the start of March, Mr Doherty will be able to attend the Dail for 26 sitting days.
Mr Doherty will also be entitled to the public representation allowance, the system for claiming expenses.
TDs can opt for a vouched or unvouched system, with the unvouched amount set at a minimum of ?15,000 a year, or ?3,750 for three months. Under the vouched system, where a TD must produce receipts, Mr Doherty could claim a maximum of ?25,700 a year, or ?6,425 for three months."

johngalway

ArtSmart wrote: »

who? de doherty or de Gerry?

Ooops, my apologies.

I meant Gerry

manta356

johngalway wrote: »

Ooops, my apologies.

I meant Gerry

Or the Bailiff of the Baron of Nortstead.;)

Capt'n Midnight

manta356 wrote: »

Or the Bailiff of the Baron of Nortstead.;)

Crown Steward and Bailiff of the Manor of Northstead.

thetonynator

Why would anyone want adams in the dail, when he doesn't even know what the vat rate in this country is. There should be a mandatory exam set up that all td candidates murt take to ensure some level of cop on. . .

mike65

Anyone listening to his masterclass in banking and finance?

on news at one now gerry is failing badly...comical stuff

Biggins

c montgomery wrote: »

No you couldnt!

How many current TD's have used terror and violence to further their agenda?

I'm guessing you have one of your own with the allegation insinuated with that post?
(Since he's been elected for up North, I've yet to see him use said "terror and violence" - there was me thinking he helped bring about peace in his electoral role!)

I'm NOT a voter for SF (in fact if I can run - I will be running against him!) but if enough people elect him, he's entitled as equally to the wages and expenses of a TD as others - some of whom are probably in parties you do support.

mike65

Its probably to his credit that his voice gives his uncertainty away every time.

Paddysnapper

Look on the bright side..If he gets elected in Louth he will already know where the bodies are buried :eek:

Elmer Blooker

Deleted User wrote: »

on news at one now gerry is failing badly...comical stuff

I dont think I've ever heard such an interrogation, sorry interview.
I cant recall hearing anyone on RTE interviewing a FF politician in such an aggressive manner but then again there has always been a partitionist mentality in RTE.

crebel81

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

I dont think I've ever heard such an interrogation, sorry interview.
I cant recall hearing anyone on RTE interviewing a FF politician in such an aggressive manner but then again there has always been a partitionist mentality in RTE.

Totally agree. You could extend that belief to the free state in general. Lets not forgot that there are 32 counties on this Island...total ignorance down south to what has happend in the 6 counties...I hear it everyday from my friends to the workplace...is it just a coincidence that most republicans come from the 6 counties or would it have something to do with the fact that it is they who have suffered at the hands of the british forces for too long a time??

P. Breathnach

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

I dont think I've ever heard such an interrogation, sorry interview.
I cant recall hearing anyone on RTE interviewing a FF politician in such an aggressive manner but then again there has always been a partitionist mentality in RTE.

So asking Adams to give the numbers on his party's economic policy is aggressive? And partitionist, to boot?

It was an appalling performance by Adams.

delta720

crebel81 wrote: »

Totally agree. You could extend that belief to the free state in general. Lets not forgot that there are 32 counties on this Island...total ignorance down south to what has happend in the 6 counties...I hear it everyday from my friends to the workplace...is it just a coincidence that most republicans come from the 6 counties or would it have something to do with the fact that it is they who have suffered at the hands of the british forces for too long a time??

I think you'll find the majority of people living in the republic are republicans. What your post should read is that most terrorists come from the 6 counties and border counties.

I'm sorry if you feel forgotten up the North but we've enough problems going on down here without unrealistic 32 county talk being brought into it.

I'm all for Northern Ireland staying as it is, otherwise where would I get my cheap drink! :pac:

Elmer Blooker

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

I dont think I've ever heard such an interrogation, sorry interview.
I cant recall hearing anyone on RTE interviewing a FF politician in such an aggressive manner but then again there has always been a partitionist mentality in RTE.

rubbish.
He was asked important questions and he had no answer eg,how do you get money,the 19 billion a year we're over spending if you tell the markets and imf to go home.
Oh and no answer as to how to capitalise the cough merged aib/boi when the markets dont trust us after we burned them.
Fairyland stuff.

Sir Oxman

I posted on another thread about his radio slot today but the thread is gone?

Anyway, Adams will be eaten alive in any debates held just like he was in 2007 and SF will suffer electorally because of this, if he's going to espouse radical policies he better have at least a basic grasp of the fundamentals.
To not know the child benefit rate here and then demand there can be no cuts is well, stoopid.

Corkblowin

crebel81 wrote: »

?.......the free state

I live in the Republic of Ireland thanks.

crebel81

delta720 wrote: »

I think you'll find the majority of people living in the republic are republicans. What your post should read is that most terrorists come from the 6 counties and border counties.

