Fianna Fail / Sinn Fein Government

ninebeanrows

With Fianna Fail likely to increase its share of vote during the campaign and Sinn Fein to do likewise.

It is not beyond possible vote share could be;

FF: 30%
SF: 20%

Seat Share:
FF: 50
SF 25

So the parties could reach an agreement to enter government and offer a consensus approach; tackling the economic issues and finding a centre ground from the two extremes.

It would force FF to find solutions to unpopular decisions while the Shinners could offer the opinions and solutions of the ordinary public.

As the elections campaign continues this solution will become increasingly possible, Sinn Fein will pick up the moving labour protest vote while FF will pick up floating voters not impressed by FG or Labour policies but no way would they vote SF.

eddison

Hmm could work..

Lets face it, there will be a coalition of some sort. The only question is how it will be made up.. Thats is, If balancing one out with another is a good idea.
FF/FG are not extremes so that coalition is out. they would simply agree.
FG/L would probably work out ok.
FG/SF ? haven't thought about that.
FF/SF ? well SF would have a bigger spine than the greens, and FF are quite 'Irish' compared to FG.
So yeah SF/FF might work..

imme

I don't see this as any way likely.
You say FF could get 50 seats, they'll be fortunate to get 40, fortunate even to get 30.
SF to get 25 seats, you say?. They'll be fortunate to get 10 seats.

Even if they got 50 and 25 they'd still need someone else to go in with them. I can't see anyone else ready to work with such a combination.

You say as well they are extremes, in what way?

SF is on the extreme left and FF even though they don't look it has always liked to think of itself as re-distributive in econ/social terms.


I think a FF/SF govt to be as likely as North Korea to win the Eurovision.

imme

eddison wrote: »

FF/SF ? well SF would have a bigger spine than the greens, and FF are quite 'Irish' compared to FG.

Fine Gael aren't Irish? are you sure:(
maybe you could ask to see their birth certs.

Snakeblood

Weathercheck wrote: »

With Fianna Fail likely to increase its share of vote during the campaign and Sinn Fein to do likewise.

It is not beyond possible vote share could be;

FF: 30%
SF: 20%

Seat Share:
FF: 50
SF 25

So the parties could reach an agreement to enter government and offer a consensus approach; tackling the economic issues and finding a centre ground from the two extremes.

It would force FF to find solutions to unpopular decisions while the Shinners could offer the opinions and solutions of the ordinary public.

As the elections campaign continues this solution will become increasingly possible, Sinn Fein will pick up the moving labour protest vote while FF will pick up floating voters not impressed by FG or Labour policies but no way would they vote SF.

FF are poison at the moment. I'd willing to bet (A TINY AMOUNT) that FF are the fourth largest party after the next election.

eddison

Fine Gael aren't Irish? are you sure
maybe you could ask to see their birth certs.

Of course they are Irish- the people themselves. The party itself has its roots in the blue shirts, which is a type of extreme right wing party.
They have moved away from this now, but that 'right wing' feeling is still there. Look at Noonan? does he look like a left wing guy to you?
That is why they come across as less 'Irish' than FF, SF etc And that is why they normally loose elections, unless the opposition completely F*** up the country.

TheReverend

Just wont happen, FG/Lab is the most likely result of the next election

LeixlipRed

Would expose SF for who they really are so sure, why not?

wolfpawnat

Labour/FG will get it sadly. Every time they are in power together it doesn't end too well for them though. I would be interested to see a FF/SF coalition, though I am not sure it would happen, but FF will be desperate to stay in.

I myself would love an all left government but again that is not going to happen

imme

eddison wrote: »

Of course they are Irish- the people themselves. The party itself has its roots in the blue shirts, which is a type of extreme right wing party.
They have moved away from this now, but that 'right wing' feeling is still there. Look at Noonan? does he look like a left wing guy to you?
That is why they come across as less 'Irish' than FF, SF etc And that is why they normally loose elections, unless the opposition completely F*** up the country.

you make it sound like it was yesterday.
The Blueshirts were active in the mid 1930's you know;)

It doesn't alter the fact that Fine Gael is an Irish party.

Fine Gael has it's roots in the original Sinn Fein, just like the party that calls itself SF today, even though they're the off shoot of an off shoot etc.