I'm sorry if you feel forgotten up the North but we've enough problems going on down here without unrealistic 32 county talk being brought into it.

I'm all for Northern Ireland staying as it is, otherwise where would I get my cheap drink! :pac:

Ahh, Irish traditions die hard....well im glad you have some recognition for the north, be it drink or not

Happyman42

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

I dont think I've ever heard such an interrogation, sorry interview.
I cant recall hearing anyone on RTE interviewing a FF politician in such an aggressive manner but then again there has always been a partitionist mentality in RTE.

What was aggressive about it? He was asked questions about what he said, he couldn't answer.....end of.
This pro FF RTE lament is getting tiresome...used to be pathetically funny in AH but in here it's just sad and tiresome.

Stripey Cat

I heard the interview and he was okay. Not great, but most people listening to it would have heard the basic message: that SF want to burn the bondholders.

He also clearly pointed out that while he is trying to get fiscal sovereignity for the north, FF have been busy giving it away in the south and that the bank debt can never realistically be repaid.

Nobody thinks that SF are going to be in government this year, so the message only has to work as a good opposition point to stand on.

There was a telling contrast to listen to how the presenter spoke to him, in contrast to how he interviewed other guests on the show.

I certainly think the fact that the presenter kept talking over Adams, sticking to negative points (you will definitely be in opposition won't you? etc) and generally badgering him, made him look desperate for an argument.

I presume the average undecided voter will do the human thing, and side with the person being badgered.

But as the campaign goes on I expect Adams won't get caught up in specific figures and discussions of the international bond markets etc, but will do what Joe Higgins does and make the moral case for taking the private debts of greedy bankers away from the taxpayer. He can keep returning to this unanswerable case whenever the economy comes up and in the absence of any real difference between the other parties, I expect it will gather up a lot of support.

He hasn't got the measure of the difference in the way they are treating him yet, but I expect he'll improve and get his message across better in the coming weeks.

Today was maybe six out of ten. Earlier in the week was more like four or five. I reckon he will not be happy with it, but he is probably happy with the trend.

selfobsessed

crebel81 wrote: »

Totally agree. You could extend that belief to the free state in general. Lets not forgot that there are 32 counties on this Island...total ignorance down south to what has happend in the 6 counties...I hear it everyday from my friends to the workplace...is it just a coincidence that most republicans come from the 6 counties or would it have something to do with the fact that it is they who have suffered at the hands of the british forces for too long a time??

There are 26 :rolleyes:

Elmer Blooker

Deleted User wrote: »

rubbish.
He was asked important questions and he had no answer eg,how do you get money,the 19 billion a year we're over spending if you tell the markets and imf to go home.
Oh and no answer as to how to capitalise the cough merged aib/boi when the markets dont trust us after we burned them.
Fairyland stuff.

Adams was asked to come up with an exact figure on how much it will cost to recapitalize the banks. I dont think Lenihan (a qualified accountant I think?) or even Noonan could answer that.
In my opinion that question was a deliberate attempt to "snooker" him.

LordSutch

imme wrote: »

Will Gerry Adams Lose Seats For SF

I sincerely hope so.

Anonymous1987

I just saw this on the rte website

He (Adams) said ordinary citizens had been burdened with a debt crisis and he said if in government, he would bring in a new budget to reverse certain cuts to social welfare payments.
He reiterated that he would tell the IMF to 'go home and take their money with them'.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0130/politics3.html

I'm pretty sure everyone is disgusted that we needed to be bailed out but when the IMF are charging 5.7% and the markets are charging an unsustainable 9.12%, which is better for the country?

Stripey Cat

Anonymous1987 wrote: »

I'm pretty sure everyone is disgusted that we needed to be bailed out but when the IMF are charging 5.7% and the markets are charging an unsustainable 9.12%, which is better for the country?

The markets are only lending at that rate because the state withdrew from the bond markets.

There were fewer Irish bonds around, so of course the price went up.

I imagine if we did something painful and radical with our banking sector and stopped pourting the money we borrow into a black hole of private debt, we might get a more sensible price for our bonds.

Remember, we don't need IMF money to run this country if we get rid of the bank debt.

Chucky the tree

Stripey Cat wrote: »

The markets are only lending at that rate because the state withdrew from the bond markets.

There were fewer Irish bonds around, so of course the price went up.

I imagine if we did something painful and radical with our banking sector and stopped pourting the money we borrow into a black hole of private debt, we might get a more sensible price for our bonds.

Remember, we don't need IMF money to run this country if we get rid of the bank debt.

So how/who will we pay for our deficit?

femur61

I hope they are crucified.

Anonymous1987

Stripey Cat wrote: »

The markets are only lending at that rate because the state withdrew from the bond markets.

Its the other way around, the state was forced into a bailout because the market interest rates on their bonds became unsustainable.

Stripey Cat wrote: »

There were fewer Irish bonds around, so of course the price went up.