All you can do is judge FG on their policies. their website is www.finegael.ie

Riskymove

you are overlooking the fact that SF and FF will be in competition for many seats

they are unlikely (unless there is a hell of change in current polling) to both do as well as you set out....I do not think they could get 75 seats between them...if SF do well it will be at FF's expense I think

sceptre

Weathercheck wrote: »

Seat Share:
FF: 50
SF 25

Even an (I suggest) optimistically-estimated return for the two parties like that would together leave them eight seats shy of a majority (nine if they have to find a Ceann Comhairle from their number).

wolfpawnat

Riskymove wrote: »

you are overlooking the fact that SF and FF will be in competition for many seats

they are unlikely (unless there is a hell of change in current polling) to both do as well as you set out....I do not think they could get 75 seats between them...if SF do well it will be at FF's expense I think

But every party will be in competition for the seats, every area has at least one candidate from each of the 5 parties!

Riskymove

wolfpawnat wrote: »

But every party will be in competition for the seats, every area has at least one candidate from each of the 5 parties!

theoretically yes...but thats like suggesting that the Greens might win 30 seats if they have a candidate in 30 constituencies...theoretically correct

but polling and voting patterns would suggest otherwise

for SF and FF to do that well both labour and FG would have to not get seats in many constituencies which I cannot see happening

the best I can see FF and SF doing is 50-60 in total with 40-50 more likely

wolfpawnat

Riskymove wrote: »

theoretically yes...but thats like suggesting that the Greens might win 30 seats if they have a candidate in 30 constituencies...theoretically correct

but polling and voting patterns would suggest otherwise

for SF and FF to do that well both labour and FG would have to not get seats in many constituencies which I cannot see happening

the best I can see FF and SF doing is 50-60 in total with 40-50 more likely

You see I think it is all down to who does more on a local level. Healy-Rae was terrible in the Dáil, but locally he was always on the issues, and people, even if he was in the Nazi Party, would still vote for him as a result. So the FF's that do alot for the constituency, plus the usual idiots that vote them in regardless, will be few and far between this time.

A lot of Labour and FF supporters have turned to SF, but I have no illusions that it will be enough to even get the numbers you are talking about. Ferris barely got in last time, though I see Doherty and Adams doing well!

eddison

A lot of Labour and FF supporters have turned to SF, but I have no illusions that it will be enough to even get the numbers you are talking about. Ferris barely got in last time, though I see Doherty and Adams doing well!

I agree, i think SF will not get very much more support than last time. It will all go to FG and to a lesser extent Labour. The indies will get some votes but people want change on a national level, so they wont vote for Ind.

Same old, same old. FF **** up the country FG get in and put emergency measure in- happened all through our history, and is happening now. Same thing will happen next time FF get in.
Welcome to the magic roundabout.

keithm1

I don't even know why fianna fail are gonna run
ANYONE ive spoken to has said they'll never vote for them again

catherin

Anyone who votes for FF is either stupid or rich. They have destroyed the country and made a total A** of us.
FG is not much better, only supports the business people and labour seem to have forgotten what they stood for in a bid to get into power at any cost, even with FG who are complete opposites. They should learn from the PD's and the Greens that this greed for power at the expense of everything will be their undoing.
SF are the only one who have made any sense so far and who have had the guts to stick their neck out and state that they will not support the banks anymore... From what i remember this is what everyone wanted from FF up until last week.
I think the independents will do well and some FG, and Labour but SF will also increase their votes.

Lawrence1895

eddison wrote: »

Of course they are Irish- the people themselves. The party itself has its roots in the blue shirts, which is a type of extreme right wing party.
They have moved away from this now, but that 'right wing' feeling is still there. Look at Noonan? does he look like a left wing guy to you?
That is why they come across as less 'Irish' than FF, SF etc And that is why they normally loose elections, unless the opposition completely F*** up the country.

...and when I moved to Ireland, I was convinced, there was no right wing party over here. Well, I was proven wrong recently...and it seems to me, those with a racist and xenophobic attitude tend to support FG :mad:

catherin

Lars1916 wrote: »

...and when I moved to Ireland, I was convinced, there was no right wing party over here. Well, I was proven wrong recently...and it seems to me, those with a racist and xenophobic attitude tend to support FG :mad:

I totally agree with you.

Lawrence1895

catherin wrote: »

I totally agree with you.

Did I mention, that they like to give out to the Germans, because of Hitler? Well, he was an Austrian, but still, it reminds me of some fascist idiots in Germany, even if FG are associated with the likes of Angela Merkel and the Christian Democrates :eek:

eddison

Lars1916 wrote: »

Did I mention, that they like to give out to the Germans, because of Hitler? :eek:

Sorry, I completely lost your point there, could you explain this please?

nesf

Lars1916 wrote: »

...and when I moved to Ireland, I was convinced, there was no right wing party over here. Well, I was proven wrong recently...and it seems to me, those with a racist and xenophobic attitude tend to support FG :mad:

Yeah and ignorant simpletons with no understanding of how the world works tend to support the left wing parties.

See how nice it is to throw around offensive generalisations? Cut it out please.

Lawrence1895

eddison wrote: »

Sorry, I completely lost your point there, could you explain this please?

I meant, that I can't understand obvious FG supporters, saying (I quote:) 'Them Blacks and Romanians are bleeding the system dry, they are to blame for the recession'...which is racism, I guess, and shortly after that complaining about racism in Germany, mentioning Hitler.

Lawrence1895

nesf wrote: »

Yeah and ignorant simpletons with no understanding of how the world works tend to support the left wing parties.

See how nice it is to throw around offensive generalisations? Cut it out please.

Sorry, I was not meant to be offensive, it was just, what I experienced. I married into a family of FG supporters in 2009, and since then I always hear comments like that.

I guess, there are bad and good people in every party or direction, but still...I strongly oppose any kind of racism.

eddison

Hi,

I didn't know that, could you refer me to where these points were quoted please? Like an article or anything really, thanks.

Lawrence1895

eddison wrote: »

Hi,

I didn't know that, could you refer me to where these points were quoted please? Like an article or anything really, thanks.

I mentioned that in a previous post, I married into a FG family in 2009, and I quoted the other half and her mother :rolleyes:

nesf

Lars1916 wrote: »

Sorry, I was not meant to be offensive, it was just, what I experienced. I married into a family of FG supporters in 2009, and since then I always hear comments like that.

I guess, there are bad and good people in every party or direction, but still...I strongly oppose any kind of racism.

Yeah but there's plenty racism amongst certain elements of the hard left. Which is paradoxical given Marxism's general principles but no one ever said people's views had to be internally consistent.

No group, party or wing has a monopoly on idiocy.

d'Oracle

I am very uncomfortable with some of the implications here.
I have friends and relations who are FG people.
I have never experienced racism by them.

Racism is, to the best of my knowledge, NOT a policy of Fianna gael, nor Fianna Fail nor any other party.

Further more Racism is not a function of political allegiance at all.
I do know some fianna fail and Sinn Fein supporters who are racist.

I do not draw the conclusion that Fianna Fail people are racists, from the actions of few.

Nehaxak

nesf wrote: »

Yeah but there's plenty racism amongst certain elements of the hard left. Which is paradoxical given Marxism's general principles but no one ever said people's views had to be internally consistent.

No group, party or wing has a monopoly on idiocy.

It is however, quiet damning of the current leader of FG espousing racist views in a very public manner. Or have we all conveniently forgotten about Enda Kenny's joke where he used the disgusting "N" word to describe an African person in a public place, in front of journalists who then agreed (all apart from one newspaper) not to publish the story when he approached them afterwards ?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2002/sep/15/world.race

"some ni**er who died..."

Yes, such a great man FG are putting up there for the potential new leader of our country, no wonder he's been in hiding for so long recently, they're afraid he'll say something equally as racist and stupid again.

PauloMN

Sweet f**k. A SF/FF government. I actually cannot think of a worse result, and I'd have to give serious consideration to packing up and leaving if that were to happen.

I'm pretty sure it won't though.

PauloMN

Lars1916 wrote: »

I mentioned that in a previous post, I married into a FG family in 2009, and I quoted the other half and her mother :rolleyes:

So you abhor racism but you married one? Bad luck dude.

GSF

Lars1916 wrote: »

Sorry, I was not meant to be offensive, it was just, what I experienced. I married into a family of FG supporters in 2009, and since then I always hear comments like that.

I guess, there are bad and good people in every party or direction, but still...I strongly oppose any kind of racism.

If your in laws are racist - thats your problem for marrying into the family.
Dont blame FG for that.

In my experience other parties talk the talk in public but can deliver quite a different message on the streets in working class areas when it suits them

GSF

PauloMN wrote: »

Sweet f**k. A SF/FF government. I actually cannot think of a worse result, and I'd have to give serious consideration to packing up and leaving if that were to happen.