You are confusing the price of bonds with the interest rate. The interest rate is what matters to the Irish government. Bonds have an inverse relationship between the interest rate and the price of a bond, as price increases due to increased demand, interest rates fall. Irish bonds at present have an interest rate of 9.12% because there is little demand for them. As a result investors expect a high interest rate to compensate for investing in very risky Irish bonds.

Otherwise you are arguing that interest rates went up because we weren't borrowing enough .

Stripey Cat wrote: »

I imagine if we did something painful and radical with our banking sector and stopped pourting the money we borrow into a black hole of private debt, we might get a more sensible price for our bonds.

Sure, things might have been different if the bank debt was converted to equity.

Stripey Cat wrote: »

Remember, we don't need IMF money to run this country if we get rid of the bank debt.

At this stage, I'm afraid we do need the IMF even without the bank debt. The bailout consisted of 85bn, 17.5bn of which was our own. 35bn of the 85bn is for the banks which includes our own 17.5bn and a portion lent by the EU. The IMF portion of the 85bn works out at 22.5bn and is devoted solely to government expenditure not the banks. Even if you exclude the part of the bailout for the banks we are still borrowing a total of 50bn for government expenditure from the EU/IMF.

What Adam is basically saying is that we don't need this 50bn, we'd rather raise taxes and/or borrow from the market at unsustainable rates instead. Keep in mind current annual tax receipts are at about 32bn, the 50bn would be in addition to this.

Elmer Blooker

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

Adams was asked to come up with an exact figure on how much it will cost to recapitalize the banks. I dont think Lenihan (a qualified accountant I think?) or even Noonan could answer that.
In my opinion that question was a deliberate attempt to "snooker" him.

Oh yes they could answer it.
RTE were just checking if Adams had done his homework.
E minus in maths I'm afraid.

But then,Adams and co are playing to the angriest of the angry vote who don't care either and think that manna does come from heaven.
The rest of us are looking at ideas and have the cop on to know that while it's horrible that FF mis management got us into the position of having to rely on imf help,we need to negotiate and be reasonable if we are to fund the country and get out of this mess.
I'm quite confident that FG and Labour and the shane Ross group have this cop on aswell from what I've read and heard.
So they'll be getting preferences on my ballot paper.
The ULA and SF won't
FF certainly won't either as they've proved their incompetence.

Anonymous1987

Deleted User wrote: »

Oh yes they could answer it.
RTE were just checking if Adams had done his homework.
E minus in maths I'm afraid.

In fairness, no-one knows how much it will cost to recapitalise the banks, it depends on the losses faced by the banks on their loan books. Where Adams fails at maths is his claim that we don't need the IMF. It is simply not possible for us to continue without assistance.

He also distanced Sinn Fein from a Labour coalition (unlikely anyway) by describing them as "conservative". A description which seems ridiculous to me. At the same time Adams does not accept Sinn Fein will be in opposition while polls put the party at 13% .

A certain detachment from reality pervades Adams rhetoric.

Sergeant

Another utterly dreadful performance from Adams on This Week. You can hear the uncertainty in his voice every time he is asked a question.

MP3 version

COYW

Irish Slaves for Europe wrote: »

SF TDs only take the average industrial wage (which is about 30k I think), the rest of the money for being a TD is donated to SF.

Then how can he afford to have a 2nd house, holiday home, in Donegal?

Sergeant wrote: »

Another utterly dreadful performance from Adams on This Week. You can hear the uncertainty in his voice every time he is asked a question.

It was one of the worst performances I have ever seen by a political figure on that programme. No clarity in his responses either. He needs to get to grips with basic economics before the debates or the others will spank him big time.

puffdragon

I think most of us are so used to listening to the same old blarney stone politicians that we cant listen to a real alternative any more, somehow I've heard all this before from not only the experts quoted by Adams but also many more economists on various chat shows, editorials, and tv documentaries over the past year.

Whats clear is we dont know what would happen if we did free ourselves of debt money overnight, or over lets say a year, and unless theirs a reckless guesser on this forum who can tell me otherwise then his argument however strange stands as is, a valid alternative.

jbkenn

crebel81 wrote: »

Totally agree. You could extend that belief to the free state in general.

Could you kindly explain to me where this "free state" is?, as a resident of the Republic of Ireland I have been unable to find any reference to it.

Lets not forgot that there are 32 counties on this Island

Yes there are, 26 counties in the Republic and 6 counties in the U.K.

..total ignorance down south to what has happend in the 6 counties...

No there is'nt actually, it's just that we have a pain in our ar$e from listening to it.

I hear it everyday from my friends to the workplace...is it just a coincidence that most republicans come from the 6 counties or would it have something to do with the fact that it is they who have suffered at the hands of the british forces for too long a time??

It may come as a surprise to you, but there are many republicans in the Republic, but then it depends on your definition of a Republican.

Look it up sometime.

jbkenn