Dame Gerry Adams as Minister For Finance :eek:

mikemac

Nehaxak wrote: »

Or have we all conveniently forgotten about Enda Kenny's joke where he used the disgusting "N" word to describe an African person in a public place,

We haven't forgotten, it was in a thread on boards last month

It was 2002, he apologized and nobody cares anymore

Lawrence1895

PauloMN wrote: »

So you abhor racism but you married one? Bad luck dude.

I just found out, after we moved together. The wife never talked about politics before that. Seems to be some bad luck alright :rolleyes:

ultain

Time to call in the marines...

Nehaxak

feelingstressed wrote: »

We haven't forgotten, it was in a thread on boards last month

It was 2002, he apologized and nobody cares anymore

Maybe FG supporters don't care but a lot of the general public still do and don't want a racist as our leader. He and FG in general will get a large proportion of the loony right wing vote purely on the racist attitudes espoused by their current leader.

Lawrence1895

Nehaxak wrote: »

Maybe FG supporters don't care but a lot of the general public still do and don't want a racist as our leader. He and FG in general will get a large proportion of the loony right wing vote purely on the racist attitudes espoused by their current leader.

It seems like it, but shouldn't it be up to FG to tackle racism in their own ranks or amongst their supporters? I'm not sure, but their reputation might be damaged overall (even in Europe), should they turn out as some kind of safe haven for (hidden?) racists.

UDAWINNER

The worst thing Sinn Fein could do is go into power with the poison that is Fianna Fail, look at what htas happened in the past to coalition partners: PDs-extinct and the Green Party- about to be extinct

nesf

Nehaxak wrote: »

Maybe FG supporters don't care but a lot of the general public still do and don't want a racist as our leader. He and FG in general will get a large proportion of the loony right wing vote purely on the racist attitudes espoused by their current leader.

A lot still care? You're the first person I've seen mention it since 2002 you know...

PomBear

Not a chance SF would go with FF.....

/end of.

Nehaxak

'Tis true, not a chance in hell SF going with FF.
There's more a chance of FG being considered if the opportunity presented itself but that's another story for another day probably best left until political mandates have been given when the election is over...

Brenireland

No this will never happen it is against everything irish politics stands for,never.

ultain

UDAWINNER wrote: »

The Green Party- about to be extinct

Their choice..least we foget:rolleyes:

Ghost Estate

keithm1 wrote: »

I don't even know why fianna fail are gonna run
ANYONE ive spoken to has said they'll never vote for them again

There are plenty 'closet' FF voters out there, don't worry

Quackles

Ghost Estate wrote: »

There are plenty 'closet' FF voters out there, don't worry

It's a secret language... listen out for "Sure they're all the same" - that's the code for "I'm going to vote Fianna Fáil".

Monty Burnz

Yup, there are plenty of people out there who do not have the balls to admit that they are still going to vote for Fianna Fail because it's a family thing. They can't give you a single good reason why they are still going to vote for them so to avoid humiliation they pretend they won't.

Hopefully, with a bit of patience, we can make voting for FFailure as socially unacceptable as drink-driving. Both ruin lives.

And by the way, the same should go for any of the other parties who indulge in corrupt/idiotic behaviour that jeopardises the very future of our country.

Ghost Estate

Too bad voting for FF is not something you can be caught doing

Not voting for them is. If you so happen to run a pub and the FF crowd regularly come in for drinks after their meetings then one year you vote FG instead while letting on you're a FF man they suddenly stop coming to your pub

Quackles

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Yup, there are plenty of people out there who do not have the balls to admit that they are still going to vote for Fianna Fail because it's a family thing. They can't give you a single good reason why they are still going to vote for them so to avoid humiliation they pretend they won't.

Hopefully, with a bit of patience, we can make voting for FFailure as socially unacceptable as drink-driving. Both ruin lives.

And by the way, the same should go for any of the other parties who indulge in corrupt/idiotic behaviour that jeopardises the very future of our country.

Sure they're all the same

In answer to the original question, if SF went into power with FF, I'd want my vote back. Numbers will never add up anyway, and SF just wouldn't do it, their ideals are polar opposites.

SafeSurfer

Ghost Estate wrote: »

Too bad voting for FF is not something you can be caught doing

Not voting for them is. If you so happen to run a pub and the FF crowd regularly come in for drinks after their meetings then one year you vote FG instead while letting on you're a FF man they suddenly stop coming to your pub

Its a secret ballot in my local polling booth so only I know how I vote.